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The NBA Thread
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TheSlayer Offline
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Post: #2551
RE: The NBA Thread
I see it exactly the opposite. I don't see what Kobe is doing is as alpha. Far from it. This just seems like a contrived outburst for the sake of publicity. What really is he achieving by it? What's the point of berating his own teammates? The entire team is made up of bench guys and niche role players being asked to play starter roles and carry a heavier load than they are capable of carrying. If he wants to be mad at somebody then it should be the front office and himself for taking the $48 mil to play on the Lakers. He knew what the deal was when he took that money. Now he needs to shut up and simply lead the tank. It's funny how people always say Lebron is fake humble and I agree all superstars are corny but don't understand how Kobe fans don't see through the whole "mamba/will to win/mental toughness /grrrr" personna.
12-12-2014 02:15 PM
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TheSlayer Offline
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RE: The NBA Thread
Double post.
(This post was last modified: 12-12-2014 02:17 PM by TheSlayer.)
12-12-2014 02:15 PM
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Post: #2553
RE: The NBA Thread
(12-12-2014 02:15 PM)TheSlayer Wrote:  I see it exactly the opposite. I don't see what Kobe is doing is as alpha. Far from it. This just seems like a contrived outburst for the sake of publicity. What really is he achieving by it? What's the point of berating his own teammates? The entire team is made up of bench guys and niche role players being asked to play starter roles and carry a heavier load than they are capable of carrying. If he wants to be mad at somebody then it should be the front office and himself for taking the $48 mil to play on the Lakers. He knew what the deal was when he took that money. Now he needs to shut up and simply lead the tank. It's funny how people always say Lebron is fake humble and I agree all superstars are corny but don't understand how Kobe fans don't see through the whole "mamba/will to win/mental toughness /grrrr" personna.

Kobe is in my opinion the most selfish and arrogant player in the NBA. Carmelo, AI, and a couple others have gotten that distinction, but Kobe has been that guy since the Shaq years. He gives zero fucks about anyone.

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12-12-2014 02:21 PM
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MY DETROIT PLAYAS Offline
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Post: #2554
RE: The NBA Thread
(12-12-2014 02:15 PM)TheSlayer Wrote:  I see it exactly the opposite. I don't see what Kobe is doing is as alpha. Far from it. This just seems like a contrived outburst for the sake of publicity. What really is he achieving by it? What's the point of berating his own teammates? The entire team is made up of bench guys and niche role players being asked to play starter roles and carry a heavier load than they are capable of carrying. If he wants to be mad at somebody then it should be the front office and himself for taking the $48 mil to play on the Lakers. He knew what the deal was when he took that money. Now he needs to shut up and simply lead the tank. It's funny how people always say Lebron is fake humble and I agree all superstars are corny but don't understand how Kobe fans don't see through the whole "mamba/will to win/mental toughness /grrrr" personna.

Ditto for Carmelo, either you want to win now or you're paying lip service

People scratching their heads about their "slow" start

Welcome to the new bargaining agreement ladies & gents:

You take a max contract without fully exhausting ALL viable options, and you get a mediocre team

End of story

MDP
(This post was last modified: 12-12-2014 02:26 PM by MY DETROIT PLAYAS.)
12-12-2014 02:25 PM
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Post: #2555
RE: The NBA Thread
I just saw the Espn article titled " I feel the pain of losing" from the Laker organization. I think it's hilarious that it's been a few years of not winning championships and they are already crying! My team hasn't even been to the playoffs in 10 years!! How do you think we feel? Be happy for your titles and be glad our team moved to the west coast!
12-12-2014 03:32 PM
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Post: #2556
RE: The NBA Thread
I would believe Kobe only cares about himself, but he did really care and stand up for Pau Gasol when everyone was against him. Even a huge Lakers fan like myself.

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12-12-2014 03:35 PM
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Post: #2557
RE: The NBA Thread
(12-12-2014 03:35 PM)Slim Shady Wrote:  I would believe Kobe only cares about himself, but he did really care and stand up for Pau Gasol when everyone was against him. Even a huge Lakers fan like myself.


True, but he never defended Pau Gasol when he was in talks of potentially being traded in a deal to get Chris Paul. Kobe defended Pau in all other trade talks, but when it came to the possibility of getting Chris Paul to play in LA, Kobe shut his mouth real quick. In fact he didn't say anything.
(This post was last modified: 12-12-2014 04:25 PM by MidWest.)
12-12-2014 04:21 PM
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Post: #2558
RE: The NBA Thread
1) I'm not talking about the will to win blah blah stuff. Plus even if we were I don't know how you can argue that against Kobe. He definately is that "mamba/will to win/mental toughness/grrr" persona.
His tenacity and time he dedicates to his craft is more than enough to debunk you're thought process...

http://youtu.be/hrepZnj2n4M

A simple YouTube search about Kobe's work ethic will provide you with more than enough info.
Now having been in a similar situation I understand exactly where he's coming from and you can probably relate too:
This man and his teammates are paid professionals. They are in the NBA so athletic talent isn't a question. It comes down to desire to be better. And if he's doing all this why can't the others in the name of getting better? And they are not--and maybe you can relate to this if you have been the AMOG on a high level team sport--but that shit doesn't fly at all. You're going to get called out on it especially when you're practicing like a bitch/being soft.

Also on the contract situation the Lakers had enough room for another max player or 2 good players. Everyone seems to forget this shit. THAT is on management. There was MORE than enough talent in the free agency to get good players:

Gordon Hayward, Chandler Parsons, Jason Terry, Tyson Chandler, Darren Collison, Bosh, Amer Asik, the list goes on.

Management completely mismanaged the free agency.

The players they start aren't that bad of starters.
PG: Jeremy Lin is a good scoring PG. didn't start in H-town because they didn't need more scoring in the starting 5.
SF: who's this? it's not nick young
PF: Carlos Boozer was a 20-10 guy during his days in Utah so he's definately still got game. He was starting with the Bulls.
C: Jordan Hill--Low minute starter caliber player. good defense, great rebounder.

This is just not good enough in the west but definately have enough talent to be better than their shity record.
Jeremy Lin and Boozer should be enough with Kobe to make them a team that is around .500 but instead they suck ass. This is due to them being soft as fuck out there. Kobe has even said that Jeremy Lin needs to assert himself, quit being scared of offending Kobe and "piss on the fire hydrant." But I totally relate to Kobe on the softness. When your team is under performing and they're in practice being soft it's heart breaking to know that you are giving so much and they are giving so litte--and that little is something that is easily changable: a mindset.

Lastly you gotta keep in mind this dude is 36 and is still putting up effecient numbers and when you consider how his teammates are playing he's actually having a great season.

*exhales*

2) Kobe is the AMOG. I would say it's alpha because he is the lion incharge of his pride. He eats first. His desires come first, and he checks people on their bull shit (read being soft) and let's them know it's unnacxeptable. Jordan's rants are legendary for calling out people for practicing below their ability and we consider Jordan an alpha male as an athlete.

If you're blaming their record on Kobe's greed and saying that his rant is unjustified I'm just going to have to disagree. Maybe some of its his fault but the fault really falls on the teammates and management.

Who's fault it is:

1a) Management
1b) teammates being soft
2) Kobe

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12-12-2014 04:43 PM
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TheSlayer Offline
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Post: #2559
RE: The NBA Thread
(12-12-2014 04:43 PM)Mufasa Wrote:  Who's fault it is:

1a) Management
1b) teammates being soft
2) Kobe

LOL

What does his teammates being "soft" even mean? They are a bunch of bench guys/niche role players being asked to do more than they are capable of. It's not their fault that the entire 15 man roster sucks (including Kobe). That doesn't make his teammates soft. If the teammates are "soft" then so is Kobe.

For example, how is Jeremy Lin "soft" or at fault when he's the main PG on that team and he's a back-up guy or same with Young and Boozer. It absolutely makes 0 sense for Kobe to attack his teammates. He's still gotta play another 60 games with them this season. That's bad leadership.

Also, Kobe's "work ethic" is another marketing stunt. Before you attack me what I mean is KOBE WORKS HARD but so do a LOT of others NBA superstars but you don't hear about it that much. Dirk has consistently worked on his game since coming into the league adding a post game and inventing patented moves like the one-legged fade away, KD has improved his game each year and now has become an okay ball handler, LeBron has added to his game each year, Duncan has become a much better FT shooter etc. etc. Yet all we hear is how Kobe works so hard. Well yeah, so do a lot of other superstars. It's not something unique or special.
(This post was last modified: 12-12-2014 05:42 PM by TheSlayer.)
12-12-2014 05:33 PM
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Slim Shady Offline
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RE: The NBA Thread
No way anyone works as hard as Kobe. He has proved it again with the production he is giving at this age with his history of injuries. A lost art in a lot of sports today is the serial killer mentality. I did endurance sports, but Kobe's words always inspired me. You really need to want to kill the other guy, and you need to deal with pain with a calm. Like when Anton Chigur breaks his arm and the bone pops out at the end of the movie, he smiles. That's how you got to be.

Even the really good and hard working people don't have that.

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12-12-2014 05:46 PM
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Post: #2561
RE: The NBA Thread
(12-12-2014 05:46 PM)Slim Shady Wrote:  No way anyone works as hard as Kobe. He has proved it again with the production he is giving at this age with his history of injuries. A lost art in a lot of sports today is the serial killer mentality. I did endurance sports, but Kobe's words always inspired me. You really need to want to kill the other guy, and you need to deal with pain with a calm. Like when Anton Chigur breaks his arm and the bone pops out at the end of the movie, he smiles. That's how you got to be.

Even the really good and hard working people don't have that.

Come on, Slim. I expect such a comment from a Kobe stan on ESPN or some Lakers' forum but not here. I know you are a Kobe fan but that's just a silly comment. MJ didn't work hard, Kareem didn't work hard to keep playing until age 40, Duncan doesn't work hard to keep playing at this level at age 38 and unlike Kobe he's still one of the best defenders in the game, LeBron doesn't work hard? Let's not buy into the he's the "hardest worker". No, he's not. A bunch of superstars have been and are hardworkers. That's why they are superstars in the first place unless you are Shaq who just coasted most of his career.
12-12-2014 05:51 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
Sorry I meant: Nobody works as hard as Kobe in his era today. Exceptions might be Dirk, Duncan, KG, Maybe Nash/Wade/Pierce. These guys might come close.

I envy an athlete like Duncan. He is a "nice guy" player in a way but you know he cares and wants it so bad and competes that way. It's really hard to achieve that kind of mental piece while maintaining the edge, most people have to behave and think like Kobe to get there. Duncan is special in my book just for that.

I'm not saying guys like Lebron etc are not working hard. Ofcourse they are working their butts off. But i buy that Kobe has that edge even on them. That ability to go beyond where you are sacrificing logical well being. It's bringing the evolutionary survival instinct where an animal gives up an arm or leg for his life, but them channel it into self induced pain.

I'm sure MJ had that, Bird Oscar etc had it, but I'm too young to fairly judge them. It's almost a once in a generation thing.

I'd bet even AI had that.

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(This post was last modified: 12-12-2014 06:07 PM by Slim Shady.)
12-12-2014 06:06 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
(12-12-2014 06:06 PM)Slim Shady Wrote:  Sorry I meant: Nobody works as hard as Kobe in his era today. Exceptions might be Dirk, Duncan, KG, Maybe Nash/Wade/Pierce. These guys might come close.

I envy an athlete like Duncan. He is a "nice guy" player in a way but you know he cares and wants it so bad and competes that way. It's really hard to achieve that kind of mental piece while maintaining the edge, most people have to behave and think like Kobe to get there. Duncan is special in my book just for that.

I'm not saying guys like Lebron etc are not working hard. Ofcourse they are working their butts off. But i buy that Kobe has that edge even on them. That ability to go beyond where you are sacrificing logical well being. It's bringing the evolutionary survival instinct where an animal gives up an arm or leg for his life, but them channel it into self induced pain.

I'm sure MJ had that, Bird Oscar etc had it, but I'm too young to fairly judge them. It's almost a once in a generation thing.

I'd bet even AI had that.

Fair enough comment though I still disagree that Kobe has some sort of edge on this generation's stars because of his work ethic or something. As fans it's impossible for us to know who's working the "hardest". There are a bunch of hard working superstars and even role players. Heck, I would say someone like Kyle Korver might be hardest worker because he's had to reinvent himself. Superstars will still find work in the league, role players might actually be working harder because they have to stay relevant with their niche skills to remain employed in the league.

What Kobe does have is excellent marketing (lol), he's almost like Apple in that regards.

For the record before someone thinks that I am a Kobe hater or something, I think he's a Top 10 GOAT. I don't like him but I come to discuss hoops here rationally. I can't stand the fanboyism and stupidity on ESPN and other forums. People getting defensive over "their" favorite players makes me laugh and I can't be bothered. What I do find is that Kobe has some of the most ardent fans who will even call him GOAT Laugh.
(This post was last modified: 12-12-2014 06:20 PM by TheSlayer.)
12-12-2014 06:17 PM
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TravelerKai Offline
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RE: The NBA Thread
(12-12-2014 06:06 PM)Slim Shady Wrote:  Sorry I meant: Nobody works as hard as Kobe in his era today. Exceptions might be Dirk, Duncan, KG, Maybe Nash/Wade/Pierce. These guys might come close.

I envy an athlete like Duncan. He is a "nice guy" player in a way but you know he cares and wants it so bad and competes that way. It's really hard to achieve that kind of mental piece while maintaining the edge, most people have to behave and think like Kobe to get there. Duncan is special in my book just for that.

I'm not saying guys like Lebron etc are not working hard. Ofcourse they are working their butts off. But i buy that Kobe has that edge even on them. That ability to go beyond where you are sacrificing logical well being. It's bringing the evolutionary survival instinct where an animal gives up an arm or leg for his life, but them channel it into self induced pain.

I'm sure MJ had that, Bird Oscar etc had it, but I'm too young to fairly judge them. It's almost a once in a generation thing.

I'd bet even AI had that.

You still cannot say that. Lebron James might be surpassing him for all we know. I think KD's work ethic could even be higher than Kobe's right now. I don't think any of that really matters though. There could be some scrub right now that works out and develops harder, but the point is that Kobe is a terrible leader and arguably a poor teamate. Any perfectionist has a little bit of an asshole in them, but they have to keep that shit in check. Phil used to keep that shit in check, just like he kept Mike's in check.

Kobe is the reason Shaq got ran out of town as well. He hated on him and snitched about his extramarital affairs. A serious man card violation. Dude is a shitty teamate. He will never catch Jordan and might as well retire. No one will play with him.

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12-12-2014 06:42 PM
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Post: #2565
RE: The NBA Thread
(12-12-2014 02:25 PM)MY DETROIT PLAYAS Wrote:  
(12-12-2014 02:15 PM)TheSlayer Wrote:  I see it exactly the opposite. I don't see what Kobe is doing is as alpha. Far from it. This just seems like a contrived outburst for the sake of publicity. What really is he achieving by it? What's the point of berating his own teammates? The entire team is made up of bench guys and niche role players being asked to play starter roles and carry a heavier load than they are capable of carrying. If he wants to be mad at somebody then it should be the front office and himself for taking the $48 mil to play on the Lakers. He knew what the deal was when he took that money. Now he needs to shut up and simply lead the tank. It's funny how people always say Lebron is fake humble and I agree all superstars are corny but don't understand how Kobe fans don't see through the whole "mamba/will to win/mental toughness /grrrr" personna.

Ditto for Carmelo, either you want to win now or you're paying lip service

People scratching their heads about their "slow" start

Welcome to the new bargaining agreement ladies & gents:

You take a max contract without fully exhausting ALL viable options, and you get a mediocre team


End of story

You know what. I may not mind that. Remember back in the day, like the 80s and 90s, when every single team had 1 superstar with one near superstar? Karl Malone and Stockton, Jordan and Pippen, etc. etc. The role players had to be carefully drafted and developed. None of all of this BIG 3 bullshit and free agency ruining the chemistry of the game. Every city had a ball team they could feel excited about. It makes me sad to see nearly empty arenas in some of the teams.

Look at the parity of the NFL. Any team can be beat on any Sunday. The NBA could benefit from the same thing.

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12-12-2014 06:54 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
(12-12-2014 06:54 PM)TravelerKai Wrote:  
(12-12-2014 02:25 PM)MY DETROIT PLAYAS Wrote:  
(12-12-2014 02:15 PM)TheSlayer Wrote:  I see it exactly the opposite. I don't see what Kobe is doing is as alpha. Far from it. This just seems like a contrived outburst for the sake of publicity. What really is he achieving by it? What's the point of berating his own teammates? The entire team is made up of bench guys and niche role players being asked to play starter roles and carry a heavier load than they are capable of carrying. If he wants to be mad at somebody then it should be the front office and himself for taking the $48 mil to play on the Lakers. He knew what the deal was when he took that money. Now he needs to shut up and simply lead the tank. It's funny how people always say Lebron is fake humble and I agree all superstars are corny but don't understand how Kobe fans don't see through the whole "mamba/will to win/mental toughness /grrrr" personna.

Ditto for Carmelo, either you want to win now or you're paying lip service

People scratching their heads about their "slow" start

Welcome to the new bargaining agreement ladies & gents:

You take a max contract without fully exhausting ALL viable options, and you get a mediocre team


End of story

You know what. I may not mind that. Remember back in the day, like the 80s and 90s, when every single team had 1 superstar with one near superstar? Karl Malone and Stockton, Jordan and Pippen, etc. etc. The role players had to be carefully drafted and developed. None of all of this BIG 3 bullshit and free agency ruining the chemistry of the game. Every city had a ball team they could feel excited about. It makes me sad to see nearly empty arenas in some of the teams.

Look at the parity of the NFL. Any team can be beat on any Sunday. The NBA could benefit from the same thing.

We might be going back to the 80s type of Superteams with Lakers/Celtics/Pistons though as the salary cap agrees and is expected to be close to 90mil in 2 years. The max will increase too but imagine KD/LeBron on the same team (will never happen) like Kareem and Magic or an 80s type Celtics team which was one of the GOAT teams.

The Big 3 right now is unsustainable because of luxury tax but in 2-3 years $100 mil rosters might become the norm in the NBA. The new TV deal is a game changer.
12-12-2014 06:59 PM
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Post: #2567
RE: The NBA Thread
Mavericks acquire Rajon Rondo

Wow.

The Mavs are going for broke. One last run with Dirk and a transition with a stable core for a few years once he hangs them up in a year or two.
12-18-2014 11:03 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
Not a Lakers fan, but there's no doubt that he works inhumanely hard. I've heard stories from my company CEO, Larry Tennenbaum, he lives across the street from Kobe. He says that Kobe is usually is sweating from lap-swimming and doing sprints by 4 in the morning. He fully deserves every penny is being paid. People say Duncan/Dirk are true franchise stars for taking under max-contract for the team sake, but that's because they can actually trust their respective organizations to make viable changes to the roster. Not to mention Kobe sells more jerseys and Nikes in a day, than Duncan can sell Adidas in a year.

The Lakers and Knicks are just using Kobe/Melo as box office sellers, to cover up their flawed bureaucracy. Dolan/Buss don't actually care about team success, when you own MSG and a media outlet, $120 million to Dolan is like toilet paper. LA/NY fans will cough up for tickets from proximity alone. As a Knicks fan, I actually wouldn't fault Carmelo for ditching NY, he's been screwed over by the front office for years by being unable to put cohesive talent around him.
(This post was last modified: 12-18-2014 11:30 PM by Pontifex Maximus.)
12-18-2014 11:28 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
Mavs have got to win the Championship this year now. That team is stacked. Rondo is perfect there. He doesn't want to score, and Ellis and Dirk can score at any time.

Also the Mavs are a team you can actually feel good rooting for.

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(This post was last modified: 12-18-2014 11:46 PM by Slim Shady.)
12-18-2014 11:45 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
bye Corey Brewer to the Rockets!......
12-19-2014 04:17 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
I'm surprised. Not sure how this will help us. We needed a point guard or power forward more. I dunno, need to think about it more.

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12-19-2014 04:28 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
(12-19-2014 04:28 PM)TravelerKai Wrote:  I'm surprised. Not sure how this will help us. We needed a point guard or power forward more. I dunno, need to think about it more.

Yeah they needed another depth player at the 1/2 position opposed to another swingman at the 2/3 slots.

yb13
12-19-2014 05:55 PM
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Sonsowey Offline
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RE: The NBA Thread
Corey Brewer with the sickest travel of the year:

[Image: steps.gif]

RVF Book Club February: Julius Evola - Revolt Against the Modern World
12-19-2014 08:15 PM
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Post: #2574
RE: The NBA Thread
(12-19-2014 08:15 PM)Sonsowey Wrote:  Corey Brewer with the sickest travel of the year:

[Image: steps.gif]

Jordan dunked from the free throw line. Brewer traveled from the free throw line. Both for two points. Edge: Brewer
12-19-2014 08:21 PM
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Post: #2575
RE: The NBA Thread
Looks like Stan Van Gundy finally got fed up with Josh Smith's inconsistent effort and bad decision making/jump shooting and cut him. This should help the Pistons retain Monroe, since he is a free agent, and they will use the stretch provision to ease the sting of his massive contract which they will spread out over the next 5 years.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nba.../20761617/
12-22-2014 03:25 PM
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