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Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
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Manbeline Offline
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Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
A recent video by Thomas Sowell where he explains two New York blackouts, and how the time before morality declined (civil rights, welfare increases), there was little crime and business were more honest and ethical to their customers. During the second black out, after this point in history, the crime during the blackout went astronomically up.





From his view, a lot of outcomes and conflicts of today is based on the fact that there is no moral glue keeping most of society together, whether it is the fall of church or just simple morals in general shared among a people. Curious on others' interpretation of this.
(This post was last modified: 08-13-2019 02:01 PM by Manbeline.)
08-13-2019 02:00 PM
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RE: Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
I had been poor most of my life. Never had issues with violence. When I started hanging around thugs and trashy people and allowed negative influences in my life is when I got more geared towards violence. I agree with Thomas Sowells presumptions about societal violence and it's origination

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08-13-2019 03:23 PM
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infowarrior1 Offline
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RE: Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
When Japan had its earthquake in 2011. People simply lined up for their turn and no looting went on.
08-14-2019 06:30 AM
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RawGod Offline
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RE: Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
"Moral glue" is fancy theorizing. How about another hypothesis: fatherlessness plus low IQ plus high testosterone equals crime. Investigate fully before invoking metaphysics.

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08-14-2019 06:37 AM
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Rorogue Offline
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RE: Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
Can't talk as I am a rich boy but I know first hand (from my past) that no matter what your economic condition is, if your spiritual condition is in disarray you can be filled with jealousy, hatred, rage and violence.

It's especially precarious in big cities where you are constantly bombarded by materialism and the suggestion that what you have isn't enough.
08-14-2019 06:50 AM
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TigerMandingo Offline
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RE: Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
Isn’t this the same guy who says black dysfunction is because of muh Democrats and muh welfare state?
08-14-2019 07:33 AM
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infowarrior1 Offline
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RE: Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
(08-14-2019 07:33 AM)TigerMandingo Wrote:  Isn’t this the same guy who says black dysfunction is because of muh Democrats and muh welfare state?

I don't see the falsehood in those assumptions. Compare pre-welfare blacks and post-welfare blacks.One is far better than the other.
08-14-2019 07:56 AM
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TigerMandingo Offline
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RE: Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
Because it’s got nothing to do with welfare lol. Newly arrived Polish and Bosnian immigrants are on welfare. You see them robbing liquor stores? It’s a copout and beating around the bush. Plain and simple.
08-14-2019 08:00 AM
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Manbeline Offline
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RE: Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
(08-14-2019 08:00 AM)TigerMandingo Wrote:  Because it’s got nothing to do with welfare lol. Newly arrived Polish and Bosnian immigrants are on welfare. You see them robbing liquor stores? It’s a copout and beating around the bush. Plain and simple.
So are you saying blacks are inherently barbaric? I assume that's where this is headed. All scientific, of course. I'm not looking to cause any morality here.
(This post was last modified: 08-14-2019 08:39 AM by Manbeline.)
08-14-2019 08:38 AM
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infowarrior1 Offline
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RE: Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
(08-14-2019 08:00 AM)TigerMandingo Wrote:  Because it’s got nothing to do with welfare lol. Newly arrived Polish and Bosnian immigrants are on welfare. You see them robbing liquor stores? It’s a copout and beating around the bush. Plain and simple.

Perhaps. But one cannot be deny incentives doing their work in either unleashing or restraining evil. But its the heart that needs the work.
08-14-2019 08:46 AM
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TigerMandingo Offline
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RE: Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
Inherently barbaric, no. Unable to control their impulses as well as white Western folks? Definitely. Different cultural values as well, like less of an emphasis on education, being civil in public, and maintaining lower noise levels and cleanliness. I’m not gonna touch IQ because I think it’s overstated and irrelevant.
08-14-2019 08:51 AM
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Manbeline Offline
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RE: Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
Education can be blamed on the state, civility an noise levels/ cleaniness can be blamed on the poverty and pushing of the ole clubhouse jazz scene that was popping up. This is just me referring to the historic time. Today, we can easily point to all sources of why they are the way they are. And no one wants to make any strong solutions cause they fear their position as politicians.
(This post was last modified: 08-14-2019 08:59 AM by Manbeline.)
08-14-2019 08:57 AM
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RE: Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
(08-14-2019 08:51 AM)TigerMandingo Wrote:  Inherently barbaric, no. Unable to control their impulses as well as white Western folks? Definitely. Different cultural values as well, like less of an emphasis on education, being civil in public, and maintaining lower noise levels and cleanliness. I’m not gonna touch IQ because I think it’s overstated and irrelevant.
Indeed. I don't disagree. A healthy family unit underpinned by healthy sexual morality. And a Singapore style justice system would suit temperaments of the 3rd world well. Enforced by Christian black men with as excellent moral caliber as their community can muster.

Examples of punishment for vandalism:




Caning as described by Michael:




Death penalty for murder,rape and kidnapping. Executed more swiftly with the same type of requirements for evidence "beyond all reasonable doubt" in our current legal system.

Dismantling welfare bit by bit to ensure better incentives for sexual morality is a must to help make that community capable of government possible.
(This post was last modified: 08-14-2019 09:14 AM by infowarrior1.)
08-14-2019 09:10 AM
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Leonard D Neubache Offline
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RE: Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
A sinking tide lowers all boats.

Some boats are merely taller than others.

God demands of Man responsibility. God demands of Woman vulnerability. These are their curse and blessing alike. Libertianism is to Man as Feminism is to Woman.
08-14-2019 10:28 AM
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Thot Leader Offline
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RE: Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
(08-14-2019 08:51 AM)TigerMandingo Wrote:  Inherently barbaric, no. Unable to control their impulses as well as white Western folks? Definitely. Different cultural values as well, like less of an emphasis on education, being civil in public, and maintaining lower noise levels and cleanliness. I’m not gonna touch IQ because I think it’s overstated and irrelevant.

So IQ and impulse control aren't correlated? I would imagine impulse control has a lot to do with the capacity for abstract thinking.

Also, I'm looking back on how I got "outed" as a "WRT" for some of my threads that weren't even explicitly about race, and lol'ing at how quickly/quietly this forum got redpilled on the subject.
(This post was last modified: 08-14-2019 07:51 PM by Thot Leader.)
08-14-2019 07:50 PM
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Kona Offline
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RE: Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
(08-14-2019 10:28 AM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  A sinking tide lowers all boats.

Some boats are merely taller than others.

Yes but the ship that never sinks is the friendSHIP.

Aloha!
08-14-2019 08:11 PM
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RE: Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
(08-14-2019 08:11 PM)Kona Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 10:28 AM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  A sinking tide lowers all boats.

Some boats are merely taller than others.

Yes but the ship that never sinks is the friendSHIP.

Aloha!

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08-14-2019 08:21 PM
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perros Offline
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RE: Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
I believe every race of people has their characteristics.

People hate talking about this because it goes against our American notion that everyone is created equal. Which we are equal under the law but very much different in tendencies and characteristics.

But we are animals, plain and simple.

Take dogs for instance. Each breed has its own characteristics. Poodles, golden retrievers and black labs are for the most part docile and easy going dogs. German Sheppard's, Rottweiler's and Pitbulls on the other hand tend to have more aggressive tendencies if not trained right. Each dog breed is different and unique in their own way.

Humans are the same way. Each race is different and unique in their own way.
08-14-2019 08:57 PM
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RE: Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
(08-14-2019 06:37 AM)RawGod Wrote:  "Moral glue" is fancy theorizing. How about another hypothesis: fatherlessness plus low IQ plus high testosterone equals crime. Investigate fully before invoking metaphysics.

(08-14-2019 08:00 AM)TigerMandingo Wrote:  Because it’s got nothing to do with welfare lol. Newly arrived Polish and Bosnian immigrants are on welfare. You see them robbing liquor stores? It’s a copout and beating around the bush. Plain and simple.

Welfare is what makes fatherlessness an option. The 2 are linked. Moral Glue is what keeps certain groups from choosing that option more than others when it's available.


(08-14-2019 08:51 AM)TigerMandingo Wrote:  Inherently barbaric, no. Unable to control their impulses as well as white Western folks? Definitely. Different cultural values as well, like less of an emphasis on education, being civil in public, and maintaining lower noise levels and cleanliness. I’m not gonna touch IQ because I think it’s overstated and irrelevant.

All of the lower IQ, loudness and crime flow from the inner city culture. I have no idea if adopting that culture is inherent to a race.
(This post was last modified: 08-14-2019 09:50 PM by Captainstabbin.)
08-14-2019 09:49 PM
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RE: Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
(08-14-2019 09:49 PM)Captainstabbin Wrote:  
(08-14-2019 06:37 AM)RawGod Wrote:  "Moral glue" is fancy theorizing. How about another hypothesis: fatherlessness plus low IQ plus high testosterone equals crime. Investigate fully before invoking metaphysics.

(08-14-2019 08:00 AM)TigerMandingo Wrote:  Because it’s got nothing to do with welfare lol. Newly arrived Polish and Bosnian immigrants are on welfare. You see them robbing liquor stores? It’s a copout and beating around the bush. Plain and simple.

Welfare is what makes fatherlessness an option. The 2 are linked. Moral Glue is what keeps certain groups from choosing that option more than others when it's available.


(08-14-2019 08:51 AM)TigerMandingo Wrote:  Inherently barbaric, no. Unable to control their impulses as well as white Western folks? Definitely. Different cultural values as well, like less of an emphasis on education, being civil in public, and maintaining lower noise levels and cleanliness. I’m not gonna touch IQ because I think it’s overstated and irrelevant.

All of the lower IQ, loudness and crime flow from the inner city culture. I have no idea if adopting that culture is inherent to a race.

Yeah - not touching IQ, because a 70-IQ society is just as strong and prosperous as a 106-IQ one. Utter overvaluation despite clear correlation to a multitude of metrics.

There are 2 reasons for black crime and it's both mired in racial genetics - low IQ and high testosterone. Obviously you have also the culture and the way black society was in the past was based on them living by White Christian man's rules. Crime was still higher, but the marriage rate was 90% and black folk worked in various jobs that are not being filled by Mexicans.

It was the strict adherence and strong Western culture which kept the crime mostly at bay in black society. Also young black men who crossed the line were punished severely - I wonder how many black guys who could not control their temper were incarcerated before having been able to sire 5 kids with 3 different women by 21?

There is correlation to culture of course, but even the Jewish Ethopians while adhering fully to orthodox Jewry - they do far more crime in Israel than the locals - hundreds of percent more!

So the only conclusion after looking at the diaspora and a ton of data from the West to Brazil to Israel - is racial differences and IQ are fundamentally different.

In a way the 1950s model was oppressive from Whites towards blacks and while unfair to some degree, it also suppressed the negative tendencies. Even in a full free fair society the stats would be terrible.
08-15-2019 04:56 AM
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RE: Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
Being dumb doesn’t cause you to commit crime. And we’re not talking about successful and prosperous nations. The reasons are complex, and like I said, culture and the way black American kids are raised has a lot to do with it. Yes, we’re well-aware of “muh Africa has average 75-IQ”. Whatever. Human behavior can’t be reduced down to a number, no matter how many autists continue to do so.
08-15-2019 08:10 AM
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RE: Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
(08-14-2019 08:51 AM)TigerMandingo Wrote:  Inherently barbaric, no. Unable to control their impulses as well as white Western folks? Definitely. Different cultural values as well, like less of an emphasis on education, being civil in public, and maintaining lower noise levels and cleanliness. I’m not gonna touch IQ because I think it’s overstated and irrelevant.

I'll touch IQ, because I believe it's totally relevant. What group has outsized success in the U.S? A small percent of the population, but an enormous percent of CEOs, Hollywood moguls, banking leaders, and Supreme Court justices? Then ask, what group, world-wide, has the highest average IQ? Its the same group: Ashkenazi jews, average IQ around 112. Coincidence? Seems unlikely.

Then ask what group performs SECOND best in the United States: It's Asians, who far outperform whites. And who has the second-highest IQ? Asians, around 106.

Third best performing group? Caucasians (this, in the country they founded and developed!). Third highest average IQ? Caucasians, around 100. If you want to shut down a white suprematist, ask him why he can't do better than third in what is basically his own society.

Hispanics and africans are next on the IQ score, and also on their performance in society. Note that these are GLOBAL IQ scores, not just US scores. So don't bother with the "the test is culturally insensitive, the test is raciss!". Even in IQ tests administered in Africa, africans perform below the groups noted above.

This is all verboten to speak of now, but I believe in 30-50 years it will be accepted science. Much like Galileo was persecuted for saying the earth revolved around the sun, but of course the truth won out eventually; it always does. So some day, we may be giving out welfare and "Diversity hires" not according to how poor you are or what color you are, but according to your IQ. Ultimately, I expect that in 50-100 years genetic engineering will have advanced to a point where IQ differences between the races will have been eliminated, and we will have harmony. Hope I live to see it.
(This post was last modified: 08-15-2019 08:36 AM by DogLover.)
08-15-2019 08:34 AM
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Leonard D Neubache Offline
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RE: Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
IQ appears to be related but not entirely indicative.

There are groups of people who are dumb by European standards but for whatever reason have bred to be socially responsible and behave as such.

On the other hand we all know of a certain tribe that have the IQ required for thoughtful, polite behavior yet still act like assholes 24/7.

Average behavioral traits are indeed inherited but they're not linked inextricably to IQ.

God demands of Man responsibility. God demands of Woman vulnerability. These are their curse and blessing alike. Libertianism is to Man as Feminism is to Woman.
(This post was last modified: 08-15-2019 08:39 AM by Leonard D Neubache.)
08-15-2019 08:37 AM
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RE: Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
(08-14-2019 06:37 AM)RawGod Wrote:  "Moral glue" is fancy theorizing. How about another hypothesis: fatherlessness plus low IQ plus high testosterone equals crime. Investigate fully before invoking metaphysics.

Glad to see a post like this. People are starting to question the standard conservative party line.

I want to tie the idea of low I.Q. and fatherlessness together. What has happened in lower-class community (of all races) is that women are not expected to marry, so they no longer look for men who are "marriage material."

That means they pass up the men who are responsible and intelligent, and instead breed with players. The end result is the two problems I singled out here: You get low I.Q. kids with no dads.

Both liberals and conservatives will argue this point, claiming genetics don't matter so much. Really? Then why is it that when their men are infertile, the couples go to sperm banks and seek donors with high I.Q.s from Ivy League universities? Why not just mate with the town drug dealer (like lower-class women do)? It would be cheaper than paying for Ivy League sperm.
08-15-2019 08:47 AM
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RE: Moral Decline Caused Crime, Not Poverty
(08-15-2019 08:37 AM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  IQ appears to be related but not entirely indicative.

There are groups of people who are dumb by European standards but for whatever reason have bred to be socially responsible and behave as such.

On the other hand we all know of a certain tribe that have the IQ required for thoughtful, polite behavior yet still act like assholes 24/7.

Average behavioral traits are indeed inherited but they're not linked inextricably to IQ.

Israel Folau is a good example of a group known as Pacific Islanders who due to their genuine faith are salt of the earth despite in many cases being dumb by European standards.
08-15-2019 10:06 AM
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