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Let’s get to the part that everyone wants to hear:

Women:
TL;DR version:
For a n00b trying to get his first flag, I have to say as charming as Sarajevo is and as beautiful the women’s faces are, this would be a very tough place to start and not worth it if you only have 2 weeks of vacation a year. The society is still a bit conservative in some ways and the language barrier is very large.

Quality:
Looks:
The girls in Sarajevo are very good looking, and all over the place. They have faces that are a very nice cross between Italian and Slavic with extremely high cheekbones and delicate features in most cases. They are slender, with long black and brown hair, brown and light eyes, with teeth in good but not tooth paste advertisement condition. That being said, you won’t see many girls above what Roosh would consider an 8. As well, while they almost always have nice hour glass figures well into their 40s, you will be disappointed if you are an assman or a breastman. You should not expect much in those categories. For guys obsessed with blondes, any blondes that you see are almost guaranteed to be peroxide.

Fatty Alerts:
Almost none. You see only a couple of girls under 35 a day that you see overweight, and one gets the feeling that they really do have a glandular problem. Girls are extremely slender here in general. Also, they remain slender as you go out into the suburbs and the country side. I think that I can safely vouch for this since my hotel was 2 miles outside the city center and I took a bus trip to Mostar, 2 ½ hours away by bus. As far as I can tell, one will not see what Roosh saw in Latvia, with hotties during the day but fat suburban girls at night.

Attitude:
They are quite friendly and helpful, very pretty girls actually smiled when I asked them questions that would get zero reaction in DC though their English was usually hopeless. I was stunned when the extremely good looking stewardess on Bosnian airways seem to take a liking to me by simply smiling at her during turbulence. The few girls who I approached seem genuinely glad that I had. I even caught a few checking me out. About half of those were sub 5s by Roosh’s standard, which would normally depress me but it didn’t. Then I realized that they weren’t overweight and making the best of their appearance, making it feel like a genuine compliment. While they are mostly Muslim in Sarajevo, it is a very secular version. Almost everyone drinks alcohol and relatively few women wear head scarves. PDA between couples is common.
Also, I got the impression that Sarajevo is a bit of a small town. Cabbies would regularly honk at people, which I thought was rude, when I would realize that they were just saying hi to their friends. I’m guessing judgment is going to be a problem for her, especially given that 20 years ago the Serbs and Croats were attempting to wipe her from the face of the earth with only her family and friends to protect her.

Attitude-Kino:
There is an exception to the good attitude – kino.
My few attempts at very light kino (light touching around the elbow only) did not go over well.
I got immediate squirmy reactions from Kino that I do all the time in DC and never have a problem and backed off. One girl that I had take a photo of me immediately moved away as I tried to direct her to where to stand by touching her upper arm.
When I bought some groceries at a grocery store indistinguishable from any modern European one, when I put out my hand for change the lady behind the counter put it instead on the tray.
While my sample size is small, I get the feeling that touching women you don’t know in Sarajevo is heavily frowned upon.

Language:
This is going to be a very big problem. Most people don’t speak English, and those that do don’t have conversational fluency. How bad is the lack of English? The waiter at the Hotel Europa (the best hotel in Bosnia) and the girl at the McCafe at McDonald’s in the Old City could not speak any. While body language might help, kino does not seem to be appreciated as I showed above. I’m not seeing one getting far here unless one knows Serbo-Croatian unless you have a lot of experience getting flags in difficult places. It gets worse. While S-C is a Slavic language, they do not understand Russian.

Mentality:
Bosnia looks fairly well off but is in very bad shape below the surface. It doesn’t look third world beyond the war damage but has third world numbers. They have 44% unemployment. 60% of foreign aid gets lost to corruption. Tourism is far lower than it should be due to expensive flights and a lack of modern highways due to corruption. They can’t emigrate because not enough of them moved to the UK, States, and Canada before the Civil War to lobby for immigration quotas and were dealt another blow when it turned out a few Bosnians worked for Osama Bin Laden. Since the country has significant Serb and Croat minorities who refuse to cooperate, reform is next to impossible. People are happy and helpful, but underneath there is a desperation. The girl you’re trying to swoop has a grim future ahead of her. I would speculate that she is painfully aware of the need for protection given that she lives in a country surrounded by people who want to rape and kill her with little hope of help from Western Europe.


The Competition:

Busted Dudes Test:

You’re not going to see any trolls with 6s in Sarajevo. While some of the men have the Slavic “Square Head” look, many others are tall guys with the Northern Italian Soccer Player features that girls go ga-ga for the world over. The girls appeared to be quite happy with their men. That being said, I saw plenty of cases of shorter, overweight (not American overweight), slightly goofy guys with very cute girlfriends.

Ratios:
There seemed to be plenty to go around. Every venue that I went to had a significant proportion of attractive women.

Use of Game by locals:

If game is used by locals, it’s imperceptibly subtle to an American. One guy actually egged me on to approach girls at a table and it worked – though one girl turned out to be Polish. With the right attitude and practice, approaching seated girls might actually work fairly well here. But again, good luck hoping they will speak English.

Drunk Brits, Desperate Italians, and Other Obnoxious Tourists:
There are very few tourists from anywhere in Bosnia due to a perception of risk, minimal intercity roads, and the total lack of cheap flights. This may be the last big and pretty European city west of the Baltics where the girls are untouched by desperate foreign men. Drunk Brits have not pissed everyone off yet. That being said, I saw middle aged British business men act like jerks to the hotel and refuse to pay their restaurant bill over the need to register passports when you check in. I got no perception that locals hate Americans.

Competition Conclusion:
Your biggest competition is learning to speak Serbo-Croatian.

The bars and clubs:
The café culture is EVERYWHERE – including late night bars. Everyone sits around. There is effectively ZERO mingling in any of the night spots that I went to – I wonder if I was the only guy in the entire city to make an approach at all. There are some late night clubs, but I only went to one and even in those places there was a bit of a seated culture.

The Old City:
There are two bars called Cheers and City Bar across the street from each other near Hotel Europa. This was the only area where I found students who knew any English at all. If you can speak Serbo-Croatian, though, the night life is massive. The old walking street on a Saturday night is packed with people. There are night clubs but I was only there one Saturday night and no Thursday or Friday nights, so I really can’t comment besides the one I went to rather drunk. It was packed and had a weird metal live band. I did not get the feeling that anyone mingled outside of their social groups.

Special note on the night life:
Sarajevo sprawls to west in suburbs that go on for miles. Even around my hotel miles from the city center there were cafes that served alcohol open late into the night. Before I saw that, I was suspicious that some of the people at the bar who were not drinking were doing it because they were muslim and not because they were designated drivers. Given the size of the place, there are probably other night spots out in the western areas with women of equal quality to the old city. However, expecting anyone to speak English in those places would be naïve.


Mundane Details:

Getting there:
Not as bad as needing to learn the language, but still tough. Flights are very expensive due to Bosnia not having control of its airspace and corruption causing massive overcharging for landing rights at the airport. The only regularly affordable flights that I found were from Istanbul in a French-Italian turboprop so badly designed and maintained that I assumed that it was Russian. It can cost $3000 to fly to and from Munich.

Trains – there is only one train to and from Belgrade and it takes 9 to 10 hours. One could probably take a bus from Dubrovnik and then a train, but again expect long travel times.

Bus – The 2 buses that I took to and from Mostar were clean and had air conditioning. I do not know how it works with cross border, though. I was warned to avoid those by others on the forum.

Where to stay:
Hotels are very affordable, especially if you are willing to stay in the suburbs to the west of the old city – they go on for miles. Taxis are cheap, so it’s not so much of a burden, and the girls are just as good looking in the suburbs as the old city. From the city center to the airport is only 5 euros, but be careful on arrival. Taxi cab drivers will try to scam you. Insist on using the meter.

Prices:
Everything is extremely cheap due to a depressed economy. As long as you don’t go to luxury restaurants, everything is cheap.

Food:
World class. Bosnians know how to cook. You could schedule every meal that you had over 2 weeks and still not sample all of the delicacies that they have to offer. They make incredible Northern Italian style food, Turkish style kebab, as well as traditional dishes. The vegetables are incredibly fresh and delicious (at least in May when I was there).
Alcohol:
Even though it is Muslim, Sarajevo drinks a lot and it is cheap. Decent Vodka can be had for a euro a shot. Good beer from Germany and Denmark can be had for a Euro, though only drink the premium version of the local stuff. The normal kind had me uttering a phrase that I thought I would never say – “I long for the rich and full bodied taste of Bud Light”. The local wine is outstanding. It can go toe to toe with the best wine in the world. The reds are simply terrific. The local white is very well made but uses an odd berry that takes getting used to. Higher end restaurants have the local Chardonnay, which is the best that I have ever drunk – light and refreshing, not syrupy like California. It’s fun to try to local fruit brandy’s, but ultimately they are unmemorable.

The Sights:
Sarajevo is very pretty, but some have described it as a mini Prague. It is not. While charming and clean, it’s architecture and art in no way compares. I would describe it as a mini Copenhagen full of mosques in surrounded by gorgeous green mountains. It is dirt cheap right now, though, and when you realize that WWI started there, they had the most successful Olympics of the last 40 years, and the Civil War, it is one of the most historical cities in the world.
I would not recommend Sarajevo as a place for gaming. A mix of conservative culture, village mentality, and Muslims.

Maybe the reason you didn't notice any hostility to Americans is because tour are oblivious to the actions of tour own countrymen?

I don't think you should assume that because some Brits had a disagreement in a hotel, that there.might be some.underlying hatred towards Brits.

People in the FYU love meeting strangers and are not generally hostile.to any nation including USA and UK

Trains are bad in FYU, buses are faster and more pleasent.

They should be able to understand Russian pretty well there.

One question, why do you think a Bosnian girl is in imminent danger of being raped, and murdered?
(05-12-2012 09:30 AM)Deb Auchery Wrote: [ -> ]Good input, I would not recommend Sarajevo as a place for gaming. A mix of conservative culture, village mentality, and Muslims.

Maybe the reason you didn't notice any hostility to Americans is because tour are oblivious to the actions of tour own countrymen?

I don't think you should assume that because some Brits had a disagreement in a hotel, that there.might be some.underlying hatred towards Brits.

People in the FYU love meeting strangers and are not generally hostile.to any nation including USA and UK

Trains are bad in FYU, buses are faster and more pleasent.

They should be able to understand Russian pretty well there.

One question, why do you think a Bosnian girl is in imminent danger of being raped, and murdered?

I'm half Danish, and extremely used to getting an earful from leftist Scandinavians, Germans, French, Dutch, and Brits about how terrible and evil all of us Americans are and not getting treated very nicely as a result. I've also been to the Egypt, where there was some of the same. As well, I saw advertisements for "American Culture Month" which given our total domination of world culture seems bizarre that had no graffiti on them all over the city. If Bosnians hated Americans the way that I'm used to, they hid it extremely well. Also, we generally tip Wink

As for the Brits, they have a VERY bad reputation on this forum. Posters complain endlessly here about how they make it difficult for them to swoop girls in EE because of their bad behavior.

For wanting to meet you, I absolutely agree. Bosnians are really friendly, but they can't speak English very well so you are going to have to learn Serbo-Croatian to get anywhere.

As for knowing Russian, I don't speak it but my father who was with me does. He quickly gave up when people said that they didn't know it. You might be able to get a taxi or order food in it, but you're definitely not going to be able to build a relationship with a girl with it.

As for the part of fear about rape and murder, you just need to physically look at the city. War damage is still apparent everywhere. War cripples are a common sight. The stewardess on Bosnian airways had a scar on her arm that did not look like it came from surgery. The west did a terrible job trying to protect them during the war. While people and the girls are friendly, getting her to sleep with you is going to probably bring things like that up - she knows that she needs someone who is going to provide and protect her - not some foreign guy who is going to run off without her. I tried to indicate that that was speculation by me on this point. I apologize if that was not apparent.
(05-12-2012 09:59 AM)beta_plus Wrote: [ -> ]
(05-12-2012 09:30 AM)Deb Auchery Wrote: [ -> ]Good input, I would not recommend Sarajevo as a place for gaming. A mix of conservative culture, village mentality, and Muslims.

Maybe the reason you didn't notice any hostility to Americans is because tour are oblivious to the actions of tour own countrymen?

I don't think you should assume that because some Brits had a disagreement in a hotel, that there.might be some.underlying hatred towards Brits.

People in the FYU love meeting strangers and are not generally hostile.to any nation including USA and UK

Trains are bad in FYU, buses are faster and more pleasent.

They should be able to understand Russian pretty well there.

One question, why do you think a Bosnian girl is in imminent danger of being raped, and murdered?

I'm half Danish, and extremely used to getting an earful from leftist Scandinavians, Germans, French, Dutch, and Brits about how terrible and evil all of us Americans are and not getting treated very nicely as a result. I've also been to the Egypt, where there was some of the same. As well, I saw advertisements for "American Culture Month" which given our total domination of world culture seems bizarre that had no graffiti on them all over the city. If Bosnians hated Americans the way that I'm used to, they hid it extremely well. Also, we generally tip Wink

As for the Brits, they have a VERY bad reputation on this forum. Posters complain endlessly here about how they make it difficult for them to swoop girls in EE because of their bad behavior.

For wanting to meet you, I absolutely agree. Bosnians are really friendly, but they can't speak English very well so you are going to have to learn Serbo-Croatian to get anywhere.

As for knowing Russian, I don't speak it but my father who was with me does. He quickly gave up when people said that they didn't know it. You might be able to get a taxi or order food in it, but you're definitely not going to be able to build a relationship with a girl with it.

As for the part of fear about rape and murder, you just need to physically look at the city. War damage is still apparent everywhere. War cripples are a common sight. The stewardess on Bosnian airways had a scar on her arm that did not look like it came from surgery. The west did a terrible job trying to protect them during the war. While people and the girls are friendly, getting her to sleep with you is going to probably bring things like that up - she knows that she needs someone who is going to provide and protect her - not some foreign guy who is going to run off without her. I tried to indicate that that was speculation by me on this point. I apologize if that was not apparent.

Pretty juvenile response.

Certainly not a leftist

Oh so you've been to Egypt too? You have been or plan to goto quite a few muslim countries, not bad for a Danish person.

Did you look around in Bosnia?, did you see a war going on? Maybe the stewardess' scar came from the pilot, he probably rapes her after her shift too.
Can't say too much about gaming Sarajevo as I was sick and relegated to my hotel room most of the time, and it was Ramadan to boot, but if you're looking for a largely untouched patch of land that is a step(or three) up from Industrial Shithole, then Sarajevo is it. The Old City is beautiful, and unlike anything you'd find in all of Europe. If you've ever been to Turkey, you'd get the same feeling in Sarajevo.

However, one cannot look past the scars from war that the people of the country still carry with them. I found the people to be largely jaded and broken down. For example, I saw few people smiling or laughing in Sarajevo. Additionally, once you get outside of the Old City, there are still bullet holes and large shell holes that pepper the Soviet era buildings throughout the city and the country.

The infrastructure is underdeveloped and corrupt. Mind you, there are three "presidents" in the country, that are each recognized as the leader by different people within Bosnia. Flying in is prohibitively expensive, and trains and buses are passable at best. I got into Bosnia via a torturous, eighth circle of hell, 12 hour bus ride from Croatia. We stopped at the border for about a half hour, but no one came on the bus or even bothered to check passports. I traveled onto Serbia from Sarajevo shrouded under the cover of night by throwing a guy $100 and having him drive me in his Audi. At one point we were stopped by an armed soldier on the road, where I was told by my driver to keep my mouth shut, whereby the driver presumably explained why the hell an American was sitting in the back of his car.

If you're expecting to pillage the women of Bosnia, then you're likely to find greener pastures in other parts of this world, but if you're into history, culture and overall an interesting experience then Sarajevo is worth it.
(05-12-2012 10:14 AM)Deb Auchery Wrote: [ -> ]
(05-12-2012 09:59 AM)beta_plus Wrote: [ -> ]
(05-12-2012 09:30 AM)Deb Auchery Wrote: [ -> ]Good input, I would not recommend Sarajevo as a place for gaming. A mix of conservative culture, village mentality, and Muslims.

Maybe the reason you didn't notice any hostility to Americans is because tour are oblivious to the actions of tour own countrymen?

I don't think you should assume that because some Brits had a disagreement in a hotel, that there.might be some.underlying hatred towards Brits.

People in the FYU love meeting strangers and are not generally hostile.to any nation including USA and UK

Trains are bad in FYU, buses are faster and more pleasent.

They should be able to understand Russian pretty well there.

One question, why do you think a Bosnian girl is in imminent danger of being raped, and murdered?

I'm half Danish, and extremely used to getting an earful from leftist Scandinavians, Germans, French, Dutch, and Brits about how terrible and evil all of us Americans are and not getting treated very nicely as a result. I've also been to the Egypt, where there was some of the same. As well, I saw advertisements for "American Culture Month" which given our total domination of world culture seems bizarre that had no graffiti on them all over the city. If Bosnians hated Americans the way that I'm used to, they hid it extremely well. Also, we generally tip Wink

As for the Brits, they have a VERY bad reputation on this forum. Posters complain endlessly here about how they make it difficult for them to swoop girls in EE because of their bad behavior.

For wanting to meet you, I absolutely agree. Bosnians are really friendly, but they can't speak English very well so you are going to have to learn Serbo-Croatian to get anywhere.

As for knowing Russian, I don't speak it but my father who was with me does. He quickly gave up when people said that they didn't know it. You might be able to get a taxi or order food in it, but you're definitely not going to be able to build a relationship with a girl with it.

As for the part of fear about rape and murder, you just need to physically look at the city. War damage is still apparent everywhere. War cripples are a common sight. The stewardess on Bosnian airways had a scar on her arm that did not look like it came from surgery. The west did a terrible job trying to protect them during the war. While people and the girls are friendly, getting her to sleep with you is going to probably bring things like that up - she knows that she needs someone who is going to provide and protect her - not some foreign guy who is going to run off without her. I tried to indicate that that was speculation by me on this point. I apologize if that was not apparent.

Pretty juvenile response.

Certainly not a leftist

Oh so you've been to Egypt too? You have been or plan to goto quite a few muslim countries, not bad for a Danish person.

Did you look around in Bosnia?, did you see a war going on? Maybe the stewardess' scar came from the pilot, he probably rapes her after her shift too.

OK, I just noticed the Serbian flag on your profile. I think it's best we end this conversation.
(05-12-2012 10:14 AM)Deb Auchery Wrote: [ -> ]
(05-12-2012 09:59 AM)beta_plus Wrote: [ -> ]
(05-12-2012 09:30 AM)Deb Auchery Wrote: [ -> ]Good input, I would not recommend Sarajevo as a place for gaming. A mix of conservative culture, village mentality, and Muslims.

Maybe the reason you didn't notice any hostility to Americans is because tour are oblivious to the actions of tour own countrymen?

I don't think you should assume that because some Brits had a disagreement in a hotel, that there.might be some.underlying hatred towards Brits.

People in the FYU love meeting strangers and are not generally hostile.to any nation including USA and UK

Trains are bad in FYU, buses are faster and more pleasent.

They should be able to understand Russian pretty well there.

One question, why do you think a Bosnian girl is in imminent danger of being raped, and murdered?

I'm half Danish, and extremely used to getting an earful from leftist Scandinavians, Germans, French, Dutch, and Brits about how terrible and evil all of us Americans are and not getting treated very nicely as a result. I've also been to the Egypt, where there was some of the same. As well, I saw advertisements for "American Culture Month" which given our total domination of world culture seems bizarre that had no graffiti on them all over the city. If Bosnians hated Americans the way that I'm used to, they hid it extremely well. Also, we generally tip Wink

As for the Brits, they have a VERY bad reputation on this forum. Posters complain endlessly here about how they make it difficult for them to swoop girls in EE because of their bad behavior.

For wanting to meet you, I absolutely agree. Bosnians are really friendly, but they can't speak English very well so you are going to have to learn Serbo-Croatian to get anywhere.

As for knowing Russian, I don't speak it but my father who was with me does. He quickly gave up when people said that they didn't know it. You might be able to get a taxi or order food in it, but you're definitely not going to be able to build a relationship with a girl with it.

As for the part of fear about rape and murder, you just need to physically look at the city. War damage is still apparent everywhere. War cripples are a common sight. The stewardess on Bosnian airways had a scar on her arm that did not look like it came from surgery. The west did a terrible job trying to protect them during the war. While people and the girls are friendly, getting her to sleep with you is going to probably bring things like that up - she knows that she needs someone who is going to provide and protect her - not some foreign guy who is going to run off without her. I tried to indicate that that was speculation by me on this point. I apologize if that was not apparent.

Pretty juvenile response.

Certainly not a leftist

Oh so you've been to Egypt too? You have been or plan to goto quite a few muslim countries, not bad for a Danish person.

Did you look around in Bosnia?, did you see a war going on? Maybe the stewardess' scar came from the pilot, he probably rapes her after her shift too.

Deb, leave this guy alone. His data sheet is very solid and he is honest about what he thinks and his level of game. Respect any man who goes to a country like that and gives us a report, whether it sounds juvenile or not.
Good work beta plus.
I was a bit harsh. Although I didn't find what he said very accurate, he posted.some accurate logistical information.
I thought Sarajevo was a very cool city but I had no success there.
I just arrived in Sarajevo last night and have done basically nothing - checked into an isolated hotel near the bus station last night, ate breakfast in the hotel, took a cab to a short-term apartment rental, and went to the mall across the street. In that short time I have been checked out by plenty of hot young girls. I went to this upscale buffet restaurant, you know, the kind where they give you a card and you use the card to order whatever you want. Had an awkward convo with the hostess who was trying to explain the concept to me, she said the card had 100 Bosnian Marks on it, and I know from experience that means the minimum payment would be 100 Bosnian Marks, but I only wanted a coffee, which would cost around 2 Bosnian Marks. So we had a friendly argument and I finally took her word for it, deciding I would just run for it if she tried to charge me 100 BM when leaving. Good looking girl but I didn't think anything of it - it's her job to talk to people who walk in. I'll come back to that.

So I sit down, by myself, at a table. The restaurant is full of beautiful women from university students up to middle aged businesswomen. Well-dressed, in shape, nice facial features, pleasant, relaxed expressions - you get the picture. Even the gothic busgirl is hot. I'm starting to wonder why nobody ever mentions Sarajevo as a destination. 3 girls walk in. I'm sitting at a table for 6 by myself. I get up to get my lunch which is ready. When I come back, the girls are standing around my table. I think nothing of it. I'm from Toronto where you learn not to bother talking to women - you learn to ignore them because what's the point of getting told to fuck off all the time. I sit down and start in on my lunch. Next thing I know one of the girls, a fatty, asks if she and her friends can sit with me. I say "sure, why not". But a quick glance around the room shows there are several empty tables left...

Fatty says they wanted to sit at my table because of the view... The other two girls are a really short 4 or 5 and an incredible-looking olive-skinned beauty with slightly Asian features. That gets my attention and I start conversing with them. They're Romanian archaeologists. The beauty is a true Romanian while the other two are Hungarian-Romanians. First I talk to Fatty because she was the one who asked if she could sit at the table, and she happens to be sitting next to me. But I quickly turn my attention to the beauty of the group. Again, experience tells me she will ignore me and be rude, but the opposite happens. She's really friendly and interesting, and is showing some interest in me - flipping her hair, playing with her hair, asking me questions, etc. We all have an enjoyable lunch, talking for maybe 45 minutes. I spend most of it talking with olive-skinned beauty. Then her phone rings and it's the other 2 people they're travelling with and they have to go. They said they were going back to Romania, now, apparently, so I didn't bother getting contact details because that means either they are going back, or they don't want to meet up with me and are making an excuse. I probably should have anyway. They spent a long time saying goodbye to me, and actually said "thanks for the conversation". I am not used to that.

I finish my lunch and go to the hostess stand to pay. I'm still sort of expecting her to charge me 100BM, even though I only consumed 25BM worth. She asks me how it was, I tell her it was just as you described, thank you. She asks me for 25BM. As I'm fumbling around with my wallet she asks me where I'm from. "Canada". She asks me what I'm doing here, and seems interested in my answer. I'm almost too slow to realize there's an opportunity here. She asks how long I'm staying and if I need anything, any help or anything. She has a big smile on her face and looks a little nervous, this is strange... So I ask her where I can buy a local SIM card. In fact, I would have asked her for her number if I had a local SIM card, and was starting to realize she might actually be interested rather than just being extra friendly because it's her job. So 'SIM card' came into my head. She actually leaves her post and goes to ask somebody for me. I check out her figure from behind as she does that and am quite impressed - she almost looked South American from behind. I didn't see much of that in Croatia where I've been for the last few months, the girls are really skinny in Croatia, which is awesome, I love that, but variety is good also... So she comes back, and I want to get her number but I need the SIM card first. Yeah, I could have gotten her to write it down but it all happened too fast for me to react. I need more practice. But she seemed genuinely excited when I told her I was staying nearby, and told me to please come back. If I do I'll definitely get her contact details.

On the 90 second walk back to my place, nearly every girl is checking me out. None of them are ugly. A lot of them look young enough to be students. I'm starting to get angry at how they brainwash you in Toronto to think you're living in the centre of the universe. Really, it's one of the layers of Hell. If you're a single man, in Toronto, LEAVE NOW. There's nothing there for you. I think you might prefer to live in Bosnia...
(10-29-2012 10:01 AM)allgood Wrote: [ -> ]I just arrived in Sarajevo last night and have done basically nothing - checked into an isolated hotel near the bus station last night, ate breakfast in the hotel, took a cab to a short-term apartment rental, and went to the mall across the street. In that short time I have been checked out by plenty of hot young girls. I went to this upscale buffet restaurant, you know, the kind where they give you a card and you use the card to order whatever you want. Had an awkward convo with the hostess who was trying to explain the concept to me, she said the card had 100 Bosnian Marks on it, and I know from experience that means the minimum payment would be 100 Bosnian Marks, but I only wanted a coffee, which would cost around 2 Bosnian Marks. So we had a friendly argument and I finally took her word for it, deciding I would just run for it if she tried to charge me 100 BM when leaving. Good looking girl but I didn't think anything of it - it's her job to talk to people who walk in. I'll come back to that.

So I sit down, by myself, at a table. The restaurant is full of beautiful women from university students up to middle aged businesswomen. Well-dressed, in shape, nice facial features, pleasant, relaxed expressions - you get the picture. Even the gothic busgirl is hot. I'm starting to wonder why nobody ever mentions Sarajevo as a destination. 3 girls walk in. I'm sitting at a table for 6 by myself. I get up to get my lunch which is ready. When I come back, the girls are standing around my table. I think nothing of it. I'm from Toronto where you learn not to bother talking to women - you learn to ignore them because what's the point of getting told to fuck off all the time. I sit down and start in on my lunch. Next thing I know one of the girls, a fatty, asks if she and her friends can sit with me. I say "sure, why not". But a quick glance around the room shows there are several empty tables left...

Fatty says they wanted to sit at my table because of the view... The other two girls are a really short 4 or 5 and an incredible-looking olive-skinned beauty with slightly Asian features. That gets my attention and I start conversing with them. They're Romanian archaeologists. The beauty is a true Romanian while the other two are Hungarian-Romanians. First I talk to Fatty because she was the one who asked if she could sit at the table, and she happens to be sitting next to me. But I quickly turn my attention to the beauty of the group. Again, experience tells me she will ignore me and be rude, but the opposite happens. She's really friendly and interesting, and is showing some interest in me - flipping her hair, playing with her hair, asking me questions, etc. We all have an enjoyable lunch, talking for maybe 45 minutes. I spend most of it talking with olive-skinned beauty. Then her phone rings and it's the other 2 people they're travelling with and they have to go. They said they were going back to Romania, now, apparently, so I didn't bother getting contact details because that means either they are going back, or they don't want to meet up with me and are making an excuse. I probably should have anyway. They spent a long time saying goodbye to me, and actually said "thanks for the conversation". I am not used to that.

I finish my lunch and go to the hostess stand to pay. I'm still sort of expecting her to charge me 100BM, even though I only consumed 25BM worth. She asks me how it was, I tell her it was just as you described, thank you. She asks me for 25BM. As I'm fumbling around with my wallet she asks me where I'm from. "Canada". She asks me what I'm doing here, and seems interested in my answer. I'm almost too slow to realize there's an opportunity here. She asks how long I'm staying and if I need anything, any help or anything. She has a big smile on her face and looks a little nervous, this is strange... So I ask her where I can buy a local SIM card. In fact, I would have asked her for her number if I had a local SIM card, and was starting to realize she might actually be interested rather than just being extra friendly because it's her job. So 'SIM card' came into my head. She actually leaves her post and goes to ask somebody for me. I check out her figure from behind as she does that and am quite impressed - she almost looked South American from behind. I didn't see much of that in Croatia where I've been for the last few months, the girls are really skinny in Croatia, which is awesome, I love that, but variety is good also... So she comes back, and I want to get her number but I need the SIM card first. Yeah, I could have gotten her to write it down but it all happened too fast for me to react. I need more practice. But she seemed genuinely excited when I told her I was staying nearby, and told me to please come back. If I do I'll definitely get her contact details.

On the 90 second walk back to my place, nearly every girl is checking me out. None of them are ugly. A lot of them look young enough to be students. I'm starting to get angry at how they brainwash you in Toronto to think you're living in the centre of the universe. Really, it's one of the layers of Hell. If you're a single man, in Toronto, LEAVE NOW. There's nothing there for you. I think you might prefer to live in Bosnia...


Awesome.

Can you remark on general living costs over there (apartment, food, restaurants, groceries) as you get settled in?
(10-29-2012 10:39 AM)temujin Wrote: [ -> ]Awesome.

Can you remark on general living costs over there (apartment, food, restaurants, groceries) as you get settled in?

I've done very little here except rent a couple of places, take a cab and have a meal, but so far the costs have been pleasantly reasonable. For example I stayed in a 'luxury' hotel (it was a bit run down) near the train station last night which only cost me around €40. Now I'm in an apartment which is only costing €180 for 5 days or €36/day, and it's probably one of the nicest one-bedrooms I've ever seen. It even has recessed lighting in the living room. See the link. The meal at that upscale restaurant cost 25BM which would be around €13. The cab was around €3 for a short distance which might have cost me $8CAD back home. Retail prices for soft drinks are apparently around €.50 instead of the typical €1 or €2 in other European countries and North America. But you get what you pay for - there are signs that there are problems here with infrastructure. It's a new country and there was a war not that long ago which they're still recovering from.

https://roomorama.com/short-term-rentals...gin=search
(10-29-2012 10:01 AM)allgood Wrote: [ -> ]I'm starting to get angry at how they brainwash you in Toronto to think you're living in the centre of the universe. Really, it's one of the layers of Hell. If you're a single man, in Toronto, LEAVE NOW. There's nothing there for you. I think you might prefer to live in Bosnia...
YOu say you have been in Croatia for a couple of month already.. Have you not adjusted your game? In Moscow I wasted a few weeks at first but when I came to Kiev I knew exactly what I had to do.
(10-29-2012 11:18 AM)gadabout Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-29-2012 10:01 AM)allgood Wrote: [ -> ]I'm starting to get angry at how they brainwash you in Toronto to think you're living in the centre of the universe. Really, it's one of the layers of Hell. If you're a single man, in Toronto, LEAVE NOW. There's nothing there for you. I think you might prefer to live in Bosnia...
YOu say you have been in Croatia for a couple of month already.. Have you not adjusted your game? In Moscow I wasted a few weeks at first but when I came to Kiev I knew exactly what I had to do.

Since being overseas, I have adjusted my game. I've become more confident and my conversational skills have improved. But it's going to be a long process. The Toronto scene takes everything out of you. If you haven't lived there as long as I have, you won't fully understand. There was no such thing as game when I was starting out; there were only cheesy manuals that had worthless information in them, and reading them would mean you were a sleazebag. I had one of them. One of the instructions was to give girls flowers and say nice things to them. Ok, that didn't work. Now what? Nobody had any answers. Nothing you do works. You have no idea what you're doing wrong. After a few years of constant humiliation, you give up and you internalize that.
Cool... but interesting country of choice for someone who want's to come out of his shell.
(10-29-2012 10:01 AM)allgood Wrote: [ -> ]On the 90 second walk back to my place, nearly every girl is checking me out. None of them are ugly. A lot of them look young enough to be students.

Do you have a clue of what make nearly all of them look at you?
Was it because of the conversation in English or because of your clothing style / appearance, or other reasons?
(10-29-2012 01:29 PM)Way Cool Jr Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-29-2012 10:01 AM)allgood Wrote: [ -> ]On the 90 second walk back to my place, nearly every girl is checking me out. None of them are ugly. A lot of them look young enough to be students.

Do you have a clue of what make nearly all of them look at you?
Was it because of the conversation in English or because of your clothing style / appearance, or other reasons?

I'm going to have to go out a bit more here to determine that. I obviously don't look like a local so that would have a lot to do with it. I don't think they get as much tourism as other nearby countries.
(05-12-2012 09:59 AM)beta_plus Wrote: [ -> ]As for the Brits, they have a VERY bad reputation on this forum. Posters complain endlessly here about how they make it difficult for them to swoop girls in EE because of their bad behavior.


Hi just to clarify the bad reputation thing about us brits relates to the stag weekend brigade but just like most things its the minority that cause the problem for everyone else. I don't see 'endless complaints' but it is mentioned on some of the forums.
If this is the general consensus I think will take my knowledge else where.

(10-29-2012 01:55 PM)EU Explorer Wrote: [ -> ]
(05-12-2012 09:59 AM)beta_plus Wrote: [ -> ]As for the Brits, they have a VERY bad reputation on this forum. Posters complain endlessly here about how they make it difficult for them to swoop girls in EE because of their bad behavior.


Hi just to clarify the bad reputation thing about us brits relates to the stag weekend brigade but just like most things its the minority that cause the problem for everyone else. I don't see 'endless complaints' but it is mentioned on some of the forums.
When you say that a few Bosnian Muslims "worked" for Osama Bin Laden, that's a bit misleading. During the civil war NATO powers collaborated with Saudi Wahabbist Oil rulers to ship in thousands of Al Qaeda Jihadists who alongside the Bosnian Muslim army and militas, were very keen on slaughtering Christian Serbs and also Croats on occasion. Many of the Jihadis are still there as the Bosnian Muslim government rewarded their "services" with passports and many married Bosnian Muslim women; possibly you were closer to some of them at times than you realised.

Everyone killed and was killed during the war, but we only get the version of events that suits NATO and their Saudi/Bosnian Muslim buddies.

Bosnia is hardly a suitable place for foreign guys who want to travel to have sex with the local women. If some of the resident Islamists had realised what your intrentions were, you would have been in hot water.
I was in BiH for few times and cost-benefit analysis tells me it's not worth: go sightsee, enjoy the nature and culture.
(10-29-2012 03:25 PM)Zak Wrote: [ -> ]When you say that a few Bosnian Muslims "worked" for Osama Bin Laden, that's a bit misleading. During the civil war NATO powers collaborated with Saudi Wahabbist Oil rulers to ship in thousands of Al Qaeda Jihadists who alongside the Bosnian Muslim army and militas, were very keen on slaughtering Christian Serbs and also Croats on occasion. Many of the Jihadis are still there as the Bosnian Muslim government rewarded their "services" with passports and many married Bosnian Muslim women; possibly you were closer to some of them at times than you realised.

Everyone killed and was killed during the war, but we only get the version of events that suits NATO and their Saudi/Bosnian Muslim buddies.

Bosnia is hardly a suitable place for foreign guys who want to travel to have sex with the local women. If some of the resident Islamists had realised what your intrentions were, you would have been in hot water.

Well said Zak
@allgood

You are right, not many tourists there and most of the tourists are middle-aged people on bus drives through BiH for sightseeing, staying in one place for a day or two, and there are many more bosnian expatriates from other EU countries who return 'home' for vacation.
(10-29-2012 05:29 PM)MeshTryOut Wrote: [ -> ]@allgood

You are right, not many tourists there and most of the tourists are middle-aged people on bus drives through BiH for sightseeing, staying in one place for a day or two, and there are many more bosnian expatriates from other EU countries who return 'home' for vacation.

Some tourists go rafting, hiking and skiing, a famous spot is in the south of Sarajevo, but the problem is there are lots of unmarked mine fields and unexploded devices that are yet to be cleaned, so walking in the mountains and offroad is dangerous (each year few people die or are injured because of it). So, tourism just cannot flourish yet.
So yes: Girls don't see a young foreigner in his 20', 30' many times who is a good prospect for her, be it fulfing her fuck fantasy or LTR. Clothing, grooming and being a foreigner is just a surplus; you are perceived as having money ---> your status sky-rockets.


@Zak

That's why a guy should never game a conservative girl (even if she is eye-fucking you --> it can happen to guys many times in Turkey, or muslim Balkan places) if you aren't making it completely discreet and consider/ understand their values, culture and make adjustments to it. But once you get it, it's funny how even the completely traditional girls would make everything in their power to suck you off or to have anal at least once in their lifetime.

one correction:
girls who are down for anal in those places aren't doing it for the first time; they are well versed and rather skilled for taking that piece of meat deep inside Angel
(10-29-2012 04:11 PM)MeshTryOut Wrote: [ -> ]I was in BiH for few times and cost-benefit analysis tells me it's not worth: go sightsee, enjoy the nature and culture.

Getting a SNL in Sarajevo during those few days of your stay are scarce and your investment will be tremendous. Don't go there for that. On the other hand, if you're staying for at least 2 weeks there and start to game massively from the moment you arrive in the city, then the prospects are good. You just must do the dating stuff to seal the deal. I got my both flags only in this way, but never a SNL (and I speak pretty solid s-c). And I approached like shit crazy, just to let you know I have no magic spell and I poured gallons of sweat for the results (that's why I say it's not worth going there, but I went there for a bang and was determined to get it). Your dick is a lucky beast if you bypass the day limit and get a bang sooner, but my experience was excrutiating. Getting a girl from the club to your place on the same night... not a chance if she's local, and european or western travellers on the other hand probably don't count here Wink.

Next time I'm going to BiH I will dismiss Sarajevo and head again to Banjaluka instead. Women dress sexier there and are more compliant to your escalation (majority of population are serbs), they also don't behave in such a conservative way as Sarajevo girls. If nothing else, you will enjoy the view of their mini skirts and high heels walking around. Parties are in my opinion better than in Sarajevo. I got a flag there just while staying over the weekend; in the club I got the makeout and the next day we met again and banged all night after that. But already from distance I had clearly seen she was a first caliber slut. I don't believe it would go so easily in other cases. And if you're an American, there's a chance you won't feel so welcomed there as in Sarajevo; even young people there have some negative feelings towards USA.

I would skip BiH for a short visit just to get a flag, period

This is excellent location-specific advice. I don't expect any SNLs - if I see an opportunity for one, I'll take it, but I know bangs will require time, skill and some work here. I plan on being here for at least a couple of weeks. It won't surprise me at all if I get nothing. But I'm going to at least try - after seeing the women here, I can't not stick around for a little while and make an effort. They're worth it.

I'm not American, I'm Canadian, but they probably can't tell the difference.

And I'm not going to hit on girls who are obviously conservative - wearing a hijab for example. Even though you usually shouldn't judge a book by its cover, that's too much of a challenge IMHO.
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