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Full Version: Russian language: no more bullshit
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(10-21-2017 08:54 PM)bucky Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-18-2017 12:42 PM)estraudi Wrote: [ -> ]
(08-20-2017 05:39 AM)peterfoo22 Wrote: [ -> ]How long has it taken people on here to get to close to fluency in Russian?

It doesn't help there are no russian people around me to conversate with.

You might try getting an on-line tutor. I've got two on-line tutors who I found on http://www.preply.com who I talk to once or twice a week just to stay in practice with my Russian. One charges $3/hr, the other $4/hr.

I have a hard time transitioning between the 2 languages. Do they help with speaking in both languages so you're not just sitting there in limbo of language?
I think the best way to become fluent from what I have seen is

1st. They work directly with Russian people in their work, usually some type of volunteer project or teaching.

2nd. They have a girlfriend that does not speak english and have to learn as fast possible, putting tons of pressure on you to learn.

3rd. Taking classes continuously either through a private school/tutor or through an immersion program at a university.

I have noticed these three trends that it make possible for people to learn Russian the fastest and easiest. I think you might be able to become completely fluent in about 2-3 years time if you are in one of these scenarios.
Did Roosh finally learn Russian?
Finally enrolled in a Russian language course, after years spent self -learning. The teacher insists on us reading and writing in the cursive script. Whilst I understand that a native should be expected to do this, in the age of word processors, is this really necessary? Of course, there will be instances where it is useful, but I feel my time and effort are better spent mastering the language. Keen to hear other people's experiences.
You want to master Russian without being able to read and write it?
No, I can read and write it. Im specifically referring to the cursive script which is quite different to the standard printed letters. I assume you knew that already, so I'm not sure what point you are trying to make.
No, I just didn't understand your question.

I asked myself the same at the beginning and if you don't plan to be there for a longer period of time then you're right, it isn't really necessary. Also because especially mastering to read (or rather decipher) written Cyrillic is quite the pain. I'd say 8020 rule would be to be able to write a few basic things for filling out forms etc and that's good enough.
I tried writing cursive a few times but always gave up. I've never needed it.

However, it's useful to be able to read it, at least in the printed italic form that shows up frequently on signs, menus, footnotes, etc.
It's just the way the language is handwritten. It's not super useful, as you'll rarely use it in real life but I don't think it's that challenging anyways.

I'd assume that chinese language learners practice regularly their calligraphy. In comparison writting in cyrillic cursive is a piece of cake.

If you assist a language course or take an official exam you'll be expected to complete stuff in writing. Unless you take your laptop to class, you'll also have to write down your notes.

Also, as Edlefou has mentioned, you will see cursive script in many places and if you are not used to it you'll have a hard time reading it (I remember struggling with the t's and m's which look quite similar).

Overall, I don't see why you'd choose not to learn it unless you're only aiming to pick up the very basics.
Many thanks for your responses. Yeah, the "t's" and "m's" are particularly troublesome!
(11-26-2017 04:31 PM)Gopnik Wrote: [ -> ]It's just the way the language is handwritten. It's not super useful, as you'll rarely use it in real life but I don't think it's that challenging anyways.

I'd assume that chinese language learners practice regularly their calligraphy. In comparison writting in cyrillic cursive is a piece of cake.

If you assist a language course or take an official exam you'll be expected to complete stuff in writing. Unless you take your laptop to class, you'll also have to write down your notes.

Also, as Edlefou has mentioned, you will see cursive script in many places and if you are not used to it you'll have a hard time reading it (I remember struggling with the t's and m's which look quite similar).

Overall, I don't see why you'd choose not to learn it unless you're only aiming to pick up the very basics.

You see cursive a lot - especially in Ukraine. I noticed it on menus, outside buildings and in some train stations. Handwriting is quite hard to read if you haven't practiced it - it's not like english; some letters look completely different.
Russian women in the West don't seem particularly impressed when I speak to them in Russian (it's obvious looking at me that I'm not ethnic Russian, but I can hold a conversation easily). However, girls from other cultures are much more impressed by a foreigner speaking their language and are subsequently very friendly and open. What gives? What is a good way to use my language skills as a DHV without making it seem too try hard?
Not really sure I get the question.

You would never want to switch to Russian voluntarily if you find out she speaks it. That's like giving up homecourt advantage. Instead you want to be surprised and interested by the fact she's Russian, which shouldn't be a lie anyways cause that's why you learned it in the first place. At some point you'll have a chance to smoothly slip in the fact that you speak it and you'll be in like Flynn.

That's at least what I did when I swooped a Ukrainian in New York.
Taking the time to learn Russian was the best investment I ever made. But you can't half-ass it. You need to be conversationally fluent to get results.
I took 10 private lessons with an old school soviet teacher earlier this year. Total waste of money, didn´t even finish the alphabet. At least for me, learning russian the academic way with a lot of focus on grammar and hand writing is a serious motivation killer if your goal is to master A1-A2 level.

As a beginner I found "Teach yourself" books to be quite entertaining and would recommend that for people who are interested in the language, but have limited time (and energy) to go all inn.

Arado: Im my experience, speaking very little Russian, but with good pronunciation has given me a strong boost in building comfort with RU and UA girls in the west. Just rambling away for 20 seconds when you meet cute Russians on vacay in the west will get your foot in the door. They definitely appreciate your effort knowing its a language very few westerners speak.

As for Spanish, French or German chicks..they just don´t give a fuck, since it common for foreigners to speak their languages.
(12-05-2017 10:37 AM)icrus Wrote: [ -> ]Not really sure I get the question.

You would never want to switch to Russian voluntarily if you find out she speaks it. That's like giving up homecourt advantage.

I don't know. Back when I was single, I found that I got great responses by approaching Ukrainian and Russian girls in Russian. My first date after my ex-wife moved out was with a stunning little Russian cutie and I did the whole thing in Russian. I asked her if she wanted to call it a night after a few hours since we both had work the next morning and she said no, I'm having a great time, let's not.

My Russian is advanced though. I had a few girls tell me I was the only American they'd ever met with whom they could really have an adult-level conversation in Russian. Maybe that helped.
(10-27-2017 05:22 PM)estraudi Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-21-2017 08:54 PM)bucky Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-18-2017 12:42 PM)estraudi Wrote: [ -> ]
(08-20-2017 05:39 AM)peterfoo22 Wrote: [ -> ]How long has it taken people on here to get to close to fluency in Russian?

It doesn't help there are no russian people around me to conversate with.

You might try getting an on-line tutor. I've got two on-line tutors who I found on http://www.preply.com who I talk to once or twice a week just to stay in practice with my Russian. One charges $3/hr, the other $4/hr.

I have a hard time transitioning between the 2 languages. Do they help with speaking in both languages so you're not just sitting there in limbo of language?

Sorry, I just noticed your question. Do you mean can you get a tutor on Preply who also speaks English well so that he/she can explain things to you in English if needed? I'm almost sure you can, you'd just want to check out the tutor's profile and maybe message him/her to ask that. I never speak English with my tutors unless it's to ask how to say a word I can't remember, but my Russian is pretty advanced.
(11-26-2017 12:19 PM)Atticus Wrote: [ -> ]Finally enrolled in a Russian language course, after years spent self -learning. The teacher insists on us reading and writing in the cursive script. Whilst I understand that a native should be expected to do this, in the age of word processors, is this really necessary? Of course, there will be instances where it is useful, but I feel my time and effort are better spent mastering the language. Keen to hear other people's experiences.

Russians still write a lot and reading Cyrillic typed and hand written is completely different.

Your teacher is doing you a massive solid, I can read Cyrillic typed (I don't understand a lot of it but I can sound it out) but I haven't got a clue what handwritten notes say half the time, the letters are so different it just looks like hieroglyphics to me.

You need to be able to write it to fill out basically all forms and while you can write in "text" you'll look as stupid as I do when I do it and it's a blatant give away that you're not fluent.

And yeah, they use it occasionally on signs and the like (same as English I guess on this front) so it's handy to have an understanding. In fairness, it shouldn't take long to learn if you already know the alphabet and everything.
Has anyone taken the Lang Unlimited program recently?
I learned Russian in JFK's Army in Monterey, CA. It was such a good school, I could pass for native Russian at Russian parties. So could some of my classmates. After getting out and going to college, I took some courses in Russian lit, always writing my exams in cursive cyrillic, like a Russian would. Then I studied civil engineering. Constantly printing English, I somehow lost the ability to write cursive in any language but Russian. My penmanship is terrible, except in Russian cursive. Once you learn Russian cursive, it will probably stay with you like riding a bicycle. Mine did.
(12-08-2017 10:28 PM)bucky Wrote: [ -> ]
(12-05-2017 10:37 AM)icrus Wrote: [ -> ]Not really sure I get the question.

You would never want to switch to Russian voluntarily if you find out she speaks it. That's like giving up homecourt advantage.

I don't know. Back when I was single, I found that I got great responses by approaching Ukrainian and Russian girls in Russian. My first date after my ex-wife moved out was with a stunning little Russian cutie and I did the whole thing in Russian. I asked her if she wanted to call it a night after a few hours since we both had work the next morning and she said no, I'm having a great time, let's not.

My Russian is advanced though. I had a few girls tell me I was the only American they'd ever met with whom they could really have an adult-level conversation in Russian. Maybe that helped.

I've tried approaching only in English and also using Russian and have had mixed results and I know there has to be a way to use it to DHV without coming across as try-hard.

I'm not white, so I know that's a huge no-go for many Russian women - I don't make this complaint about other women so I'm not being a race troll. Because they make decisions soon after the approach, I need to bust out the Russian quickly to use the advantage before they eliminate me on race alone. Therefore it would be waiting far too long if I casually dropped a Russian phrase into the conversation 15 minutes after the approach. Has anyone found a specific technique that gives them the best bang for the buck in terms of using Russian as a DHV?
Went to pick up some jewelry in a Kay's the other day, and the counter girl greeted me in a strong Russian accent. I asked her, "otkuda vi?" and she said, "Vladivostok." As she's wrapping the jewelry, we are commenting back and forth, I'm tossing in all the Russian I can (aint as much as Id like to, but hey). After a few minutes, she turns to me and asks, "So, how do you know Russian?"

It's on. Cool

Five minutes later, had the number.
(12-16-2017 02:21 PM)Arado Wrote: [ -> ][quote='bucky' pid='1696886' dateline='1512790119']
[quote='icrus' pid='1694402' dateline='1512488257']

I'm not white, so I know that's a huge no-go for many Russian women -

Many Russian (and Russian-speaking FSU) women like Turks, so if you have a Mediterranean look (look like a Turk, Greek or Italian), you could be ok. Many Russian/Ukrainian chicks go on vacation to Turkey specifically to hook up with Turks, and many marry them. There are Russian women's blogs dedicated to Turks.
(10-21-2017 08:54 PM)bucky Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-18-2017 12:42 PM)estraudi Wrote: [ -> ]
(08-20-2017 05:39 AM)peterfoo22 Wrote: [ -> ]How long has it taken people on here to get to close to fluency in Russian?

It doesn't help there are no russian people around me to conversate with.

You might try getting an on-line tutor. I've got two on-line tutors who I found on http://www.preply.com who I talk to once or twice a week just to stay in practice with my Russian. One charges $3/hr, the other $4/hr.

The Preply tutors seem cheap not sure about the quality though.

I started my lessons on ITalki and had my 3 trial lessons which costed a few dollars total. I was very impressed with my third teacher and thinking of going with her.

If anyone wants to join Italki send me a Pm so we can both get a $10 bonus.
Russians in Russia will love you for speaking their language but you want to demonstrate your value as a foreigner before then further demonstrating the value of speaking the language.

Many of the Russians that I've met overseas have left Russia because they don't like the place and do not speak of it favourably so it wouldn't shock me that for a lot of them speaking in Russian could have negative results. There are certainly plenty who left for other reasons that will really appreciate it but if you get the ones who don't like Russia and have moved away because of that then the language probably doesn't get you any points. Think of it if you leave your tiny little town you're from because you hated the place and it only has bad memories and you meet someone who has traveled there for some reason and all they want to do is talk about it, not a great experience generally.
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