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The Official Presidential Election Thread
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Timoteo Offline
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Post: #251
RE: The Official Presidential Election Thread
(11-07-2012 04:57 PM)ManAbout Wrote:  
(11-07-2012 04:40 PM)playa_with_a_passport Wrote:  I don't buy the whole "immigrants do the jobs that Americans won't do" meme. There are tons of White males who are willing to do back breaking labor provided they get paid well to do it.

Nobody is going to pay you $50/hr to clean toilets. Without cheap Mexican labour, the US economy will collapse and businesses will go bankrupt.

I thought conservatives were all about letting businesses run rampant, and do what ever it takes to make a profit, whether it's polluting the environment or paying workers $1/hr if that's what it takes.

Now I see conservatives here talking about making it illegals for businesses to hire immigrants. Interfering with the free market economy? Blasphemy. What next? Make it illegal to send jobs offshore? Of course, not. They would never do that. Usual conservative hypocrisy. It suits them to blame "illegal immigrants" because that's what plays to their overwhelmingly white base.

This is, and has ALWAYS been what should have been the primary solution to the "problem" of illegal immigration. At the same time, the business class that lines their pockets needs this cheap labor, and they know it. So publicly they rail about immigration, while wink-wink, nod-nodding behind the scenes and being just fine with a decent flow of this labor coming in. The government will stage an occcasional raid on a meat processing plant in the Midwest, and while they're walking a few illegals out the front door, their replacements are being walked in the back. And the wheels just keeps turning. Countless candidates for appointment to high level posts have had to quietly withdraw because of nanny issues at home, which they publicly state as "tax" issues (not paying taxes on the "housekeeper" income). They can keep positions below a certain level, but high level posts have a more extensive background check, which they know they can't pass.

"The best kind of pride is that which compels a man to do his best when no one is watching."
(This post was last modified: 11-08-2012 11:46 AM by Timoteo.)
11-08-2012 11:32 AM
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Timoteo Offline
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Post: #252
RE: The Official Presidential Election Thread
(11-07-2012 04:45 PM)The Texas Prophet Wrote:  It is interesting that so many Obama supporters are anti-immigrant on this thread.

Newsflash: Obama is not going to do a thing to get rid of illegals. In fact, he will probably legalize as many as he can.

Also, he doesn't need the Republicans to work with him on immigration: he can legalize through executive order just like his partial amnesty earlier this year.

My understanding is that the Obama administration has deported more people than Bush did his whole 8 years. So he's working both ends of it - looking at compromises for some illegals that are working or going to school, while sending the undesirables back.

"The best kind of pride is that which compels a man to do his best when no one is watching."
11-08-2012 11:37 AM
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Vicious Offline
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Post: #253
RE: The Official Presidential Election Thread
Republicans would do themselves a favor if they admited that Romney was a weak candidate, from a field of weak nominees. I personally think that had McCain ran this year he would have beat Obama. But he was a staunch ideologist and made a bad move with Sarah Palin. It's like the GOP was trying to run with Romney as a tactical choice.

Even though you might not be a conservative it's easy to respect a man of principles like McCain because he has a code he operates from. Unlike Romney that was against everything he was earlier for a month after he was picked as the nominee.
(This post was last modified: 11-08-2012 11:51 AM by Vicious.)
11-08-2012 11:43 AM
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WestIndianArchie Offline
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Post: #254
RE: The Official Presidential Election Thread
(11-07-2012 05:30 PM)j r Wrote:   Their economy is atrophying exactly because they refuse to let immigrants in and help their economy keep going.

Their economy has had 20+ years of stagnation because they refused to clean up their banking situation.

During the boom in the 80's, their banking system made tons of bad loans. Rather than call them bad loans, they had their own TARPS and other programs to "wait out the storm".

Meanwhile, South Korea, Taiwan, Singapore, and Hong Kong came in and took mad market share. Lotta y'all bought Samsung TV's cause the Sony's were too expensive. And nowadays, most of the electronics are made in China and then a American, Western, Japanese, or Korean label is put on top of it.

So now they had mad debt and their exports couldn't compete price wise. (it all and always comes down to price)

Their population likes to save, so it's not like they were going to pull an America, and have it's domestic economy save the whole thing.

Throw in their xenophobia and education, you've got chicks not pumping out kids until their late 20's and mid 30's.

Disaster.

Same low grade horror is happening in America, Western Europe, and believe it or not China and India.

China has a grip of bad loans and a serious gender disparity. They were growing in the double digits every year, moving 100's of millions of people out of poverty. Now that wages have risen, those same capitalists are setting up shop in Indonesia and the rest of South East Asia, where the wages are lower.

India isn't nearly as developed, but it's an "alpha's" paradise, like Russia. Anything you want, you pretty much have to take by force, because it's not like you can depend on the rule of law.

But before any of that happens, i'm sure Global Warming will kick in - and we may have to reassess the game completely

WIA
11-08-2012 11:45 AM
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Timoteo Offline
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Post: #255
RE: The Official Presidential Election Thread
(11-08-2012 11:43 AM)Vicious Wrote:  Republicans would do themselves a favor if they admited that Romney was a weak candidate, from a field of weak nominees. I personally think that had McCain ran this year he would have beat Obama. But he was a staunch ideologist and made a bad move with Sarah Palin. It's like the GOP was trying to run with Romney as a tactical choice.

If the McCain of 2000 had won the nomination, I would have had to give him a hard look. The Republican party knew they couldn't control McCain back then, and wanted a guy they could, so they elevated Bush. In '08, knowing it was his last chance at the White House, McCain completely sold out to the party on certain positions, and yes, accepting Palin as his running mate was the final nail. I don't believe he could have won in 2012. Too much damage had been done to him.

"The best kind of pride is that which compels a man to do his best when no one is watching."
(This post was last modified: 11-08-2012 12:18 PM by Timoteo.)
11-08-2012 11:50 AM
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Vicious Offline
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Post: #256
RE: The Official Presidential Election Thread
I'd say that McCain was far closer to his conservative roots than the party was and still is.
11-08-2012 11:59 AM
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Tex Pro Offline
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Post: #257
RE: The Official Presidential Election Thread
(11-07-2012 10:21 PM)speakeasy Wrote:  
(11-07-2012 04:45 PM)The Texas Prophet Wrote:  It is interesting that so many Obama supporters are anti-immigrant on this thread.

Newsflash: Obama is not going to do a thing to get rid of illegals. In fact, he will probably legalize as many as he can.

Also, he doesn't need the Republicans to work with him on immigration: he can legalize through executive order just like his partial amnesty earlier this year.

Actually Obama has deported more illegals than any other president.

http://www.ibtimes.com/under-obama-depor...011-781511

Obama also did this:
http://www.cnn.com/2012/06/15/politics/i...index.html

Anyone hoping Obama will be tough on illegal immigration is in for a big surprise. His is going to continue to legalize illegal immigrants.

See article below:
http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/latin...ction.html
(This post was last modified: 11-08-2012 12:12 PM by Tex Pro.)
11-08-2012 12:08 PM
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Excelsior Offline
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Post: #258
RE: The Official Presidential Election Thread
(11-08-2012 11:37 AM)Timoteo Wrote:  My understanding is that the Obama administration has deported more people than Bush did his whole 8 years. So he's working both ends of it - looking at compromises for some illegals that are working or going to school, while sending the undesirables back.

That's a strategy I can get behind.

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11-08-2012 02:33 PM
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kosko Offline
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Post: #259
RE: The Official Presidential Election Thread
(11-08-2012 09:06 AM)Ramon Zarate Wrote:  
(11-07-2012 10:36 PM)kosko Wrote:  Anybody read the news today? Like a script the MSM is now pushing the 'Fiscal Cliff' narrative and story. It did not matter whom got elected this December massive Austerity (ala UK, Spain, Italy style) is coming to America. Obama punted the real Grand Bargain to December and in his own words is "egear" to get a deal done. Him with Congress and the "Supercommitee" will soon slash and cut, and raise taxes on a good chunk of Anericans (Romney would of done the same). This election was a total pony show to distract people from this and to make wise choices in selecting representatives whom will be voting on this.

Welcome to the great hangover.

The words 'fiscal cliff' are now everywhere in the mainstream media (for no reason obviously, since it's the last thing the US should be worrying about at the moment). So now we know that the big boys are pro-austerity (actually we knew this already as Wall Street sided predominantly with Romney). Krugman has a great argument as to why this is - if you can convince politicians that 'business confidence' is on a knife edge, and only austerity will make the difference between business confidence and meltdown, the influence of business interests will expand relative to the interests of the electorate.

Yes indeed. Austerity is really just an extreme baseball bat to the poor as generally the money "saved" gets used for bailouts and "stimulus". But the hole of austerity is that it never works as you can't create a large Government Economy cut the floor from it and expect it to still grow. Tax returns dip, good employment disappears, etc.

You see the MSM selling this junk now bacause it benefits them emmensly. Where was this talk prior? DURING THE CAMPAIGN?

The USA can roll over as much debt as its needed but Obama had to buy time to not give into the cuts that were cried for. Now that we have a environment in which we have more retiring Congressmen then in almost any point in history you have a group of old decaying men ready to sell out during the lame duck session of November & December.
11-08-2012 04:28 PM
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kosko Offline
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RE: The Official Presidential Election Thread
...
(This post was last modified: 11-08-2012 04:31 PM by kosko.)
11-08-2012 04:29 PM
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Excelsior Offline
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RE: The Official Presidential Election Thread
More photo reports from Romney HQ:

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[Image: 404261_10152232996415076_273840226_n.jpg]

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11-08-2012 08:37 PM
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TheSlayer Offline
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Post: #262
RE: The Official Presidential Election Thread
These pictures are very funny, Athlone. I can understand Republicans having disdain for Obama but I don't understand the whining about "liberty and freedom" being in jeopardy.
11-08-2012 08:57 PM
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Excelsior Offline
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Post: #263
RE: The Official Presidential Election Thread
[Image: tumblr_md6twwaWEB1rkd8gso1_500.jpg]
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[Image: tumblr_md71x4QfPd1rkd8gso1_500.jpg]

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11-08-2012 09:55 PM
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Excelsior Offline
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Post: #264
RE: The Official Presidential Election Thread
[Image: tumblr_md6rdug6Eu1rkd8gso1_500.png]
[Image: tumblr_md6r41WlXO1rkd8gso1_500.png]
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[Image: 600]

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11-08-2012 09:58 PM
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chyamor Offline
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RE: The Official Presidential Election Thread
do you think the ones posting and bitching are driven by race?
11-08-2012 09:59 PM
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OGNorCal707 Offline
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RE: The Official Presidential Election Thread
Notice every single one of the groveling Romney supporters are white, minorities side with the Democrats 90% of the time, the Republican party is fucked.
11-08-2012 10:03 PM
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Excelsior Offline
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RE: The Official Presidential Election Thread
(11-08-2012 09:59 PM)chyamor Wrote:  do you think the ones posting and bitching are driven by race?

Our knowledge about the conservative base and its range of ideologies (many of which are quite insensitive to minorities) will tell us that yes, quite a few are. Which ones exactly? More difficult to tell.

(11-08-2012 10:03 PM)OGNorCal707 Wrote:  Notice every single one of the groveling Romney supporters are white, minorities side with the Democrats 90% of the time, the Republican party is fucked.

I actually managed to find one:

[Image: tumblr_md5d09zula1rkd8gso1_500.jpg]

Check him out on the bottom right. He's the only minority of any kind I've seen so far among the many post-election photos I've been sifting through.

Meanwhile, more of his fellow conservatives in all their dismay:

[Image: tumblr_md5k2sTEm41rkd8gso1_500.jpg]
[Image: tumblr_md5byfrLCI1rkd8gso1_500.jpg]
[Image: tumblr_md3otaHIEE1qa2118o1_500.png]
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[Image: tumblr_md5ssuG8Ym1rkd8gso1_500.jpg]
[Image: 5099ff502f4be.image.jpg]

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11-08-2012 10:26 PM
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RE: The Official Presidential Election Thread
Is there a reason that all these girls are crying and talking about losing American and their "freedom and liberty" and all that? Seriously, Obama winning isn't gonna change your life at all. Yes, I wanted Obama to win but even if Romney won, he really wouldn't do anything differently either (regarding woman's right and all that stuff, I think both candidates will probably maintain the status quo). Although, I am sure if Obama had won all the feminists would have been crying. Are people in the US that passionate about the elections that they cry if their guy loses? I can't remember an election in Canada where the losing party's supporters were this visibly sad.
(This post was last modified: 11-08-2012 11:03 PM by TheSlayer.)
11-08-2012 10:47 PM
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Excelsior Offline
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RE: The Official Presidential Election Thread
(11-08-2012 10:47 PM)TheSlayer Wrote:  Are people in the US that passionate about the elections that they cry if their guy loses?

You have no idea...

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(This post was last modified: 11-08-2012 10:52 PM by Excelsior.)
11-08-2012 10:52 PM
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Capitán Peligroso Offline
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RE: The Official Presidential Election Thread
(11-08-2012 10:47 PM)TheSlayer Wrote:  Is there a reason that all these girls are crying and talking about losing American and their "freedom and liberty" and all that? Seriously, Obama winning isn't gonna change your life at all. Yes, I wanted Obama to win but even if Romney won, he really wouldn't do anything differently either (regarding woman's right and all that stuff, I think both candidates will probably maintain the status quo). Although, I am sure if Obama had won all the feminists would have been crying. Are people in the US that passionate about the elections that they cry if their guy loses? I can't remember an election in Canada where the losing party's supporters were this visibly sad.

I didn't know that anyone liked Mitt Romney that much other than his family, and I'm not so sure about them. "It's sad when you live in a world where someone (MITT ROMNEY?!?!?!?) can be too good." Too good for America? Rape, pillage, and burn Mitt Romney? I think this may be a case of the "dance with them that brung ya" syndrome. Would they be singing the same praises of Frothy Santorum if it was him that had just been dispatched by the Obama machine? This is really the first time I've heard of anyone being that into Mitt Romney, other than Ann. It was always more like "well, he's an asshole, but he's OUR asshole." I still have yet to hear someone passionately and cogently make a case for a Mitt Romney presidency, including Mitt Romney. It's like they don't even believe their own bullshit. So this seemingly genuine pearl-clutching is a bit of a curiosity to me.

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11-08-2012 11:55 PM
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dragnet Offline
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RE: The Official Presidential Election Thread
Good lord I about orgasmed just looking at those sad motherfuckers---epic photos are simply epic.

On Tuesday night as Ohio was being called I flipped over to Fox News just to bask in the schadenfreude. I saw Karl Rove losing his shit as reality was finally dawning on him. He was begging---beggin!---for them not to call Ohio for Obama. A once proud man going through Kubler Ross' stages of grief in front of the entire country was almost too much to watch. To witness Megyn Kelly (would hit!) acting as grief counselor for this man was surreal. If he had become anymore unhinged you would have been looking at a hostage situation.

The only people who didn't know the score were people like Rove and those pathetic maroons in Athlone's photos. This is the inevitable result of existing entirely within a hermetically sealed parallel universe---and then driving face-first smack into the unyielding brick wall of reality at 100 mph. And this is the inevitable next stage of the most fundamental battle of our country: the defeat of white supremacy as the organizing principle of our society. Yep, I said it: the defeat of the GOP last night was the latest manifestation of white supremacy's long retreat.

But it's important not to blame the GOP, really. White supremacy is such a powerful force in our society--I believe it to be the founding/organizing principle of this country--that when the Democrats abandoned it for civil rights it was a foregone conclusion that the other party would grasp it. Power cannot be created or destroyed---it can only change hands. So don't blame the sonofabitches, but hold them accountable and I'll be damned if it didn't happen Tuesday night. Which is, I suspect, a source of much of discomfort and dismay from the right---they were finally unmasked and there was no hiding.

It's still a long--very long--struggle from here. Anyone who thinks these guys are going to play ball with Obama needs to stop freebasing right now. And the left is by no means perfect---it needs to get serious about tackling the debt and putting an enforcement regime in place with regards to low-skill immigration, among other things. But Tuesday night felt like another little-big victory in the most fundamental battle we face in this country and that is to be cheered.
(This post was last modified: 11-09-2012 12:46 AM by dragnet.)
11-09-2012 12:44 AM
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T and A Man Offline
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RE: The Official Presidential Election Thread
White supemacy as powerful force in the U.S.?

You are off with the fairies.
11-09-2012 12:47 AM
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RE: The Official Presidential Election Thread
(11-09-2012 12:47 AM)T and A Man Wrote:  White supemacy as powerful force in the U.S.?

You are off with the fairies.

Then fairies are real.

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11-09-2012 12:59 AM
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T and A Man Offline
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RE: The Official Presidential Election Thread
lol

No fairies are not real, and neither is white supremacy being a powerful force.

You do not know real racial oppresion if you nominate what occurs in the U.S. as amongst the worst.

Buminputra in the Malaysia is much worse on all other ethnic classes by orders of magnitudes. Large scale social exclusion to Gaijin in Japan is about supremacy, the same as treatment of Geilo in Cantonese China. The internecine conflicts within the African continent is about ethnic supremacy.

East Asian races would not succeed in the U.S. and occupy positions of economic prominance if that was the case.

South Asian races would not succeed in the U.S. and occupy positions of economic prominance if that was the case.

Latinos would not be able to comproise over 10% of the population if that was thecase.

Racial supremacy is virulent and aggressive. That does not occur in the U.S.

In fact the most outward display of dogmatic racial hatred..... not indifference, disrespect or antipathy, but sheer violence-on-plain-sight HATRED is directed from blacks towards whites. Any outsider, of which I am one, can see that. However, no one claims there are pockets of black supremacy in the U.S.

There may be intransient motives of white/european cultural primacy, but the U.S. shares that cultural primacy with most other races.

Can't say the same about the bumniputra.
(This post was last modified: 11-09-2012 01:15 AM by T and A Man.)
11-09-2012 01:11 AM
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RE: The Official Presidential Election Thread
(11-09-2012 12:59 AM)Athlone McGinnis Wrote:  
(11-09-2012 12:47 AM)T and A Man Wrote:  White supemacy as powerful force in the U.S.?

You are off with the fairies.

Then fairies are real.

It didn't seem all that far off to me either. I would never go so far as to say it was the founding/organizing principle of the country, but it is so deeply ingrained in the national psyche that a lot of (white) people don't see it. For me, having been awake and alive the last couple dozen years, it's in plain view. I know plenty of people who DESPISE Barack Obama and will say with a straight face that he's the second coming of Satan himself. Yet, if you engage them, they can't articulate a good reason why. This hatred and fear doesn't come from the logical part of the brain. It comes from knowing that your basic assumptions about power in this country are dissolving and that the friendly face of this new multi-cultural fascism is, ulp...black. Fast change is arriving, slow change is moving out. Good. Bring it on...

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11-09-2012 01:24 AM
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