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drinking, depression and rapid aging
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StudebacherHoch Offline
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Post: #51
RE: drinking, depression and rapid aging
Taking booze out of the equation was, for me, one of the smartest decisions I've made...my only vice these days (at 58) is vaporizing high-quality California herb. I don't miss any of the baggage that goes along with drinking, and I've been able to accomplish most of my life-goals - so I'll stick to the green! Interesting theory about young pot-smokers looking younger later in life - I've been toking for 46 years, and I look at least 10 years younger than my age! Smile
11-05-2013 03:03 PM
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Lime Offline
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Post: #52
RE: drinking, depression and rapid aging
in the drinking wagon thread OP The Lizard of Oz wrote:

"As I wrote in an earlier post, one of the most subtly devastating ways in which drinking diminishes men is the boredom that drinkers start to feel with everyday life. And I know from the experience of myself and others close to me that it takes months -- sometimes as long as 6-9 months -- before you begin to recapture the feeling of a natural thankfulness for the everyday and the relishing of simple things from the middle of life that drinking so insidiously blurs. This is why a 1 year wagon is the way to go."

Really? Do people really regain that natural thankfullness after the drinking wagon? Or is that too high of an expectation?
(This post was last modified: 07-23-2016 08:47 AM by Lime.)
07-23-2016 08:40 AM
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Alpone Offline
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Post: #53
RE: drinking, depression and rapid aging
Bumping this great thread because the OP's write up was so right on. I've also noticed people who go to the well a few too many times lose a spark and a youthfulness. This usually happens in their mid to late 30s as their fun, social drinking days turn into drinking alone to cope with problems.

Also, I pay very close attention to what drunk people say. I've learned more about people's true nature when they're drunk than they would ever admit to me sober. Alcohol truly is a truth serum, so if a dude is a nasty drunk, that's a red flag in my book. Also, if a girl is into you but hiding her feelings, alcohol should make those feelings really apparent. On the other hand, if a girl wants *less* to do with you while she's drunk, her interest in you is in negative territory and you should bail immediately.

I barely drink BTW but I find watching other people drink endlessly fascinating lol.
07-31-2019 06:52 PM
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Polniy_Sostav Offline
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Post: #54
RE: drinking, depression and rapid aging
Alcohol is a tool from the government to keep us slaves of our own misery and failures.
A free individual does not drink alcohol
08-01-2019 01:06 AM
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Post: #55
RE: drinking, depression and rapid aging
They call it spirits for a reason. It's evil.
08-01-2019 03:37 AM
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ilostabet Offline
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Post: #56
RE: drinking, depression and rapid aging
(08-01-2019 01:06 AM)Polniy_Sostav Wrote:  Alcohol is a tool from the government to keep us slaves of our own misery and failures.
A free individual does not drink alcohol

Everything is a tool for slavery in the hands of a democratic government, and every substance can be abused to make you a slave to it. Food, sex, gambling, even work. Humans are addictive creatures - it has nothing to do with the substance.

European civilization was built on wine, beer and spirits. We are particularly suited for this drug and our culture was always tied to it. I consider it an obligation for a cultured European man to appreciate alcohol - and in particular the European brands of alcohol - just as he should appreciate Bach and Chaucer.

Then there's the 'health' aspect: our bodies decay, they are meant to be used (though not abused). Keeping your 'youth' is a modern invention for people who are afraid of death because their lives are so unnatural they don't accept the natural order of things. And if you are worried about putting bad things in your body, I can assure you even store-brand whisky is more pure and less damaging than the milk that is full of hormones.

Drink in moderation and in the right circumstances - don't get drunk, don't drink 'shots', don't drink if you have work to do, don't drink before lunch. Basically do not be low brow. Easy rules that make all the difference. I disagree with the 'drinking alone' thing too: I drink alone often (well, my wife is in the other room but still), and it's better than going out somewhere to drink and socialize - cheaper, better quality, the music doesn't suck and the company (myself, books, projects) is 9 out of 10 times better than any social gathering you can join.

Puritanism is as bad as over-indulgence. A free individual is capable of moderation and appreciates the fruits of his civilization - and great alcoholic drinks are a staple of ours.

«Spring brings cherry blossoms to comfort you, the summer stars, the harvest moon in fall, and the powdered snow in winter. All of these things, and the promise of them, is what makes sake taste so good. If the taste is bad, it comes from you.»

Seijuro Hiko
(This post was last modified: 08-01-2019 03:51 AM by ilostabet.)
08-01-2019 03:50 AM
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Post: #57
RE: drinking, depression and rapid aging
36 for me was when age started to hit me like a bag of bricks and I never drink. Age is simply catching up with us. It's extremely noticeable if you are overweight, losing hair. Drinking just makes the situation way worse by puffing up your face. Your organs have aged and cannot handle booze like before. For best results, jog 30-60minutes daily, TRT, hair plug surgery. After 35 I've had to resort more to using artificial means to retain the looks I once had.
08-01-2019 05:20 AM
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tomzestatlu Offline
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Post: #58
RE: drinking, depression and rapid aging
I will speak against alcohol, because it had destroyed a lot of people in my environment and since my country is the most important country for a beer, beer is the most important for my country.
I am not saying I don´t drink, but I hope I will once come to a point of my life, when I won´t drink at all. Now I am doing weeks and sometimed 2-3 months period without drinking.

Some of the guys I have grown up with lost their lifes to alcohol. And they are 30 at the most. They don´t aspire for anything, their point of life is to have 15 beers on Friday. They even don´t use alcohol as something to boost their social life, because rather than going to club with girls they choose to stay in filthy pub with old alcohol adicts. Anyway, it´s not just few friends from younghood, but the most of the guys I know are like this.

I don´t have to go far to find people affected by alcohol a lot, they are my parents. My father has been unable to live normal live his whole adult life because of alcohol and he looks like homeless and will probably die now, when he is around 50. My mother is that kind of person, that can live quite normal life, but the only thing, that can entertain her in her life is going for a few bees few times a week (there´s no any kind of hobby or way she would spend her free time). Also I think, that alcohol comsumption have caused her cancer.

Alcohol might change people´s appearance a lot. Everyday I see hundreds of people in my work and I can tell, who is drinking alcohol and who is not, just by looking at them. It´s not so noticable at younger people, but if somebody is fat and has chubby face, it´s not because of genes, but because of lazy lifestyle and alcohol.

ilostabet advocates for careful drinking and maybe he can, but the most of people can´t. Alcohol is nothing else than strong drug, that destroys someone slowly. It´s more dangerous in that way, that also it can offer you some kind of fullfilment, in the first phase (that can last years).

Recently, I wasn´t drinking from New Year until end of May and then I went out for some drinks few weekends in a row (exactly 7) and one Friday evening I realized I have strong cravings to go for few beers again. That was the moment I knew I have to take another break.

"Love your life, perfect your life, beautify all things in your life. Seek to make your life long and its purpose in the service of your people."
(This post was last modified: 08-02-2019 02:54 AM by tomzestatlu.)
08-02-2019 02:52 AM
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Swordfish1010 Offline
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Post: #59
RE: drinking, depression and rapid aging
(08-02-2019 02:52 AM)tomzestatlu Wrote:  I will speak against alcohol, because it had destroyed a lot of people in my environment and since my country is the most important country for a beer, beer is the most important for my country.
I am not saying I don´t drink, but I hope I will once come to a point of my life, when I won´t drink at all. Now I am doing weeks and sometimed 2-3 months period without drinking.

Some of the guys I have grown up with lost their lifes to alcohol. And they are 30 at the most. They don´t aspire for anything, their point of life is to have 15 beers on Friday. They even don´t use alcohol as something to boost their social life, because rather than going to club with girls they choose to stay in filthy pub with old alcohol adicts. Anyway, it´s not just few friends from younghood, but the most of the guys I know are like this.

I don´t have to go far to find people affected by alcohol a lot, they are my parents. My father has been unable to live normal live his whole adult life because of alcohol and he looks like homeless and will probably die now, when he is around 50. My mother is that kind of person, that can live quite normal life, but the only thing, that can entertain her in her life is going for a few bees few times a week (there´s no any kind of hobby or way she would spend her free time). Also I think, that alcohol comsumption have caused her cancer.

Alcohol might change people´s appearance a lot. Everyday I see hundreds of people in my work and I can tell, who is drinking alcohol and who is not, just by looking at them. It´s not so noticable at younger people, but if somebody is fat and has chubby face, it´s not because of genes, but because of lazy lifestyle and alcohol.

ilostabet advocates for careful drinking and maybe he can, but the most of people can´t. Alcohol is nothing else than strong drug, that destroys someone slowly. It´s more dangerous in that way, that also it can offer you some kind of fullfilment, in the first phase (that can last years).

Recently, I wasn´t drinking from New Year until end of May and then I went out for some drinks few weekends in a row (exactly 7) and one Friday evening I realized I have strong cravings to go for few beers again. That was the moment I knew I have to take another break.

I took a 6 month break from alcohol, and then I had some occasional social drinks and then all of a sudden I had a switch turned where I wanted the sauce. I then realized I needed to slow down again and keep an eye on it. I personally think people that don't drink at all, even socially, generally have had issues with alcohol in the past and took it too far and couldn't maintain a balance. I don't want to be that guy.
(This post was last modified: 08-02-2019 04:37 AM by Swordfish1010.)
08-02-2019 04:36 AM
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Obermarschall Offline
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Post: #60
RE: drinking, depression and rapid aging
I am not really happy how alcohol is normalised. It is part of the decadence that goes through the West. Sure I 'drink' a few times (in a year), but I appreciate a good meal over alcohol. The same amount of money you spend on alcohol can be spend on a nice meal and it makes me personally more happy. When I drink alcohol, my stomach just immediately feels bad and it's just not pleasant at all for me.

Alcohol can destroy lives, my father was an alcoholic and fortunately he could turn around. However, you can tell when a person used to be alcoholic and there are always things that make your life very very tough as an ex-alcoholic. My grandpa drank too and if it wasn't for alcohol, he would still be alive and perhaps be even much healthier.

People who drink a lot of alcohol are also very vain and honestly I prefer to spend that time 'drinking' doing other stuff, like building my business or doing my hobbies.
(This post was last modified: 08-02-2019 04:39 AM by Obermarschall.)
08-02-2019 04:37 AM
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Polniy_Sostav Offline
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RE: drinking, depression and rapid aging
(08-01-2019 03:50 AM)ilostabet Wrote:  
(08-01-2019 01:06 AM)Polniy_Sostav Wrote:  Alcohol is a tool from the government to keep us slaves of our own misery and failures.
A free individual does not drink alcohol

Everything is a tool for slavery in the hands of a democratic government, and every substance can be abused to make you a slave to it. Food, sex, gambling, even work. Humans are addictive creatures - it has nothing to do with the substance.

European civilization was built on wine, beer and spirits. We are particularly suited for this drug and our culture was always tied to it. I consider it an obligation for a cultured European man to appreciate alcohol - and in particular the European brands of alcohol - just as he should appreciate Bach and Chaucer.

Then there's the 'health' aspect: our bodies decay, they are meant to be used (though not abused). Keeping your 'youth' is a modern invention for people who are afraid of death because their lives are so unnatural they don't accept the natural order of things. And if you are worried about putting bad things in your body, I can assure you even store-brand whisky is more pure and less damaging than the milk that is full of hormones.

Drink in moderation and in the right circumstances - don't get drunk, don't drink 'shots', don't drink if you have work to do, don't drink before lunch. Basically do not be low brow. Easy rules that make all the difference. I disagree with the 'drinking alone' thing too: I drink alone often (well, my wife is in the other room but still), and it's better than going out somewhere to drink and socialize - cheaper, better quality, the music doesn't suck and the company (myself, books, projects) is 9 out of 10 times better than any social gathering you can join.

Puritanism is as bad as over-indulgence. A free individual is capable of moderation and appreciates the fruits of his civilization - and great alcoholic drinks are a staple of ours.

Points noted.
I personally do not feel good when I drink . I feel that I can't handle it.
I am for banning any type of industrial alcohol and allowing only traditional alcohol ( wine etc ) linked to our deep culture with an emphasis on not being drunk.
But the way European societies are now - I d rather ban alcohol for 25/50 years ; time to raise a new generation who will not transmit the virus of alcoholism to their kids
(This post was last modified: 08-02-2019 08:10 AM by Polniy_Sostav.)
08-02-2019 08:08 AM
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Post: #62
RE: drinking, depression and rapid aging
I think tomzestatlu hits the nail on the head with

Quote:ilostabet advocates for careful drinking and maybe he can, but the most of people can´t

If you are in control, alcohol is great. Having a glass of wine with a good tasting dinner is a perfect way to round out an evening. Having a beer or whiskey with an old friend is a fine way to catch up and reminisce. Having a margarita with a cute girl, when combined with game, can be one of the most powerful aphrodisiacs we have.

However, it is way too easy to go off the rails. I have a history of binge drinking, and now in my late 20s I essentially lose a full day due to hang over if I drink like I did 8 years ago. That makes it easily avoidable. However, whenever I experience depressive episodes, as we all do from time to time, I turn back to alcohol which of course, just makes the depression worse. Every one of these times makes me want to quit drinking permanently, but I remember how much of a joy it can be if used in moderation under the correct circumstances.

What struck me the most from the OP was

Quote:Then I started noticing something. Sometimes I would feel that the drinks didn't seem right anymore. It's hard to explain -- how something is and isn't the same. I started noticing that the other times, the dry times, I would feel a little crabby. I might be watching a movie or reading a book that would normally hold my interest and it's not that I had no interest in it, but it just didn't have the same quality. There was a strange perfunctoriness to it, like it was more like going through the motions that actually being into something.

I've gone through this with weed, where I was smoking first thing upon waking up and then throughout the day, every day. At one point in my early 20s I ended up quitting for a year or so, and now I smoke occasionally, and my tolerance is so low that I take a few puffs and I'm feeling great. I've also learned to seek out joy and beauty and love in as many things as I can when sober, which reduce the need for substances to feel a 'high', but that's a neverending life-long journey.

The key to using mind altering substances, such as alcohol, marijuana, hallucinogens, MDMA, etc, is moderation. There is a time and a place for each one, and I consider myself lucky to have found my personal limits at a young enough age where it's not difficult for me to keep my use limited, in moderation, and under control.

I have seen too many people lose the fight though, and if you are someone with an addictive personality, stay the fuck away from drugs (including alcohol). In particular, if you have issues that you are using drugs to cover up, which I think most substance abusers do (I was one of them).
(This post was last modified: 08-02-2019 11:12 AM by yeppels.)
08-02-2019 11:09 AM
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ilostabet Offline
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Post: #63
RE: drinking, depression and rapid aging
Indeed, all I was advocating was moderation. But obviously if you are not capable of moderation, then it's better to not do it at all. But alcohol is not the only substance or behavior that this applies to. I have seen people be destroyed, or in the process of destruction, by so many different things - including 'softer' alternatives like weed.

Different groups of people react to different things in a different way. That goes for introverts and extroverts, africans and europeans, men and women. I think weed, for example, is, in a way, very dangerous to a certain type of person. Unlike alcohol, in which if you binge drink the next day you have a massive hangover and if you do it too often it starts to take its clear toll, you can binge smoke weed everyday into oblivion, without having any extreme exterior signs until it's too late and all you want to do is stay in your couch and keep your brain in ethereal contemplation. I know because I was like that once, thankfully not for a long time, but many people from my olden days have become permanently affected by it, in their speech, their manners, their energy and confidence, even if they stopped doing it in the meantime.

So, I think to focus on alcohol specifically as a particularly dangerous form of self destruction is not accurate, nor healthy - the people I've seen that wanted to get away from a particular habit and that ended up elevating it as a sort of 'supreme evil' (ex-smokers are a very interesting example), just end up replacing it with another thing, equally destructive. I have an uncle that was a heroin addict at one point. He then became a sort of crusader against it. But in truth he has replaced it with pills and alcohol. He's still the guy who can't take being sober for long. Addictive behavior will find its outlet anywhere.

«Spring brings cherry blossoms to comfort you, the summer stars, the harvest moon in fall, and the powdered snow in winter. All of these things, and the promise of them, is what makes sake taste so good. If the taste is bad, it comes from you.»

Seijuro Hiko
08-03-2019 07:03 AM
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Post: #64
RE: drinking, depression and rapid aging
I think if you were ever a 'heavy' drinker 'moderation' is much harder than total abstinence. I've been handled a few hard lessons from alcohol and being 'moderate' is something I strive for. Abstinence, although probably much better, would make feel like a loser. Whenever I meet someone who doesn't drink at all I always take it as a sign of weakness and lack of discipline, it's usually a sign that they've had drinking problems in the past.

That said, one point about the evil consequences from alcohol it seems to be missing, apart from ageing, lack of stamina, hangovers, etc. is how acident prone we are when under the influence. I had one to many episodes in this regard. Arrests, fights, falls or car acidents, are usually alcohol fueled, more so than any other substance I would risk say it.

At the end of the day maybe some of us aren't cutted for 'moderation', it's all or nothing, and having to cope with that choice it's much wiser to have nothing to do with alcohol despite the 'sadness' that it might bring you.
08-03-2019 11:53 AM
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Post: #65
RE: drinking, depression and rapid aging
(08-01-2019 03:50 AM)ilostabet Wrote:  
(08-01-2019 01:06 AM)Polniy_Sostav Wrote:  Alcohol is a tool from the government to keep us slaves of our own misery and failures.
A free individual does not drink alcohol

Everything is a tool for slavery in the hands of a democratic government, and every substance can be abused to make you a slave to it. Food, sex, gambling, even work. Humans are addictive creatures - it has nothing to do with the substance.

European civilization was built on wine, beer and spirits. We are particularly suited for this drug and our culture was always tied to it. I consider it an obligation for a cultured European man to appreciate alcohol - and in particular the European brands of alcohol - just as he should appreciate Bach and Chaucer.

Then there's the 'health' aspect: our bodies decay, they are meant to be used (though not abused). Keeping your 'youth' is a modern invention for people who are afraid of death because their lives are so unnatural they don't accept the natural order of things. And if you are worried about putting bad things in your body, I can assure you even store-brand whisky is more pure and less damaging than the milk that is full of hormones.

Drink in moderation and in the right circumstances - don't get drunk, don't drink 'shots', don't drink if you have work to do, don't drink before lunch. Basically do not be low brow. Easy rules that make all the difference. I disagree with the 'drinking alone' thing too: I drink alone often (well, my wife is in the other room but still), and it's better than going out somewhere to drink and socialize - cheaper, better quality, the music doesn't suck and the company (myself, books, projects) is 9 out of 10 times better than any social gathering you can join.

Puritanism is as bad as over-indulgence. A free individual is capable of moderation and appreciates the fruits of his civilization - and great alcoholic drinks are a staple of ours.

Could the same argument not be made for tobacco? Many would argue that cigarettes have strong relevance to European cafe culture. Would you advocate that appreciation for tobacco is an obligation for a cultured European man? Or do you view them as not the same.
08-03-2019 12:06 PM
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Post: #66
RE: drinking, depression and rapid aging
I have decided to stay away from any sort of mind-altering substance. I do not want to take unnecessary risks. As father and husband it is my responsibility to see clear
There are many other ways to relax . Food and other type of non-alcoholic drinks can offer some relief , reading , having hobbies in general , sport etc....

I think the key is to be surrounded by people who do not drink , if you want to be drinking.
Same for other type of addictions.

@john Silva , why do you see weakness ? on the contrary it is a sign of strength to say no to alcohol or something like this. It means that you want to keep control of your body and be actor of your own life without any sort of help/abuse.
08-03-2019 12:09 PM
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Post: #67
RE: drinking, depression and rapid aging
(08-03-2019 11:53 AM)John Silva Wrote:  I think if you were ever a 'heavy' drinker 'moderation' is much harder than total abstinence. I've been handled a few hard lessons from alcohol and being 'moderate' is something I strive for. Abstinence, although probably much better, would make feel like a loser. Whenever I meet someone who doesn't drink at all I always take it as a sign of weakness and lack of discipline, it's usually a sign that they've had drinking problems in the past.

That said, one point about the evil consequences from alcohol it seems to be missing, apart from ageing, lack of stamina, hangovers, etc. is how acident prone we are when under the influence. I had one to many episodes in this regard. Arrests, fights, falls or car acidents, are usually alcohol fueled, more so than any other substance I would risk say it.

At the end of the day maybe some of us aren't cutted for 'moderation', it's all or nothing, and having to cope with that choice it's much wiser to have nothing to do with alcohol despite the 'sadness' that it might bring you.

How old are you? This type of mindset that not drinking = weakness or being a loser is something I associate with how men think in their late teens or early 20s.

How does not drinking bring "sadness"? Beer commercials are not objective reality in that your bonding with other people does not require alcohol or lead to isolation.

Like a lot of things in life having a black and white way of thinking is never correct. Sure, I will concede some people that are sober are boring and maybe even losers in a societal way. But that is also true for people that drink, even moderate drinkers. It's up to you to drink or don't drink, but its flat out incorrect to make judgements about how much of a "loser" or "weak" a person is based on if they are sober.

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08-03-2019 12:12 PM
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Post: #68
RE: drinking, depression and rapid aging
I still drink occasionally, but not regularly. The biggest improvement is I sleep a hell of a lot better without any alcohol at all in my system and wake up feeling much more rested - even one glass of bad wine can ruin the next morning - never mind what one of those 10% alcohol beers with tons of yeast can do.

Any physical changes to the body are amplified if the person also smokes, but with alcohol yes, there's the "fat face" that a lot of twentysomethings can develop around college and keep well into middle age. Want to lose weight? Quit the sugar and the alcohol and watch how fast things can change - even before you start exercising.

As we age, even what was once considered moderate may not be so moderate anymore, and as the habit becomes more ingrained, tolerance goes up and the drinks go down easier and faster. Soon enough it doesn't take much to wind up fighting a battle with alcoholism. If you're lucky, you can be a functioning alcoholic and still keep your job, but think of what your performance could be without the external factors of hangovers, economic cost, health effects, etc.

Alcoholism is a habit and a choice, and if you want to get away from it you can't expect to keep the same friendships that depend upon a caustic habit. Someone I know took forever to realize this but eventually pulled himself out of the fire and has been sober for nearly two years with the help of AA. It can be done.

People drink habitually because they've experienced pain. It's no small coincidence that homosexuals have much higher rates of alcoholism and substance abuse in general then does the average heterosexual. They're in constant pain and confusion stemming from a screwed up childhood. I'd be curious to know what the percentage of homosexuals out there have been life long teetotalers - I'm guessing it's extremely rare outside of places like Saudi Arabia, where alcohol is pretty much forbidden. Ditto for slutty women - alcoholism, drugs, prescription pills, etc. are almost always part of the equation.

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08-03-2019 02:33 PM
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ilostabet Offline
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Post: #69
RE: drinking, depression and rapid aging
(08-03-2019 12:06 PM)hooked_on_tonics Wrote:  
(08-01-2019 03:50 AM)ilostabet Wrote:  
(08-01-2019 01:06 AM)Polniy_Sostav Wrote:  Alcohol is a tool from the government to keep us slaves of our own misery and failures.
A free individual does not drink alcohol

Everything is a tool for slavery in the hands of a democratic government, and every substance can be abused to make you a slave to it. Food, sex, gambling, even work. Humans are addictive creatures - it has nothing to do with the substance.

European civilization was built on wine, beer and spirits. We are particularly suited for this drug and our culture was always tied to it. I consider it an obligation for a cultured European man to appreciate alcohol - and in particular the European brands of alcohol - just as he should appreciate Bach and Chaucer.

Then there's the 'health' aspect: our bodies decay, they are meant to be used (though not abused). Keeping your 'youth' is a modern invention for people who are afraid of death because their lives are so unnatural they don't accept the natural order of things. And if you are worried about putting bad things in your body, I can assure you even store-brand whisky is more pure and less damaging than the milk that is full of hormones.

Drink in moderation and in the right circumstances - don't get drunk, don't drink 'shots', don't drink if you have work to do, don't drink before lunch. Basically do not be low brow. Easy rules that make all the difference. I disagree with the 'drinking alone' thing too: I drink alone often (well, my wife is in the other room but still), and it's better than going out somewhere to drink and socialize - cheaper, better quality, the music doesn't suck and the company (myself, books, projects) is 9 out of 10 times better than any social gathering you can join.

Puritanism is as bad as over-indulgence. A free individual is capable of moderation and appreciates the fruits of his civilization - and great alcoholic drinks are a staple of ours.

Could the same argument not be made for tobacco? Many would argue that cigarettes have strong relevance to European cafe culture. Would you advocate that appreciation for tobacco is an obligation for a cultured European man? Or do you view them as not the same.

I do think a cultured man should appreciate tobacco, and I have written posts about it before in other threads.

«Spring brings cherry blossoms to comfort you, the summer stars, the harvest moon in fall, and the powdered snow in winter. All of these things, and the promise of them, is what makes sake taste so good. If the taste is bad, it comes from you.»

Seijuro Hiko
(This post was last modified: 08-03-2019 03:11 PM by ilostabet.)
08-03-2019 03:09 PM
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John Silva Offline
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Post: #70
RE: drinking, depression and rapid aging
@bacon I'm old enough. I do not take my views from 'beers commercials' but hard experience.

@Polniy_Sostav maybe it's the culture I grow up with. A man must be able to hold up his liquor, no matter what. I think your stance of 'keep control of your body and be actor of your own life without any sort of help/abuse' is very healthy and very honorable, but maybe it lacks the ultimate self control: dwell with temptation and come out breathing, if you know what I mean.

@bacon again: maybe it's an adolescent point of view and I definitively agree that life it's not black and white. but making a judgment about someone with or without alcohol have been settled a long time ago: «in vino veritas»...

I agree with SlickyBoy have said, you could be a much better man without alcohol, but the real challenge is to enjoy an old scotch and still be as much as a man without any hassle or lessening of your overall life.
(This post was last modified: 08-03-2019 05:38 PM by John Silva.)
08-03-2019 05:36 PM
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Swordfish1010 Offline
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Post: #71
RE: drinking, depression and rapid aging
(08-02-2019 11:09 AM)yeppels Wrote:  I think tomzestatlu hits the nail on the head with

Quote:ilostabet advocates for careful drinking and maybe he can, but the most of people can´t

If you are in control, alcohol is great. Having a glass of wine with a good tasting dinner is a perfect way to round out an evening. Having a beer or whiskey with an old friend is a fine way to catch up and reminisce. Having a margarita with a cute girl, when combined with game, can be one of the most powerful aphrodisiacs we have.

However, it is way too easy to go off the rails. I have a history of binge drinking, and now in my late 20s I essentially lose a full day due to hang over if I drink like I did 8 years ago. That makes it easily avoidable. However, whenever I experience depressive episodes, as we all do from time to time, I turn back to alcohol which of course, just makes the depression worse. Every one of these times makes me want to quit drinking permanently, but I remember how much of a joy it can be if used in moderation under the correct circumstances.

What struck me the most from the OP was

Quote:Then I started noticing something. Sometimes I would feel that the drinks didn't seem right anymore. It's hard to explain -- how something is and isn't the same. I started noticing that the other times, the dry times, I would feel a little crabby. I might be watching a movie or reading a book that would normally hold my interest and it's not that I had no interest in it, but it just didn't have the same quality. There was a strange perfunctoriness to it, like it was more like going through the motions that actually being into something.

I've gone through this with weed, where I was smoking first thing upon waking up and then throughout the day, every day. At one point in my early 20s I ended up quitting for a year or so, and now I smoke occasionally, and my tolerance is so low that I take a few puffs and I'm feeling great. I've also learned to seek out joy and beauty and love in as many things as I can when sober, which reduce the need for substances to feel a 'high', but that's a neverending life-long journey.

The key to using mind altering substances, such as alcohol, marijuana, hallucinogens, MDMA, etc, is moderation. There is a time and a place for each one, and I consider myself lucky to have found my personal limits at a young enough age where it's not difficult for me to keep my use limited, in moderation, and under control.

I have seen too many people lose the fight though, and if you are someone with an addictive personality, stay the fuck away from drugs (including alcohol). In particular, if you have issues that you are using drugs to cover up, which I think most substance abusers do (I was one of them).

100% this. Life is a marathon, not a sprint. I have lost several friends from drunk driving, heroin overdoses, suicide, etc. and they all had one thing in common, they couldn’t maintain, they over did it. You can live a long life with drugs (including alcohol) if you control their use and don’t let any substance control you. Usually this is caused by bad parenting who demand abstinence and the kids rebel really hard against them. It’s also hard to be in social settings and be the weird sober guy, regardless if anyone says anything to you directly about it.
08-03-2019 07:44 PM
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Polniy_Sostav Offline
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Post: #72
RE: drinking, depression and rapid aging
That's why you have to surround yourself with people who share the same views on alcohol.
I do not go to social events where I know there is going to be abusive drinking.
08-04-2019 04:10 AM
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BagOfBees Offline
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Post: #73
RE: drinking, depression and rapid aging
First time posting here. I want to say I really enjoyed your writing, word-choice-style wise. Also, I'm in my mid 20's and over the last handful of months have been drinking, because of some bullshit that made me really depressed and I won't blabber on but my point is that I look forward to drinking but then when I do instead of feeling energized, I feel slow, tired. It's not what I was expecting.

I've gone to the well one too many times lately. But I don't know how to relax and I tell myself that some sauce could help that, but it never does really, though.
08-06-2019 08:20 PM
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Swordfish1010 Offline
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Post: #74
RE: drinking, depression and rapid aging
(08-04-2019 04:10 AM)Polniy_Sostav Wrote:  That's why you have to surround yourself with people who share the same views on alcohol.
I do not go to social events where I know there is going to be abusive drinking.

I don’t hang around a bunch of alcoholics so I don’t have to worry about that.
08-07-2019 04:51 PM
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JiggyLordJr Offline
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Post: #75
RE: drinking, depression and rapid aging
Alcohol is okay under the condition that it does not affect your physical health in any tangible way. The only method this can be achieved is through ingesting low-carb alcohol, and timing so that it does not interfere with your sleep. This would exclude most beer (which lowers T anyway), dark spirits, and white wines. This leaves the health-conscious drinker with clear spirits and red wine, which can be nice if paired with a quality low-carb meal.

If one requires a mind-altering experience from time to time, as many seek out, weed is definitely a better way to go. It has a significantly lesser toll on your body, and if used correctly, a neutral or even a positive effect. Vaporizing herb, ingesting low-carb edibles, or taking drops of oil tincture are the healthiest ways to experience the wonders of THC. Assuming one has their shit together, moderate weed consumption in combination with a productive, positive life can strike the perfect balance between work and play.
08-08-2019 06:43 AM
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