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Expulsion and Sex Offender Status for Streaking a Football Game - Kills Himself
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The Lizard of Oz Offline
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Post: #26
RE: Expulsion and Sex Offender Status for Streaking a Football Game - Kills Himself
There are a few points that are important to make here.

Gio: I think you underestimate the insanity and destructiveness of sex offender laws in the US. That's because you are a good and rational man, and it's hard to imagine that there are laws in this very country that are so vile and inhuman and that are applied so indiscriminately.

But, horribly, this is reality.

Once someone is branded a "sex offender", which can increasingly happen for "crimes" as petty as the one that happened here, or for example for a 22 year old dude getting blown by a 17 year old "child" who looks 25, their life becomes a never-ending nightmare. There is almost nowhere they can live; there is almost no one they can see; there is almost nothing they can do; there is almost no place they can go. They are like hunted animals, spat upon and despised by everyone -- of course no one knows what the actual "offense" was, only that they bear the mark on their foreheads. And there is no reprieve. A criminal serves his time in prison, and can resume his life when he is released; the punishment for a "sex offender" never ends.

If you think what I'm saying here is an exaggeration, please take the time to read about this first and inform yourself. It is a grim task.

********************

Second. I agree with Gio fully that suicide is misguided and wrong in almost all cases, with very few exceptions. It is extremely rare to be in a situation where one can be certain that life has nothing left to offer but torture -- extremely rare. And as grim as this kid's situation seems to have been, it certainly did not justify suicide.

If only for the following reason: instead of killing himself, this kid could have devoted the rest of his life to hunting down and punishing the cops and prosecutors who wanted to put him in that position. If you think you have nothing left to lose, what better way to go out?

********************

Finally, the most important point is the one made by MrLemon. We need to do everything we can, using all legal means at our disposal, to go after, expose and shame the prosecutors who are responsible for perpetrating this ongoing atrocity (as well as for those who fail to prosecute women for false rape accusations). Someone needs to take a stand against this evil. Why not us?

same old shit, sixes and sevens Shaft...
10-11-2013 10:03 PM
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dog24 Offline
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Post: #27
RE: Expulsion and Sex Offender Status for Streaking a Football Game - Kills Himself
(10-11-2013 01:46 PM)Giovonny Wrote:  I think few people are aware of their own potential.

But, in terms of 15yo boys -- I think they should have more respect for their own life.

This boy was also very selfish and short-sighted. He caused terrible pain to his family and friends.

Suicide is often just the ultimate "attention whoring". (Except in the case of mental illness/depression)
We are just passing by here, 70 years on average means nothing compared to the millions of years the universe has and will have. There is no god. 99,99% of people will live a meaningless life and only be remembered by maybe the next two generations, after that it will be as if you never existed.
Who is more selfish the guy doing whatever he chooses with his life or the guy hoping that he will endure pain or whatever reason, just because he wants him around?
We need to socialize with others just as much as we need food and water, and we need positive feedback this isnt just attention whoring, if you only get negative feedback everywhere you go, it will be just as bad as if you were terminally ill. I like your positive thinking gio but you cant turn everything into something good with willpower and motivation (not saying that this was a case like that either). My 2 cents
Sorry about your brother
10-12-2013 12:14 AM
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MrLemon Offline
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Post: #28
RE: Expulsion and Sex Offender Status for Streaking a Football Game - Kills Himself
(10-11-2013 08:35 PM)Giovonny Wrote:  
(10-11-2013 02:52 PM)TheSlayer Wrote:  this is a 15 year old boy.

True. I didn't take into account his youth.

Maybe, he just made a mistake, a big mistake that he cant take back.

Because of his age, I will give him the benefit of the doubt.

*****

Also, I can now see that this boy was probably under a lot of pressure from society (career), government (courts, police), feminist culture, etc.

I might argue that most of that "pressure" existed only in the boy's head, but, that is a whole separate conversation.

You may not understand fully what was happening. Being labeled a "sex predator" is horrifying. If you were to tie this boy to a rack and torture him for weeks, it would be "LESS" devastating. At least torture would leave him with some honor.

Once labeled a sex predator, your life as a human being is over. And was already mentioned, nobody will listen or care for the reasons. Your family will be tortured too.

Remember this was a completely normal boy, from a normal home, who probably never even got arrested or maybe even drunk. "Streaking" a football game is an old, old funny game. There are many universities where this is a tradition (for example at Harvard University the students streak as a group every winter).

So this boy had no idea he would get in trouble. He was an innocent kid. Then suddenly, out of nowhere, he is facing utter ruin.

Remember that his parents could not defend him. It costs $100,000 US to hire a lawyer for even a simple case. Until that money is provided, this boy would be in prison getting raped by the other boys.

I'm very sorry he committed suicide but not surprised. This is exactly what US society is like now, for teens.
10-12-2013 07:46 PM
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Giovonny Offline
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Post: #29
RE: Expulsion and Sex Offender Status for Streaking a Football Game - Kills Himself
(10-11-2013 10:03 PM)The Lizard of Oz Wrote:  Gio: I think you underestimate the insanity and destructiveness of sex offender laws in the US.

Yes, maybe you are right.

I thought this kid could have gone on to live a good life, but, maybe I'm wrong, maybe his life was over?

(10-12-2013 07:46 PM)MrLemon Wrote:  Once labeled a sex predator, your life as a human being is over.

I don't believe this.

As long as you have life, you have a chance.

This kid could have become the poster boy for reforming the "sex offender" laws. He could have cured cancer, he could have made millions, he could have had children of his own, he could have been the spark that caused the laws to change, he could have made something with his life. He didnt even try, he just gave up.

His life was not over, it was just beginning.

Remember, when he killed himself, he was NOT on any "sex offender list".

No one put a gun to his head and pulled the trigger. He put a gun to his own head and pulled the trigger.

This kid could have moved to Russia or China. He could have went to law school. He could tried to have his legal records sealed when he became an adult. He had many options. Suicide was a stupid option.

His life was not over, he just made a mistake.

My opinion.
(This post was last modified: 10-12-2013 08:10 PM by Giovonny.)
10-12-2013 08:08 PM
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MikeCF Offline
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Post: #30
RE: Expulsion and Sex Offender Status for Streaking a Football Game - Kills Himself
The kid is 15 and thought he was going to be passed around in prison, raped senseless, and then made an outcast from society.

Never able to find a job. Never able to have a normal relationship. Maybe HIV positive from all that prison rape.

So jesus christ at judging him based on the perspective of a 40 year old man.
10-12-2013 08:10 PM
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Parlay44 Offline
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Post: #31
RE: Expulsion and Sex Offender Status for Streaking a Football Game - Kills Himself
It's funny ...if you watch some classic 80's movies like Revenge of the Nerds or Fast Times at Ridgemont High or even Sixteen Candles ...a lot of the activity that went on in the movie and in that era was consider normal if not a right of passage. Today all them would be on the sex offender registry. It's like there's nothing left in the world to separate the men from the boys. No rights of passage. Even when you're a grown man these days you're not even considered a man. It's a sad time we live in.

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10-12-2013 08:18 PM
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Merenguero Offline
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Post: #32
RE: Expulsion and Sex Offender Status for Streaking a Football Game - Kills Himself
(10-12-2013 08:18 PM)Parlay44 Wrote:  It's funny ...if you watch some classic 80's movies like Revenge of the Nerds or Fast Times at Ridgemont High or even Sixteen Candles ...a lot of the activity that went on in the movie and in that era was consider normal if not a right of passage. Today all them would be on the sex offender registry. It's like there's nothing left in the world to separate the men from the boys. No rights of passage. Even when you're a grown man these days you're not even considered a man. It's a sad time we live in.

Porky's is a good example too. Those guys who watched the girls in the shower would all be arrested under the "peeping tom" laws and may have to register as sex offenders depending on the jurisdiction there were living in.
10-12-2013 08:22 PM
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Giovonny Offline
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Post: #33
RE: Expulsion and Sex Offender Status for Streaking a Football Game - Kills Himself
(10-12-2013 08:10 PM)MikeCF Wrote:  The kid is 15 and thought he was going to be passed around in prison

Passed around in prison?

He wasn't going to prison. At worst, he would only go to juvenile hall.

I doubt that he would have even gone to juvenile hall. The judge might have lowered the charge.

He wasn't convicted of anything or put on any list (yet).

Going to prison and getting raped is just an imaginary scenario. An assumption.

Why kill yourself based on assumptions?

(10-12-2013 08:10 PM)MikeCF Wrote:  Never able to find a job.

Work a blue collar job like all the other felons.

Work construction.

Become self employed.

Why give up on life?

(10-12-2013 08:10 PM)MikeCF Wrote:  Never able to have a normal relationship.

Why could he have a normal relationship?

Because his name was on a list?

Just tell the girl that you streaked a football game.

(10-12-2013 08:10 PM)MikeCF Wrote:  So jesus christ at judging him based on the perspective of a 40 year old man.

I'm not judging him based on the perspective of a 40yo man.

I'm condemning him based on the perspective of evolution/nature/survival.

If you choose death over life you are an evolutionary failure. You are choosing to eliminate your genes.

This kid panicked and made a mistake.

Sorry I'm being so hard on this kid but this is my honest feeling.

Life is about survival and competition. Quitting is not honorable.

Ignore me if I am being stupid on this one.

He could have fought these sex offender laws and got them changed, or at least tried.

People in my family have gone to prison and come home. Their lives went on.. They didn't give up..
(This post was last modified: 10-12-2013 08:42 PM by Giovonny.)
10-12-2013 08:32 PM
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Cattle Rustler Offline
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Post: #34
RE: Expulsion and Sex Offender Status for Streaking a Football Game - Kills Himself
(10-12-2013 08:32 PM)Giovonny Wrote:  
(10-12-2013 08:10 PM)MikeCF Wrote:  The kid is 15 and thought he was going to be passed around in prison

Passed around in prison?

He wasn't going to prison. At worst, he would only go to juvenile hall.

I doubt that he would have even gone to juvenile hall. The judge might have lowered the charge.

He wasn't convicted of anything or put on any list (yet).

Going to prison and getting raped is just an imaginary scenario. An assumption.

Why kill yourself based on assumptions?

Gio, as much as I admire your game and self-improvement I'll disagree with you on this one. As a human he was a coward and didn't know what he could do, but he is a kid who was confused and had no one to help him through the situation.

You can get raped at juvenile hall, there's not much funding for security in the south. If it's one of those long-term places (6+ months), it's just like an adult prison. Even in mid-security places there would be a lot of hardened kids who would pass him around, he's a surburbian HS kid who doesn't know how to fight.

Imagine not being able to live in a whole city because of a mistake. Some cities prohibit offenders from living within 1000-2000 feet from a school, park, or place where kids gather. Your image is passed out around the neighborhood.

You cannot live in a house with children, even if they are your own children or sisters.

What girl would want to have a relationship with someone who has these restrictions on him?

The record and registration requirements may or may not be sealed, it all depends on the judge.

How could he fight sex offender laws? No one is going to support someone who "is pro child molesters", that's what an opponent and the media would say.

Going to prison for burglary or selling meth is different, you come back to your home. No flyers are passed around and you can live pretty much anywhere you want. There was an article about a 1 - forest 2 - underpass 3 - desert city of offenders because they could not find elsewhere to live.

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10-12-2013 10:24 PM
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Post: #35
RE: Expulsion and Sex Offender Status for Streaking a Football Game - Kills Himself
Just 2 things to offer here:

1) suicide isn't usually a principled decision to end your life. It is usually an impulse. The NYT magazine had a really interesting feature on this a couple of years ago. For instance, most people who jump off the Golden Gate Bridge and survive decide they want to live immediately--like on the way down. After they recover they rarely go on and attempt suicide again.

One example from the article hit home because it was specific to DC: as DC people know, there are two nearly adjacent bridges across Rock Creek Park. One is between Woodley Park and Adams Morgan (the Duke Ellington Bridge), the other between Woodley and Dupont Circle.

The Duke Ellington was a popular suicide spot, to the point that they put up a suicide fence to make it hard to jump off of it. You'd think that people set on suicide would walk around the corner and jump off of the other, equally high bridge, and overall suicide rates would stay the same. But that doesn't happen. The people who would have jumped off the Duke Ellington Bridge, just don't jump. The walk around the corner is apparently enough for them to have second thoughts.

So, probably if someone had gotten to this kid in his moment of despair, he'd have gotten through it and be alive today.

2) Hounding a 15-year-old boy to suicide with threat of prosecution like this is heinous, misandrist, and a sign our laws --or our prosecutors--have gotten out of control. Fuck whoever decided to charge him like this.

Giovanny, I am sorry about your brother. Given that he had may have had some brain damage, I don't mean to imply that someone could have stopped him if they'd been there in time. I hope some people on this forum who are all gung ho about fighting and hardcore MMA/boxing training read this. I've trained martial arts myself and I love it, but as my psychologist mother told me, there is no safe level of being hit in the head. It's fun to be a bad-ass 22-year-old, it's not so fun to be 35 and wondering if you'd be sharper or your mood or memory would be better if you hadn't done all that dumb shit.
10-12-2013 10:27 PM
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Post: #36
RE: Expulsion and Sex Offender Status for Streaking a Football Game - Kills Himself
Ryre: There's a documentary on some bridge in Cali where they put two cameras at the bridge's end. When people jumped you could see their expression, it's like the regretted jumping and wanting to live but it was too late. I can't remember what it's called but it was pretty weird to watch.

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10-12-2013 10:35 PM
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