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The NBA Thread
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Chewbacon Offline
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Post: #2126
RE: The NBA Thread
(06-27-2014 10:57 AM)iWin Wrote:  







If Jabari and Wiggins pan out those battles are gone be something. Many compare Jabari to Melo and there are a ton of similarities strengths-wise, with their weaknesses being identical too.




ppl in this thread seem to always be bearish on carmelo.

But as I've said before, carmelo is arguably the best 2nd option in the NBA. Just look at the damage he did on team USA.

He cannot be efficient as a first option, but as a second option he is supremely efficient.

If I were a coach and had a better first option (lebron, KD), I would use carmelo primarily for catch-and-shoots at the 3, or to post up to give my first option some rest.
06-27-2014 11:09 AM
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RE: The NBA Thread
(06-27-2014 11:06 AM)YoungDominican Wrote:  But on the topic of is Kobe better than Lebron, the reason I think Kobe is better : I think he is a lot more clutch than Lebron, has a better ability to take over the game and create plays and Lebron's a dick.

Now we are getting somewhere. I will say this, when it comes to clutch stats, LeBron is way ahead of Kobe. Clutch is usually defined as the last 5 minutes of the game when the game is within 5 points. LeBron also has more playoff game winners than Kobe. It really comes down to what you prefer. If you prefer your best player to take the shot even over 2 or 3 defenders, sure you can go with Kobe. If you prefer your best player to take the shot if he can or find an open man which is much more likely to go in (percentage wise), then you take LeBron. For the record, once PJ got to Chicago even MJ was a lot like LeBron. He would take the shot if he was single covered or he would find the open man (Kerr, Paxon etc.) for the better shot.

Taking over the game is arguable and need to be more specific.

Creating plays, LeBron's the better playmaker and passer (though Kobe is just as good when he tries). I didn't think that would be up for debate.

As for being a dick, I got nothing lol. I think both are dicks. MJ was a dick, Kobe was a dick, LeBron is also arrogant and so was Shaq etc. I think that just comes down to which players you like and which players you dislike. Players that you like, you tend to ignore that stuff, players you don't like stick out and you hate on them even more lol.
06-27-2014 11:14 AM
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Post: #2128
RE: The NBA Thread
(06-27-2014 11:06 AM)YoungDominican Wrote:  Yeah no, you're right, not even sure what I was arguing about now
But on the topic of is Kobe better than Lebron, the reason I think Kobe is better : I think he is a lot more clutch than Lebron, has a better ability to take over the game and create plays and Lebron's a dick.

Lebron's personality has no bearing on his talent. Michael Jordan was a HUGE DICK..and yet he is GOAT.

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06-27-2014 11:15 AM
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Rotisserie Offline
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Post: #2129
RE: The NBA Thread
(06-27-2014 10:57 AM)iWin Wrote:  If Jabari and Wiggins pan out those battles are gone be something. Many compare Jabari to Melo and there are a ton of similarities strengths-wise, with their weaknesses being identical too.

Man Jabari is silky smooth. Great jumper. He's a Carmelo clone.

I don't understand how people are down on Wiggins. One ESPN writer said he'd be 'more Corey Brewer than even Vince Carter or Tmac.' I don't understand how some of these writers get paid to write shit like that. Wiggins is a crazy good athlete, and he will develop some handling and a better shooting touch. If everything works out, I don't see how he'll be any less than a Scottie Pippen-type player.

I guess the Cavs had a difficult choice to make. Would you rather have Scottie, or Carmelo? I would vote Scottie, based on superior D and the potential he becomes an offensive machine.
06-27-2014 11:19 AM
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Rotisserie Offline
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RE: The NBA Thread
(06-27-2014 11:09 AM)SHANbangs Wrote:  If I were a coach and had a better first option (lebron, KD), I would use carmelo primarily for catch-and-shoots at the 3, or to post up to give my first option some rest.

The problem is you're paying max money for an admittedly exceptional situational player just to catch and shoot 3s who can't defend PFs or athletic 3s. You can't pay Carmelo max money and win a championship.
06-27-2014 11:22 AM
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Post: #2131
RE: The NBA Thread
(06-27-2014 11:14 AM)TheSlayer Wrote:  
(06-27-2014 11:06 AM)YoungDominican Wrote:  But on the topic of is Kobe better than Lebron, the reason I think Kobe is better : I think he is a lot more clutch than Lebron, has a better ability to take over the game and create plays and Lebron's a dick.

Now we are getting somewhere. I will say this, when it comes to clutch stats, LeBron is way ahead of Kobe. Clutch is usually defined as the last 5 minutes of the game when the game is within 5 points. LeBron also has more playoff game winners than Kobe. It really comes down to what you prefer. If you prefer your best player to take the shot even over 2 or 3 defenders, sure you can go with Kobe. If you prefer your best player to take the shot if he can or find an open man which is much more likely to go in (percentage wise), then you take LeBron. For the record, once PJ got to Chicago even MJ was a lot like LeBron. He would take the shot if he was single covered or he would find the open man (Kerr, Paxon etc.) for the better shot.

Taking over the game is arguable and need to be more specific.

Creating plays, LeBron's the better playmaker and passer (though Kobe is just as good when he tries). I didn't think that would be up for debate.

As for being a dick, I got nothing lol. I think both are dicks. MJ was a dick, Kobe was a dick, LeBron is also arrogant and so was Shaq etc. I think that just comes down to which players you like and which players you dislike. Players that you like, you tend to ignore that stuff, players you don't like stick out and you hate on them even more lol.

When I use clutch I mean at a point where his team needs him, not the last 5 minutes of the game. Bad habit that's how we use it here.

By taking over the game I mean he starts making shit happen, making plays and shots.

Lebron isn't a better passer, just more likely to pass.

(06-27-2014 11:15 AM)Moma Wrote:  Lebron's personality has no bearing on his talent. Michael Jordan was a HUGE DICK..and yet he is GOAT.

I didn't say that it did.

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There's way more people that want it than people that have it.
(This post was last modified: 06-27-2014 11:50 AM by YoungDominican.)
06-27-2014 11:36 AM
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TheSlayer Offline
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RE: The NBA Thread
(06-27-2014 11:36 AM)YoungDominican Wrote:  When I use clutch I mean at a point where his team needs him, not the last 5 minutes of the game.

By taking over the game I mean he starts making shit happen, making plays and shots.

Lebron isn't a better passer, just more likely to pass.

Then that's a completely arbitrary standard that you made which can't be quantified and measured. By any other definition of clutch: last 5 minutes in close games, game winners, last minute of close games, LeBron is better than Kobe statistically. That's a fact, bro. Not a made-up arbitrary standard lol.

You have got to quantify it better than making "shit happen, making plays and shots". What does that even mean?

As for a better passer? Is that really a debate? LeBron's a much more better passer than Kobe. You don't have to argue everything about your favorite player, just like I won't argue that Kobe isn't a better mid-range shooter than LeBron.
(This post was last modified: 06-27-2014 11:52 AM by TheSlayer.)
06-27-2014 11:50 AM
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RE: The NBA Thread
(06-27-2014 11:50 AM)TheSlayer Wrote:  
(06-27-2014 11:36 AM)YoungDominican Wrote:  When I use clutch I mean at a point where his team needs him, not the last 5 minutes of the game.

By taking over the game I mean he starts making shit happen, making plays and shots.

Lebron isn't a better passer, just more likely to pass.

Then that's a completely arbitrary standard that you made which can't be quantified and measured. By any other definition of clutch: last 5 minutes in close games, game winners, last minute of close games, LeBron is better than Kobe statistically. That's a fact, bro. Not a made-up arbitrary standard lol.

You have got to quantify it better than making "shit happen, making plays and shots". What does that even mean?

As for a better passer? Is that really a debate? LeBron's a much more better passer than Kobe. You don't have to argue everything about your favorite player, just like I won't argue that Kobe isn't a better mid-range shooter than LeBron.

It's not arbitrary and I didn't make it up. You can measure how many shots/plays a player makes in a high pressure situation. For instance a team is down by 20 at half time. A clutch player will rise up and start knocking down points/creating plays.

What do you mean quantify it better? I thought it was pretty clear.

Like I said, Kobe just passes less than lebron. Lebron has more turnovers per game than Kobe, that's one illustration.

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There's way more people that want it than people that have it.
(This post was last modified: 06-27-2014 12:10 PM by YoungDominican.)
06-27-2014 12:10 PM
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Brosemite Offline
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RE: The NBA Thread
(06-27-2014 10:30 AM)Moma Wrote:  Of course it's the team. If you play with scrubs, you lose..Kobe lucked into a team that had four all stars at one point in one year..everyone wants to go and play in LA..and many will take a paycut just to get an opp to play in great cities where you can enjoy your money.

Who wants to play in OKC or Minnesota? What is there to do?

This is a problem with the NBA & NHL where longer seasons means that players prefer to play in bigger entertainment markets & are willing to take paycuts to do so. Figuring in training camp till end of regular season (Sept till Mid-April), players will essentially spend 8 months out of the year in their franchise's city and longer periods (1-2 more months depending on postseason status).

In the NFL, it's more about the chance to win & compensation because training camp till the end of the regular season is basically late July till early January which is about a 5.5 month span allowing players to train/live elsewhere remainder of the year. Big name players therefore will not mind signing contracts with "smaller markets" such as Green Bay, Buffalo, Indy, or Cincy so long as they're getting good money or contention opportunities.

yb13
(This post was last modified: 06-27-2014 12:50 PM by Brosemite.)
06-27-2014 12:42 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
With the 11th pick the Chicago Bulls select Doug McDermott (McBuckets) PF from Creighton University








The Bulls gave up two first round picks (the 16th and 19th) to move up to get this guy! I hope he pans out for them. There is already a lot of upset fans in Chicago saying that he's going to be a bust and that he's too small and that he's fat and he won't be able to beat the big NBA guys.

The truth is that the Bulls need a scorer and the guy has a sick and smooth release. He will fit right in with the Bulls elite defense. I hope Tom Thibs can make him a good player. Very excited.
(This post was last modified: 06-27-2014 01:31 PM by MidWest.)
06-27-2014 01:30 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
(06-27-2014 11:19 AM)Rotisserie Wrote:  
(06-27-2014 10:57 AM)iWin Wrote:  If Jabari and Wiggins pan out those battles are gone be something. Many compare Jabari to Melo and there are a ton of similarities strengths-wise, with their weaknesses being identical too.

Man Jabari is silky smooth. Great jumper. He's a Carmelo clone.

I don't understand how people are down on Wiggins. One ESPN writer said he'd be 'more Corey Brewer than even Vince Carter or Tmac.' I don't understand how some of these writers get paid to write shit like that. Wiggins is a crazy good athlete, and he will develop some handling and a better shooting touch. If everything works out, I don't see how he'll be any less than a Scottie Pippen-type player.

I guess the Cavs had a difficult choice to make. Would you rather have Scottie, or Carmelo? I would vote Scottie, based on superior D and the potential he becomes an offensive machine.

Agreed Wiggins is raw right now, but he's amongst the top 2 wing defenders in the draft along with Gary Harris and is an off the charts athlete. He has a good base now skills wise and the work ethic to really improve down the line, so at the very least the Cavs are getting an elite defender down the line. Jabari is far more polished on O, but with a backcourt featuring Kyrie and Waiters who are awful defenders it made a lot of sense to grab Wiggins. Jabari is just terrible on defense and will struggle in that area for some time since he lacks tools physical tools like lateral quickness, despite being a very good athlete. As far as the projections, it's really anyone's guess. Scouts have a methodology for what they deem is a good prospect, but they get it wrong gall the time. The best thing to do is just wait and see.
06-27-2014 01:37 PM
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TheSlayer Offline
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RE: The NBA Thread
(06-27-2014 12:10 PM)YoungDominican Wrote:  It's not arbitrary and I didn't make it up. You can measure how many shots/plays a player makes in a high pressure situation. For instance a team is down by 20 at half time. A clutch player will rise up and start knocking down points/creating plays.

What do you mean quantify it better? I thought it was pretty clear.

Like I said, Kobe just passes less than lebron. Lebron has more turnovers per game than Kobe, that's one illustration.

That is an arbitrary standard. How do you quantify? Do you have some stat to show that when Kobe's team is down 20 he "will rise up and start knocking down points/creating plays". That's a statement which can't really be backed with any facts and doesn't lend itself to productive discussion.

If anything, LeBron's style leads to more "takeover" for games. LeBron will score, get his team involved, and takeover. Kobe will attack as a one-man force which may or may not work.

Okay, even if I concede the arguments that Kobe is a better passer (which he isn't), you don't get points for not doing something while maintaining that you are better at it than player X. Of course, LeBron has more turnovers but he also has more assists than Kobe for his career while scoring roughly the same number of points.

The way you are making points for Kobe is really rudimentary and does not creative an objective debate. I could just as well say LeBron is clutch the entire game and knocks down more shots and makes plays whenever needed, not just when his team is down 20. But that is a meaningless statement and that's what you are doing.

Here, I will try to create a real discussion with some facts and stats:

[Image: bwtxfczcmae-dec-large.png]

Quote:Since LeBron came into the league in 2003-04, nobody in the NBA has made more game-tying and go-ahead shots in the final 24 seconds of playoff games than LeBron, who is 7-of-16 on those shots. His 43.8 field goal percentage on those clutch shots ranks the best in the NBA since his rookie season among players with at least 10 attempts. The league average is 28.3 percent on those shots.
06-27-2014 01:39 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
(06-27-2014 11:19 AM)Rotisserie Wrote:  
(06-27-2014 10:57 AM)iWin Wrote:  If Jabari and Wiggins pan out those battles are gone be something. Many compare Jabari to Melo and there are a ton of similarities strengths-wise, with their weaknesses being identical too.

Man Jabari is silky smooth. Great jumper. He's a Carmelo clone.

I don't understand how people are down on Wiggins. One ESPN writer said he'd be 'more Corey Brewer than even Vince Carter or Tmac.' I don't understand how some of these writers get paid to write shit like that. Wiggins is a crazy good athlete, and he will develop some handling and a better shooting touch. If everything works out, I don't see how he'll be any less than a Scottie Pippen-type player.

I guess the Cavs had a difficult choice to make. Would you rather have Scottie, or Carmelo? I would vote Scottie, based on superior D and the potential he becomes an offensive machine.

I agree. His upside is Pippin whom was a all time great. The lowest he could go is still better then the majority of the league. He is a project but with patience the Cavs will be rewarded.

Vince never had a deep shot when he came in. It took him a long time to get range in his shot. People (writers and media) have just been spoiled by freak athletes like KD and Bron whom were pretty much ready to roll out once they were drafted. People knocking Wiggins on his poor shot are dumb, he will get better as will Parker with his flat as fuck defense.
06-27-2014 01:58 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
(06-27-2014 01:39 PM)TheSlayer Wrote:  
(06-27-2014 12:10 PM)YoungDominican Wrote:  [Image: bwtxfczcmae-dec-large.png]

Nothing more annoying the ESPN random mean nothing stats...

"First player to score more then 40 points when eating whole wheat pasta pre-game instead of white"

"First player to have no vowels in his name and make consecutive All-Star games"
06-27-2014 02:02 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
(06-27-2014 02:02 PM)kosko Wrote:  Nothing more annoying the ESPN random mean nothing stats...

"First player to score more then 40 points when eating whole wheat pasta pre-game instead of white"

"First player to have no vowels in his name and make consecutive All-Star games"

Kosko, that's not a random stat and not really a fair point. A lot of us put a lot of credence into close games and game winners. That's what this stat shows. Don't get me wrong, ESPN and the media do have a lot of random stats but this is not one of them. It is certainly better than saying Kobe is more clutch because when his team is down he starts knocking down buckets and making plays.

I like to discuss my hoops with stats and objectivity instead of narratives which can't really be backed by anything.
(This post was last modified: 06-27-2014 02:06 PM by TheSlayer.)
06-27-2014 02:04 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
(06-27-2014 01:39 PM)TheSlayer Wrote:  
(06-27-2014 12:10 PM)YoungDominican Wrote:  It's not arbitrary and I didn't make it up. You can measure how many shots/plays a player makes in a high pressure situation. For instance a team is down by 20 at half time. A clutch player will rise up and start knocking down points/creating plays.

What do you mean quantify it better? I thought it was pretty clear.

Like I said, Kobe just passes less than lebron. Lebron has more turnovers per game than Kobe, that's one illustration.

That is an arbitrary standard. How do you quantify? Do you have some stat to show that when Kobe's team is down 20 he "will rise up and start knocking down points/creating plays". That's a statement which can't really be backed with any facts and doesn't lend itself to productive discussion.

If anything, LeBron's style leads to more "takeover" for games. LeBron will score, get his team involved, and takeover. Kobe will attack as a one-man force which may or may not work.

Okay, even if I concede the arguments that Kobe is a better passer (which he isn't), you don't get points for not doing something while maintaining that you are better at it than player X. Of course, LeBron has more turnovers but he also has more assists than Kobe for his career while scoring roughly the same number of points.

The way you are making points for Kobe is really rudimentary and does not creative an objective debate. I could just as well say LeBron is clutch the entire game and knocks down more shots and makes plays whenever needed, not just when his team is down 20. But that is a meaningless statement and that's what you are doing.

Here, I will try to create a real discussion with some facts and stats:

[Image: bwtxfczcmae-dec-large.png]

Quote:Since LeBron came into the league in 2003-04, nobody in the NBA has made more game-tying and go-ahead shots in the final 24 seconds of playoff games than LeBron, who is 7-of-16 on those shots. His 43.8 field goal percentage on those clutch shots ranks the best in the NBA since his rookie season among players with at least 10 attempts. The league average is 28.3 percent on those shots.

You went ahead and took the "down by 20 at halftime" example very literally.

When you say attack as a one man force, do you mean he takes all the shots and not allow for other teammates to partake because I don't understand where you got that idea from. Kobe will start taking and making more shots when his team around him isn't playing up to par.

The funny thing about that statement is that, in the last 30 seconds Kobe has shot better clutch shots than Lebron.

http://swishnba.com/2013/10/11/kobe-vs-l...re-clutch/

Last 24 seconds

Kobe: 46 for 155 (29.7%)

LeBron: 28 for 91 (30.8%)

Last 30 seconds

Kobe (since 01): 65 for 181 (35.9%)

LeBron: 32 for 100 (32.00%)

The rewards I see from working is what made me an addict.
There's way more people that want it than people that have it.
06-27-2014 02:06 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
(06-27-2014 02:06 PM)YoungDominican Wrote:  The funny thing about that statement is that, in the last 30 seconds Kobe has shot better clutch shots than Lebron.

http://swishnba.com/2013/10/11/kobe-vs-l...re-clutch/

Last 24 seconds

Kobe: 46 for 155 (29.7%)

LeBron: 28 for 91 (30.8%)

Last 30 seconds

Kobe (since 01): 65 for 181 (35.9%)

LeBron: 32 for 100 (32.00%)

Did you even fully read the link, bro?

Quote:Regular Season; a shot to tie or take the lead

Last 24 seconds

Kobe: 46 for 155 (29.7%)

LeBron: 28 for 91 (30.8%)

Last 30 seconds

Kobe (since 01): 65 for 181 (35.9%)

LeBron: 32 for 100 (32.00%)

Last 2 minutes

Kobe (since 01): 125 for 327 (38.2%)

LeBron: 84 for 213 (39.4%)

Last 5 minutes

Kobe (since 2001 season): 233 for 555 (41.9%)

LeBron (since 04 season): 173 for 399 (43.4%)

Conclusion: Neither Kobe or LeBron shoot a good percentage when the time is winding down (last 30 seconds or less) although LeBron has the edge in the last 24 seconds compared to Kobe having the edge in the last 30 seconds. In the last 2 minutes and 5 minutes of a regular season game LeBron has the edge over Kobe. Overall I would give LeBron the edge as he leads in 3 out of the 4 categories.

LeBron has a slight edge in the regular season, if you read more:

Quote:Post Season; a shot to tie or take the lead

Last 24 seconds

Kobe: 7 for 28 (25.0%)

LeBron: 7 for 17 (41.1%)

Last 30 seconds

Kobe: 7 for 28 (25.0%) (0 for 8 from the 09 post season till present day)

LeBron: 9 for 19 (47.30%)

Last 2 minutes

Kobe: 17 for 50 (34%) (0 for 8 in the last two playoffs; 2010 and 2011)

LeBron: 21 for 43 (48.8%)

Last 5 minutes

Kobe (since 01 season): 30 for 88 (34.09%)

LeBron: (since 06 season): 36 for 74 (48.6%)

Conclusion: In the last 24 seconds and 30 seconds of a post season game Kobe only shoots 25%, which is terrible. LeBron however is clearly ‘more clutch’ shooting 41% in the last 24 seconds and 47% in the last 30 seconds of a game. This disparity between LeBron and Kobe continues as in the last 2 minutes and 5 minutes of a game LeBron shoots 14% higher than Kobe in both circumstances. Overall LeBron is more ‘clutch’ in a land-slide.

You are making my point for me. In the RS, LeBron has a slight edge. In the postseason LeBron has much better clutch stats than Kobe.

If you read more:

Quote:Playoff Games

Game 7 of a Playoff Series

Kobe 22.2ppg on 38.9% FG with 8.0rpg and 5.0apg (6 games)

LeBron *34.0ppg on 46.5% FG with 8.1rpg and 3.5 APG (4 games) (* NBA Record)

LeBron is clearly the better player when it pertains to game 7s

Elimination Games

Kobe 21.5 ppg on 41.4% FG with 5.8rpg and 3.5apg (19 games)

LeBron 31.5 ppg on 46% FG with 10.0rpg and 6.5apg (12 games)

LeBron is also clearly the better player when facing elimination.

I rest my case.
(This post was last modified: 06-27-2014 02:13 PM by TheSlayer.)
06-27-2014 02:12 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
(06-27-2014 02:12 PM)TheSlayer Wrote:  
(06-27-2014 02:06 PM)YoungDominican Wrote:  The funny thing about that statement is that, in the last 30 seconds Kobe has shot better clutch shots than Lebron.

http://swishnba.com/2013/10/11/kobe-vs-l...re-clutch/

Last 24 seconds

Kobe: 46 for 155 (29.7%)

LeBron: 28 for 91 (30.8%)

Last 30 seconds

Kobe (since 01): 65 for 181 (35.9%)

LeBron: 32 for 100 (32.00%)

Did you even fully read the link, bro?

Quote:Regular Season; a shot to tie or take the lead

Last 24 seconds

Kobe: 46 for 155 (29.7%)

LeBron: 28 for 91 (30.8%)

Last 30 seconds

Kobe (since 01): 65 for 181 (35.9%)

LeBron: 32 for 100 (32.00%)

Last 2 minutes

Kobe (since 01): 125 for 327 (38.2%)

LeBron: 84 for 213 (39.4%)

Last 5 minutes

Kobe (since 2001 season): 233 for 555 (41.9%)

LeBron (since 04 season): 173 for 399 (43.4%)

Conclusion: Neither Kobe or LeBron shoot a good percentage when the time is winding down (last 30 seconds or less) although LeBron has the edge in the last 24 seconds compared to Kobe having the edge in the last 30 seconds. In the last 2 minutes and 5 minutes of a regular season game LeBron has the edge over Kobe. Overall I would give LeBron the edge as he leads in 3 out of the 4 categories.

LeBron has a slight edge in the regular season, if you read more:

Quote:Post Season; a shot to tie or take the lead

Last 24 seconds

Kobe: 7 for 28 (25.0%)

LeBron: 7 for 17 (41.1%)

Last 30 seconds

Kobe: 7 for 28 (25.0%) (0 for 8 from the 09 post season till present day)

LeBron: 9 for 19 (47.30%)

Last 2 minutes

Kobe: 17 for 50 (34%) (0 for 8 in the last two playoffs; 2010 and 2011)

LeBron: 21 for 43 (48.8%)

Last 5 minutes

Kobe (since 01 season): 30 for 88 (34.09%)

LeBron: (since 06 season): 36 for 74 (48.6%)

Conclusion: In the last 24 seconds and 30 seconds of a post season game Kobe only shoots 25%, which is terrible. LeBron however is clearly ‘more clutch’ shooting 41% in the last 24 seconds and 47% in the last 30 seconds of a game. This disparity between LeBron and Kobe continues as in the last 2 minutes and 5 minutes of a game LeBron shoots 14% higher than Kobe in both circumstances. Overall LeBron is more ‘clutch’ in a land-slide.

You are making my point for me. In the RS, LeBron has a slight edge. In the postseason LeBron has much better clutch stats than Kobe.

If you read more:

Quote:Playoff Games

Game 7 of a Playoff Series

Kobe 22.2ppg on 38.9% FG with 8.0rpg and 5.0apg (6 games)

LeBron *34.0ppg on 46.5% FG with 8.1rpg and 3.5 APG (4 games) (* NBA Record)

LeBron is clearly the better player when it pertains to game 7s

Elimination Games

Kobe 21.5 ppg on 41.4% FG with 5.8rpg and 3.5apg (19 games)

LeBron 31.5 ppg on 46% FG with 10.0rpg and 6.5apg (12 games)

LeBron is also clearly the better player when facing elimination.

I rest my case.

I did fully read it about an hour ago. Let's rest with in about 10 years when all the stats are done we will know who was truly better.

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06-27-2014 02:18 PM
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TheSlayer Offline
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RE: The NBA Thread
(06-27-2014 02:18 PM)YoungDominican Wrote:  I did fully read it about an hour ago. Let's rest with in about 10 years when all the stats are done we will know who was truly better.

Oh, true. So you did see LeBron has a huge advantage in post-season and elimination game stats. In the regular season it's more of a toss-up.

Sure, we can look again in 10 years. But Kobe's stats won't get any better as he enters the last phase of his career and I do hope we see him do well. LeBron's advantage will remain pronounced unless he totally falls off a cliff.

Again, none of this is to say Kobe is not an all-time great. He is and I have him on my top 10 all-time list but when comparing him as a player to LeBron, especially their peaks and primes, LeBron is ahead and should have another 2-3 prime years left in him.
06-27-2014 02:22 PM
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YoungDominican Offline
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RE: The NBA Thread
I don't think Kobe will stay down, he will always get back up and go again. I'm not sure if I can say the same about Lecramp.
They are both greats, no one can deny that.


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(This post was last modified: 06-27-2014 02:29 PM by YoungDominican.)
06-27-2014 02:25 PM
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TheSlayer Offline
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RE: The NBA Thread
(06-27-2014 02:25 PM)YoungDominican Wrote:  I don't think Kobe will stay down, he will always get back up and go again. I'm not sure if I can say the same about Lecramp.
They are both greats, no one can deny that.

You do realize Kobe is 36 years old coming off two major surgeries. There's a real chance that he may come back as the Wizards' MJ. On the other LeCramp will turn 30 in December and probably has another 2-3 prime years left. In that sense, Kobe's stats will take a hit.

I do wish to see him perform at a high level again but I am not sure given his age and injuries.
06-27-2014 02:44 PM
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Moma Offline
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RE: The NBA Thread
For the Lebron Haters, also realise that since he went to Miami, he took them to the finals 4 years in a row.

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06-27-2014 05:32 PM
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Kish Offline
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RE: The NBA Thread
The only stat that matters concerning Kobe and Lebron

Championship rings
Kobe 5

Lebron 2

And one of those championships was during a shortened season.
(This post was last modified: 06-27-2014 06:06 PM by Kish.)
06-27-2014 06:02 PM
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Moma Offline
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RE: The NBA Thread
(06-27-2014 06:02 PM)Kish Wrote:  The only stat that matters concerning Kobe and Lebron

Championship rings
Kobe 5

Lebron 2

And one of those championships was during a shortened season.

Kobe has 2 rings as a leader (the focal point of the team). Minus the 3 with Shaq because even Kerry Kittles could have pulled 3 with Shaq, he was that dominant.

Lebron also has 2 rings as the focal point of the team.

So they are tied Banana

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06-27-2014 06:21 PM
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YoungDominican Offline
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RE: The NBA Thread
(06-27-2014 06:02 PM)Kish Wrote:  The only stat that matters concerning Kobe and Lebron

Championship rings
Kobe 5

Lebron 2

And one of those championships was during a shortened season.

I was just about to recount the championship rings. Can't not count that in the final debate. Who got rings like they were supposed to. A lot is put on the star players during the playoffs, the way the star players play the rest of the team usually falls around it. Lebron disappears ,as proven in the last couple playoffs, when the going gets tough.
So 5 rings Kobe, Kobe is the victor.

The rewards I see from working is what made me an addict.
There's way more people that want it than people that have it.
(This post was last modified: 06-27-2014 06:23 PM by YoungDominican.)
06-27-2014 06:22 PM
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