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The NBA Thread
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JayMillz Offline
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Post: #751
RE: The NBA Thread
Along with Michael Jordan, Magic Johnson, Lew Alcindor, Kobe Bryant, Larry Bird, and Walt "Clyde" Frazier ... one of my all time favorite players ... and more exciting than anyone currently in the league: http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nba-ball-d...49594.html
06-11-2013 09:40 AM
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Timoteo Offline
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Post: #752
RE: The NBA Thread
(06-10-2013 11:49 PM)Vacancier Permanent Wrote:  Nice analysis Timoteo! I agree that the game was much more physical and harder in the past than it is now. Do you guys see a parallel between how basketball is being pussified as a reflection of the overall society specially in North America? Where being macho, a manly man has been slowly frowned upon to almost being made illegal with the laws of the game being made to make things "nicer and cleaner and less offensive". Exactly the same as the society has been going with all this PC crap that has been plaguing the social world. Very sad indeed!

No, I don't see what's happening in the NBA (and the NFL) as an extension of the pussification of North America, though it kind of feels that way. It's business. When Stern took over the NBA, it was mired in drug scandals. Going back to the 70s, there was the growing issue of the league becoming more black, with the fanbase being predominantly white. There was a fear that this fan would be repelled by big black guys knocking the shit out of each other and fighting. Don't get me wrong - it wasn't JUST the black guys - you had guys like Jeff Ruland, teaming up with Rick Mahorn in Washington to form the "McFilthy & McNasty" combo known for being really physical. You also had Bill Laimbeer, who was universally hated for his chippy play. In sports, the fan wants entertainment in the form of a fast-moving, free-flowing, high-scoring game. Easing the thuggery out of the game made for a better product. Stern took the further step of instituting a dress code for players on the bench. Again, the league, with the flood of high schoolers starting with Kevin Garnett in '95 (it had been 20 years since a player came into the pros from high school), the league became younger and blacker. They dressed the way their peers dressed, but they were in an adult business. Guys like Tim Duncan and Steve Nash dressed like bums also, with ratty t-shirts and beat-up jeans (Stern also wanted them more presentable for the popular tv shot of players entering the bowels of the arena). Again, it was for the benefit of the fanbase - presenting them with a more attractive (or less offensive) product.

"The best kind of pride is that which compels a man to do his best when no one is watching."
06-11-2013 01:17 PM
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samsamsam Offline
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Post: #753
RE: The NBA Thread
Great insights Timoteo. I am always gonna hate that stern bastard. He blocked the CP3 trade (and I am not the biggest laker fan - but he set off some events.) Lamar's feelings get hurt - he has to get traded for nothing, Lakers's get than ramon sessions guy and then he leaves. Lakers get a 40 year old Nash who is on the back end of his career. Etc.

Like I said not the biggest fan of the lakers but boy did blocking that trade messed up the franchise a bit.

In the free market that was the trade that was negotiated, I just think Stern didn't want the Lakers to be overly dominant.
(This post was last modified: 06-11-2013 01:34 PM by samsamsam.)
06-11-2013 01:33 PM
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Timoteo Offline
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Post: #754
RE: The NBA Thread
(06-11-2013 01:33 PM)samsamsam Wrote:  Great insights Timoteo. I am always gonna hate that stern bastard. He blocked the CP3 trade (and I am not the biggest laker fan - but he set off some events.) Lamar's feelings get hurt - he has to get traded for nothing, Lakers's get than ramon sessions guy and then he leaves. Lakers get a 40 year old Nash who is on the back end of his career. Etc.

Like I said not the biggest fan of the lakers but boy did blocking that trade messed up the franchise a bit.

In the free market that was the trade that was negotiated, I just think Stern didn't want the Lakers to be overly dominant.

The Paul fiasco was the final sign that it was time for Stern to step aside. He flat-out stopped that deal because he didn't want to see the Lakers continue to get rich. It was a blatant attempt to create what he felt was greater balance. That came on the heels of the new basketball fiasco, where he wanted to put a synthetic ball in play instead of the leather one. The problem is, he didn't consult with the men that would actually be using it. It was a blatant kiss-up to long-time business partner Spaulding. After the complaints from the players, he had to pull it, making himself look really stupid. The dress code, while well intentioned, was another act of imperiousness. He just brought down the edict, without explaining the move. It wasn't so much that it was a bad move - the problem was not treating adults like adults. You deal with children by saying, "Because I said so," but you don't deal with adults that way. It didn't really affect that many players honestly - most guys when the come into the league immediately upgrade their wardrobe. And they're actually still allowed to wear jeans and t-shirts - they just have to be nice, well-fit ones, with a jacket on top. Put on top of that a couple of lock-outs, and it was time for him to step aside. At one time he was deservedly recognized as the top commissioner in sports, but everyone's run ends. A new set of eyes, and a different personality are needed now.

"The best kind of pride is that which compels a man to do his best when no one is watching."
06-11-2013 02:24 PM
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TheSlayer Offline
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Post: #755
RE: The NBA Thread
(06-11-2013 02:24 PM)Timoteo Wrote:  The Paul fiasco was the final sign that it was time for Stern to step aside. He flat-out stopped that deal because he didn't want to see the Lakers continue to get rich. It was a blatant attempt to create what he felt was greater balance.

As much as I don't like Stern and Lakers that's only partly true. The Chris Paul fiasco cannot be blamed on Stern himself. He was pressured into blocking the trade by Dan Gilbert (who wrote another letter in Comic Sans font) and Cuban (and other owners who didn't go public with their objections I assume) who were upset that they had endured a lockout to bring more parity to the league, only to see Paul end up with the Lakers.

Here's what Gilbert wrote to Stern after the trade was announced and then Stern said he was blocking the trade for "basketball reasons". He wasn't going to publicly say that he got pressured by small market owners who were pissed at Lakers getting another marquee player right after a bitter lockout.

Quote:Commissioner,
It would be a travesty to allow the Lakers to acquire Chris Paul in the apparent trade being discussed.

This trade should go to a vote of the 29 owners of the Hornets.

Over the next three seasons this deal would save the Lakers approximately $20 million in salaries and approximately $21 million in luxury taxes. That $21 million goes to non-taxpaying teams and to fund revenue sharing.

I cannot remember ever seeing a trade where a team got by far the best player in the trade and saved over $40 million in the process. And it doesn’t appear that they would give up any draft picks, which might allow to later make a trade for Dwight Howard. (They would also get a large trade exception that would help them improve their team and/or eventually trade for Howard.) When the Lakers got Pau Gasol (at the time considered an extremely lopsided trade) they took on tens of millions in additional salary and luxury tax and they gave up a number of prospects (one in Marc Gasol who may become a max-salary player).

I just don’t see how we can allow this trade to happen.

I know the vast majority of owners feel the same way that I do.

When will we just change the name of 25 of the 30 teams to the Washington Generals?

Please advise….

Dan G.

Agree with everything else you said about the league and the thuggery being weeded out and whatnot.
06-11-2013 03:07 PM
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InternationPlayboy Offline
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Post: #756
RE: The NBA Thread
I work all night but luckily firstrowsports comes in on my work pc, so no big deal, I'll be getting paid to watch the game. Should be a good game 3.
06-11-2013 03:16 PM
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samsamsam Offline
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Post: #757
RE: The NBA Thread
Slayer thanks for sharing that, wasn't aware of those specifics. As I said, I am not the biggest lakers fan though I do watch them. This seems like a hating the player rather than the game. The Lakers used what the rules allowed and outgamed the other teams and then they cried not fair. I agree it would have thrown off the balance. But look what happened to the Lakers now, fucked in other ways because of the blocked trade. Nash? Damn that hurt - gave 2 1sts I believe for him.
06-11-2013 03:19 PM
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Timoteo Offline
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Post: #758
RE: The NBA Thread
Stern does work for the owners. I do remember the public comments of Gilbert and Cuban. It's easy enough to dismiss Cuban because he goes at Stern regularly, and Gilbert was painted as the victim in the LeBron affair, even though he ended up with the #1 pick (Kyrie Irving). I'm sure other owners felt the same way. Bottom line - Stern still made the decision. At the same time, bad owners are always whining about what big market teams are doing, but mismanage their own franchises and then expect Stern to make decisions to save them from themselves. Many of these owners could spend more to keep their best players, but they aren't REALLY trying to win.

"The best kind of pride is that which compels a man to do his best when no one is watching."
06-11-2013 05:21 PM
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2Wycked Offline
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Post: #759
RE: The NBA Thread
Any thought on the Grizzlies letting Lionel Hollins walk? He struck me a very good coach and a consummate professional. Anybody got a good coaching profile on him - where would he fit best?

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06-11-2013 07:18 PM
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Timoteo Offline
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Post: #760
RE: The NBA Thread
(06-11-2013 07:18 PM)2Wycked Wrote:  Any thought on the Grizzlies letting Lionel Hollins walk? He struck me a very good coach and a consummate professional. Anybody got a good coaching profile on him - where would he fit best?

Here's some lowdown on why Hollins may have been let go...

Quote:"Yahoo! Sports has reported that Hollins and Grizzlies VP of Basketball Operations John Hollinger do not see eye-to-eye when it comes to the use of analytics in coaching decisions."


Quote:"During the Grizzlies’ playoff run, tensions turned to a confrontation when Hollins exploded during a practice session upon finding Hollinger had walked onto the practice court and engaged forward Austin Daye during a shooting drill, multiple sources told Yahoo! Sports.

With the team watching — and with a motive to show his players that he was completely in charge on the floor, sources said — Hollins loudly questioned Hollinger about what he was doing, and why he believed it was appropriate for a management official to intrude on what’s considered sacred territory for a coach and team, sources said.

That wasn’t the first direct exchange between Hollins and Hollinger. Following a game between the Grizzlies and Blazers in Portland back in April 2011, Hollinger, then a sportswriter for ESPN.com, asked Hollins whether Allen and Zach Randolph didn’t play in the late-season game because the Grizzlies were trying to manipulate their first-round playoff match-up. Hollins had just gotten through explaining that Allen and Randolph were dealing with minor injuries.

“Tony was hurt,” Hollins responded, raising his voice, annoyed that he had to repeat himself. “Do you understand English? Tony was hurt. I chose to sit him out because he was hurt.”

http://nba.si.com/2013/06/10/lionel-holl...hollinger/

It's really unfortunate. He led them to their best season ever. Players like Mike Conley and Marc Gasol have improved tremendously under his leadership. He has them playing hard, especially on the defensive end, which isn't easy to do in the NBA. And THAT isn't good enough to get you another contract? A step away from playing for the title?

"The best kind of pride is that which compels a man to do his best when no one is watching."
06-11-2013 07:59 PM
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2Wycked Offline
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Post: #761
RE: The NBA Thread
Thanks for the reply, Timoteo. I had no idea Hollinger was such a dick! What a loss for Memphis in the end.

I am listening to the game on ESPN radio and I have to say they have some good announcers - I believe one is Hubie Brown.

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06-11-2013 08:57 PM
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Professor Fox Offline
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Post: #762
RE: The NBA Thread
These Spurs just can't do anything wrong tonight.
06-11-2013 09:52 PM
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Vacancier Permanent Offline
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Post: #763
RE: The NBA Thread
Loving this!!!!Banana Game 2 the Miami bench stepped up big time and tonight, it's Spurs' bench to do the same. And I love how Manu is responding to all those so called tv pundits who have been repeating ad nauseam that he is finished! Eat your words bitches!!!! Dale Manu Dale!!!
2 more games like that and it's going to be in the bag!!!

Come on Spurs! Allez Tony!

(06-11-2013 09:52 PM)Professor Fox Wrote:  These Spurs just can't do anything wrong tonight.
06-11-2013 09:58 PM
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Vacancier Permanent Offline
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Post: #764
RE: The NBA Thread
Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Gary Neal show!!!Banana
06-11-2013 10:05 PM
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Professor Fox Offline
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Post: #765
RE: The NBA Thread
In before Simmons adds Gary Neal to his new irrational confidence rankings.
06-11-2013 10:06 PM
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Professor Fox Offline
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Post: #766
RE: The NBA Thread
WTF??? They just throw anything up!!!!
06-11-2013 10:10 PM
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Vacancier Permanent Offline
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Post: #767
RE: The NBA Thread
113-77!!!! 36 points in the Heat's face!!!! NBA final records in terms of 3 points made (16) and 3rd biggest blow-out in NBA Finals history! What a way for the Spurs to bounce back from that dissappointing performance in the 2nd half of Game 2.

Gary Neal and Danny Green stepping up BIG time! And Manu playing as he can.

I know the Heats are a great team with tremendous players and they can turn it on at any time as they did during that run in Game 2, so will be taking this one game at a time. But I am optimistic about my Spurs chances' of winning it this year! I can't wait for Games 4 and 5!!!
06-11-2013 11:07 PM
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Post: #768
RE: The NBA Thread
[Image: spowelp_medium.gif]
06-11-2013 11:14 PM
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TheBulldozer Offline
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Post: #769
RE: The NBA Thread
Weird.
06-11-2013 11:16 PM
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JoyStick Offline
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Post: #770
RE: The NBA Thread
all the 3s were impressive, but the spurs are leading the series because of their defense. green and leonard are doing an amazing job containing james.
06-11-2013 11:20 PM
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TheSlayer Offline
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Post: #771
RE: The NBA Thread
Holy hell! What a beatdown by the Spurs. That stretch in the 3rd quarter when they stretched the lead from around 10 to 20+ was equally terrifying and exciting to watch as someone who is rooting for Miami. Those 35 footers that Green and Neal were making just broke Miami's back today.

(06-11-2013 10:10 PM)Professor Fox Wrote:  WTF??? They just throw anything up!!!!

Yeah, that's exactly what it was lol. That 5-7 minute stretch was ridiculous.

I think Miami comes back strong in game 4 and win it. I expect LeBron to stop passing the ball and attack the paint. What do you guys think?
(This post was last modified: 06-11-2013 11:26 PM by TheSlayer.)
06-11-2013 11:23 PM
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JayMillz Offline
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Post: #772
RE: The NBA Thread
Spurs need a knockout punch in the next game. Playing at home should give them a lot more confidence so they have a chance.
06-11-2013 11:49 PM
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2Wycked Offline
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Post: #773
RE: The NBA Thread
You guys need to check this stat-line of the hero of the Heat:

Suspect: Mario Chalmers

Stats: 0/5 FG's, 0/1 3's, 2 boards, 1 assist, 4 turnovers & 4 fouls.

That is some Hall of Fame shit right there.

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06-11-2013 11:51 PM
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samsamsam Offline
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Post: #774
RE: The NBA Thread
Fuck, Parker has a hamstring issue. MRI tomorrow.
06-11-2013 11:51 PM
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Professor Fox Offline
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Post: #775
RE: The NBA Thread
(06-11-2013 11:51 PM)samsamsam Wrote:  Fuck, Parker has a hamstring issue. MRI tomorrow.

His comments after the game didn't make it sound like he was in serious trouble, we'll see soon enough.
06-11-2013 11:53 PM
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