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The NBA Thread
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Latina Hunter Offline
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Post: #5451
RE: The NBA Thread
(11-29-2018 09:55 AM)eradicator Wrote:  
(11-19-2018 09:54 AM)Soy Jooce Wrote:  
(11-17-2018 09:33 PM)playerone Wrote:  
(11-11-2018 07:56 PM)Juancho Hernangomez Wrote:  Denver vs. Toronto - NBA Finals

===

WCF: Denver vs. Golden State - Denver in 6

ECF: Toronto vs. Boston - Toronto in 5


Nikola Jokic MVP

Most Improved Player: Juan Hernangomez

No Way Denver beats a healthy GSW unless Draymond and KD keep fighting.

Jokic is playing great ball. Kawhi Leonard will be a top candidate if the raptors finish 1st in the east.

Way to nominate yourself for MIP lol

No one on GS Warriors can guard Jokic. I am a Raptors fan and I think this is the year they finally make it to the NBA Finals.

Raptors vs. Nuggets/Jazz/etc anyone but Warriors (or Spurs) from the West.

Stick Cousins on Jokic,

Lol I don't know about that...Jokic is averaging 7 assists per game, which is insane for a center. Jokic is a top 5 (maybe even top 3) player right now; if Denver keeps winning a MVP candidate for sure. Mike Malone is a good coach...I could see him winning coach of the year.

Toronto is playing GSW tonight and Denver next Monday -- both are good tests to see how they matchup with the elite of the West
(This post was last modified: 11-29-2018 04:06 PM by Latina Hunter.)
11-29-2018 04:03 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
You can’t really call gsw a good test with no Curry, no Draymond no cousins

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11-29-2018 04:19 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread



Kokkinakis banged your girlfriend. Sorry to tell you that mate.
11-29-2018 07:12 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
This thread is the ultimate flavour of the day NBA coverage.

The Warriors are in a league of their own, 3 of the 5 best players are out and they're matching it with the best teams in the NBA, their two best playmakers included in that 5.

The only way the Warriors don't win the title is injuries or if Boogie ends up being the purest form of cancer in league history and destroys the entire thing, in which case he'd get cut and they'd still roll to the title.

I'd love to be wrong but I just don't see any team that can match them, it's hard to find any team that is even better than them in 2 positions.
11-30-2018 06:51 AM
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RE: The NBA Thread
Again, the Rockets took them to 7 games and were up 3-1 just 6 months ago in last years playoffs, and arguably would have won game 7 if Chris Paul had not got hurt. It isn't that much of a stretch to say that another team like the Nuggets or Raptors could pull off something similar to a healthy warriors team. But I agree, the warriors are going to be heavy favorites if healthy.

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11-30-2018 09:31 AM
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RE: The NBA Thread



“The greatest burden a child must bear is the unlived life of its parents.”

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11-30-2018 06:28 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread



“The greatest burden a child must bear is the unlived life of its parents.”

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12-02-2018 04:56 PM
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Rainbow RE: The NBA Thread
Denver Nuggets fan (as you can tell by my username lol) checking in. Jokic was a BEAST last night! Nuggets are legit championship contenders!

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12-04-2018 01:48 PM
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Post: #5459
RE: The NBA Thread
Are there any Kodi addons that have good quality NBA streams?

Those reddit streams don't work well with my Amazon Fire TV.
12-05-2018 11:25 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
Where are all the geniuses at who thought the Lakers wouldn’t make the playoffs? They are going to be a top 4 seed easily and they haven’t even come close to playing their best basketball.
12-06-2018 11:42 AM
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RE: The NBA Thread
Coach Pop recently said that basketball is dead. I think he was referring to the fact that there is no more defense. Teams now are putting up insane offensive numbers and you often see games with scores upwards of 130 points. That was unfathomable say 15-20 years ago. You might see a team score 110 points every now and then but that was it.

Personally I enjoy this kind of offensive frenzy. What do you guys think though? Is it a good thing overall?

Kokkinakis banged your girlfriend. Sorry to tell you that mate.
(This post was last modified: 12-06-2018 11:56 AM by TigerMandingo.)
12-06-2018 11:56 AM
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RE: The NBA Thread
(12-06-2018 11:56 AM)TigerMandingo Wrote:  Coach Pop recently said that basketball is dead. I think he was referring to the fact that there is no more defense. Teams now are putting up insane offensive numbers and you often see games with scores upwards of 130 points. That was unfathomable say 15-20 years ago. You might see a team score 110 points every now and then but that was it.

Personally I enjoy this kind of offensive frenzy. What do you guys think though? Is it a good thing overall?

Depends on what kind of basketball you like. Back in the 80s even the worst teams were averaging over 100 a game. Personally I'd rather see that then the low scoring matches of the late 1990s.

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12-06-2018 12:37 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
I'm Eating a lot of Crow for trashing the Lakers.

What they were trying to do this offseason, to make Lebron more like Magic to extend his career and develop the youngsters (Ingram, Kuzma and Ball), was silly and they didn't have the personnel (no outside shooting).

But the addition of Chandler to take the interior beatngs off Lebron, and Lebron's decisions to ignore the Coach and play his own game have turned this ship around.

Lebron is playing hard now, we are seeing post-February Lebron right now. If he can stay healthy the Lakers could get the 2 or 3 seed.

But, I'll enjoy any slip ups.
12-06-2018 01:53 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
(12-06-2018 01:53 PM)Rotten Wrote:  I'm Eating a lot of Crow for trashing the Lakers.

What they were trying to do this offseason, to make Lebron more like Magic to extend his career and develop the youngsters (Ingram, Kuzma and Ball), was silly and they didn't have the personnel (no outside shooting).

But the addition of Chandler to take the interior beatngs off Lebron, and Lebron's decisions to ignore the Coach and play his own game have turned this ship around.

Lebron is playing hard now, we are seeing post-February Lebron right now. If he can stay healthy the Lakers could get the 2 or 3 seed.

But, I'll enjoy any slip ups.

Ball, Hart, Kuzma and Ingram have all been making contributions on both ends of the floor.

Bron is just doing what he's done his whole career. He doesn't look tired or like he's expending much more energy than usual.
(This post was last modified: 12-06-2018 02:36 PM by rungoodinc.)
12-06-2018 02:23 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
(12-06-2018 11:56 AM)TigerMandingo Wrote:  Coach Pop recently said that basketball is dead. I think he was referring to the fact that there is no more defense. Teams now are putting up insane offensive numbers and you often see games with scores upwards of 130 points. That was unfathomable say 15-20 years ago. You might see a team score 110 points every now and then but that was it.

Personally I enjoy this kind of offensive frenzy. What do you guys think though? Is it a good thing overall?

I'm kind of torn, the 80s and 90s were what I grew up on and what I consider the peak of basketball. The thing I miss the most from that era is the physicality if I'm being honest. Think the Knicks/Heat rivalry, hell Charles Oakley in general, The Glove, the Bad Boy Pistons and all their fun, so on and so on.

The scoring is now getting back to what it was in that era but I personally don't like the way they've gone about it by essentially removing defense and physicality to achieve it. I just don't really enjoy the 3ball era, for me I'd much rather dunks, layups and post-ups than 3 balls.

I miss post play, watching Hakeem clown people in the post was great, guys like Rodman using physicality to defend anyone was great, Jordan, Pippen and Payton hounding people on the perimeter, Mutombo and the finger wave.

For me I like the idea of increasing scoring, I didn't like the 00s era where they had neither scoring or physicality but this era has proven to me that if I could pick one I'd take the physicality over the scoring which for me is fundamentally what Pop is saying.

So yeah, basketball now is better than the 00s era but I don't think it's got anything on the 80s and 90s (to the lockout basically). I do like that we've got more pace but I'd love if it would get more physical.
12-07-2018 08:59 AM
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RE: The NBA Thread
History says Javale is going to need his minutes managed or he will get injured . Their defense will suffer big time even with Chandler , who only scores put backs and dunks on the offensive end while Javale can actually score.
12-07-2018 04:52 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
I know it may be early but Kawhi Leonard is looking great on the Raptors, his personality may actually suit Toronto and more. He was always a quiet guy with a seeming 'non American' vibe and that may gel more with the Canadian psyche (which is pretty reserved). I'm not sure if he would resign with the Raptors but he might be a great fit for that team. Thoughts?

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12-08-2018 10:05 AM
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RE: The NBA Thread
(12-08-2018 10:05 AM)Moma Wrote:  I know it may be early but Kawhi Leonard is looking great on the Raptors, his personality may actually suit Toronto and more. He was always a quiet guy with a seeming 'non American' vibe and that may gel more with the Canadian psyche (which is pretty reserved). I'm not sure if he would resign with the Raptors but he might be a great fit for that team. Thoughts?

The dude signed s shoe deal with fucking New Balance. A match so seemingly made in heaven you have to wonder if he is self aware.



12-08-2018 11:44 AM
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RE: The NBA Thread
(12-07-2018 08:59 AM)JimBobsCooters Wrote:  For me I like the idea of increasing scoring, I didn't like the 00s era where they had neither scoring or physicality but this era has proven to me that if I could pick one I'd take the physicality over the scoring which for me is fundamentally what Pop is saying.

I think Pop may have been talking about physicality indirectly, but he said specifically what he didn't like was the predictability of basketball today. A dude on ESPN published a real interesting article a few days ago on Carmelo, and how his game is a remnant of an era that passed him by. I hate ESPN but this was one of the only insightful articles on that site in years, on why Carmelo's game has aged so badly.

Carmelo Anthony is the last great American ball hog


Today everyone knows that the best shots in basketball are inside shots... layups and dunks... and 3s, if you can hit them. So, no surprise, everyone looks for either layups or dunks, or 3s. A good representative of that is last year's MVP.

   

Avoided mid range like the plague. It resulted in extremely efficient stats, higher true shooting percentage. Whereas Carmelo modeled his game after Jordan and other players who thrived in isolations.

   

Look at all that midrange. Carmelo likes low-percentage shots, but it also made him, and guys like Kobe and MJ, unpredictable. The problem with that style is that Melo has a league-average true shooting percentage, while Harden's is elite. Harden is efficient, Melo is not.

Popovich is saying basketball has been reduced to layups or 3s, and nothing else matters. That makes it boring and 'ugly.'

But I completely disagree. Offenses now move the ball beautifully. Layups and 3s are an equalizer, it allows players with average physiques be as dominant as once-in-a-generation athletes like Shaq, Lebron, etc. Talking about Curry, obviously. For fuck's sake, Stephen A named his all-time starting 5 recently and picked Curry over Magic. Curry over Magic! And I agree with him!





As the article says, Carmelo is the last American ball hog. People are seeing ball hogging isn't good for a team. Carmelo never won and never came close. Those of us who said throughout his career, that you could never win with him and that style as the main option were proven right.

Pop is just mad he's got sour grapes. He had the personnel to exploit that style and create one of the greatest teams of all time the year they beat Miami for a title. But now he has DeRozan... a guy also stuck in the past who's not even close to Melo, skill-wise.

The league finally caught up to Pop, strategically.
(This post was last modified: 12-08-2018 12:39 PM by Kamikaze.)
12-08-2018 12:34 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
Sometimes I think folks forget that there are more ways to impact a basketball game than just pure scoring

While I respect AI & Stephen A.'s knowledge of the game however both are dead wrong. Outside of shooting what does Steph have over Magic? I'll wait

Besides a PG's primary responsible to distribute the basketball, not necessarily score the ball. On a dream team with MJ, Shaq and Lebron how many shots do you think will be left for a PG?

Magic had the intangibles that no other PG possessed, and happens to be a top 5 all player. Better passer, leader, and crunch time player. You don't reach 9 finals (5 titles) in 11 years without that level of greatness. Not to mention in a better era with more active hall of famers.

Let's stop being prisoners of the moment

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12-08-2018 03:03 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
(12-08-2018 03:03 PM)MY DETROIT PLAYAS Wrote:  Sometimes I think folks forget that there are more ways to impact a basketball game than just pure scoring

While I respect AI & Stephen A.'s knowledge of the game however both are dead wrong. Outside of shooting what does Steph have over Magic? I'll wait

Besides a PG's primary responsible to distribute the basketball, not necessarily score the ball. On a dream team with MJ, Shaq and Lebron how many shots do you think will be left for a PG?

Magic had the intangibles that no other PG possessed, and happens to be a top 5 all player. Better passer, leader, and crunch time player. You don't reach 9 finals (5 titles) in 11 years without that level of greatness. Not to mention in a better era with more active hall of famers.

Let's stop being prisoners of the moment

We have to take into account styles. Durant made a great point about playing with great players like Lebron. No, not that it's a toxic environment because of the media... but that Lebron demands the ball and needs it in his hands a lot in order to be effective. Every team Lebron goes to automatically becomes the Lebron system. I promise this'll get to Magic eventually.

Think about these famous big 3s, as individuals. The Heat with Lebron, Wade and Bosh; Lakers with Magic, Kareem and Worthy; Warriors with Curry, Klay and Draymond.

Individually, the Heat and Lakers players are recognized as WAY better than the Warriors.

And yet only one team has won 73 times in the regular season. And only one of those players won a unanimous MVP.

...

The effect Curry has on the game is obvious. He has gravity, he pulls everyone to him. It's an effect Magic does not have like Curry does.

Magic needs the ball in his hands to distribute. But don't Lebron and Jordan to a lesser extent need it too?

THAT'S the issue. If Jordan or Lebron have the ball in their hands, and they SHOULD have the ball very often, Magic is an afterthought compared to the weapon that is Steph.

Steph can play off the ball. You can't ignore him. That gravity makes him a very underrated PG as well, because it opens up the game for everyone.

Isn't opening up the game for everyone what a prototypical PG should be doing anyway...?

Steph > Magic
(This post was last modified: 12-08-2018 04:30 PM by Kamikaze.)
12-08-2018 04:13 PM
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RE: The NBA Thread
(12-08-2018 03:03 PM)MY DETROIT PLAYAS Wrote:  Sometimes I think folks forget that there are more ways to impact a basketball game than just pure scoring

While I respect AI & Stephen A.'s knowledge of the game however both are dead wrong. Outside of shooting what does Steph have over Magic? I'll wait

Besides a PG's primary responsible to distribute the basketball, not necessarily score the ball. On a dream team with MJ, Shaq and Lebron how many shots do you think will be left for a PG?

Magic had the intangibles that no other PG possessed, and happens to be a top 5 all player. Better passer, leader, and crunch time player. You don't reach 9 finals (5 titles) in 11 years without that level of greatness. Not to mention in a better era with more active hall of famers.

Let's stop being prisoners of the moment

While I agree with your Magic > Steph comment I'd actually prefer Steph in a team like that because his shooting is far more valuable than Magic's playmaking. The PG's job in a team like that is basically going to be dribble up the court and call the play then give it to the scorer and provide spacing.

Also lets not act like that Lakers team wasn't loaded, in a Western conference that was actually pretty weak at the time, in a league that was super top heavy, the good teams were phenomenal but there were a lot of awful teams as well. I'd argue that what the Warriors have achieved in the salary cap era is as impressive, probably more so, than the Lakers in the 80s. To be clear, not arguing the Warriors are better than the Lakers on talent, just that their achievement is greater. Same as the Pats for mine are the greatest in NFL history for achievement but no way I'd take them over some of the great teams of the pre-salary cap era which were just stacked.

I'd take Magic every day of the week if I'm constructing a normal team to try and win games, although even that is debatable in the modern game where Magic's skillset isn't as well suited (see Ben Simmons and his struggles and I'm not saying he's Magic but he basically limits who can play with him and Magic would be similar because of his shooting).

I think for the first time the style of basketball has genuinely shifted and comparing eras has become difficult. Take a guy like Gary Payton, he was a great player but almost none of his game translates to the modern game, he'd foul out in 5 minutes playing defense the way he did, his shooting would be a liability, if he hadn't fouled out his intensity would have him ejected in 10 minutes and yet you can make a counter to that that can't be substantiated at all that if he'd grown up in this era he'd have learned to shoot, he'd learn to defend without being the Glove and he'd control his temper but it's still a case where his game is basically what the NBA has tried to remove from the game.

Then taking Payton I try and Imagine guys like Oakley, Rodman and countless others and it's impossible!

I don't doubt that the greats would have still been great, the largest part of why they were great isn't changing and that's the competitiveness and instincts but trying to compare their games to how it's played now is actually becoming impossible to do for the first time in the sports existence. On the flipside, a guy like Larry Bird almost certainly would have been a better player in the modern game, imagine how good he would have been with no one allowed to beat him up and modern conditioning to stop his body falling to pieces. I genuinely feel like basketball is a different sport now which makes comparing some of the greats with current players damn difficult because stylistically it's just so different that the things that made certain players great is now almost irrelevant. Even Shaq is hard to envisage right now with the way the game has softened up and basically eliminated post play.
12-09-2018 06:39 AM
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RE: The NBA Thread
(12-08-2018 12:34 PM)Kamikaze Wrote:  Pop is just mad he's got sour grapes. He had the personnel to exploit that style and create one of the greatest teams of all time the year they beat Miami for a title. But now he has DeRozan... a guy also stuck in the past who's not even close to Melo, skill-wise.

The league finally caught up to Pop, strategically.

I agree, the entire league finally caught up to doing what Pop did during the 2013-14 season. If you watch the entire Spurs title run that season, you'll notice that they were a few years ahead of time.

In the time since then, the Warriors turned that strategy up to 11 & now every team has adopted some parts of it.

The result now, as of the time of writing, is that the scoring efficiency sits at 109.7 points per 100 possessions.
Code:
.                                                                                                      Offense Four Factors  Defense Four Factors
Rk                     Team  Age  W  L PW PL    MOV   SOS   SRS  ORtg  DRtg  NRtg  Pace  FTr 3PAr  TS% eFG% TOV% ORB% FT/FGA eFG% TOV% DRB% FT/FGA                      Arena Attend. Attend./G
1           Milwaukee Bucks 26.7 16  8 18  6   9.79  0.45 10.24 115.1 105.7  +9.4 103.4 .253 .444 .592 .561 12.9 22.6   .193 .510 11.6 81.6   .164               Fiserv Forum  258487     17232
2           Toronto Raptors 27.3 21  6 20  7   8.04 -0.71  7.33 114.6 106.7  +7.9 100.0 .242 .375 .586 .550 12.5 23.7   .195 .499 12.9 74.8   .180           Scotiabank Arena  277588     19828
3            Boston Celtics 25.8 15 10 18  7   7.40 -0.59  6.81 110.7 103.3  +7.4  98.8 .211 .402 .558 .526 11.4 22.3   .166 .495 13.8 79.1   .200                  TD Garden  186240     18624
4            Denver Nuggets 24.5 17  9 18  8   6.31  0.35  6.66 112.1 105.7  +6.4  97.4 .251 .331 .550 .517 11.9 27.2   .186 .508 12.8 78.9   .200               Pepsi Center  216570     18048
5     Golden State Warriors 28.1 18  9 18  9   5.78 -0.54  5.24 116.0 110.2  +5.8  99.6 .246 .344 .599 .563 13.0 23.2   .203 .509 10.9 76.9   .196               Oracle Arena  254748     19596
6     Oklahoma City Thunder 25.6 16  8 17  7   6.75 -1.82  4.93 108.9 102.3  +6.6 102.0 .259 .342 .536 .505 12.2 27.7   .184 .500 14.8 78.6   .196    Chesapeake Energy Arena  218436     18203
7      Los Angeles Clippers 27.8 16  9 15 10   3.08  0.16  3.24 113.0 110.0  +3.0 101.1 .335 .285 .572 .521 11.9 21.9   .271 .494 10.2 75.0   .216             STAPLES Center  186008     16910
8            Indiana Pacers 26.8 16 10 17  9   4.58 -1.55  3.03 108.4 103.7  +4.7  97.8 .238 .292 .559 .529 13.3 21.0   .177 .510 14.4 78.2   .176    Bankers Life Fieldhouse  202381     16865
9         Charlotte Hornets 26.8 12 13 15 10   2.96 -0.27  2.69 113.1 110.2  +2.9  99.9 .256 .370 .561 .522 10.4 21.5   .205 .523 13.0 75.8   .197            Spectrum Center  217043     15503
10   Portland Trail Blazers 26.2 15 11 15 11   1.92  0.74  2.66 112.2 110.3  +1.9  99.7 .261 .353 .562 .520 12.8 26.4   .213 .514 10.6 77.7   .174                Moda Center  271151     19368
11     New Orleans Pelicans 26.7 13 14 15 12   2.15  0.05  2.20 114.4 112.3  +2.1 103.2 .288 .316 .574 .536 12.7 26.3   .221 .532 11.4 77.6   .195       Smoothie King Center  215981     15427
12                Utah Jazz 26.8 13 13 13 13   0.23  1.53  1.76 108.1 107.9  +0.2  99.4 .313 .382 .564 .529 13.8 21.7   .225 .528 13.5 78.9   .189    Vivint Smart Home Arena  183060     18306
13       Philadelphia 76ers 26.0 18  9 15 12   2.00 -0.38  1.62 110.2 108.2  +2.0 101.7 .324 .361 .570 .525 13.7 23.1   .252 .495 10.8 78.2   .208         Wells Fargo Center  284861     20347
14       Los Angeles Lakers 26.5 16 10 15 11   2.19 -0.81  1.38 109.6 107.5  +2.1 102.9 .251 .334 .559 .532 13.2 22.7   .178 .505 12.3 76.1   .189             STAPLES Center  265958     18997
15   Minnesota Timberwolves 27.0 13 13 13 13   0.19  0.87  1.06 110.4 110.2  +0.2  99.5 .257 .320 .546 .505 11.7 24.7   .207 .518 13.3 72.9   .186              Target Center  214692     14313
16        Memphis Grizzlies 28.3 15 10 13 12   0.80  0.21  1.01 106.9 106.1  +0.8  95.2 .283 .331 .551 .513 12.1 17.9   .213 .512 14.9 76.8   .234                FedEx Forum  183528     15294
17         Dallas Mavericks 26.6 13 11 13 11   1.13 -0.66  0.46 110.2 109.1  +1.1  99.8 .300 .389 .567 .529 14.0 24.2   .225 .531 13.4 78.7   .193   American Airlines Center  257056     19774
18         Sacramento Kings 24.4 13 12 11 14  -1.44  0.78 -0.66 110.2 111.6  -1.4 103.9 .247 .303 .562 .538 12.2 22.4   .172 .536 13.9 75.4   .208            Golden 1 Center  181595     16509
19          Detroit Pistons 27.2 13 10 11 12  -0.35 -1.00 -1.34 107.4 107.7  -0.3 100.1 .285 .369 .527 .488 12.0 26.2   .211 .517 13.1 80.2   .236       Little Caesars Arena  225188     16085
20          Houston Rockets 29.1 11 14 11 14  -1.44 -0.13 -1.57 112.2 113.7  -1.5  95.7 .271 .493 .564 .530 12.9 25.0   .204 .533 12.9 74.5   .235              Toyota Center  180550     18055
21               Miami Heat 27.1 11 14 12 13  -0.24 -1.48 -1.72 107.6 107.9  -0.3 100.1 .283 .375 .535 .502 12.8 26.0   .200 .504 12.4 76.7   .218     AmericanAirlines Arena  274486     19606
22            Orlando Magic 25.8 12 14 11 15  -2.54  0.59 -1.95 107.5 110.1  -2.6  97.9 .197 .359 .546 .517 11.6 19.8   .154 .526 12.7 76.8   .192               Amway Center  231608     16543
23            Brooklyn Nets 25.6 10 18 12 16  -1.93 -0.50 -2.42 109.5 111.4  -1.9  97.9 .268 .384 .543 .509 12.4 26.1   .195 .513 11.8 74.9   .229            Barclays Center  193547     13825
24        San Antonio Spurs 29.3 12 14 10 16  -3.65  0.33 -3.33 111.0 114.7  -3.7  98.5 .246 .275 .554 .512 10.9 22.9   .204 .550 11.1 78.8   .166                 ATT Center  220483     18374
25       Washington Wizards 26.9 11 15  9 17  -4.69 -0.27 -4.96 109.5 114.1  -4.6 101.5 .289 .369 .558 .519 11.9 20.1   .218 .536 13.5 72.1   .221          Capital One Arena  197298     16442
26          New York Knicks 23.5  8 19  8 19  -6.41  0.68 -5.73 107.8 114.1  -6.3  99.4 .271 .323 .534 .492 12.2 25.8   .211 .543 12.4 75.6   .208 Madison Square Garden (IV)  231302     19275
27      Cleveland Cavaliers 26.0  6 20  7 19  -8.04  0.23 -7.81 108.1 116.5  -8.4  95.7 .241 .276 .536 .498 12.1 26.8   .191 .556 11.5 77.6   .182        Quicken Loans Arena  272048     19432
28            Chicago Bulls 24.0  6 21  5 22 -10.74  1.16 -9.58 101.0 111.6 -10.6 100.1 .233 .333 .533 .497 13.6 16.3   .180 .529 12.2 75.4   .182              United Center  282272     20162
29            Atlanta Hawks 25.5  6 20  6 20 -10.31  0.56 -9.74 102.3 112.1  -9.8 105.5 .263 .398 .540 .505 15.1 21.2   .195 .540 13.9 75.9   .226           State Farm Arena  188789     14522
30             Phoenix Suns 25.5  4 22  5 21 -11.65  1.72 -9.93 102.3 114.0 -11.7  99.5 .223 .361 .546 .513 14.8 18.4   .172 .542 12.9 75.2   .231 Talking Stick Resort Arena  193343     14873
             League Average       26.5 13 13   0.00  0.00  0.00 109.7 109.7        99.9 .263 .352 .556 .520 12.6 23.2   .201 .520 12.6 76.8                              .201  225543     17529

Provided by Basketball-Reference.com: View Original Table
Generated 12/9/2018.

_______________________________________________

(12-09-2018 06:39 AM)JimBobsCooters Wrote:  I don't doubt that the greats would have still been great, the largest part of why they were great isn't changing and that's the competitiveness and instincts but trying to compare their games to how it's played now is actually becoming impossible to do for the first time in the sports existence. On the flipside, a guy like Larry Bird almost certainly would have been a better player in the modern game, imagine how good he would have been with no one allowed to beat him up and modern conditioning to stop his body falling to pieces. I genuinely feel like basketball is a different sport now which makes comparing some of the greats with current players damn difficult because stylistically it's just so different that the things that made certain players great is now almost irrelevant. Even Shaq is hard to envisage right now with the way the game has softened up and basically eliminated post play.

I think that Wilt Chamberlain would've thrived in any basketball era. Remember, he was so dominant on the court that the league had to change the rules in order to mitigate his on-court dominance.

_______________________________________________
"Men lie, women lie, but buckets don't." #225

(03-23-1983 09:19 PM)delete Wrote:  delete

"A man's dream will never die!"
"When you want to succeed as bad as you want to breathe, then you'll be successful."
"When do you think people die? When they are shot by the bullet of a pistol? No. When they are ravaged by an incurable disease? No! It’s when… they are forgotten."


Nobody could have stopped this, the rampaging point of this era.
12-09-2018 08:15 AM
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RE: The NBA Thread
(12-09-2018 08:15 AM)Built to Fade Wrote:  
(12-08-2018 12:34 PM)Kamikaze Wrote:  Pop is just mad he's got sour grapes. He had the personnel to exploit that style and create one of the greatest teams of all time the year they beat Miami for a title. But now he has DeRozan... a guy also stuck in the past who's not even close to Melo, skill-wise.

The league finally caught up to Pop, strategically.

I agree, the entire league finally caught up to doing what Pop did during the 2013-14 season. If you watch the entire Spurs title run that season, you'll notice that they were a few years ahead of time.

In the time since then, the Warriors turned that strategy up to 11 & now every team has adopted some parts of it.

The result now, as of the time of writing, is that the scoring efficiency sits at 109.7 points per 100 possessions.
Code:
.                                                                                                      Offense Four Factors  Defense Four Factors
Rk                     Team  Age  W  L PW PL    MOV   SOS   SRS  ORtg  DRtg  NRtg  Pace  FTr 3PAr  TS% eFG% TOV% ORB% FT/FGA eFG% TOV% DRB% FT/FGA                      Arena Attend. Attend./G
1           Milwaukee Bucks 26.7 16  8 18  6   9.79  0.45 10.24 115.1 105.7  +9.4 103.4 .253 .444 .592 .561 12.9 22.6   .193 .510 11.6 81.6   .164               Fiserv Forum  258487     17232
2           Toronto Raptors 27.3 21  6 20  7   8.04 -0.71  7.33 114.6 106.7  +7.9 100.0 .242 .375 .586 .550 12.5 23.7   .195 .499 12.9 74.8   .180           Scotiabank Arena  277588     19828
3            Boston Celtics 25.8 15 10 18  7   7.40 -0.59  6.81 110.7 103.3  +7.4  98.8 .211 .402 .558 .526 11.4 22.3   .166 .495 13.8 79.1   .200                  TD Garden  186240     18624
4            Denver Nuggets 24.5 17  9 18  8   6.31  0.35  6.66 112.1 105.7  +6.4  97.4 .251 .331 .550 .517 11.9 27.2   .186 .508 12.8 78.9   .200               Pepsi Center  216570     18048
5     Golden State Warriors 28.1 18  9 18  9   5.78 -0.54  5.24 116.0 110.2  +5.8  99.6 .246 .344 .599 .563 13.0 23.2   .203 .509 10.9 76.9   .196               Oracle Arena  254748     19596
6     Oklahoma City Thunder 25.6 16  8 17  7   6.75 -1.82  4.93 108.9 102.3  +6.6 102.0 .259 .342 .536 .505 12.2 27.7   .184 .500 14.8 78.6   .196    Chesapeake Energy Arena  218436     18203
7      Los Angeles Clippers 27.8 16  9 15 10   3.08  0.16  3.24 113.0 110.0  +3.0 101.1 .335 .285 .572 .521 11.9 21.9   .271 .494 10.2 75.0   .216             STAPLES Center  186008     16910
8            Indiana Pacers 26.8 16 10 17  9   4.58 -1.55  3.03 108.4 103.7  +4.7  97.8 .238 .292 .559 .529 13.3 21.0   .177 .510 14.4 78.2   .176    Bankers Life Fieldhouse  202381     16865
9         Charlotte Hornets 26.8 12 13 15 10   2.96 -0.27  2.69 113.1 110.2  +2.9  99.9 .256 .370 .561 .522 10.4 21.5   .205 .523 13.0 75.8   .197            Spectrum Center  217043     15503
10   Portland Trail Blazers 26.2 15 11 15 11   1.92  0.74  2.66 112.2 110.3  +1.9  99.7 .261 .353 .562 .520 12.8 26.4   .213 .514 10.6 77.7   .174                Moda Center  271151     19368
11     New Orleans Pelicans 26.7 13 14 15 12   2.15  0.05  2.20 114.4 112.3  +2.1 103.2 .288 .316 .574 .536 12.7 26.3   .221 .532 11.4 77.6   .195       Smoothie King Center  215981     15427
12                Utah Jazz 26.8 13 13 13 13   0.23  1.53  1.76 108.1 107.9  +0.2  99.4 .313 .382 .564 .529 13.8 21.7   .225 .528 13.5 78.9   .189    Vivint Smart Home Arena  183060     18306
13       Philadelphia 76ers 26.0 18  9 15 12   2.00 -0.38  1.62 110.2 108.2  +2.0 101.7 .324 .361 .570 .525 13.7 23.1   .252 .495 10.8 78.2   .208         Wells Fargo Center  284861     20347
14       Los Angeles Lakers 26.5 16 10 15 11   2.19 -0.81  1.38 109.6 107.5  +2.1 102.9 .251 .334 .559 .532 13.2 22.7   .178 .505 12.3 76.1   .189             STAPLES Center  265958     18997
15   Minnesota Timberwolves 27.0 13 13 13 13   0.19  0.87  1.06 110.4 110.2  +0.2  99.5 .257 .320 .546 .505 11.7 24.7   .207 .518 13.3 72.9   .186              Target Center  214692     14313
16        Memphis Grizzlies 28.3 15 10 13 12   0.80  0.21  1.01 106.9 106.1  +0.8  95.2 .283 .331 .551 .513 12.1 17.9   .213 .512 14.9 76.8   .234                FedEx Forum  183528     15294
17         Dallas Mavericks 26.6 13 11 13 11   1.13 -0.66  0.46 110.2 109.1  +1.1  99.8 .300 .389 .567 .529 14.0 24.2   .225 .531 13.4 78.7   .193   American Airlines Center  257056     19774
18         Sacramento Kings 24.4 13 12 11 14  -1.44  0.78 -0.66 110.2 111.6  -1.4 103.9 .247 .303 .562 .538 12.2 22.4   .172 .536 13.9 75.4   .208            Golden 1 Center  181595     16509
19          Detroit Pistons 27.2 13 10 11 12  -0.35 -1.00 -1.34 107.4 107.7  -0.3 100.1 .285 .369 .527 .488 12.0 26.2   .211 .517 13.1 80.2   .236       Little Caesars Arena  225188     16085
20          Houston Rockets 29.1 11 14 11 14  -1.44 -0.13 -1.57 112.2 113.7  -1.5  95.7 .271 .493 .564 .530 12.9 25.0   .204 .533 12.9 74.5   .235              Toyota Center  180550     18055
21               Miami Heat 27.1 11 14 12 13  -0.24 -1.48 -1.72 107.6 107.9  -0.3 100.1 .283 .375 .535 .502 12.8 26.0   .200 .504 12.4 76.7   .218     AmericanAirlines Arena  274486     19606
22            Orlando Magic 25.8 12 14 11 15  -2.54  0.59 -1.95 107.5 110.1  -2.6  97.9 .197 .359 .546 .517 11.6 19.8   .154 .526 12.7 76.8   .192               Amway Center  231608     16543
23            Brooklyn Nets 25.6 10 18 12 16  -1.93 -0.50 -2.42 109.5 111.4  -1.9  97.9 .268 .384 .543 .509 12.4 26.1   .195 .513 11.8 74.9   .229            Barclays Center  193547     13825
24        San Antonio Spurs 29.3 12 14 10 16  -3.65  0.33 -3.33 111.0 114.7  -3.7  98.5 .246 .275 .554 .512 10.9 22.9   .204 .550 11.1 78.8   .166                 ATT Center  220483     18374
25       Washington Wizards 26.9 11 15  9 17  -4.69 -0.27 -4.96 109.5 114.1  -4.6 101.5 .289 .369 .558 .519 11.9 20.1   .218 .536 13.5 72.1   .221          Capital One Arena  197298     16442
26          New York Knicks 23.5  8 19  8 19  -6.41  0.68 -5.73 107.8 114.1  -6.3  99.4 .271 .323 .534 .492 12.2 25.8   .211 .543 12.4 75.6   .208 Madison Square Garden (IV)  231302     19275
27      Cleveland Cavaliers 26.0  6 20  7 19  -8.04  0.23 -7.81 108.1 116.5  -8.4  95.7 .241 .276 .536 .498 12.1 26.8   .191 .556 11.5 77.6   .182        Quicken Loans Arena  272048     19432
28            Chicago Bulls 24.0  6 21  5 22 -10.74  1.16 -9.58 101.0 111.6 -10.6 100.1 .233 .333 .533 .497 13.6 16.3   .180 .529 12.2 75.4   .182              United Center  282272     20162
29            Atlanta Hawks 25.5  6 20  6 20 -10.31  0.56 -9.74 102.3 112.1  -9.8 105.5 .263 .398 .540 .505 15.1 21.2   .195 .540 13.9 75.9   .226           State Farm Arena  188789     14522
30             Phoenix Suns 25.5  4 22  5 21 -11.65  1.72 -9.93 102.3 114.0 -11.7  99.5 .223 .361 .546 .513 14.8 18.4   .172 .542 12.9 75.2   .231 Talking Stick Resort Arena  193343     14873
             League Average       26.5 13 13   0.00  0.00  0.00 109.7 109.7        99.9 .263 .352 .556 .520 12.6 23.2   .201 .520 12.6 76.8                              .201  225543     17529

Provided by Basketball-Reference.com: View Original Table
Generated 12/9/2018.

_______________________________________________

(12-09-2018 06:39 AM)JimBobsCooters Wrote:  I don't doubt that the greats would have still been great, the largest part of why they were great isn't changing and that's the competitiveness and instincts but trying to compare their games to how it's played now is actually becoming impossible to do for the first time in the sports existence. On the flipside, a guy like Larry Bird almost certainly would have been a better player in the modern game, imagine how good he would have been with no one allowed to beat him up and modern conditioning to stop his body falling to pieces. I genuinely feel like basketball is a different sport now which makes comparing some of the greats with current players damn difficult because stylistically it's just so different that the things that made certain players great is now almost irrelevant. Even Shaq is hard to envisage right now with the way the game has softened up and basically eliminated post play.

I think that Wilt Chamberlain would've thrived in any basketball era. Remember, he was so dominant on the court that the league had to change the rules in order to mitigate his on-court dominance.

_______________________________________________
"Men lie, women lie, but buckets don't." #225

I don't disagree, just really hard to compare him now, but realistically he's like Anthony Davis on steroids, the question obviously being could he develop the range the modern game asks of its centers? The rest of his game was proven and just imagine his athletic ability harnessed by modern training.

Having said that, modern drugs and women might have derailed his career pretty quickly if that side of his life was the dominant element to carry over...
12-09-2018 08:24 AM
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Post: #5475
RE: The NBA Thread
(12-09-2018 08:24 AM)JimBobsCooters Wrote:  
(12-09-2018 08:15 AM)Built to Fade Wrote:  I think that Wilt Chamberlain would've thrived in any basketball era. Remember, he was so dominant on the court that the league had to change the rules in order to mitigate his on-court dominance.
_______________________________________________
"Men lie, women lie, but buckets don't." #225

I don't disagree, just really hard to compare him now, but realistically he's like Anthony Davis on steroids, the question obviously being could he develop the range the modern game asks of its centers? The rest of his game was proven and just imagine his athletic ability harnessed by modern training.

[...]

Interestingly, Wilt claimed he was reasonably good at free-throw shooting during high school, shooting 80%. I suspect that the free-throw issues were mainly mental, as was the case with Shaq.

The Video Description Wrote:"Wilt Chamberlain says he shot 80 percent from the foul line in high school. The stats say he was a 62 percent free throw shooter in college, 58 percent as an NBA rookie and a career-best 61 percent in 1961-62. For his pro career, he was a 51 percent free throw shooter and shot under 50 percent in six different seasons, his worst being 38 percent in 1967-68. In the NBA playoffs, he made only 46 percent. Yet he holds the NBA record for most free throws made in a game (28), which happened the night he scored 100. A Philadelphia Inquirer story of March 18, 1991, listed six reasons given by Chamberlain over the years for his poor free throw shooting: 1. Arthritic Knees. 2. Too much English on his shot. 3. Too tall, which ruins his shooting arch. 4. Lifting weights made him too strong. 5. His hands are too big. 6. It's all in his head." - Tall Tales: The Glory Years of the NBA

For more information and testimony from this book check out the links below:

Link for book purchase: https://books.google.com/books?id=9BaqPfGcI84C...

Wilt Chamberlain's basketball reference stats: https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/c/chambwi01.html

The fade-away video is the only possible indicator of Wilt's potential shooting range. But he also did this:

_______________________________________________
"Where's all the game footage pre-1992? Maybe the league doesn't want the fans to know that there's nothing new in basketball (except for the 3-point shot)." #226

(03-23-1983 09:19 PM)delete Wrote:  delete

"A man's dream will never die!"
"When you want to succeed as bad as you want to breathe, then you'll be successful."
"When do you think people die? When they are shot by the bullet of a pistol? No. When they are ravaged by an incurable disease? No! It’s when… they are forgotten."


Nobody could have stopped this, the rampaging point of this era.
12-09-2018 08:53 AM
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