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Russian language: no more bullshit
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The Fantasist Away
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Post: #34
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
(04-15-2013 01:40 PM)Dr.Benway Wrote:  i would say to not even waste time with pimsleur unless its in some passive way like while you walk to work or ride the subway or something. Without a really good grasp of the grammar you will never be able to form proper sentences in russian. I studied it intensively at a russian university in the preparation faculty and it took about 8 months before i felt comfortable having conversations with people. this language is very tough.

(04-15-2013 02:56 PM)Dr.Benway Wrote:  i think this type of thing can be great to learn vocabulary, but in russian vocabulary alone can be quite useless, because of the declension of the nouns and adjectives. like in the video on the homepage they give you sobaka собака and ulitsa улица..which is fine when used as a subject. but when he uses them together in the sentence "look at the sobaka on the utlitsa"-this is incorrect in russian. what is correct is "look at the sobaku on the ulitse" (смотри на собаку на улитце)

you can see the words changed. if you heard these two words in a different declension you might think they are different words that denote a different noun altogether, when in fact the are the same. that sentence is also phrased a little bit strangely for russian too. "learning by context" is great for vocabulary but i believe its actually impossible to learn a language like you did as a child because now you already know a language, and so all of your learning will be filtered through the prism of english. this is just my two cents. learning in many different ways will help, but i would just be weary of any advertised methods of learning languages that try to avoid grammar because it isn't as "fun" or whatever. you need to know this stuff-especially for russian.

even russian school children spend years learning russian grammar in depth, much more so than we did in school for english.

I have to disagree with you somewhat in regards to how important grammar is when trying to make yourself understood in Russian. I think you are over stressing it a little. Personally I have little concept of the case system and agreement of adjectives etc. I don't know when to say меня or мне let alone how word endings change in relation to gender or case. However despite only relying on building vocabulary I have never had any problems being understood. What I mean is that every time I have not been understood it has always been due to a lack of vocabulary and never due to not having a good grammatical base. Just like when an American says "I'll write you", although a Brit would never say that and to us it is grammatically wrong,we still have no problem understanding it. What would make it hard to understand is if the speaker did not know the verb 'To write' whilst conveying the intent.

I would say to learners to decide what their aims are. If you want to just travel around and do tourist stuff on a trip or two then concentrate of vocabulary pretty much exclusively, no need to confuse yourself with the Gordian Knot of Russian grammar,you'll get proficient quicker and you will get by without trouble, up to a point.

The guys who need to study grammar along with vocabulary are guys like Roosh who have decided that their future will in some way be linked to Russian speaking countries and people. Then it's worth doing and will no doubt reward you greatly ( I hope this proves to be the case personally ) but even then I'd lean towards vocabulary building over deep grammar study. Lets face it once you got the cases sorted out you are well on the way and can survive without knowing all the verbs of motion etc.

Just my take.
04-15-2013 04:21 PM
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Russian language: no more bullshit - Roosh - 04-14-2013, 06:51 PM
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit - The Fantasist - 04-15-2013 04:21 PM

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