Post: #1

I think Airbnb may end up changing the game for guys looking for short-term monthly rentals. It's really catching on and a lot of European cities have tons of supply on the market. The only problem is that Airbnb rates are higher than if you contact short-term companies directly, but not always (in Zagreb, airbnb is cheaper).

The key to saving money is understanding that the owners will come down in price by quite a bit. Don't accept the price at face value. If their calendar is empty, they will give you a discount to get some money, especially if you stay a month.

What I did for Zagreb is blast a a bunch of people (without even looking at the pictures) to get an idea of what kind of rates I could get. I found out that 700 euros seemed to be the floor in summer for a nice apartment in the center, so I got almost everyone down from their initial asking prices of 1000 or more (I got one guy down from 1500 euros to 800).

I know Americans don't like negotiation, so simply say, "I have another offer for 700 euros not far from your apartment. Can you match that?" Most people will come down.

Since Airbnb's fees are so high (10%), Soma in another thread said to book for a few days and then negotiate a rate during that time to pay in cash for the rest of your stay. It sounds good in theory, but you may end up paying more. For example:

The apartment I got for one month had an 80 euro service charge from airbnb for the month I will stay. I got a monthly discount (I asked via messaging) so my daily rent is 27 euros. The total is 880 euros for the month.

He lists the apartment for 67 euros a day. If I rented it for 3 nights it would have cost me 220 euros including the service fee. For the remaining 28 nights it would have cost me 756 euros (28 nights times 27 euros, no airbnb fee). The total cost would be 976 euros.

I saved 96 euros by booking the entire month with airbnb. If the monthly savings you get on rent is considerable from the daily rent, you should just book the entire thing with airbnb. If the monthly rate is the same as the daily rate, then you should book a short time and then pay a monthly rent in cash.

Anything I missed?

Post: #2

The apart-hotel I'm staying in was listed on airbnb. They always give the street name, so I tracked them down and negotiated a better rate.

Post: #3

Sounds right. The outlier here, of course, is the giant disparity between the daily rate (€67) and the negotiated monthly rate per day (€27), and, as such, it makes no sense to pay the daily rate initially as you have noted. Normally, the daily rate would not be 2.5x the monthly rate; 1x-1.5x is more standard.

Post: #4

(08-17-2012 08:13 AM)Soma Wrote:  Sounds right. The outlier here, of course, is the giant disparity between the daily rate (€67) and the negotiated monthly rate per day (€27), and, as such, it makes no sense to pay the daily rate initially as you have noted. Normally, the daily rate would not be 2.5x the monthly rate; 1x-1.5x is more standard.

Yeah gotta take it on a case by case basis.

An empty calendar is a great indicator of how low someone will go. May want to target those listings first.

Post: #5

I never thought to negotiate. Solid idea.

In terms of logistics it is absolutely changing the game. Instead of making up nonsense about why I'm in a hotel, I can say that I'm living in xxxx. It makes my game stronger because the girl is convinced I really do live in xxxx and I even believe it myself.

This might be a bit of an outlier, but I was chased out of an airbnb apartment in Bangkok after 2 days because the owner of the apartment was told by the super that women were coming back to my room with me. Thinking they were prostitutes, she refunded me my money and told me to get lost. I'd at least ask the owner if it's ok if your girlfriend spends some nights with you in the apartment.

Post: #6

I used the service in france for the first time this summer. I would only book for three nights at a time to see how you like the place and the logistics. If it sucks, move on. I had a problem with the first place i rented as it was a good twenty minute drive from the nightlife and town center, and i booked in advance for a week. Live and learn

Needless to say i def. Advocate short term apartments with a kitchen over hotels and hostels.

Post: #7

What I like to do is rent a big pimp ass apartment in E Europe from an agency, then rent out extra rooms to air bnb people. And of course they must meet certain criteria, no riff raff.

Post: #8

Even if you squeeze the maximum from AirBnB, those are still extravagant prices for a (one bedroom) apartment close to the center of the city. I'm not in Zagreb, but my apartment with same conditions costs me about 300 € (including electricity, internet, water and TV) / month.

Even if Zagreb cost 50% more (which it, from what I know, certainly does not), that's still.... kind of mind-boggling. 800 €, jeez. I suppose that's the kind of premium on local prices that you have to accept if you're a foreigner renting for only one month, no matter the country?

Post: #9

Zagreb is the most expensive monthly rent I've paid anywhere in Europe. This includes Iceland and Sweden.

It's not a supply and demand issue. The supply is there, but these landlords are holding out for insane prices. It's like they want to rent it for one month then take a few months off instead of having consistent business. I don't get it, really.

Post: #10

Yes the amounts you were talking did seem a lot for Croatia Roosh.

I quite often scour the Couchsurfing groups for countries I am visiting, they often have a accommodation group where people are looking to rent apartments.

A decent size studio in the Balkans should cost you no more than 300 Euros presently.

Post: #11

I've been using airbnb this year. So far it is great:

- NYC East Village studio for 100/night (negotiated). Can't get any hotel for that rate. Helped tremendously with game, told girls I was doing a test run of living in the city.
- Munich for Oktoberfest, booked through airbnb. Considerably cheaper than hotels during this peak time.

I'm using it for all my travels now.

Post: #12

'It's not a supply and demand issue. The supply is there, but these landlords are holding out for insane prices. It's like they want to rent it for o'ne month then take a few months off instead of having consistent business. I don't get it, really"

thats very eastern europe,FSU mentality. Even prostitutes will sit in bar day after day turning down what they consider "beneath them", mind you they are buying drinks etc, work expenses, but they hold out for that dumb tourist wh owill pay the mwhat they want, even thoguh they get that fee maybe once every 2 weeks or so.restaurants work same way, overprice food so only wealthy eat there but place stays open all day with empty tables, a shame really. They havent figured out how to make money serving in mass.

Post: #13

A trend I noticed in EE and FSU countries is stubbornness to a point of stupidity when it comes to negotiating the price of things. I noticed it most prominently in Bosnia. I was unable to bargain for something as trite as a souvenir in this part of the world. The price, is the price, is the price. The guy cost himself money at the expense of appearing powerful. It seemed to be cultural thing. Perhaps a cross between Balkan Power and the fact that Bosnia has been endlessly torn apart by war.

Post: #14

(08-17-2012 01:58 PM)lotharius Wrote:  What I like to do is rent a big pimp ass apartment in E Europe from an agency, then rent out extra rooms to air bnb people. And of course they must meet certain criteria, no riff raff.

Interesting. How did that work out? Were you able to come close to recouping your payment by renting out the extra rooms?

Post: #15

(08-17-2012 04:12 PM)speakeasy Wrote:  

(08-17-2012 01:58 PM)lotharius Wrote:  What I like to do is rent a big pimp ass apartment in E Europe from an agency, then rent out extra rooms to air bnb people. And of course they must meet certain criteria, no riff raff.

Interesting. How did that work out? Were you able to come close to recouping your payment by renting out the extra rooms?

Well not totally recounting the cost but some months I was getting 50% of the rent, and the odd bang.

Post: #16

2 questions:

-can you negotiate a lower price on Airbnb for less than a week in low season?

-do you guys rent appartments or private rooms in a host's place?

Post: #17

(09-03-2012 04:12 AM)michelin Wrote:  2 questions:

-can you negotiate a lower price on Airbnb for less than a week in low season?

-do you guys rent appartments or private rooms in a host's place?

1. You can try.

2. I rent entire apartments. I don't want to share.

Post: #18

Another tip for this is to check 9flats.com . Its basically the same thing but comes from Germany. Can still get places in all major cities though. As I posted in the Oktoberfest thread we got a central 2 bed apartment for less each than the camp sites out in the sticks were charging for a tent. Theres also another one called Wimdu which I havnt used before but its also supposed to be decent.

Post: #19

I've used Airbnb extensively and always negotiate. If they aren't willing to negotiate at all then don't rent with them.

One scam that the landlords pull on Airbnb is to put up several apartments, one for a cheap price, one for a medium, and one for an expensive price. You message for the cheap price, they draw out the interaction until it gets closer to the date you wanted to arrive, and then they say sorry the cheap place is taken but we will still have the medium one, then they do the same thing again, until its really close and say the medium one is taken, but you can have the expensive one. Their excuse is that the previous tenant needed to stay longer for some reason. Obviously they only try this in peak season, but beware.

I found that most of the time you save money by doing the pay-in-cash, I never really saw a disparity like Roosh between the posted Airbnb monthly rate and the daily rate but maybe things have changed a little. I would only pay for 1 night on Airbnb and then just show up with the cash when they gave me the key.

Post: #20

Can add another like here for AIRBNB. Got my Kiev apartment through them and even managed to contact the owner directly away from AIRBNB. Won't mention how.

Post: #21

Personally I don't mind paying Airbnb's charges for the security their ratings system provides. Also they will escrow the money into a day of your stay so you can never be truly fucked by a host. For me that's worth it when I'm traveling far and staying in a sweet, central place where last minute changes would jeopardize the plan.

Post: #22

(08-17-2012 02:21 PM)Roosh Wrote:  Zagreb is the most expensive monthly rent I've paid anywhere in Europe. This includes Iceland and Sweden.

It's not a supply and demand issue. The supply is there, but these landlords are holding out for insane prices. It's like they want to rent it for one month then take a few months off instead of having consistent business. I don't get it, really.

It's the balkan mentality especially in Croatia. They would complain that there is no work, but if there is a shipyard job in the Dalmatian coast summer heat they wont take it. Blame it on the former communist system or on something else. They can be hard headed and narrow minded in terms of business savy.

Post: #23

I used Airbnb in San Diego, NYC, Barcelona, Istanbul, Munich, and a few other places. I love it. You should definitely try to negotiate a price if you are staying a week or more.

I agree with Vicious about preferring to use airbnb even with the extra cost. I had to use their customer service a few times and they answered my email in minutes. Also having the money in escrow and the owner knowing if they screw up you can rate them poorly is incentive for them to keep their end of the bargin and not try to screw you.

I have only rented from people who had a lot of positive reviews and so far I have never had a problem.

Post: #24

Is it really that difficult to contact an airbnb member directly?

I recently used airbnb, and told the seller to call me at the hotel I was staying at, and gave him my room number. He called my hotel, we talked for a bit, and I paid cash.

Post: #25

I've found better luck going on Criagslist for one month rentals... at least for rooms. Not sure what the disparity is with full apartments to yourself.