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Owning/buying a bar or pub
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Jbk Offline
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Post: #1
Owning/buying a bar or pub
Hi all,

I always have had a strong desire to own a small pub, just a whole in the wall neighbourhood type place. I know it's a pretty commonly desired thing to do, of course.

I run a business online that is fairly automated and generates a decent late five figures yearly income. As such, I know I wouldn't need to rely on the income a pub would generate but making a profit is an essential goal obviously.

The way I'd envision doing it is with one or two partners who could split costs, liability and management time. Again, I know the risks of partnerships but they can also make pursuits like this more manageable and ultimately successful.

I am fully aware of how it involves far more work than now expect. I also know how grim the figures are for the percentage of new openings that fail.

Still, it is so thing I want to achieve within the next five years ideally.

I only have a few years experience in bar tending back at university. I wold need to partner up wisely and research heavily first.

Anyways,

Any bar owners/staff here?

Or people with a similar ambition?

Cheers
(This post was last modified: 05-15-2013 04:28 PM by Jbk.)
05-15-2013 04:15 PM
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Jbk Offline
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Post: #2
RE: Owning/buying a bar or pub
Thought I'd add, ideally I'd like it o be in Chicago...
05-15-2013 04:25 PM
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bacon Offline
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RE: Owning/buying a bar or pub
I would never own a bar in the US because the liability is not worth it. For example some drunk over indulges in your bar drives a hits a family killing them all you bet your ass they are going after you. I am considering owning a bar in a foreign country but I need to find a country with flexible laws for foreigners to run businesses. Any recommendations?

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(This post was last modified: 05-15-2013 04:42 PM by bacon.)
05-15-2013 04:41 PM
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thegmanifesto Offline
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Post: #4
RE: Owning/buying a bar or pub
Get a job at a bar.

Do every job; dishwashing, barbacking, bartending, managing etc.

Then see if you really want to do it.

You need to learn every position inside and out (ideally learn spanish and know how all the machinery works as well, and some plumbing, electric etc) or you are going to get robbed by each employee.

We have multiple threads on this topic.

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(This post was last modified: 05-15-2013 04:50 PM by thegmanifesto.)
05-15-2013 04:45 PM
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Jbk Offline
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Post: #5
RE: Owning/buying a bar or pub
(05-15-2013 04:41 PM)bacon Wrote:  I would never own a bar in the US because the liability is not worth it. For example some drunk over indulges in your bar drives a hits a family killing them all you bet your ass they are going after you. I am considering owning a bar in a foreign country but I need to find a country with flexible laws for foreigners to run businesses. Any recommendations?


All true. Flipside to this though is a lot of countries where this risk isn't present, there are equally big challenges e.g lack of respect for foreign ownership, local mafia type groups, corrupt police that demand brides etc etc
05-15-2013 06:20 PM
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Jbk Offline
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RE: Owning/buying a bar or pub
(05-15-2013 04:45 PM)thegmanifesto Wrote:  Get a job at a bar.

Do every job; dishwashing, barbacking, bartending, managing etc.

Then see if you really want to do it.

You need to learn every position inside and out (ideally learn spanish and know how all the machinery works as well, and some plumbing, electric etc) or you are going to get robbed by each employee.

We have multiple threads on this topic.

All good points. I am thinking very small scale though, so we're taking only a handful of employees.

I would also only look at it with at least one partner and it would have to be relatively turn key from the offset with room for improvements.
05-15-2013 06:23 PM
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lurker Offline
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Post: #7
RE: Owning/buying a bar or pub
Reread what MPM wrote. Then reread it again. Then get your capital together and consult a good business attorney. If you have one mantra owning a bar, it should be "do... not... commingle... my.. funds."
05-15-2013 08:20 PM
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Merenguero Offline
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Post: #8
RE: Owning/buying a bar or pub
(05-15-2013 04:41 PM)bacon Wrote:  I would never own a bar in the US because the liability is not worth it. For example some drunk over indulges in your bar drives a hits a family killing them all you bet your ass they are going after you.

You're from Baltimore, right? In Baltimore, there is definitely no need to worry about third parties suing you due to overserving a patron at your bar. Maryland does not follow the Dram Shop Act, which would allow for such lawsuits against bar owners. The last time I checked, someone was seeking to have the highest court apply some variation of the Dram Shop Act (although that is clearly for the legislature, and not an appellate court, to consider) in a particular case, but as far as I know the court has been reluctant to do so.

New Jersey is a different story. Where I'm from, people sue at the drop of a dime and bar owners spend half their lives defendant cases, both frivolous and meritorious.
(This post was last modified: 05-15-2013 08:49 PM by Merenguero.)
05-15-2013 08:44 PM
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theArbiter Offline
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Post: #9
RE: Owning/buying a bar or pub
(05-15-2013 06:23 PM)Jbk Wrote:  
(05-15-2013 04:45 PM)thegmanifesto Wrote:  Get a job at a bar.

Do every job; dishwashing, barbacking, bartending, managing etc.

Then see if you really want to do it.

You need to learn every position inside and out (ideally learn spanish and know how all the machinery works as well, and some plumbing, electric etc) or you are going to get robbed by each employee.

We have multiple threads on this topic.

All good points. I am thinking very small scale though, so we're taking only a handful of employees.

I would also only look at it with at least one partner and it would have to be relatively turn key from the offset with room for improvements.

"Very small scale" doesn't mean you can get away with not dishwashing, not barbacking, not bartending, not managing, not advertising, not sourcing, etc. The point here is to gain experience or to at least educate yourself in these realms.

Also, the rules in the forum say to bump another related thread instead of creating a separate topic if one does not already exist. There are numerous threads on this topic as said before.

However, it seems that you did do a significant amount of research, so you might have seen this post:
http://www.rooshvforum.com/thread-10995-...#pid422736
If not, read it.
05-15-2013 10:21 PM
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billy Offline
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Post: #10
RE: Owning/buying a bar or pub
Don't do it, I had my own wine bar at 23-24 and would never go back to it, the only good part was banging the hot EE girls I employed, working 80 hours a week for 1 k is a waste of time. If you ate not there 24/7 your staff will try and rob you and this is from someone people generally know not to fuck with. Also dealing with drunken fuck heads and having to throw them out gets old quick.
05-16-2013 03:46 AM
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Jbk Offline
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Post: #11
RE: Owning/buying a bar or pub
(05-15-2013 10:21 PM)theArbiter Wrote:  
(05-15-2013 06:23 PM)Jbk Wrote:  
(05-15-2013 04:45 PM)thegmanifesto Wrote:  Get a job at a bar.

Do every job; dishwashing, barbacking, bartending, managing etc.

Then see if you really want to do it.

You need to learn every position inside and out (ideally learn spanish and know how all the machinery works as well, and some plumbing, electric etc) or you are going to get robbed by each employee.

We have multiple threads on this topic.

All good points. I am thinking very small scale though, so we're taking only a handful of employees.

I would also only look at it with at least one partner and it would have to be relatively turn key from the offset with room for improvements.

"Very small scale" doesn't mean you can get away with not dishwashing, not barbacking, not bartending, not managing, not advertising, not sourcing, etc. The point here is to gain experience or to at least educate yourself in these realms.

Also, the rules in the forum say to bump another related thread instead of creating a separate topic if one does not already exist. There are numerous threads on this topic as said before.

However, it seems that you did do a significant amount of research, so you might have seen this post:
http://www.rooshvforum.com/thread-10995-...#pid422736
If not, read it.

Thanks for this
05-16-2013 02:38 PM
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Jbk Offline
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Post: #12
RE: Owning/buying a bar or pub
(05-15-2013 10:21 PM)theArbiter Wrote:  
(05-15-2013 06:23 PM)Jbk Wrote:  
(05-15-2013 04:45 PM)thegmanifesto Wrote:  Get a job at a bar.

Do every job; dishwashing, barbacking, bartending, managing etc.

Then see if you really want to do it.

You need to learn every position inside and out (ideally learn spanish and know how all the machinery works as well, and some plumbing, electric etc) or you are going to get robbed by each employee.

We have multiple threads on this topic.

All good points. I am thinking very small scale though, so we're taking only a handful of employees.

I would also only look at it with at least one partner and it would have to be relatively turn key from the offset with room for improvements.

"Very small scale" doesn't mean you can get away with not dishwashing, not barbacking, not bartending, not managing, not advertising, not sourcing, etc. The point here is to gain experience or to at least educate yourself in these realms.

Also, the rules in the forum say to bump another related thread instead of creating a separate topic if one does not already exist. There are numerous threads on this topic as said before.

However, it seems that you did do a significant amount of research, so you might have seen this post:
http://www.rooshvforum.com/thread-10995-...#pid422736
If not, read it.

Thanks for this
05-16-2013 02:39 PM
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thegmanifesto Offline
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Post: #13
RE: Owning/buying a bar or pub
(05-16-2013 03:46 AM)billy Wrote:  Don't do it, I had my own wine bar at 23-24 and would never go back to it, the only good part was banging the hot EE girls I employed, working 80 hours a week for 1 k is a waste of time. If you ate not there 24/7 your staff will try and rob you and this is from someone people generally know not to fuck with. Also dealing with drunken fuck heads and having to throw them out gets old quick.

Yeah.

The Art of Bouncing is essential to know as well.

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The Guide to Getting More out of Life
http://www.thegmanifesto.com

Twitter: https://twitter.com/michaelporfirio

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The G Manifesto Facebook Page

Grew up with gorillas, you grew up on Twitter, don’t care if you follow me.

"Can't be like the rest", is the most I'll confess.
05-16-2013 02:42 PM
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Sebastian Offline
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Post: #14
RE: Owning/buying a bar or pub
geez, owning a wine bar would be one of my dream.
well decorated interior, lounge type bar with a chill music background.
a place for people to have good conversation, not to get drunk or act crazy.

anyways, I thought usually classy crowds come to such bars?

I know this bar in town. they overprice their drinks. there are crackheads right next door at a cheaper bar. People dress nice so any trashy crowds won't feel like they belong there.
they have trendy hipster crowds early 20s~ early 30s. you don't see club crowds, guys with attitudes, girls acting like a total bitch. all people are generally nice. I've never seen people even verbally arguing or acting crazy. I think such bars would be cool to have. The only question is how can you control to have certain crowds...

(05-16-2013 03:46 AM)billy Wrote:  Don't do it, I had my own wine bar at 23-24 and would never go back to it, the only good part was banging the hot EE girls I employed, working 80 hours a week for 1 k is a waste of time. If you ate not there 24/7 your staff will try and rob you and this is from someone people generally know not to fuck with. Also dealing with drunken fuck heads and having to throw them out gets old quick.
05-16-2013 08:39 PM
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billy Offline
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RE: Owning/buying a bar or pub
Posh people get drunk and rowdy too and do not forget that often the only people headed to posh bars and spending money on week days are the top local drug dealers and the more sucessful hoods. Trying to control the mix of clientele is a ball ache and why you have I be there 24/7. I can remember one day being there late with a 6 and a half foot, notorious Jamaican criminal, one of my white lads from Rhodesia and the Owner of a large high end IFA company. Keeping that night on track was hard work and it's how you learn proper skill as a host.
05-17-2013 03:02 AM
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Timoteo Offline
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RE: Owning/buying a bar or pub
In the first couple of chapters of "Kitchen Confidential," Anthony Bourdain talks about this. How people that are successful in other disciplines decide they want to, and can, open and run a successful restaurant. I know you're thinking about a bar/pub, but there are enough similarities regarding the issues you'll have to deal with in running this type of business. He held every type of job in the restaurant business before he became a chef and ran his own kitchen, and subsequently his own catering business. He understands the business from both the perspective of an employee at each level, to being the boss. He discourages anyone from opening a restaurant, but also discusses how the best in the business stay successful. I don't write this to discourage you, but to give you an idea of what you need to think about. If you can, read the first couple of chapters of this book.

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05-17-2013 12:02 PM
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