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Holocaust fact finding thread
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nomadbrah Offline
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Post: #298
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread
(09-05-2017 05:11 PM)Truth Teller Wrote:  Rudolf Hoss, wrote an autobiography in which he discussed the events of the Wannsee conference and the actions carried out at Auschwitz-Birkenau.

There's no need to take Rudolf Hoss on his word (as a loser in a war), since we have the Wannsee protocols and the only, repeat, only thing that could be even remotely interpreted as relating to the Holocaust is a single line:

[Image: wannseeprotokoll-5-BM-Vermischtes-ARD-jpg.jpg]

That's it.

I've read it, there is nothing about the Holocaust here, not a single sentence discussing killings or death camps.

All there is, that one sentence:

Quote:Anstelle der Auswanderung ist nunmehr als weitere Lösungsmöglichkeit nach entsprechender vorheriger Genehmigung durch den Führer die Evakuierung der Juden nach dem Osten getreten.

Diese Aktionen sind jedoch lediglich als Ausweichmöglichkeiten
anzusprechen, doch werden hier bereits jene praktischen Erfahrungen
gesammelt, die im Hinblick auf die kommende Endlösung der
Judenfrage von wichtiger Bedeutung sind.

Quote:Another possible solution of the problem has now taken the place of
emigration, i.e. the evacuation of the Jews to the East, provided that
the Führer gives the appropriate approval in advance.

These actions are, however, only to be considered provisional, but
practical experience is already being collected which is of the
greatest importance in relation to the future final solution of the
Jewish question.

Ok, so that is all there supposedly is to plan, orchestrate and direct an unprecedented genocide.

Not exactly a smoking gun?

I agree it can be interpreted omniously, but that's the key here "interpreted". It could simply be referring to the KZ camps in Poland. Auswitch II, the camp for jews, was built in 1942 following the Wansee conference of January 20, 1942. It is rather clear then that the passage refers to the building of these KZ camps and the "evacuation" of the jews to them. However, nothing in the Wansee protocols support that they were to be used for genocide. You have to be honest and admit this. It is simply not there.

The entire idea becomes even more ludicrous when you consider that the "jewish question" is dealt with in great detail otherwise in the Wannsee Protocols:
Quote:The work concerned with emigration was, later on, not only a German
problem, but also a problem with which the authorities of the countries
to which the flow of emigrants was being directed would have to deal.
Financial difficulties, such as the demand by various foreign
governments for increasing sums of money to be presented at the time of
the landing, the lack of shipping space, increasing restriction of
entry permits, or the cancelling of such, increased extraordinarily the
difficulties of emigration. In spite of these difficulties, 537,000
Jews were sent out of the country between the takeover of power and the
deadline of 31 October 1941. Of these
approximately 360,000 were in Germany proper on 30 January 1933
approximately 147,000 were in Austria (Ostmark) on 15 March 1939
approximately 30,000 were in the Protectorate of Bohemia and Moravia on
15 March 1939.
The Jews themselves, or their Jewish political organizations, financed
the emigration. In order to avoid impoverished Jews' remaining behind,
the principle was followed that wealthy Jews have to finance the
emigration of poor Jews; this was arranged by imposing a suitable tax,
i.e., an emigration tax, which was used for financial arrangements in
connection with the emigration of poor Jews and was imposed according
to income.

Again, how curious that the Nazis wrote in detail about how the jews were "emmigrated" by which means, how the nazis paid them to go away basically. Not lacking in detail.

In fact, the Wannsee Protocols makes it abundantly clear what the goal is:

Quote:By order of the Reich Marshal, a Reich Central Office for Jewish
Emigration was set up in January 1939 and the Chief of the Security
Police and SD was entrusted with the management. Its most important
tasks were
a) to make all necessary arrangements for the preparation for an
increased emigration of the Jews,
b) to direct the flow of emigration,
c) to speed the procedure of emigration in each individual case.
The aim of all this was to cleanse German living space of Jews in a
legal manner.

In a legal manner.

Why is it the Nazis are going to these great lengths to discuss and debate how to legally expell the jews of Germany if this is supposed to be the conference where the Holocaust is being ordered?

Now here is something VERY interesting:

Quote:Under proper guidance, in the course of the final solution the Jews are
to be allocated for appropriate labor in the East. Able-bodied Jews,
separated according to sex, will be taken in large work columns to
these areas for work on roads, in the course of which action doubtless
a large portion will be eliminated by natural causes.

The possible final remnant will, since it will undoubtedly consist of
the most resistant portion, have to be treated accordingly, because it
is the product of natural selection and would, if released, act as a
the seed of a new Jewish revival (see the experience of history.)

Again, nazis are not making any excuses for their views. None. They gleefully remark that no doubt many jews will perish from hard work, but then - absurdly if we believe the official story - discuss what to make of the survivors.

It simply makes no sense if we are to believe the nazis planned a deliberate full scale genocide of the jews.

Conclusion: No one here denies that jews were sent to camps in Poland or that the nazis were not exactly too concerned if many perished from the conditions. What has little factual basis is the planned mass genocide by means of gassing.

Edit: I want to make clear that the above alone, the KZ camps for ALL jews, is in itself a great crime against humanity and utterly despicable. I honestly feel nauseous reading the passage I quoted. I also am not at the point where I can or will say that there wasn't genocidal killings in those camps. There could very well have been. What I find improbable is that it was ordered from the top down already at Wannsee. The evidence doesn't suggest that. These things are important when we deal with a topic that is the foundation myth of the post-WW2 world.

You have to compare to what the Japanese allegedly do in China. That was also atrocious crimes against humanity including medical experiments, mass killings and rapes. However, those crimes are not deemed "original sin" for which the Japanese should be replaced by foreigners in their own country. THAT is my interest in this matter. That if we are to accept demographic replacement in Europe (and by extension US), because of the unprecedented and unique evil of the white European, then it has to be based on fact. If the evil committed is not an "evil above all others" and not "evil in which all Germans were complicit" then the replacement of Europeans is not morally justified (it's not anyway).

It's good even for skeptics to read this stuff, so we're not tempted to believe that fascism is a-ok and not that bad. Not that we think so, but we shouldn't throw the baby out with the bathwater. Just because communism was a great evil, does not make the nazis less evil.
(This post was last modified: 09-05-2017 06:33 PM by nomadbrah.)
09-05-2017 06:14 PM
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Messages In This Thread
Holocaust fact finding thread - Valentine - 12-31-2016, 01:57 AM
RE: The Holocaust (Holohoax?) Thread - Sp5 - 01-01-2017, 10:14 PM
RE: The Holocaust (Holohoax?) Thread - Sp5 - 01-02-2017, 04:05 AM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Delta - 01-02-2017, 12:37 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Zep - 01-02-2017, 10:21 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Zep - 01-03-2017, 08:56 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - atlant - 01-03-2017, 12:33 AM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - atlant - 01-03-2017, 01:17 AM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Kona - 01-03-2017, 03:32 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Kona - 01-03-2017, 06:10 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - XPQ22 - 01-07-2017, 10:11 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - XPQ22 - 01-07-2017, 10:55 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Delta - 01-17-2017, 07:25 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Teedub - 01-17-2017, 02:23 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - amity - 02-20-2017, 11:44 AM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - amity - 03-01-2017, 10:54 AM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Menace - 04-12-2017, 09:32 AM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Teedub - 04-12-2017, 02:33 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - amity - 09-01-2017, 01:08 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Kona - 09-02-2017, 11:06 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Kona - 09-03-2017, 01:43 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Zep - 09-03-2017, 01:54 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - amity - 09-03-2017, 12:21 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Zep - 09-03-2017, 01:35 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Kona - 09-03-2017, 02:00 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - nomadbrah - 09-05-2017 06:14 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Laska - 09-05-2017, 06:14 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Zep - 09-05-2017, 11:43 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Laska - 09-05-2017, 08:35 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Laska - 09-05-2017, 09:10 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Laska - 09-05-2017, 09:21 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Kona - 09-06-2017, 12:25 AM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Laska - 09-06-2017, 12:42 AM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Teedub - 09-06-2017, 12:33 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Nowak - 09-11-2017, 02:07 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - 911 - 01-28-2018, 05:07 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Kona - 01-27-2018, 06:20 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Teedub - 01-29-2018, 12:39 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Ruslan - 01-29-2018, 04:53 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - rotekz - 04-11-2018, 03:05 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - amity - 04-11-2018, 02:04 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - rotekz - 04-11-2018, 03:20 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Dusty - 04-12-2018, 07:42 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Suits - 04-12-2018, 10:56 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Kona - 04-13-2018, 07:44 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Kona - 04-14-2018, 07:17 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - rotekz - 04-13-2018, 11:45 AM
RE: Holohoax - blck - 05-24-2018, 02:01 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Teedub - 04-15-2018, 06:00 AM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Teedub - 04-15-2018, 01:50 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Teedub - 04-15-2018, 01:56 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Kona - 04-15-2018, 03:59 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Teedub - 04-17-2018, 03:12 AM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - amity - 04-19-2018, 12:55 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Suits - 05-02-2018, 09:35 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - kamoz - 05-19-2018, 07:52 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Lika - 05-23-2018, 03:15 AM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - fokker - 05-20-2018, 04:04 AM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - nola - 05-23-2018, 04:22 AM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - rotekz - 07-26-2018, 03:06 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - rotekz - 07-26-2018, 03:55 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - rotekz - 08-02-2018, 01:06 AM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - storm - 10-22-2018, 04:56 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - rotekz - 10-23-2018, 01:34 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Teedub - 10-24-2018, 01:54 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Teedub - 10-24-2018, 02:56 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - 911 - 10-25-2018, 10:15 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - rotekz - 10-27-2018, 04:00 AM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - 911 - 10-25-2018, 10:24 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - amity - 11-08-2018, 08:33 AM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - 911 - 11-08-2018, 09:00 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - 911 - 04-06-2019, 04:48 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - 911 - 04-07-2019, 01:11 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - rotekz - 01-27-2020, 04:27 PM
RE: Holocaust fact finding thread - Goni - 01-28-2020, 04:45 AM

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