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Russian language: no more bullshit
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Polniy_Sostav Offline
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Post: #626
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
(01-13-2019 08:13 AM)Ceasar Wrote:  ^^Going "Russian only" is an ideal. Of course, occasionally you might need explanations in English. But when I learned Japanese at a language school where English was banned, what happened is that my fluency in Japanese improved day-by-day. They had methods to teach people with zero Japanese. Even then, a few times I did get an explanation of something in English. But, what I also learned is that if you have lessons which mostly consist of someone explaining grammar to you in English is that, while it may seem beneficial, all those explanations will come at a cost to your fluency. You want to practice having a conversation in the language you want to learn as much as possible.

Also, one of my favorite things to do with a tutor is a grammar lesson, where you practice the grammar and make example sentences, and so forth. I'm not saying don't study grammar, I'm saying don't make studying out of a textbook by yourself the centerpiece of your language learning, especially if you can help it.

I respectfully disagree.
This might give you a big boost and reach an intermediate level pretty fast. But with the intention of absolute fluency you need to understand grammatical mechanisms in and out. Once you have them , you can go to a place where only russian is spoken , listen to russian radio/music , watch russian films ( the best is to find the russian subtitles with it ) .

Speaking a language without understanding the grammar is like being skilled at a sport but without having the appropriate tactical background.

But anyway , people should go to whatever they feel the most comfortable for themselves.

I find Russian to be key if you want to travel to FSU / Central Asia & remote Russia.
01-13-2019 08:48 AM
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RVF400 Offline
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Post: #627
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
(01-13-2019 08:13 AM)Ceasar Wrote:  But when I learned Japanese at a language school where English was banned, what happened is that my fluency in Japanese improved day-by-day. They had methods to teach people with zero Japanese.

Cesar could you expand a bit on your Japanese journey and using the method you did, how long to fluency?
01-13-2019 09:03 AM
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Constitution45 Offline
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Post: #628
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
Any beginners have questions, fire them at me. I am not fluent but around the intermediate level.
01-14-2019 06:27 AM
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WanderingFlame Offline
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Post: #629
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
I am starting to think that apps like DuoLingo, Babbel etc are a bit of a waste of time. With usage of gamification they feed your brain endorphins, giving a sense of progression and achievement. I question whether it is "real world helpful". What has seemed most valuable to me is actual conversation (having to recall words and construct sentences on the fly). It's just too easy to sit there on your phone for an hour faffing about with apps. Maybe they are okay as a backup method of learning.

So now I'm going with:

1. Spend half an hour per day constructing random sentences and talking (out loud) to myself. Write some down in notebook. Note down and learn anything that I need to lookup throughout this process.
2. Vocab - groups of words - e.g. "emotions" one day, then useful verbs the next, etc. Integrate into #1.
3. Study grammar from textbook in small steps (and note down in grammar notebook). PRACTICE grammar in conjunction with points number 1 and 2.
4. Continue Pimsleur (currently nearing end of 3, will probably buy 4 too)
5. Lessons with my new good Italki tutor (3 per week - I have been lax with this in the past)

I'm having basic conversations with Russian girls and they are very complimentary, but I don't do things half arsed. My current level is not where I want to be. Need to push harder.

Edit: @Constitution45 what did you find most helpful in terms of actual progression?
(This post was last modified: 01-14-2019 06:32 AM by WanderingFlame.)
01-14-2019 06:29 AM
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Constitution45 Offline
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Post: #630
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
To be frank, just one to one lessons. I did about a year of 'memirze' and it didn't really help me a great deal.
Italki is a good way to learn, if you are fortunate enough to have lessons at work that is also very helpful.
It looks like you are on top of it all at this stage, grammar books are also a must.

I don't understand why people say 'don't learn grammar'. If you wish to be intermediate level or above, you'll need to understand the cases, otherwise you simply won't be able to 'speak your mind' if you get what I mean.

Three hours a week at least is a must !
01-14-2019 06:38 AM
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WanderingFlame Offline
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Post: #631
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
Nice to hear. Completely agree on the grammar. Like with most things in life, a middle-ground is a good approach - obsessing over it in the early stages is bad. But in my case I simply didn't understand what was being said and why, until I delved into it more.

E.g. I wish someone had just told me:

1 = nominative
2-4 = genitive
5-20 = genitive plural
?1 = nominative
?2-?4 = genitive
?5-?0 = genitive plural

1 and 2 can change in gender. два is actually masculine.
(This post was last modified: 01-14-2019 07:14 AM by WanderingFlame.)
01-14-2019 07:13 AM
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Polniy_Sostav Offline
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Post: #632
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
can someone explain to me the difference in the aspect (perfective/imperfective) in the past ?

I believe that it is easier for english native speakers or other slavic languages native speakers as they have this . As A french native I struggle a bit.

I understand in the present tense , and even at imperative.
but In the past - i don't

example when someone tells me :
kak mogu skazat , chtoby ty ponimal ? why not chtoby ty ponial ?
01-27-2019 06:49 AM
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Beirut Offline
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Post: #633
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
^ Because the action didnt happen.

Beirut
Budva
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01-27-2019 07:29 AM
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Hazaer Offline
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Post: #634
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
How good have the free Princeton free Russian courses been for you in terms of self study for basic conversation? It looks like just course 1 will get you up to speed with basic conversation, equivalent to 2 semesters of russian.I plan to combine it with weekly conversation with natives.
Appreciate your thoughts.
06-01-2019 05:48 PM
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Salame Offline
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Post: #635
RE: Russian language: no more bullshit
Does anyone have issues to keeping up with the learning when away from Russian speakers? I'm currently in Blighty and away from the Russian speakers I know in London and Ukraine, aside from watching the odd film or TV series, I'm not getting a lot of exposure and I'm lacking the will to improve although I know when my trip comes around, I'll be cramming like hell, learning nothing!

Anyone else face the same issue, if so, how did you overcome the lack of motivation and power through to improve, especially when I'm away from any kind of Russian contact, not even an evening course nearby!

And is there any general advice on the best way to learn, I've got the Colloquial Russian series book as well as the New Penguin Course, I dabble with Memrise for vocab and watch the odd Russian film and TV series. How best to utilise?
07-11-2019 09:57 AM
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