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Russian language: no more bullshit
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ElFlaco Away
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Post: #401
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
(05-26-2016 09:03 AM)marty Wrote:  Duolingo isn't very useful either

I'm not a Russian student, but here's an observation. I've never met a novice language learner who got to intermediate level speaking with Duolingo or similar. People swear by it, but look closer and you see that they're language dabblers, not language users.

(05-26-2016 09:03 AM)marty Wrote:  Native materials are the key and are much more fun than using the aforementioned materials.

Unless you're already able to hold you own in a conversation (with mistakes and gaps, certainly), you're probably not ready for a diet of all 'authentic' materials. Once you can understand about 90% of what you hear or read, then you're able to fill in the meaning of the missing pieces based on the context. That's where learning really take off.
05-27-2016 06:25 PM
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Post: #402
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
(05-27-2016 02:54 PM)RandomGuy1 Wrote:  
(05-27-2016 02:30 AM)Switch Wrote:  - work through RT's 100 free Russian lessons within a month

This is doable but come on, don't kid youself. If you want to take this course seriously than you will maybe accomplish 2-4 lessons per week besides working or whatever you do the rest of your day.

In one month you have to pass ~3,3 lessons per day as per your receipt. I suggest you take the slow lane and try to really understand what each lesson is about. Here you will win in the long term.

Anyhow, all the best!

You missed the last sentence of his post:

(05-27-2016 02:30 AM)Switch Wrote:  ^^^definitely a joke
05-28-2016 05:03 AM
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Post: #403
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
The joke part was about being fluent, not about the one month thing i think.


I was a little disappointed with whoever said a year of intensive college studies = michel thomas + pinsleur

Ive done michel thomas and pimsleur earlier (i found pimsleur to be useless for russian). But i feel i cannot hold a conversation beyond a few lines at all.

I can just throw random sentences here and there, which is more entertaining to thr girl then actually engaging.

If one was a quick learner, moved to a russian speaking country and took private lessons, say 2 hours a day, whats s reasonable timeline to get conversational?
Mulling over whether its doable

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05-28-2016 05:17 AM
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marty Offline
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Post: #404
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
(05-27-2016 06:25 PM)ElFlaco Wrote:  
(05-26-2016 09:03 AM)marty Wrote:  Duolingo isn't very useful either

I'm not a Russian student, but here's an observation. I've never met a novice language learner who got to intermediate level speaking with Duolingo or similar. People swear by it, but look closer and you see that they're language dabblers, not language users.
Exactly. It gives you the impression you're learning a language but actually you're not really learning anything useful.

(05-27-2016 06:25 PM)ElFlaco Wrote:  
(05-26-2016 09:03 AM)marty Wrote:  Native materials are the key and are much more fun than using the aforementioned materials.

Unless you're already able to hold you own in a conversation (with mistakes and gaps, certainly), you're probably not ready for a diet of all 'authentic' materials. Once you can understand about 90% of what you hear or read, then you're able to fill in the meaning of the missing pieces based on the context. That's where learning really take off.
That's a bit vague. What kind of conversation are we talking about? You should be able to express yourself and understand what your partner is saying in a simple conversation after a few months (and by simple I don't mean something like "What's your name?", "Where are you from?", etc. but talking about your interests and somewhat more complex topics, albeit in a simple manner). Of course the actual time depends on the language.

You don't have to understand everything to be able to enjoy native materials. And you'll never learn a language well unless you make the transition into native media instead of trying to learn from dumbed-down material aimed at foreign language learners. You can start by reading children's books, comics or short stories, then work your way up.
(This post was last modified: 05-28-2016 09:18 AM by marty.)
05-28-2016 09:18 AM
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Post: #405
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
(05-28-2016 05:17 AM)Beirut Wrote:  The joke part was about being fluent, not about the one month thing i think.


I was a little disappointed with whoever said a year of intensive college studies = michel thomas + pinsleur

Ive done michel thomas and pimsleur earlier (i found pimsleur to be useless for russian). But i feel i cannot hold a conversation beyond a few lines at all.

I can just throw random sentences here and there, which is more entertaining to thr girl then actually engaging.

If one was a quick learner, moved to a russian speaking country and took private lessons, say 2 hours a day, whats s reasonable timeline to get conversational?
Mulling over whether its doable

I think a lot of people have different meanings of "conversational" (not to mention different meanings of "fluent," which most people will never get to). Both the U.S. and Europeans have standards on how they judge language proficiency. (See for example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_Eur..._Languages)

If you want to get to, for example, a B1 level, which will allow you probably to have a good 5 to 10 minute normal conversation in decent grammar and without annoying a native speaker on topics of familiarity you are probably looking at maybe 3-4 months of intensive studying (assuming you have already done Pimsleur and MT and have a basic grasp of the language, tenses, verb conjugation, etc).
05-28-2016 11:28 AM
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Post: #406
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
While I appreciate the debate about what paths work best, I also kno people learn differently. I think that constant regular exposure is the key.

I also think most guys here want to learn Russian to carry on a conversation and that requires actually speaking to someone who is a native Russian speaker. You will find out soon if they can understand you or not (screw you Liguarian and Rocha Laugh )

It is also a good test to see where you get stumped. Which words you want to say but don't know.

There are many options on the Internet and have been discussed here for finding language partners. You might have to contact a bunch of people find a few you connect with that want to continue to practice with you.

Or find a tutor online and then you can get some structured learning and language practice.

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05-28-2016 11:33 AM
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Post: #407
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
(05-27-2016 06:25 PM)ElFlaco Wrote:  
(05-26-2016 09:03 AM)marty Wrote:  Duolingo isn't very useful either

I'm not a Russian student, but here's an observation. I've never met a novice language learner who got to intermediate level speaking with Duolingo or similar. People swear by it, but look closer and you see that they're language dabblers, not language users.

   


You must think.....in Russian.....

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(This post was last modified: 05-28-2016 12:45 PM by LeeEnfield303.)
05-28-2016 12:45 PM
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Post: #408
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
(05-28-2016 09:18 AM)marty Wrote:  
(05-27-2016 06:25 PM)ElFlaco Wrote:  Unless you're already able to hold you own in a conversation (with mistakes and gaps, certainly)[/b], you're probably not ready for a diet of all 'authentic' materials. Once you can understand about 90% of what you hear or read, then you're able to fill in the meaning of the missing pieces based on the context. That's where learning really take off.
That's a bit vague. What kind of conversation are we talking about? You should be able to express yourself and understand what your partner is saying in a simple conversation after a few months (and by simple I don't mean something like "What's your name?", "Where are you from?", etc. but talking about your interests and somewhat more complex topics, albeit in a simple manner). Of course the actual time depends on the language.

The proficiency level I have in mind is B1 (lower intermediate). Here is what a B1 language user can do (source: Common European Framework of Reference, Council of Europe):
  • Can understand the main points of clear standard input on familiar matters regularly encountered in work, school, leisure, etc.
  • Can deal with most situations likely to arise while travelling in an area where the language is spoken.
  • Can produce simple connected text on topics that are familiar or of personal interest.
  • Can describe experiences and events, dreams, hopes and ambitions and briefly give reasons and explanations for opinions and plans.

If an adult learner can't do these things already, then they're going to advance very slowly if they're relying entirely on authentic materials (i.e., materials not prepared or selected for learners). It's frustrating to listen to input you can't follow. Eventually you give up. That's human nature. Even at B2 (upper intermediate), there's a role for continuing to use materials that have been designed for learners at that level, alongside authentic materials that aren't specifically for learners. That helps you focus more directly and quickly on where you need work. For example, an intermediate student of English could watch and understand movies and television in English for years without ever noticing that we can say 'I started to speak' but we don't say 'I finished to speak'. This kind of blindness is especially common with false cognates (in many Romance languages, 'actual' means 'current', not 'real'). Materials for students emphasize that kind of point, either indirectly (with constructed dialogues that multiple instances of the target structure) or directly, via highlighted examples or explanations.

(05-28-2016 09:18 AM)marty Wrote:  And you'll never learn a language well unless you make the transition into native media instead of trying to learn from dumbed-down material aimed at foreign language learners. You can start by reading children's books, comics or short stories, then work your way up.

Certainly a lot of the language found in traditional learning materials is boring, irrelevant and disconnected from reality. But that's an issue of the quality of the material, not its authenticity or artificiality per se. As for children's book, the problem is that they don't really capture the interest of adults. Also, the sources you list are all reading material. If you want to improve your oral skills, what you need to be doing is listening. And that's where authentic materials can be challenging for intermediates. To make listening more productive, do repeated listenings (without subtitles), picking up more each time. Also, video is better than pure audio because you can connect what you see with what you hear. That helps you determine the meaning of new words and expressions, because they are used in a context you understand.
05-29-2016 02:52 PM
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Post: #409
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
(05-28-2016 09:18 AM)marty Wrote:  
(05-27-2016 06:25 PM)ElFlaco Wrote:  
(05-26-2016 09:03 AM)marty Wrote:  Duolingo isn't very useful either

I'm not a Russian student, but here's an observation. I've never met a novice language learner who got to intermediate level speaking with Duolingo or similar. People swear by it, but look closer and you see that they're language dabblers, not language users.
Exactly. It gives you the impression you're learning a language but actually you're not really learning anything useful.

(05-27-2016 06:25 PM)ElFlaco Wrote:  
(05-26-2016 09:03 AM)marty Wrote:  Native materials are the key and are much more fun than using the aforementioned materials.

Unless you're already able to hold you own in a conversation (with mistakes and gaps, certainly), you're probably not ready for a diet of all 'authentic' materials. Once you can understand about 90% of what you hear or read, then you're able to fill in the meaning of the missing pieces based on the context. That's where learning really take off.
That's a bit vague. What kind of conversation are we talking about? You should be able to express yourself and understand what your partner is saying in a simple conversation after a few months (and by simple I don't mean something like "What's your name?", "Where are you from?", etc. but talking about your interests and somewhat more complex topics, albeit in a simple manner). Of course the actual time depends on the language.

You don't have to understand everything to be able to enjoy native materials. And you'll never learn a language well unless you make the transition into native media instead of trying to learn from dumbed-down material aimed at foreign language learners. You can start by reading children's books, comics or short stories, then work your way up.

I like to use Duolingo for the purpose of review and preventing attrition. There is no doubt in my mind that the words that show up one time, conjugated, and delivered without context will not stick around if they're new. But, it gives me the good ability to rapid fire translate stuff I already knew, and in doing so, strengthen that. Also, does anyone else find it utterly hilarious that the site will award you X% fluent in a language as you progress, and allow you to post that on your linkedin? I'm definitely not "20%" fluent in Spanish by any sort of measure....

I may start watching Cheburashka now to actually learn more. :banana:
(This post was last modified: 05-30-2016 08:33 PM by swuglyfe.)
05-30-2016 08:32 PM
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Post: #410
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
The joke part was about being fluent by the end of the summer. However, I fully expected to be able to crank through 2-3 of the RT lessons per day, but in reality I'll be working through whatever an average of an hour to an hour and a half of studying permits me to work through. I'm not going to be rushing the process, and I will definitely be seeking understanding, not just checking the boxes next to each lesson. Learning this language is something that I am fully comitted to, and do not want to cut corners. I'm simply trying to assemble the most efficient process of learning a new language from scratch based on my past experience learning languages (Chinese). Keep in mind I still do not even know how to say 'hello' in Russian. I am the definition of a Russian-language neophtye. Learning Russian is simply a fun, difficult, and beneficial project that I will be undertaking until I've reached fluency (B2-C1 level).

In other news I'm becoming more comfortable with cyrillic. It's like a puzzle just waiting to be put together. I think any more time spent only on learning the alphabet would be time wasted, so I will be starting the RT lessons tomorrow.

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05-31-2016 01:52 AM
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Post: #411
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
(05-31-2016 01:52 AM)Switch Wrote:  The joke part was about being fluent by the end of the summer. However, I fully expected to be able to crank through 2-3 of the RT lessons per day, but in reality I'll be working through whatever an average of an hour to an hour and a half of studying permits me to work through. I'm not going to be rushing the process, and I will definitely be seeking understanding, not just checking the boxes next to each lesson. Learning this language is something that I am fully comitted to, and do not want to cut corners. I'm simply trying to assemble the most efficient process of learning a new language from scratch based on my past experience learning languages (Chinese). Keep in mind I still do not even know how to say 'hello' in Russian. I am the definition of a Russian-language neophtye. Learning Russian is simply a fun, difficult, and beneficial project that I will be undertaking until I've reached fluency (B2-C1 level).

In other news I'm becoming more comfortable with cyrillic. It's like a puzzle just waiting to be put together. I think any more time spent only on learning the alphabet would be time wasted, so I will be starting the RT lessons tomorrow.

RT's language learning site is a solid resource. But I think it has shut down, you can't register and find out the correct answers to quizzes. Check out this site for correct answers to many of the RT quizzes:

http://www.explaura.net/learnrussian-rt-com/

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06-01-2016 08:25 AM
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scrambled Offline
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Post: #412
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
(05-26-2016 09:03 AM)marty Wrote:  Pimsleur, Michael Thomas and Duolingo all suck IMO (actually I've never encountered anyone who has reached a decent level using these materials).

Pimsleur is the single best resource I have found in learning a language; it's the only thing that really got me to speak it effectively in real life situations.

Your phrase, decent level, is useless to this discussion, as it is both utterly subjective and also untrue. Pimsleur is just an introduction to the language, aimed at the 'survival' or 'tourist' level. See the "Interagency Language Roundtable" scale for details; it describes,

Quote:"Speaking 1 (Elementary Proficiency) Able to satisfy minimum courtesy requirements and maintain very simple face-to-face conversations on familiar topics. A native speaker must often use slowed speech, repetition, paraphrase, or a combination of these to be understood by this individual. Similarly, the native speaker must strain and employ real-world knowledge to understand even simple statements/questions from this individual. This speaker has a functional, but limited proficiency. Misunderstandings are frequent, but the individual is able to ask for help and to verify comprehension of native speech in face-to-face interaction. The individual is unable to produce continuous discourse except with rehearsed material." http://www.govtilr.org/skills/ILRscale2.htm#1

That's all; what else would you expect from 90 half hour lessons? To read, without a dictionary, the complete works of Dostoyevsky? Reaching a "1" is itself quite an accomplishment in any secondary language, especially a more distant one like Russian (compared to English), and takes many hours of work.

Quote: They are okay to get your feet wet

I thought they suck "IMO"?

Quote: but you should make the transition into native materials as soon as possible, otherwise you'll never learn how natives speak the language you're learning

And you do that through a program like Pimsleur, the very thing you said won't 'bring you to a decent level'.

Quote: The problem with Pimsleur and similar materials is that they are totally unnatural. You'll never hear language used that way and it makes you content that you're making progress, while you're only repeating phrases like "Hi. My name is Jack. I am an American. Where are you from? Where is the hotel XY?" etc. and can't even understand a word in a proper conversation.

It's called linguistic register; they teach to a more formal, basic version of the language--when a tutoring program like Pimsleur uses it, it is called, "education". The point isn't to come across as a native of Novgarod, which is impossible through a single language program, but to have the minimum amount of proficiency to survive in-country and learn more in the targeted language.

Really, the best way to learn a language is to hire a tutor; so, essentially, Pimsleur is a less-expensive, more convenient, and infinitely more patient, one-on-one tutor that will bring you to the "1" or "elementary proficiency" level.

Quote:Native materials are the key and are much more fun than using the aforementioned materials.

And sprinting for a gold medal in the Olympics is much more fun than learning how to walk.
(This post was last modified: 06-01-2016 08:48 AM by scrambled.)
06-01-2016 08:40 AM
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Post: #413
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
(06-01-2016 08:40 AM)scrambled Wrote:  Really, the best way to learn a language is to hire a tutor; so, essentially, Pimsleur is a less-expensive, more convenient, and infinitely more patient, one-on-one tutor that will bring you to the "1" or "elementary proficiency" level.

I think the disconnect here is that some language learners have objectively poor skills and, as such, don't realize just how far they actually are from what is possible. To put a specific definition on it, I'm talking about people who couldn't pass the A1 (beginner) exam offered by the standard language certifying bodies for the major international languages. That's a objectively low bar for proficiency. You can do almost nothing with A1. It is merely a foundation for further study.

Those of us who have had far more success can accurately evaluate the level of those who haven't, but the opposite is not true. This is the Dunning-Kruger effect and applies to self-awareness of knowledge in general. So when we observe that the same people who swear by these popular approaches are precisely the same ones who are perpetual beginners, we rightly discard their testimonials. Also, there is also a relevant body of knowledge called Second Language Acquisition. Anyone interested in finding out what is known about how adults learn languages could benefit by checking it out.

Personally, I've given hundreds of hours of private language lessons and I've taken many private lessons as a student myself as well, all of which has led me to believe that private tutoring is not the best way to learn a language. It is merely a good way to discover where you are weak and what specifics things you have failed to notice about the language on your own for whatever reason. It should be a small part of a much larger and varied program of study.
06-01-2016 06:28 PM
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Post: #414
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
For intermediate to advance learners of Russian I'd recommend these types of TV shows.




This one is called прямой эфир which means Live Television. Another similar and popular one in Russia is called пусть говорят (Let them talk). Roosh appeared on a similar show in Ukraine. Think Russian Jerry Springer but with less fighting and more talking. They generally speak very clearly and not about something metaphysical that would confuse you.

Useful conversational language. Generally Russian and Ukrainian reality Tv has been quite helpful for my Russian, and easy watching. Be careful if the show is Ukrainian, because often I've noticed that contestants will speak in Surzhyk, which is like a blend of RU and UKR languages, which gets confusing.

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06-02-2016 04:50 AM
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Post: #415
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
Probably less useful for most of you guys beginning, but pretty funny if you are at a decent level is watching "versus battle" the Russian freestyle rap show. Lots of slang, and you will get brownie points with younger russian dudes if you mention it Big Grin

Original (without subtitles) version of this battle has more than 20 million views.



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06-02-2016 04:59 AM
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Post: #416
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
(06-02-2016 04:50 AM)369eyedea Wrote:  For intermediate to advance learners of Russian I'd recommend these types of TV shows.

This one is called прямой эфир which means Live Television. Another similar and popular one in Russia is called пусть говорят (Let them talk). Roosh appeared on a similar show in Ukraine. Think Russian Jerry Springer but with less fighting and more talking. They generally speak very clearly and not about something metaphysical that would confuse you.

Useful conversational language. Generally Russian and Ukrainian reality Tv has been quite helpful for my Russian, and easy watching. Be careful if the show is Ukrainian, because often I've noticed that contestants will speak in Surzhyk, which is like a blend of RU and UKR languages, which gets confusing.

Great stuff; not in terms of the content but at least the vocab they use; it's reassuring that I'm able to understand pretty much every word they say, but I just can't put it together fast enough to actually understand the larger context of what they're saying. That's definitely the next step.

Unrelated, has anyone had any experience with the Living Language series? I was walking in the bookstore today and saw it next to all the usual suspects: Pimsleur, MT, Rosetta Stone, MT, etc.

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06-02-2016 06:42 PM
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369eyedea Offline
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Post: #417
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
More resources for you guys:

*Easy Languages Russian




This youtube channel has videos for all the big languages like French Spanish German ect, they also have a Russian group. Street interviews with English subtitles, Russian subtitles and transliteration.

*I also read/listen to this news website. You can change the language at the top and usually the same article is available in english
Euronews

*New Deaf Club
Website has lots of movies with subtitles in Russian, so you don't have to guess what the word is from context. This link is for a movie i watched recently called Духлесс (soulless)
Духлесс

*Russian Pod 101
You pay a subscription which is about 150USD and it gives you access to heaps of pod cast style lessons and notes on grammar, example sentences. Worth every cent ($150 dollars is nothing compared to the impact knowing russian made in my life)
RussianPod101

*Поедем поедем
RUssian language tv show made by a British guy who moved over there with a russian language degree from a UK university and became well-known as a TV presenter and Businessman.
This is a travel show he presents:




Hope they're helpful for you! Best tip is to have a russian girlfriend or close friend who is patient and lets you practice with them often. Helped me a lot to achieve a decent level without going to a Russian speaking country to learn.

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06-02-2016 09:04 PM
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Post: #418
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
I speak a fluent Russian, but want to improve my writing so I decided to read Russian books. Can someone recommend me a book that isn't a novel? I'm more into real events, science and philosophy.
06-03-2016 03:37 AM
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Post: #419
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
The Primsleur or Michael Thomas debate is just mental masturbation for the most part.

The fact is that the deciding factor in whether you learn to speak Russian or not will almost exclusively be your staying power and tenacity. Technique is only a minuscule amount of the equation. What did Einstein say, '5% inspiration and 95% perspiration'? I'd say that is a fair equation.

The only good technique for you is the one that makes you want to come back day after day and study. That could be watching films, reading the back of Russian cereal boxes or studying grammar charts. It does not really matter as if you have staying power eventually you'll get to where you want to go.

You ideally want that Eureka moment that sets you on the path with determination. For me it was Kharkov as I mentioned before. In Siberia recently my buddy turned to me after a date where he struggled to make him self understood with a girl and said with a real determination 'that's it, I'm going to do this'. He has been on the path since then. Those moments are however probably the exception as opposed to the rule. Most people no doubt think about studying the language from a logical/rational viewpoint. Ideally you want to do it from an emotional standpoint like meeting a girl you like who speaks little English. People are willing to die on the battlefield for emotional devotion to a cause whereas few willingly die for a rational belief.

In Russia my buddy came across a problem a few times where he would meet a girl and they would get on well in the initial interaction. He'd set up a date but then she would flake. The reason two girls gave was that they did not want to speak English, it was too much hassle for them or they were shy of their level. No doubt many other girls flaked for this reason too whilst not actually stating it. If you see your future in Russia or with a Russian girl then there really is no excuse not to learn the language no matter the ball ache you imagine it to be.
06-05-2016 02:07 AM
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369eyedea Offline
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Post: #420
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
(06-05-2016 02:07 AM)The Ligurian Wrote:  You ideally want that Eureka moment that sets you on the path with determination. For me it was Kharkov as I mentioned before. In Siberia recently my buddy turned to me after a date where he struggled to make him self understood with a girl and said with a real determination 'that's it, I'm going to do this'. He has been on the path since then. Those moments are however probably the exception as opposed to the rule. Most people no doubt think about studying the language from a logical/rational viewpoint. Ideally you want to do it from an emotional standpoint like meeting a girl you like who speaks little English. People are willing to die on the battlefield for emotional devotion to a cause whereas few willingly die for a rational belief.

Один из лучших вещей я читал здесь недавно. Ты молодец братушка! что-то подобного случилось со мной.

Где ближайший зоомагазин?
06-05-2016 02:41 AM
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Constitution45 Offline
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Post: #421
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
(06-01-2016 06:28 PM)ElFlaco Wrote:  
(06-01-2016 08:40 AM)scrambled Wrote:  Really, the best way to learn a language is to hire a tutor; so, essentially, Pimsleur is a less-expensive, more convenient, and infinitely more patient, one-on-one tutor that will bring you to the "1" or "elementary proficiency" level.

I think the disconnect here is that some language learners have objectively poor skills and, as such, don't realize just how far they actually are from what is possible. To put a specific definition on it, I'm talking about people who couldn't pass the A1 (beginner) exam offered by the standard language certifying bodies for the major international languages. That's a objectively low bar for proficiency. You can do almost nothing with A1. It is merely a foundation for further study.

Those of us who have had far more success can accurately evaluate the level of those who haven't, but the opposite is not true. This is the Dunning-Kruger effect and applies to self-awareness of knowledge in general. So when we observe that the same people who swear by these popular approaches are precisely the same ones who are perpetual beginners, we rightly discard their testimonials. Also, there is also a relevant body of knowledge called Second Language Acquisition. Anyone interested in finding out what is known about how adults learn languages could benefit by checking it out.

Personally, I've given hundreds of hours of private language lessons and I've taken many private lessons as a student myself as well, all of which has led me to believe that private tutoring is not the best way to learn a language. It is merely a good way to discover where you are weak and what specifics things you have failed to notice about the language on your own for whatever reason. It should be a small part of a much larger and varied program of study.


I agree, I used to teach English quite a lot in that private lesson format and I came to the conclusion that for some students it only gets them so far. Also it becomes problematic when your student only can understand when you speak the language, let alone anyone else.
06-05-2016 02:51 AM
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Post: #422
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
(06-05-2016 02:41 AM)369eyedea Wrote:  
(06-05-2016 02:07 AM)The Ligurian Wrote:  You ideally want that Eureka moment that sets you on the path with determination. For me it was Kharkov as I mentioned before. In Siberia recently my buddy turned to me after a date where he struggled to make him self understood with a girl and said with a real determination 'that's it, I'm going to do this'. He has been on the path since then. Those moments are however probably the exception as opposed to the rule. Most people no doubt think about studying the language from a logical/rational viewpoint. Ideally you want to do it from an emotional standpoint like meeting a girl you like who speaks little English. People are willing to die on the battlefield for emotional devotion to a cause whereas few willingly die for a rational belief.

Один из лучших вещей я читал здесь недавно. Ты молодец братушка! что-то подобного случилось со мной.

I think подобное would be more correct
(This post was last modified: 06-05-2016 03:00 AM by fighter.)
06-05-2016 03:00 AM
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PeruLover12 Offline
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Post: #423
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
(06-05-2016 03:00 AM)fighter Wrote:  
(06-05-2016 02:41 AM)369eyedea Wrote:  
(06-05-2016 02:07 AM)The Ligurian Wrote:  You ideally want that Eureka moment that sets you on the path with determination. For me it was Kharkov as I mentioned before. In Siberia recently my buddy turned to me after a date where he struggled to make him self understood with a girl and said with a real determination 'that's it, I'm going to do this'. He has been on the path since then. Those moments are however probably the exception as opposed to the rule. Most people no doubt think about studying the language from a logical/rational viewpoint. Ideally you want to do it from an emotional standpoint like meeting a girl you like who speaks little English. People are willing to die on the battlefield for emotional devotion to a cause whereas few willingly die for a rational belief.

Один из лучших вещей я читал здесь недавно. Ты молодец братушка! что-то подобного случилось со мной.

I think подобное would be more correct

Совсем не важно. Я ему прекрасно понял и это что самая главное.
06-05-2016 03:19 AM
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samsamsam Offline
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Post: #424
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
(06-05-2016 02:41 AM)369eyedea Wrote:  [quote='The Ligurian' pid='1317619' dateline='1465110464']

Один из лучших вещей я читал здесь недавно. Ты молодец братушка! что-то подобного случилось со мной.

Совсем не важно. Я ему прекрасно понял и это что самая главное.

Maybe it took me a little bit (a minute of processing) - but a small humble brag - I got the gist of both of those sentences! Google translation of course to confirm. There were a couple of words I didn't understand but in context it makes sense. Some of the words were not in forms I was super familiar with and just had to sound them out and match what was in my vocabulary.* Whether I suck or not - I will take this as a some encouragement lol.

I don't think anyone expects perfection from a non native speaker - we have all met non native speakers in our countries and we understand and get along with them just fine.

*I do notice that when I hear words that I either didn't catch the whole word or it is unfamiliar I do try to squeeze them into my limited vocab. Sometimes, it works and sometimes I am way off Laugh

Fate whispers to the warrior, "You cannot withstand the storm." And the warrior whispers back, "I am the storm."

Women and children can be careless, but not men - Don Corleone

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(This post was last modified: 06-05-2016 03:37 AM by samsamsam.)
06-05-2016 03:34 AM
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fighter Offline
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Post: #425
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
(06-05-2016 03:34 AM)samsamsam Wrote:  
(06-05-2016 02:41 AM)369eyedea Wrote:  [quote='The Ligurian' pid='1317619' dateline='1465110464']

Один из лучших вещей я читал здесь недавно. Ты молодец братушка! что-то подобного случилось со мной.

Совсем не важно. Я ему прекрасно понял и это что самая главное.

Maybe it took me a little bit (a minute of processing) - but a small humble brag - I got the gist of both of those sentences! Google translation of course to confirm. There were a couple of words I didn't understand but in context it makes sense. Some of the words were not in forms I was super familiar with and just had to sound them out and match what was in my vocabulary.* Whether I suck or not - I will take this as a some encouragement lol.

I don't think anyone expects perfection from a non native speaker - we have all met non native speakers in our countries and we understand and get along with them just fine.

*I do notice that when I hear words that I either didn't catch the whole word or it is unfamiliar I do try to squeeze them into my limited vocab. Sometimes, it works and sometimes I am way off Laugh

If I wasn't a native speaker, I would never think of learning Russian. The grammar is too complicated and the writing is different than speaking.
06-05-2016 04:10 AM
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