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The Bitcoin (BTC) thread
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JayJuanGee Offline
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Post: #1026
RE: Bitcoins up 60% in less than a month
(01-11-2014 06:40 PM)el mechanico Wrote:  I dropped out at 860 last night with a sell order I didn't think would go. How are you guys doing?

I'm waiting for a crash now maybe get into NMC again.

Surely, I hope that you are correct about an upcoming BTC crash because I keep wanting to buy more BTC – and BTC prices just keeps going up... and all day long has been floating around 900 (and currently). To me, BTC seems to be continuing on an upward trajectory…..

Also, to me, there seems to need some significant bad BTC news first in order to predict a bubble, and there isn’t really any significant bad BTC news, at the moment. I just see good news reports... more and more adoption... more and more news about expansion and acceptance.

Further, I cannot see how Namecoin could be any more special than any of the other alt crypto currencies, in terms of out performing BTC.

It seems that whenever BTC crashes, the alt currencies (the ones on BTC e) crash more than BTC.

On the other hand, some of the other alt currencies (that are NOT listed on BTC e) seem to have an inverse relationship to the price of BTC e… (such as dogecoin, or even master or ripple and various random coins) though I would NOT really claim to know about any specific or regular pattern with those other alt currencies.

I suppose that there are other exchanges that could allow a guy to move in and out of BTC and into one or more of those other alt currencies.... though at what risk? And, also probably some learning curve... but potentially very profitable, if a guy can pick the lucky one... .the coin de jure.

EDIT: BTW, currently, my next BTC buy point is 850; however, it would be even better, if BTC were to drop below 850 for me to be able to buy at a lower price.
(This post was last modified: 01-11-2014 07:43 PM by JayJuanGee.)
01-11-2014 07:30 PM
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Post: #1027
RE: Bitcoins up 60% in less than a month
I'm wondering how I can arbitrage the bitcoins I'm mining...transfer to MtGox wallet and sell? Is it hard to get money out of MtGox?

Are you guys using bank wire or Mastercard to get money into Btc-e?
01-11-2014 08:07 PM
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el mechanico Offline
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Post: #1028
RE: Bitcoins up 60% in less than a month
Those alt coins may all be crap or whatever but as long as I can cash out fast I'll play with them.

Jay Juan buy your coins but transfer into USD fast and wait until the 31st or so
01-11-2014 08:12 PM
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svenski7 Offline
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Post: #1029
RE: Bitcoins up 60% in less than a month
@pants: How does Norge track your cryptocurrency capital gains? Do the exchanges pass the transaction information on to the gov't?

It might be good to know in case regulators in the US start down the same path (reporting, tax forms, etc...) I'm glad we haven't gone down that fascist path yet...
01-11-2014 08:14 PM
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JayJuanGee Offline
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Post: #1030
RE: Bitcoins up 60% in less than a month
(01-11-2014 08:07 PM)svenski7 Wrote:  I'm wondering how I can arbitrage the bitcoins I'm mining...transfer to MtGox wallet and sell? Is it hard to get money out of MtGox?



I have been wondering if anyone uses MtGox on this forum. The news is that MtGox is a real pain in the ass pertaining to how long it takes to get money out, but it could be worth the wait, if a guy were able to cash out at $100 more than other exchanges.



(01-11-2014 08:07 PM)svenski7 Wrote:  Are you guys using bank wire or Mastercard to get money into Btc-e?

Once you set up a BTC-e account, it is really easy and quick (usually less than 30 minutes) to transfer BTC into BTC-e, and there is NO fee to transfer BTC into BTC-e. I have NOT yet tried to transfer BTC out of BTC-e, so I am NOT sure whether there is a fee to transfer BTC out of BTC-e.

Alternatively, I had looked into various means to get dollars into BTC-e, and a lot of those means seemed cumbersome and/or expensive..... accordingly, I gave up on any attempts to transfer dollars into BTC-e.


(01-11-2014 08:12 PM)el mechanico Wrote:  Those alt coins may all be crap or whatever but as long as I can cash out fast I'll play with them.

Surely, it remains easy and fairly inexpensive (.2%) to exchange any of the 7 crypto currencies on BTC-e. I just have NO clue about how a guy would choose which one and on which day. For example, if I look at a current snapshot in the last 24 hours, PPC, XPM and TRC were the only three that significantly out performed BTC. Pretty much all the others underperformed BTC; however, difficult to know ahead of time, but I suppose that anyone who is following these trends, may be able to either see a trend or to pick up on a trend while watching various news feeds.



(01-11-2014 08:12 PM)el mechanico Wrote:  Jay Juan buy your coins but transfer into USD fast and wait until the 31st or so

I do NOT understand why you continue to engage in this kind of "I told you so" conduct, in spite of numerous times that I have explained over and over and over in this public thread, that I am engaging in a variation of dollar cost averaging.

It makes NO sense that you feel this need to instruct - in order that some day, you may be correct about your prediction of a crash, and you can say that "I told you that you should have gotten out." If BTC goes down, then I am BUYING. I am NOT selling in anticipation, AS YOU ALREADY KNOW based on my repetition and even my sending you PMs on the topic.

Additionally, even though a crash could occur, there is NO clear sign that BTC is going to crash before 1/31 in order to adjust to the Chinese restrictions. And, even if it does, my strategy is to buy on the way down (and sell on the way up, if I were to sell... but I am NOT selling.. as you know). I am continuing to build my BTC portfolio (that is how dollar cost averaging works).

Further, regarding some crash before 1/31, it is possible, but it seems likely that the BTC market has already adjusted for that Chinese news... and that particular crash already took place, largely in mid-December.

MAYBE you are correct, and MAYBE we will see some drying up of BTC exchanges between NOW and January 31 - but I am NOT going to take that chance based on the current BTC news and also based on your merely making that PRICE DROP assertion over and over again. Surely, it is fairly likely, given the volatility of BTC prices, that sooner or later you are going to be correct about some downward BTC price adjustment, yet would it NOT be better to just let the TOPIC be rather than continuing over and over to bring it up, as if every guy were engaged in some kind of BTC investment methodology of attempting to time BTC prices. Surely, YOU already know, that is NOT my strategy.


BTW: I like those headlights on your new avatar. Smile
(This post was last modified: 01-11-2014 09:04 PM by JayJuanGee.)
01-11-2014 08:58 PM
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el mechanico Offline
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Post: #1031
RE: Bitcoins up 60% in less than a month
Why? Because it's foolish. Take what you have and work it. I would never buy a bitcoin for 900 dollars with my own money. You know there will be mass panic around the end of the month, so WHY???
01-11-2014 09:15 PM
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JayJuanGee Offline
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Post: #1032
RE: Bitcoins up 60% in less than a month
At this point, WE do NOT know whether there is going to be mass panic before the end of the month.

If some reliable information is presented, then I wil consider that in terms of whether I will adjust my strategy.

Your mere assertion, over and over, for about the last month is NOT adequate info for me to change my strategy.

Why suggest that it is foolish, when other strategies may be equally foolish?

If you can point to some source of info, besides your feelings or the troll box, then I may consider making some adjustments to my BTC strategy. Otherwise, it does NOT seem foolish for a guy to stay invested in BTC, either all or in part.

I also think that I mentioned to you, several times, that BTC is only a very small fraction of my total investment portfolio. Accordingly, you are NOT in a position to know what is foolish in my circumstances.

I think we call it live and let live. I am telling guys what I am doing and revealing aspects of my strategy, but I am NOT suggesting that guys are foolish, merely bc they may choose a different strategy or predict a different BTC direction.
01-11-2014 09:46 PM
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pants Offline
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Post: #1033
RE: Bitcoins up 60% in less than a month
(01-11-2014 08:14 PM)svenski7 Wrote:  @pants: How does Norge track your cryptocurrency capital gains? Do the exchanges pass the transaction information on to the gov't?

It might be good to know in case regulators in the US start down the same path (reporting, tax forms, etc...) I'm glad we haven't gone down that fascist path yet...

I have no idea. If I were to guess I will assume they have no technology to know how much bitcoins anyone have right now. So they rely on honest people sharing their information.

As far as taxation, I think it´s a good thing that they will attempt to tax Bitcoin. I don´t really believe in a world without taxes. So tax on capital gains are fair. The one that makes no sense to me is the VAT tax. Dose this mean miners have to collect VAT when they sell bitcoin? Or is VAT supposed to be collected on every transaction. We still lack some information from the norwegian IRS
01-11-2014 10:50 PM
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Jaydublin Offline
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Post: #1034
RE: Bitcoins up 60% in less than a month
JJG bubbles catch people by surprise. You seem to think they are easy to pick out with negative news, they aren't and you most likely wont get a warning.
01-12-2014 01:48 AM
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JayJuanGee Offline
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Post: #1035
RE: Bitcoins up 60% in less than a month
(01-12-2014 01:48 AM)Jaydublin Wrote:  JJG bubbles catch people by surprise. You seem to think they are easy to pick out with negative news, they aren't and you most likely wont get a warning.

JayDub:

The known and ongoing volatility of BTC is why I am dollar cost averaging.

Generally, my plan has been to buy more BTC when BTC prices are going down and to buy less BTC when prices are going up. I have never stated that I can predict any bubble or denied that currently we could be in a bubble or attempted to time any thing related to BTC except to buy more BTC as the prices are going down and to buy less BTC as the prices are going up.

I have fairly thoroughly explained my BTC investment methodology, which seems to be consistent with standard investment strategies that invoke dollar cost averaging and a hybrid form of dollar cost averaging (my investment strategy is hybrid b/c I began by making my investments daily - yet recently, I have moved less frequently and I am largely front loading my investment within a dollar cost averaging framework).

On the other hand, several other guys in this thread seem to be attempting to time this and suggesting to get out of BTC at times when they believe BTC prices may be going down (El Mech specifically). I have NO problem with guys choosing to get out of BTC; that remains their choice. I am NOT suggesting that any of these guys are fools b/c of their investment strategy.... b/c it seems to me that guys here should be able to make their choices about how to invest in BTC without being ridiculed for their choice and without being referred to as foolish.

What about you? Are you in BTC or NOT? And, what are you suggesting to do regarding BTC?

What's your BTC investment strategy, if any? Have you read my posts regarding my understanding of my BTC investment strategy methodology through this thread? Do you have constructive criticism about how I may consider tweaking my BTC investment strategy? I do NOT mind tweaking my investment strategy, if it makes sense to me, yet currently, I am of the believe that my investment strategy is working out pretty well.

I have been employing various forms of dollar cost averaging for more than 25 years - though this BTC investment has brought unique circumstances, especially, b/c internet monitoring and investing has caused unique tracking abilities and also a unique ability to easily engage in 24/7 investing, if desired - which such rapid and direct investing abilities were NOT readily available to me in the past.
(This post was last modified: 01-12-2014 03:00 AM by JayJuanGee.)
01-12-2014 02:25 AM
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el mechanico Offline
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Post: #1036
RE: Bitcoins up 60% in less than a month
Watch Huobi like a hawk. That places sneezes and except 100 dollar drop.
01-12-2014 10:44 AM
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JayJuanGee Offline
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Post: #1037
RE: Bitcoins up 60% in less than a month
(01-12-2014 10:44 AM)el mechanico Wrote:  Watch Huobi like a hawk. That places sneezes and except 100 dollar drop.



And, how does a guy watch Huobi? Is there some kind of timely manner of accomplishing such?
01-12-2014 12:10 PM
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Tex Pro Offline
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Post: #1038
RE: Bitcoins up 60% in less than a month
(01-12-2014 12:10 PM)JayJuanGee Wrote:  
(01-12-2014 10:44 AM)el mechanico Wrote:  Watch Huobi like a hawk. That places sneezes and except 100 dollar drop.



And, how does a guy watch Huobi? Is there some kind of timely manner of accomplishing such?

http://bitcoinwisdom.com/markets/huobi/btccny
01-12-2014 01:53 PM
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JayJuanGee
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Post: #1039
RE: Bitcoins up 60% in less than a month
(01-12-2014 01:48 AM)Jaydublin Wrote:  JJG bubbles catch people by surprise. You seem to think they are easy to pick out with negative news, they aren't and you most likely wont get a warning.

If you were full time on bitcoin you could have understand at least the two previous bubbles. April mtgox went down, who had 80% of the market at that time. When they are back up we see mass panic.

This lattes one in November started after bad news from China who had driven the price up the weeks before it crashed.

What will start the next one is impossible to say but there will be a warning in some kind.
01-12-2014 02:27 PM
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portofmanteau Offline
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Post: #1040
RE: Bitcoins up 60% in less than a month
The Sacramento Kings announced Thursday that they will become the first professional sports franchise to accept Bitcoin virtual currency.

Beginning on March 1, fans will be able to buy gear in the team store and pay for tickets with the digital money.


http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/103031...pt-bitcoin


Go Kings, Boogie Cousins is the best big man in the NBA right now.
01-16-2014 03:20 PM
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MidniteSpecial Offline
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Post: #1041
RE: Bitcoins up 60% in less than a month
So should I pull the trigger and buy some bitcoins? Thinking I will buy two coins for like $1600. Heard there is a place in NYC I can buy in person. Anyone know anything about that?
01-16-2014 03:54 PM
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JayJuanGee Offline
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Post: #1042
RE: Bitcoins up 60% in less than a month
(01-16-2014 03:54 PM)MidniteSpecial Wrote:  So should I pull the trigger and buy some bitcoins? Thinking I will buy two coins for like $1600. Heard there is a place in NYC I can buy in person. Anyone know anything about that?

Surely guys participating in this thread have differing theories about how to invest in bitcoin.

If you have NOT bought any Bitcoin yet, then I would suggest that you consider getting into BTC a little slowly to get used to some of the complicated aspects of buying and storing BTC - and probably dollar cost averaging your initial BTC purchase rather than plugging in a whole investment in one chunk of money (though $1,600 is NOT a large amount - but that, of course, will depend upon your budget).

I understand that if you are saying that you want to buy 2 bitcoins, and those are your first two bitcoins, then you may already be considering the 2 BTC to be an initial investment and possibly buying more BTC in the future.

I do NOT specifically know about any NYC Bitcoin buying location(s); however, there are quite a few BTC sellers listed on Localbitcoins.com, and you will be able to buy through localbitcoins.com, nearly right away and to compare prices.

Also, consider that usually, it is a little less expensive to buy BTC through Coinbase, once you set up an account through Coinbase (though you would need to consider that Coinbase has a 1% buy and sell transaction fees (so 2% if you carry out both your buying and your selling through Coinbase).

I started buying BTC in late November 2013 (through both Localbitcoins.com and coinbase), when BTC prices were hovering around $1,200; however, today my average BTC buy in price is $772 per BTC (including transaction fees) - and I own about 16.5 BTC (so over the last two months, I have been buying BTC little by little at a rate that fits with my budget and with my investment style).

EDIT: With the BTC price fluctuations today, I could have sold my whole stash of BTC for anywhere between $810 and $850 per BTC, and after subtracting the transaction fees, I would have been between 4.8% and 8.7% ahead - which is a fairly decent return on investment over less than two months. However, if I had made a lump sum investment in BTC in late November (at $1,200 per BTC) and sat on my investment, currently, I would be kicking myself with between negative 30% and negative 32.5%. My point is that dollar cost averaging can help to get a guy into an investment at a lower price per BTC, even though he runs the risk of making less money if he fails to buy BTC in sufficient quantities when the price is low.



Recall that you do NOT need to buy whole bitcoins, and you could work out a BTC investment system in which you are buying bitcoins on about a weekly basis (in fractions of a bitcoin), until such time that you are becoming more comfortable and familiar and able to get used to various Cryptocurrency exchanges or that you get used to means of purchasing and storing BTC that are comfortable for you.

Surely, some guys are waiting for a BTC crash in order to buy a bunch of BTC at that time (which crash may or may NOT come). I would NOT suggest waiting for a crash in total before you begin to get your feet wet b/c it does take a little bit of time to learn and to get used to buying and storing BTC, so you want to have those BTC buying systems in place so that you will be ready and prepared to buy in the event that there is a BTC price crash (if that were to occur).
(This post was last modified: 01-16-2014 05:02 PM by JayJuanGee.)
01-16-2014 04:45 PM
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svenski7 Offline
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Post: #1043
RE: Bitcoins up 60% in less than a month
(01-16-2014 03:54 PM)MidniteSpecial Wrote:  So should I pull the trigger and buy some bitcoins? Thinking I will buy two coins for like $1600. Heard there is a place in NYC I can buy in person. Anyone know anything about that?

Mine it.

.25 BTC / day. Don't even notice except for the daily deposits in my wallet.

about 100 kilowatts a day...$0.0475 per kilowatt....$4.75 daily expenses...not bad

edit: also, if u put 2K into BTC and the next day the exchanges close...ur out 2K
a lot of the computer equipment is good for others things...not just mining...you could probably recover 40-60% if u sold everything off
(This post was last modified: 01-16-2014 08:59 PM by svenski7.)
01-16-2014 08:25 PM
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el mechanico Offline
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Post: #1044
RE: Bitcoins up 60% in less than a month
The FEDs got cleared to dump their wallet they stole from Silk road and Chinas deadline could cause a mass dump. I would be in CASH right now.

svenski, 1400 a week mining huh? I don't really believe you but I would set up a miner if that was the case.
01-17-2014 12:02 PM
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FrenchCanadian Offline
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Post: #1045
RE: Bitcoins up 60% in less than a month
Don't know if it's been mentioned, but the lack of intrinsic value in bitcoins makes it hard for me to invest mid/long term.

All this, because ultimately, data, even encrypted, isn't worth anything.
A bitcoin system backed by a commodity, such as gold/silver/oil, would be a lot more interesting.

m2c
01-17-2014 12:30 PM
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portofmanteau Offline
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Post: #1046
RE: Bitcoins up 60% in less than a month
(01-17-2014 12:02 PM)el mechanico Wrote:  The FEDs got cleared to dump their wallet they stole from Silk road and Chinas deadline could cause a mass dump. I would be in CASH right now.

svenski, 1400 a week mining huh? I don't really believe you but I would set up a miner if that was the case.


EL MECH HAS SPOKEN. Move to USD and batten down the hatches.
01-17-2014 12:32 PM
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el mechanico Offline
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Post: #1047
RE: Bitcoins up 60% in less than a month
Traders are losing confidence one or two big sells will send this down today maybe 50 bucks. Good time for alt pumps
01-17-2014 12:59 PM
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JayJuanGee Offline
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Post: #1048
RE: Bitcoins up 60% in less than a month
(01-17-2014 12:02 PM)el mechanico Wrote:  The FEDs got cleared to dump their wallet they stole from Silk road and Chinas deadline could cause a mass dump. I would be in CASH right now.

This NEWS that you describe does NOT automatically mean a clear and unambiguous sign of a BTC price drop, though it is possible that the price will drop based on such news. Maybe 10%? Possibly more?

Even if 28 million dollars in BTC were auctioned in the near future (when? six months?), this does NOT mean that those BTC would be purchased by one person or one entity and/or dumped on the market.

On the contrary, the Feds authorization for the auctioning of those BTC seems to give some legitimacy to BTC, and it is much better for BTC market to have those BTC auctioned off, rather than having the Feds using such BTC to manipulate the BTC market.

Most likely, in the coming months, we will be hearing about the auction process for those BTC and the timing of such....

El Mech, you may be correct, that there will be a short-term downward reaction to such news; however, I doubt the direction is clearly down... Of course, others may have predictions that align with yours, but in my humble opinion we need more news or indicators.

(01-17-2014 12:30 PM)FrenchCanadian Wrote:  Don't know if it's been mentioned, but the lack of intrinsic value in bitcoins makes it hard for me to invest mid/long term.

All this, because ultimately, data, even encrypted, isn't worth anything.
A bitcoin system backed by a commodity, such as gold/silver/oil, would be a lot more interesting.

m2c

Yes.... Peter Schiff has spoken on this thread, and there have been other naysayers throughout the 42 pages of thread to give various arguments as to why BTC is "doomed" a "bubble" etc. etc.



(01-17-2014 12:32 PM)portofmanteau Wrote:  
(01-17-2014 12:02 PM)el mechanico Wrote:  The FEDs got cleared to dump their wallet they stole from Silk road and Chinas deadline could cause a mass dump. I would be in CASH right now.

svenski, 1400 a week mining huh? I don't really believe you but I would set up a miner if that was the case.


EL MECH HAS SPOKEN. Move to USD and batten down the hatches.


Good luck with that.... NO hating on El Mech... however, AS you may recall, El Mech has been telling guys on this thread to get into dollars since about December 20....... and there has been mostly up of BTC prices since then... but also a few downs, here and there.... (but we already know that BTC is volatile and going to have up and downs with its prices). Hopefully, El Mech will let you know when to get back in, as well.

Sooner or later there is going to be a BTC price dip... and is this the time? Personally, if BTC prices go down, then I see this as a BTC buying opportunity.



(01-17-2014 12:59 PM)el mechanico Wrote:  Traders are losing confidence one or two big sells will send this down today maybe 50 bucks. Good time for alt pumps

That's a decent prediction. $50 bucks down during today.... As I type BTC prices on coinbase are floating about $790 - which is down from about $840 from about a day and a half ago. It is NOT clear enough for me that BTC prices will go down another $50 to take such chances to sell my BTC... but I will buy more BTC if it goes down an additional $50 to $740. Actually, at this time, my next BTC buy point is $760.
01-17-2014 01:13 PM
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svenski7 Offline
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Post: #1049
RE: Bitcoins up 60% in less than a month
(01-17-2014 12:02 PM)el mechanico Wrote:  svenski, 1400 a week mining huh? I don't really believe you but I would set up a miner if that was the case.

k, pic of first rig on pg 41.

JJG and I are thinking of starting up a mining LLC. Non-taxable passive income.

Only problem is finding some kind of "manager" to maintain the rigs while ur away. I'll have to turn the machines off when im in Ixtapa with sugga momma next month Sad
01-17-2014 02:29 PM
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el mechanico Offline
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Post: #1050
RE: Bitcoins up 60% in less than a month
(01-17-2014 02:29 PM)svenski7 Wrote:  
(01-17-2014 12:02 PM)el mechanico Wrote:  svenski, 1400 a week mining huh? I don't really believe you but I would set up a miner if that was the case.

k, pic of first rig on pg 41.

JJG and I are thinking of starting up a mining LLC. Non-taxable passive income.

Only problem is finding some kind of "manager" to maintain the rigs while ur away. I'll have to turn the machines off when im in Ixtapa with sugga momma next month Sad
How much did it cost?
01-17-2014 02:45 PM
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