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American women and the war not fought
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Wadsworth Offline
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Post: #26
RE: American women and the war not fought
I should mention that I don't see the siege warfare effort as one to "put women in their place," but rather one to rid the male identity of female parasitism.
08-21-2013 06:00 PM
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dtf Offline
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Post: #27
RE: American women and the war not fought
tell women to go fuck themselves

Another feel good generalization. I can't in wholesale say this as I've had women help me significantly in my life. And I know a lot of other men are in my same shoes.

Are you gonna say to all the men out there: hey guys, tell all the women in your life "go fuck yourselves!!"

How's that gonna fly with other guys?
08-21-2013 06:06 PM
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Nomad77
Nomad77 Offline
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Post: #28
RE: American women and the war not fought
Women has been very supportive of me in many aspects of my life. I owe them a great deal. While there some messed up women out there I don't think we can use them to stereotype ALL women. I believe in the inherent goodness of people.
08-21-2013 06:09 PM
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Wadsworth Offline
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Post: #29
RE: American women and the war not fought
^^This isn't about all women or even some women. It's about the average female identity in society today, and the average male identity in society today. The average male identity is much more reasonable, as you and dtf have just proven. Do you think the average female identity is aware of how much men help women? Or do you think the average female identity mostly views itself as being oppressed and victimized by men?

At some point you have to be OK with making some generalizations.
(This post was last modified: 08-21-2013 06:17 PM by Wadsworth.)
08-21-2013 06:16 PM
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Nomad77 Offline
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Post: #30
RE: American women and the war not fought
Every relationship is transactional in nature: you give something to get something in return. In the past, women exchanged sex for relationships and thru those relationships access to resources. Today, women have direct access to resources, they don't need men for that. So now, what are we going to give them? A new transaction model is need. This is why women are saying oh, we want men to be more emotional etc. But because they don't really understand their own psyche they don't really understand what they respond to and what really makes them happy. So, in my view, the problem is primarily with women not men.
(This post was last modified: 08-21-2013 06:24 PM by Nomad77.)
08-21-2013 06:24 PM
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Wadsworth Offline
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Post: #31
RE: American women and the war not fought
(08-21-2013 06:24 PM)Nomad77 Wrote:  Every relationship is transactional in nature: you give something to get something in return. In the past, women exchanged sex for relationships and thru those relationships access to resources. Today, women have direct access to resources, they don't need men for that. So now, what are we going to give them? A new transaction model is need. This is why women are saying oh, we want men to be more emotional etc. but because they don't really understand they own psyche they don't really understand what they respond to and what really makes them happy. So, in my view, the problem is primarily with women not men.

^^I agree with some of what you've said here, but in my opinion the emboldened is part of the problem. Why even ask what men are going to give women? Who cares what women think they need men for? Live for yourself, give yourself what you need, and let women do the same. If it's a healthy relationship you're after, don't impose anything on a woman's identity, and don't let her do it to you.
(This post was last modified: 08-21-2013 06:28 PM by Wadsworth.)
08-21-2013 06:28 PM
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Nomad77 Offline
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Post: #32
RE: American women and the war not fought
Unfortunately that not possible. As Maslow points out in Level 3 of his pyramid we all need to be loved and have sexual intimacy. This is not something we can give to ourselves, we can only give it to each other. The manosphere and Game sites, to a large extent, ignores this need in people. You can go out there and bang a 100 women and still not feel loved and fulfilled. In fact, it only serves to remind you of the emptiness you are attempting to fill. Other people just do drugs and try to forget about it.
08-21-2013 06:33 PM
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dtf Offline
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Post: #33
RE: American women and the war not fought
I dunno, it's almost a lost cause.

The current system (betas & white knights) lets women get away with bs, lets other men get treated like doormats.,

I think the change will need to be at the very least, be generational, where young boys are taught & trained to be real men and not to take any bs from females. Also, be taugt how to be self-sufficient where they don't need to rely on women for anything significant, otherwise they're on the hook and this is where things start all over again.

However, I don't know what would make a good model: Saudi Arabia or muslim countries, maybe Sparta..
(This post was last modified: 08-21-2013 06:47 PM by dtf.)
08-21-2013 06:38 PM
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Wadsworth Offline
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Post: #34
RE: American women and the war not fought
(08-21-2013 06:33 PM)Nomad77 Wrote:  Unfortunately that not possible. As Maslow points out in Level 3 of his pyramid we all need to be loved and have sexual intimacy. This is not something we can give to ourselves, we can only give it to each other. The manosphere and Game sites, to a large extent, ignores this need in people. You can go out there and bang a 100 women and still not feel loved and fulfilled. In fact, it only serves to remind you of the emptiness you are attempting to fill. Other people just do drugs and try to forget about it.

You're confusing two important things.

I'm not denying people need to feel loved, but there's a functional and well-adjusted way of going about it, and a dysfunctional retarded way of going about it.

I wrote a post describing how men appeal to women to validate their identity, and only two posts later, you were talking about what it is you need to give women in a transactional sense (in other words, who you need to be to gain acceptance and validation from women). See? No matter how much women attack men, you're still thinking about how to present yourself to women on a platter. Your identity becomes shaped by what you think women want.

Since you brought up Maslow, this is what self actualization is all about. You won't have access to higher levels until you're healthy at lower levels. If your identity isn't your own in order to gain love and acceptance, that's where your development stops.
(This post was last modified: 08-21-2013 07:06 PM by Wadsworth.)
08-21-2013 07:05 PM
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AnonymousBosch Away
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Post: #35
RE: American women and the war not fought
I've never been convinced by self-actualisation. The pyramid makes sense in a casual scan, but when you start digging into Maslov's ideas of what constitutes a self-actualised person, it starts sounding an awful lot like 70's hippy / feminist nonsense dictating what A Man Should Be: 'innocence of vision, like an artist or a child'; non-hostility; brotherhood with humanity; peak experiences; tolerance. It's a small step from that to Captain Planet and The Secret.
08-22-2013 11:22 PM
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Nomad77 Offline
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Post: #36
RE: American women and the war not fought
I can't defend Maslov but I can defend people needs to be loved and to care about others. There is a lot of men out there that deny that this need this and it messed them internally, screws up their personality.
08-23-2013 12:23 AM
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AnonymousBosch Away
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Post: #37
RE: American women and the war not fought
(08-23-2013 12:23 AM)Nomad77 Wrote:  I can't defend Maslov but I can defend people needs to be loved and to care about others. There is a lot of men out there that deny that this need this and it messed them internally, screws up their personality.

You're valuing romantic love higher than erotic, altruistic, platonic, parental, sacrificial, familial, material, ethereal, companionate and divine love. The drive for love can be satiated in many more ways than just having a monogamous relationship with a girlfriend.

Aside from the dogs I banged out of horniness and inexperience, I've genuinely loved the beauty of every women I've been with. Why should that be considered empty or shallow? Romantic love is a myth that grew out of the concept of courtly love. Lesbian feminists destroyed Chivalry, and, as such, destroyed Romantic Love right along with it.

Hell, Women's voracious pursuit of 'romantic love' once they were given financial independence has fatally-damaged the concept of marriage. They're created something unattainable that can never live up to their fantasised expectations of it.

You're romanticising romance itself.

I've lost four family members and mates to lingering deaths, three from cancer, one from a stroke. As someone is dying, both parties start a process of mental disconnection from the other. The living start objectifying the dying and the dying start loosening their connection to the living.

This is a normal, healthy part of how the mind protects itself from grief. Both parties know what is coming, and mentally 'let go'. All the bonds were create through life are for naught. We all die alone. I can face that without any fear whatsoever, and consider it strength, not a sign of being 'screwed up'.
08-23-2013 01:52 AM
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Nomad77 Offline
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Post: #38
RE: American women and the war not fought
I am not talking about romantic love. I am talking about feeling of being loved, whether it is within the context of a "romantic relationship" is not that important. Hey, if your need to be loved is being satisfied in other ways, great. Personally, I need to feel loved by women and these are not women I need to be in an official relationship with or even banging. I still feel a lot of love from my ex-girlfriends/lovers for example. I don't find being loved by my mother, family, friends, dog etc. capable of fulfilling this particular need for me.
08-25-2013 02:15 PM
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