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The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
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Brosemite Offline
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Post: #226
RE: The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
^ One thing I've realized is the best opportunities come to those that can successfully hover around the upper spheres of influence. This is especially more so the case in developing economies or even first world Asia as mentioned above.

Somebody can easily make great money at a top position with a US-based MBA back in Singapore, HK, etc. The people with those opportunities were however raised in those aforementioned well-connected spheres of influences so can capitalize off those chances more easily after obtaining that "prestigious" US-based degree. Any sort of ABC (American Born Chinese) who's not completely fluent or literate in Mandarin will have a much harder time getting those opportunities back in the motherland however.

yb13
(This post was last modified: 01-20-2017 12:41 AM by Brosemite.)
01-20-2017 12:39 AM
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worldtraveler3 Offline
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Post: #227
RE: The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
Look back at your post .
You said masters .
No where was senior managers discussed.
Guy with masters- paid peanuts.
Senior managers within Fortune 500 in Asia pacific ? Definitely not peanuts, but they don't need a masters.

So your argument isn't valid.

Being a senior manager in a chosen field e.g. marketing, in the states you should already reached some kind of success in the corporate world. At least middle class if you are working for Fortune 500.

Senior managers in Asia don't need masters nowadays. Another important point in which you are wrong.
(This post was last modified: 01-20-2017 10:54 AM by worldtraveler3.)
01-20-2017 10:40 AM
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worldtraveler3 Offline
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RE: The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
Also regarding multinational look for foreigners . I suggest you take a look at the backgrounds of companies like GE and their operations in Asia. I can surely tell you that they are NOT looking for foreigners at least for 99% of the roles in apac.
Sales and marketing is pretty much 100% local. Or at least you have to have significant market experience and understanding of the respective Asian market. What can you as a foreigner offer which a local with years of local understanding and experience of the market doesn't? First answer this. If you are already quite successful in marketing in the states, maybe maybe they will do a transfer. But nowadays it's rare. Especially if you don't speak the local language and more importantly understand the local culture.

Their shared service center in shanghai recruits purely within Asia pacific, r and d centers recruits within the country. With the exception of very specialized scientists from India and North America.

The areas which we are seeing hiring foreigners are: top top CEO level executives of the country/ region, we are talking about like CEO of say Accor china. These companies make hundreds of millions of dollars of sales per year IN The country ALONE. These guys are sent over from Europe. Senior managers of Unilever, Phillips and P&G these days are more local. ( have a look at their shanghai offices).

The other area we are seeing foreigner hiring is legal area. This is where if the company is engaged in cross border contracts , say purchase agreements under U.K. Law for example, or cross border m and a. This is where specialist experience is required and locals usually won't have them.
Some operation/ system roles are also open to forigners, provided there is sufficient experience in that specific domain but we are seeing companies like Heineken hiring most of these from local markets. Disney however is sending over a lot of technical people to Asia recently, as they are expanding in these markets. They are mostly sending the guys from The states, these guys do things like procurement for the theme parks, engineering, etc.
(This post was last modified: 01-20-2017 11:13 AM by worldtraveler3.)
01-20-2017 10:45 AM
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VKdog Offline
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Post: #229
RE: The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
Large companies have many managers, yes there are managers that dont require masters, but there are managers that do require high degrees of education. I never said all senior managers require masters, and also the term senior manager is very broad,
a senior manager might even have many other senior managers above him.
no one is trying to argue with you.
(01-20-2017 10:40 AM)worldtraveler3 Wrote:  Look back at your post .
You said masters .
No where was senior managers discussed.
Guy with masters- paid peanuts.
Senior managers within Fortune 500 in Asia pacific ? Definitely not peanuts, but they don't need a masters.

So your argument isn't valid.

Being a senior manager in a chosen field e.g. marketing, in the states you should already reached some kind of success in the corporate world. At least middle class if you are working for Fortune 500.

Senior managers in Asia don't need masters nowadays. Another important point in which you are wrong.
01-20-2017 08:31 PM
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VKdog Offline
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Post: #230
RE: The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
Often canidates for top managerial positions at large companies require multiple degrees. For example a top position at large electronics company might require a masters in commerce and a masters in electronics engineering. Because his knowledge of electronic products and how they are designed from his electronics degree combined with his skill set in buisiness through his commerce degree, and combined with his ability to be fluent in two languages will help guide the company to success. So this foreigner might not
get the position of a sales and marketing manager, he will actually get a more important position with higher pay and more power.

(01-20-2017 10:45 AM)worldtraveler3 Wrote:  Also regarding multinational look for foreigners . I suggest you take a look at the backgrounds of companies like GE and their operations in Asia. I can surely tell you that they are NOT looking for foreigners at least for 99% of the roles in apac.
Sales and marketing is pretty much 100% local. Or at least you have to have significant market experience and understanding of the respective Asian market. What can you as a foreigner offer which a local with years of local understanding and experience of the market doesn't? First answer this. If you are already quite successful in marketing in the states, maybe maybe they will do a transfer. But nowadays it's rare. Especially if you don't speak the local language and more importantly understand the local culture.

Their shared service center in shanghai recruits purely within Asia pacific, r and d centers recruits within the country. With the exception of very specialized scientists from India and North America.

The areas which we are seeing hiring foreigners are: top top CEO level executives of the country/ region, we are talking about like CEO of say Accor china. These companies make hundreds of millions of dollars of sales per year IN The country ALONE. These guys are sent over from Europe. Senior managers of Unilever, Phillips and P&G these days are more local. ( have a look at their shanghai offices).

The other area we are seeing foreigner hiring is legal area. This is where if the company is engaged in cross border contracts , say purchase agreements under U.K. Law for example, or cross border m and a. This is where specialist experience is required and locals usually won't have them.
Some operation/ system roles are also open to forigners, provided there is sufficient experience in that specific domain but we are seeing companies like Heineken hiring most of these from local markets. Disney however is sending over a lot of technical people to Asia recently, as they are expanding in these markets. They are mostly sending the guys from The states, these guys do things like procurement for the theme parks, engineering, etc.
(This post was last modified: 01-20-2017 08:38 PM by VKdog.)
01-20-2017 08:37 PM
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Jack Of All Trades Offline
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Post: #231
RE: The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
This is getting sidetracked about jobs, knowing the local language is huge and adds a lot to what you can do.

Your also thinking about jobs and stuff from a western perspective where an asian american would go work as a expat in a asian country because of his assumed roots. I would argue that the flipside is happening more and more where asian expats are taking over a lot of the 2nd and 3rd world countries as asian companies are pushing into frontier markets. I saw this in eastern europe of all places where huawei and bank of china were everywhere on the billboards in poland and hungary.

I mean freaking Hisense sponsored the last euro cup in france.
(This post was last modified: 01-29-2017 05:03 AM by Jack Of All Trades.)
01-29-2017 05:02 AM
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whiteknightrises Offline
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Post: #232
RE: The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
Agreed

Korea and Japan are economically colonizing SE Asia basically

And as Chinese companies get more established, you are seeing them around more, too. I think it was in the Philippines where I saw a decent amount of people using Chinese phones (Oppo, Huawei) - whereas I never saw those phones in the US, etc (Huawei phones look sick)

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01-29-2017 12:16 PM
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worldtraveler3 Offline
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Post: #233
RE: The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
what are you talking about?

we are discussing maters at first, and now you are saying things about senior managers?

tottally different things.
01-29-2017 11:48 PM
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worldtraveler3 Offline
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Post: #234
RE: The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
you clearly are arguing and you are definitely not making your arguments CLEAR and concise.

look back at your post.

you said everything about masters. And my argument is you DON'T need them.( that should be the end of discussion?)

then you switch to senior managers saying those are related or masters or something.

Because from your wording it seems like you are saying at FIRST all about masters. then you said something about senior managers requiring masters or something, which is very confusing. Just look back at your post. Your emphasis at first is about MASTERS. that is the point you are making right? so we are not talking about senior managers or anything else. Then you said 'i have never said that senior managers require masters', well i have never said you said that. I am pointing out that senior managers don't require masters. thats a trival point. not the point of discussion.


I think there MIGHT be foreigners with higher pay and whatever benefits than the local candidate who has similar level of experience, but is this widespread? we dont know. I know some guys like i said working for DISNEY in China getting paid hundreds of thousands of dollars a year, an american guy, and his focus is on engineering procurement with the park facilities. He gets a housing allowance of 6000 USD a month plus all the benefits of driver, maid, etc. So he is living the good live. But to get to that position he has probably done things you cannot do.

But is such position common these days for foreigners compared to say 15-20 years ago? the majority of people have said no, and companies are cutting back on expat packages. This is definitely the case with Hong Kong and Singapore. My friends who expatriated here 20 years ago and settled down with decent jobs are all saying if they are to do it again right now, it would probably be too difficult. Too many expats these days and companies cutting back. One of my friend's working as SAP consultant for a fortune 500 company, and they are cutting back from 100 head count to just 30 worldwide with 5 in hong kong office. The implementation of the ERP systems have been outsourced to Accenture in India. Out of cut backs, the expats are more likely to go than the locals. Another friend came to Asia 20 years ago, worked as a bartender in HK at first while it was still under British rule, then switched to various sales positions and then finally into a private investment fund. He has said if he had to come here today and do the same thing, he wouldn't be able to do it.

Sure there are always niches where foreigners can provide value, expertise above and beyond a local can. However, these days life is tougher and tougher. A friend of mine is coming to Asia from London next month, without a job, hoping to land one and live in Hong Kong. I am warning him it might be difficult now. He used to work as a commodities trader. But he's not deterred and wants to live in Asia.

It could happen, and there are alot of expats in cities like Hong Kong or Singapore. but it is a lot harder these days.
(This post was last modified: 01-30-2017 12:15 AM by worldtraveler3.)
01-29-2017 11:49 PM
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Jack Of All Trades Offline
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Post: #235
RE: The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
(01-29-2017 12:16 PM)whiteknightrises Wrote:  Agreed

Korea and Japan are economically colonizing SE Asia basically

And as Chinese companies get more established, you are seeing them around more, too. I think it was in the Philippines where I saw a decent amount of people using Chinese phones (Oppo, Huawei) - whereas I never saw those phones in the US, etc (Huawei phones look sick)

That already started in the 1970's and 1980's but slowed down significantly in since the 1990's because of the japanese asset bubble collapse and the 20 lost years in japan. It's the same with the 1997-8 asian financial crisis and it's affect on SK, it's picking up again and you can see it everywhere in southeast asia with the accession of the AIIB.

If you look around Chinese investment is mirroring japan in the 1980's except on a much larger scale and taking a more bolder approach and going into worse shitholes like cambodia and myanmar, and of course african countries; instead of relatively developed markets like thailand.

I think it's good to be a light skinned asian man in SEA Big Grin nowadays.
(This post was last modified: 01-30-2017 01:24 AM by Jack Of All Trades.)
01-30-2017 01:22 AM
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Post: #236
RE: The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
Been incredibly inactive but thought I would share about my recent travel experience to Batam with a fellow forum member.

We took the ferry from Singapore and everything was mostly planned the night before which means we weren't exactly looking at early bird prices. Overall for a 2d1n stay at a 4star hotel and a two-way ferry ride cost about SGD130 each. Food and everything was cheap so you could practically live like a king when you're there. Batam confirmed my thoughts that Indonesia is largely online game. Go through the apps and hit on the hot ones. I downloaded an app called Tagged which is essentially a bootleg of Tinder and while I didn't meet up with any girls on the app, I got over 80+ matches just by swipping 4 days before the trip. Tinder had surprisingly little girls and had the annoying problem of matching with Singaporean girls because of how close the two islands were. Still, it yielded 5 potential girls that passed the boner test. Most were 21 and below yet horny for some sort of excitement in their lives (Batam is well and truly a shithole unless you have a purpose to be on the island) Always be ready to schedule a few dates on the same day and even the same time even because these girls prove to be very flaky. I scheduled 5 dates for my 2d1n visit and only 2 showed up. Trip would have been ruined if I was banging on my 8 to show up!

Daygame in malls were shit because the prettiest girls don't seem to come to the malls and nightgame was bad too because clubs in Batam are largely places where you pay 100+ for a bottle right at the entrance and potentially walk into an empty club. I repeat: online game.

A note for my white comrades: The hottest Indonesians tend to be those who are Chinese Indonesians. But these girls display the biggest resistance to white guys because of the social stigma of being a slut if you date a white guy. These girl will still fuck you but you have to be really discrete about what you do in public. I'm Asian and my girl refused to kiss me while we were on the streets but it was a very different story back in the hotel haha.

Some non game activities that you could do in Batam includes golfing. Because its cheaper, there tend to be a few businessmen who travel to Batam exclusively for golf. If you need a cheap getaway from Singapore or Jakarta, the resorts in Batam are pretty good at low prices.

Pardon this random rambling, typing this on my phone, will update again soon.
03-17-2017 10:20 AM
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Agastya Offline
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Post: #237
RE: The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
Have you guys ever seen an Indian dude doing well in East Asia, and if so, where? I feel like East Asia in general would be a pretty difficult place for Indian guys, I would imagine Indians are perceived fairly poorly in countries like China and Thailand. I'm not super interested in Asian girls, but I am curious.
03-20-2017 02:10 AM
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Zerdame Offline
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Post: #238
RE: The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
While the general perception of Indians in East Asia may not be the best, it serves a double edged sword. If you have good game, dress well and don't act like a general creep that is stereotyped as how some Indians act around girls, you will get compliments. I'm not going to paint a rosy picture about how there isn't any disadvantage of being Indian in East Asia but I have seen successful Indian players in Tokyo and all of them have got their game together and is genuinely fun person to be around. All universal traits that women love.
(This post was last modified: 03-20-2017 04:07 AM by Zerdame.)
03-20-2017 04:06 AM
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Spitative Offline
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Post: #239
RE: The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
Got a trip to Vietnam in 2 weeks with two of my best buddies.

Little background: I'm Vietnamese but was raised in the states. I sound like a Southern Californian white dude when I talk. I can speak Vietnamese, it's not the best, I can hold a conversation but as soon as I open my mouth they all know I'm American.

Apparently, Vietnamese girls love this. They think my accent is cute as hell.

Started pipelining on Tinder 3 days ago, I would say I'm a 8/10 in looks. Lift, dress well, good hygiene, nice smile, the basics.

Bio: 5'11 / 181 cm, Viet American. I land on 4/21. Let's party.
My friends call me (name) but you can call me toi nay (Tonight in Vietnamese).

I open with English, and then some Vietnamese stating that I can't speak that much and honestly that usually interests them.

In the states, I would average a match every 20-30 swipes I would say. Highest I've gotten it was over 500 in 2 months time.

I've gotten 350+ in the past 3 days alone. This is swiping left on the uggos and fatties. I have about 2 dozen 8's+ set up in WhatsApp and Viber ready to go when I hit the ground.

Logistics: The boys and I got a nice 3 bedroom apartment on the 20th floor of this newer building. It's central in District 1 and 5 minutes away from the main backpacker area.

Any tips? Will update after trip. I'm getting mixed up trying to balance all these chicks.
(This post was last modified: 04-04-2017 03:33 PM by Spitative.)
04-04-2017 03:32 PM
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WalterBlack Offline
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Post: #240
RE: The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
(03-20-2017 02:10 AM)Agastya Wrote:  Have you guys ever seen an Indian dude doing well in East Asia, and if so, where? I feel like East Asia in general would be a pretty difficult place for Indian guys, I would imagine Indians are perceived fairly poorly in countries like China and Thailand. I'm not super interested in Asian girls, but I am curious.

I saw a few Indian guys with cute Japanese girls in Japan, but these guys were pretty well put together and didn't look like they were from India, they looked like guys raised in western countries.

I think you come across like you're not from India, then that will help. India has a very negative image in East and SE Asia countries.Thirsty Indian FOB guys ruin things for western raised or well put together Indian guys all over the world, including the US.
04-06-2017 03:15 AM
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JWLZG Offline
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Post: #241
RE: The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
(04-06-2017 03:15 AM)WalterBlack Wrote:  I think you come across like you're not from India, then that will help. India has a very negative image in East and SE Asia countries.Thirsty Indian FOB guys ruin things for western raised or well put together Indian guys all over the world, including the US.

Interestingly, there's a small Indian community in Hong Kong (even though this is a Wikipedia link, I'd heard about them through family) IIRC, largely Sikhs, and although they keep somewhat to themselves, they're viewed pretty positively there.

When I was growing up in Singapore, I observed mixed couples of Indians and Chinese. These aren't the FOBs from the subcontinent proper but local Indians. Indians /other South Asians who were born/raised in the West wouldn't be seen as negatively as those from the mother country would be, quite the opposite. I imagine the perception in Malaysia is similar as both cultures are close enough.
04-06-2017 06:09 AM
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Zerdame Offline
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Post: #242
RE: The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
(04-04-2017 03:32 PM)Spitative Wrote:  Got a trip to Vietnam in 2 weeks with two of my best buddies.

Little background: I'm Vietnamese but was raised in the states. I sound like a Southern Californian white dude when I talk. I can speak Vietnamese, it's not the best, I can hold a conversation but as soon as I open my mouth they all know I'm American.

Apparently, Vietnamese girls love this. They think my accent is cute as hell.

Started pipelining on Tinder 3 days ago, I would say I'm a 8/10 in looks. Lift, dress well, good hygiene, nice smile, the basics.

Bio: 5'11 / 181 cm, Viet American. I land on 4/21. Let's party.
My friends call me (name) but you can call me toi nay (Tonight in Vietnamese).

I open with English, and then some Vietnamese stating that I can't speak that much and honestly that usually interests them.

In the states, I would average a match every 20-30 swipes I would say. Highest I've gotten it was over 500 in 2 months time.

I've gotten 350+ in the past 3 days alone. This is swiping left on the uggos and fatties. I have about 2 dozen 8's+ set up in WhatsApp and Viber ready to go when I hit the ground.

Logistics: The boys and I got a nice 3 bedroom apartment on the 20th floor of this newer building. It's central in District 1 and 5 minutes away from the main backpacker area.

Any tips? Will update after trip. I'm getting mixed up trying to balance all these chicks.

I say run the routine. get a popular bar, location change to a bar near you and finally to your hotel. Plan your dates carefully and early. You have the luxury of abundance. Next them if they are adamant about no sex. Your logistics are tight and Asian girls always like their men from the same race but brought up in the west. Gyepos for Koreans and Nikkeis for Japanese and ABCs for Chinese, they generally love us.
04-08-2017 09:23 PM
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Post: #243
RE: The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
(04-08-2017 09:23 PM)Zerdame Wrote:  I say run the routine. get a popular bar, location change to a bar near you and finally to your hotel. Plan your dates carefully and early. You have the luxury of abundance. Next them if they are adamant about no sex. Your logistics are tight and Asian girls always like their men from the same race but brought up in the west. Gyepos for Koreans and Nikkeis for Japanese and ABCs for Chinese, they generally love us.

They think we're cool for some odd reason, I honestly don't know why; I just roll with it.
04-08-2017 09:31 PM
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Zerdame Offline
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RE: The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
(04-08-2017 09:31 PM)Jack Of All Trades Wrote:  
(04-08-2017 09:23 PM)Zerdame Wrote:  I say run the routine. get a popular bar, location change to a bar near you and finally to your hotel. Plan your dates carefully and early. You have the luxury of abundance. Next them if they are adamant about no sex. Your logistics are tight and Asian girls always like their men from the same race but brought up in the west. Gyepos for Koreans and Nikkeis for Japanese and ABCs for Chinese, they generally love us.

They think we're cool for some odd reason, I honestly don't know why; I just roll with it.

Because while they spend thousands of dollars going to Hagwons or Eikaiwas to learn English, we come "naturally" with it. In cities like Seoul, Tokyo and Taipei, knowledge of the local language + English ability = better jobs/better husbands. Or they could be basic and like us because its 'cool' to have an Asian boyfriend who speaks English that they can flaunt to their girlfriends.
04-08-2017 09:35 PM
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RE: The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
ya but I need to learn how to get these girls for quick lays, they put up a ton of resistance for me and want to me to stay and be their "boyfriend". I ain't getting first date bangs with these girls, especially if they're good looking to hot.
04-08-2017 09:51 PM
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Zerdame Offline
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RE: The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
Then be their boyfriend. What countries are these? Normally if they want to be your girlfriend, it basically just means they want some sort of reason to not be a slut. Anyways, commitment to these girls probably means 1 mass text every morning, afternoon and night to maintain some sort of communication until the next time you're in their city.
04-08-2017 10:25 PM
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RE: The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
(04-08-2017 09:31 PM)Jack Of All Trades Wrote:  
(04-08-2017 09:23 PM)Zerdame Wrote:  I say run the routine. get a popular bar, location change to a bar near you and finally to your hotel. Plan your dates carefully and early. You have the luxury of abundance. Next them if they are adamant about no sex. Your logistics are tight and Asian girls always like their men from the same race but brought up in the west. Gyepos for Koreans and Nikkeis for Japanese and ABCs for Chinese, they generally love us.

They think we're cool for some odd reason, I honestly don't know why; I just roll with it.
My wife is Chinese from China and her impression of ABCs is that they avoid Chinese people like the plague since they despise the awkwardness being perceived as Asian causes them in the West. I think there may be some truth to this.
04-08-2017 10:48 PM
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RE: The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
(04-08-2017 10:48 PM)Lunostrelki Wrote:  My wife is Chinese from China and her impression of ABCs is that they avoid Chinese people like the plague since they despise the awkwardness being perceived as Asian causes them in the West. I think there may be some truth to this.

I'm not an ABC, but am as good as one given that I grew up in Australia. You're right in that that's the general sentiment among ABC's in Australia — ignored at best, and unease for the most part. I admit, as much as I'd rather not, that I harbour such sentiments from time to time. Confused Mostly due to a worry of being associated with being the "other" — a really awkward, daggily-dressed, un-aesthetic other — and in my case, the loss of exoticness that a critical mass of Chinese can bring. My city centre is easily 60% Asian on a given day. The vast majority don't seem to perfect their English even after a few years. Maybe it's because they're transient; unlike Chinese from other parts of Asia, who make the effort to assimilate.
04-08-2017 11:12 PM
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RE: The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
I've gotten used to being a minority, that it doesn't phase me when I go to foreign countries. My biggest culture shock is when I go to asian countries and they assume I am a local, after being used to being a minority so much, it feels great to fit in.
04-09-2017 09:42 PM
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Post: #250
RE: The Asian Travel Guide to Asia
(04-09-2017 09:42 PM)Jack Of All Trades Wrote:  I've gotten used to being a minority, that it doesn't phase me when I go to foreign countries. My biggest culture shock is when I go to asian countries and they assume I am a local, after being used to being a minority so much, it feels great to fit in.

Not sure how tall you are, but my height is enough to discount me on that note — certainly throughout all of SEA — not to mention my build and accent. Last time I was in Singapore, I had a tailor ask me if I was Japanese because I was speaking Chinese in such a strong Australian accent!

Not saying it's a great thing, but I look racially ambiguous enough that you'd think I'd fit in anywhere from Kazakhstan to the Philippines (was told by a cabbie in Nepal that I could blend in among the locals if I dropped the hiking gear). Not so.
04-09-2017 10:37 PM
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