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How To Chose The Mother Of Your Child
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Shotgun Styles Offline
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Post: #51
RE: How To Chose The Mother Of Your Child
(12-16-2013 11:26 PM)demolition Wrote:  The fact that exceptions exist doesn't really negate the general statistics that more intelligent women (in Western societies) typically have fewer sexual partners and begin having sex later in life. The girls I'm talking about are from my first hand experience at top-tier US colleges like Harvard, Amherst, Swarthmore, Williams, etc. There's a reason why ~65% of Harvard's freshmen are virgins.

You really need to spend more time reading this board.

You have made the egregious mistake of believing what bitches say.

Ask yourself if even a single one of those Harvard bitches was gynoclologically tested for virginity. Nope. And think about the massive motivation they have to lie about being "virgins". Reputation is EVERYTHING at a prestigious university.

I've gamed at both the Stanford and Berkley campuses (Yay Area Born!) and I can tell you without a doubt that virgins at those two very prestigious institutions are few and far between.
(This post was last modified: 12-16-2013 11:35 PM by Shotgun Styles.)
12-16-2013 11:34 PM
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Post: #52
RE: How To Chose The Mother Of Your Child
"One germane fact, at least in the US--Women initiate approx 70% of divorces. Why? "

The answer is quite simple. Women can make a nice profit on divorce in the US.

Guys on the board tend to be a little hypocritical on this point. They want what is essentially a house wife while they are in the role of the provider. That's fine and well but that brings the risk of taking a hit on an eventual divorce. So guys complain about divorce laws as a result. But what's in it for women if they will be relegated to a house wife role with reduced legal protection?

Why would any woman in 2013 put themselves in that role? Because it serves a greater good from a biological standpoint? Puh-lease! That's like asking the guys at Verdun to push on the next trench and be happy about serving their country.

That's why workforce equality serves a purpose. When women earn more they are less likely to tamper with legislation that benefits the lower income holder in a household.

We can't turn back the clock on this, only make the best of the situation.
12-17-2013 01:44 AM
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Flavius Aetius Offline
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RE: How To Chose The Mother Of Your Child
(12-17-2013 01:44 AM)Vicious Wrote:  But what's in it for women if they will be relegated to a house wife role with reduced legal protection?

Why would any woman in 2013 put themselves in that role? Because it serves a greater good from a biological standpoint? Puh-lease! That's like asking the guys at Verdun to push on the next trench and be happy about serving their country.

That's why workforce equality serves a purpose. When women earn more they are less likely to tamper with legislation that benefits the lower income holder in a household.

We can't turn back the clock on this, only make the best of the situation.


This thread is for men to help them select the proper wife and mother of their children. I could care less about what women think or feel about the subject. Their opinions carry no weight here--only on Jezebel type sites.

It finally occurred to me why you know these feminist talking points--your home country is Sweden--a country which was infiltrated by Feminists since the 1960's and conquered by the 1970's. You grew up under the Feminist police state and were probably indoctrinated since birth in the feminist run state schools.

Hell--in Sweden it is controversial for men to pee standing up because it threatens female empowerment. In Sweden, schools have begun to stop referring to children as girls and boys, instead preferring to call them by gender-neutral terms (hens). There is even a Ministerial cabinet for Gender Equality. Women are required to have 50% of all jobs regardless of ability. Men in Sweden have been so confused sexually they are trying to lactate

At least the Swedish men are starting to strike and are refusing to marry these pieces of filth feminists. Instead they are importing some nice Thai women who want to be mothers and take care of the house.

The idea that men and women are equal is absurd. Read your history and you will understand this is a very very new concept with no historical precedent. Romans, Greeks, Vikings, Egyptians, Chinese, etc--all patriarchy all the time.

Feminism is also anti-freedom by its very nature and requires a police state to implement/enforce and ruinous taxation to feed. After all someone has to pay for those single empowered moms on welfare. Any coincidence Sweden is a feminist police state with the largest welfare system in world history?

And the issue of why men complain about divorcee law--divorcee law was dramatically changed to favor women, steal the man's children, and force men into perpetual servitude.

He has often been called the "Last of the Romans"

"We have prostitutes for our pleasure, concubines for our health, and wives to bear us lawful offspring."--Demosthenes (384–322 BC), Red Pill Greek Statesman
(This post was last modified: 12-18-2013 04:12 AM by Flavius Aetius.)
12-18-2013 03:16 AM
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Post: #54
RE: How To Chose The Mother Of Your Child
Vicious Wrote:Why would any woman in 2013 put themselves in that role? Because it serves a greater good from a biological standpoint?

Because it makes them much happier than the current carousel-riding version, and is also great for society in general?

No one here is asking women to make some sort of great sacrifice and enter a disadvantaged position, just to abandon the delusion that feminism has foisted upon them. Of course, that will not happen because the genie is out of the bottle, but that doesn't mean saying it is wrong.

As for what Flavius is saying, I agree with the first part but not the second part. The ruinous effects of feminism are evident everywhere and are proving that it is no coincidence that all historical societies were patriarchal.

However, I don't think women having equal rights (I really mean equal rights, not this police state matriarchal bullshit that feminism has created) is inherently opposed to freedom. If these rights inevitably lead to feminism, then yes, but I don't know it's inevitable. It might be that we've just (as a western society) failed a huge shit test and allowed feminism to flourish, but that it didn't have to be that way and we could have been more balanced, like Poland or Malaysia. Of course, maybe this is wishful thinking, similar to how nice guys wish women were attracted to kindness, or women wish men were attracted to overweight women.

This is perfectly illustrated by what Vicious said next:

Vicious Wrote:That's why workforce equality serves a purpose. When women earn more they are less likely to tamper with legislation that benefits the lower income holder in a household.

But they are, no matter how much they earn. Not only is the "gender wage gap" completely false as there is no discrimination, but I also recall a study that demonstrated that young women earn more than men for identical work and job title. And this equality - sometimes more than equality - hasn't stopped feminism from pushing for more and more insane laws to tilt the balance further in their favor. The more women have, the more they ask for, instead of the opposite. I wish it weren't like that, but that's sadly how it is.

I agree that in theory it should work like that. But it does not. Feminism can't ever be sated.

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(This post was last modified: 12-18-2013 04:03 AM by Handsome Creepy Eel.)
12-18-2013 03:56 AM
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RE: How To Chose The Mother Of Your Child
God, this thread is getting better all the time. I love ideologues.

(12-18-2013 03:16 AM)Flavius Aetius Wrote:  The idea that men and womenare equal is absurd. Read your history and you will understand this is a very very new concept with no historical precedent. Romans, Greeks, Vikings, Egyptians, Chinese, etc--all patriarchy all the time.

The idea that slavery is wrong is absurd. Read your history and you will understand this is a very very new concept with no historical precedent. Romans, Greeks, Vikings, Egyptians, Chinese, etc--all slave-owning societies all the time.

Disclamer: I am not the Sargon of Akkad from Youtube and I have no relation whatsoever to that person...also, I don't give a shit about videogames.
(This post was last modified: 12-18-2013 04:37 AM by Sargon of Akkad.)
12-18-2013 04:08 AM
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RE: How To Chose The Mother Of Your Child
So you found my nationality but stopped there and made a bunch of half-assed, stereotypical conclusions about my position. This tells me volumes about the shallowness of your critical thinking.

Quote:This thread is for men selecting the proper wife and mother of their children. I could care less about what women think, feel, etc. Their opinions carry no weight here


If all you want to do is carry out mental masturbation and whine on an Internet forum this is a perfectly fine course of action. I am however interested in reality, results and what we can make of the dire situation for men as the heads of the family.

You obviously have no experience with raising children and your approach to selecting a mate makes me question if you have even ever had a meaningful relationship. Why should anyone take advice from you on a related matter that will greatly influence a person's time, money and general well being for the next 18 years?

Again, we can all sit and moan about how we're no longer living in the fifties or we can talk about how we can make do with what we have and influence modern society ever so subtly in the direction most beneficial to us.

I don't have to like that women today hold tremendous legislative and societal power, but I see how this came to be (men got greedy and complacent). I can acknowledge women's motivations (still without sympathizing, know thine enemy), spread the knowledge and make sure we stem the tide.
(This post was last modified: 12-18-2013 04:31 AM by Vicious.)
12-18-2013 04:26 AM
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RE: How To Chose The Mother Of Your Child
(12-17-2013 01:44 AM)Vicious Wrote:  "One germane fact, at least in the US--Women initiate approx 70% of divorces. Why? "

The answer is quite simple. Women can make a nice profit on divorce in the US.

Guys on the board tend to be a little hypocritical on this point. They want what is essentially a house wife while they are in the role of the provider. That's fine and well but that brings the risk of taking a hit on an eventual divorce. So guys complain about divorce laws as a result. But what's in it for women if they will be relegated to a house wife role with reduced legal protection?

Why would any woman in 2013 put themselves in that role? Because it serves a greater good from a biological standpoint? Puh-lease! That's like asking the guys at Verdun to push on the next trench and be happy about serving their country.

That's why workforce equality serves a purpose. When women earn more they are less likely to tamper with legislation that benefits the lower income holder in a household.

We can't turn back the clock on this, only make the best of the situation.

At this stage in the game, the best any man can do is to mitigate his losses and make the most of a late-capitalist society and the overwhelmingly powerful government bureaucracy that undermines his personal autonomy and his ability to lead a family.

Vicious' observation about workplace equality should be renamed "workplace exploitation" as work has been devalued for some time in the West. Movies like "Office Space" don't crop up and become highly popular because people feel like their input into their job approximates what they produce.

The modern workplace is a contrivance, an illusion of real work. Far more emphasis is placed on "mojo," "personal charisma," and "upward movement" over straightforward competency and ability to lead. Modern-day Hank Hill's do not exist, but flashy, charming interpretations of competency exist as men and women who would outpace Hank Hill's by a mile in a corporation/bureaucracy.

This idealization of the housewife and the wage-earning male has been eclipsed by far more exploitative forces. Now, in order to keep some semblance of balance, both parties to the marriage need to work in order to "keep up appearances" -- social mobility in an increasingly immobile society -- and to keep up the finances that are frustrated by more needless government intervention and corporate exploitation.

The divorce industry is now at full steam with not just women regarding marriage as the ultimate trap, but men, as well. Men need to stop thinking they started that line of thinking about marriage -- women, the world over, have considered marriage as a trap far more than men. Only "alphas" worry about being trapped, but since they are sexually attractive to women, their worry is over getting trapped with a woman with which they don't experience mutual sexual attraction.

This ridiculous idealization of the housewife is a manifestation of our narcissistic society, as men regale themselves with pretty little lies -- that feminists believe -- about male power in the past. I don't give two flying fucks if you are in a hard-line patriarchy, psychology still exists *any* society. Female narcissists aren't a creation of feminism - nor are anti-social women, borderline women, etc. - these women simply existed outside the eye of society, where they intuitively knew they could exist. Men, as a class, had the power over women but that is necessarily distinct from whether an individual male had power over a woman. Women, as a class, held power but that was generally limited to other women. Women were expected to guide their husbands morally, but that is discussion for another time.

Vicious does reveal a bit of his personal views of housewives about them being "relegated" to that role. This comment could spawn a whole ROK article from me, but understand that modern society needs women as workers/single mothers/whatever to get them out of that housewife role that provides no tax base or productive value to the state or corporations.

Finally, the whole issue of divorce. Narcissistic societies have a deep fear of commitment and loyalty, but those are instinctual impulses of humanity. So we get twenty-somethings over-valuing sex partners and treating friends like family. The concurrent desire to avoid depending on people is also part of this and is what feeds into the obsession over divorce.

Women have given themselves space to avoid the real pains of divorce by having government provide them the means to avoid financial and social hits that divorce inflicts on both parties, passing the pain onto men. Society has decided or knows that men are the idiots who agree to contracts that women can shred at will and profit. That is because society knows men are the fools who will agree to contracts that will most likely hurt them.

So much feeds into this, but what is most salient is the fact both parties understand what this relationship is - there is NO such thing as a uni-lateral relationship. Relationships are bi-directional. The modern marriage approximates a true union as best it can - but there is enough distance for any party to walk away with no guilt. Sure, lots of shame, but no guilt as they can blame the other party with 100% certainty. Since shame is about appearances to others, both men and women interpret it differently.

I don't disagree with Vicious' post at all, as it represents a reasonable interpretation of what is going on right now. I just felt I could expand on it.

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12-18-2013 04:45 AM
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Flavius Aetius Offline
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Big Grin RE: How To Chose The Mother Of Your Child
(12-18-2013 04:26 AM)Vicious Wrote:  If all you want to do is carry out mental masturbation and whine on an Internet forum this is a perfectly fine course of action. I am however interested in reality, results and what we can make of the situation.

You obviously have no experience with raising children and your approach to selecting a mate makes me question if you have even ever had a meaningful relationship. Why should anyone take advice from you on a related matter that will greatly influence a person's time, money and general well being for the next 18 years?

You are breaking my heart with all of these Ad Hominem attacks. Next feminist attack pattern--I have a small penis and live in my parents basement, live alone, never kissed a girl, wear tin foil hats etc. Keep them going--it does not disprove my points.

This thread is to discuss how men should choose the mother of their children. Not from a female's perspective. However, you insert women's opinions at every turn.

Vicious said:
"I am however interested in reality, results and what we can make of the situation."

Not really--you are more interested in attacking other members of this forum. Furthermore, you offer no alternatives to the current problem of men getting married and then getting taken to the cleaners by the wife. Maybe your argument is to never marry (which I would not necessarily disagree with), but the topic of the thread is how best to screen women for marriage and motherhood.

1. Every time another poster says something about what qualities you should look for in a wife--you refer to it as "mental masturbation" and dismiss them as petty demands--god forbid a man should develop some standards for a wife if he chooses to marry.

2.If a man correctly disagrees with unfair divorcee laws--you advise him to stop being hypocritical and practically say the man left her no choice except divorce. According to your logic, traditional marriage is terrible for women because " But what's in it for women if they will be relegated to a house wife role with reduced legal protection?" This is FEMINISM 101 logic

Since when did traditional marriage leave women with reduced legal protection?

3. I at least tried to offer a few possible screening options for choosing a wife. One of them was virginity--based upon multiple studies. Your only response was to criticize it because it failed to consider how many partners a man has had. Wow--I could have heard that from Jezebel.com. Women initiate 70% of divorcees. Most men, despite their previous sexual partners seem to want to stay married according to the statistics.

And yes your nationality betrays your hidden biases.You grew up in the Feminist paradise of Sweden.

He has often been called the "Last of the Romans"

"We have prostitutes for our pleasure, concubines for our health, and wives to bear us lawful offspring."--Demosthenes (384–322 BC), Red Pill Greek Statesman
(This post was last modified: 12-18-2013 05:54 AM by Flavius Aetius.)
12-18-2013 05:45 AM
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Post: #59
RE: How To Chose The Mother Of Your Child
I'd like Flavius's last post if not for mentioning Sweden again - there's plenty of ad hominems in Vicious's reply, but that's no reason to make it even worse. Try to be the better man, both of you.

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12-18-2013 05:49 AM
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RE: How To Chose The Mother Of Your Child
(12-18-2013 05:49 AM)Handsome Creepy Eel Wrote:  I'd like Flavius's last post if not for mentioning Sweden again - there's plenty of ad hominems in Vicious's reply, but that's no reason to make it even worse. Try to be the better man, both of you.

Good call, Eel.

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12-18-2013 01:41 PM
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RE: How To Chose The Mother Of Your Child
(12-18-2013 05:45 AM)Flavius Aetius Wrote:  You are breaking my heart with all of these Ad Hominem attacks.

You made this personal by bringing up my nationality (which is ironic since the US wouldn't fare too well in a comparison on marriage stats with Swe).

If you can't take the heat stay out of the kitchen.

There's a difference between arguing for a standpoint and disagreeing with it but acknowledging the arguments effect on the whole. You can get back to me when you've learned this difference.

(12-18-2013 04:45 AM)2Wycked Wrote:  Vicious does reveal a bit of his personal views of housewives about them being "relegated" to that role.

Not really, I'm approaching this from a market economy viewpoint. Everyone today needs an incentive. I don't believe that women for altruistic reasons will do the right thing for the greater biological good if they have the chance to chase self-actualization and momentary happiness. This separates us from animals, the curse of intelligence. We are the only species that actively fight evolution.

(12-18-2013 03:56 AM)Handsome Creepy Eel Wrote:  
Vicious Wrote:Why would any woman in 2013 put themselves in that role? Because it serves a greater good from a biological standpoint?

Because it makes them much happier than the current carousel-riding version, and is also great for society in general?

Have you actually tried to use this argument in a public setting? You'll be tied to the stake.

Doesn't matter what the truth is, the perception of what the truth is will always take precedence.

(12-18-2013 03:56 AM)Handsome Creepy Eel Wrote:  
Vicious Wrote:That's why workforce equality serves a purpose. When women earn more they are less likely to tamper with legislation that benefits the lower income holder in a household.

But they are, no matter how much they earn. Not only is the "gender wage gap" completely false as there is no discrimination, but I also recall a study that demonstrated that young women earn more than men for identical work and job title. And this equality - sometimes more than equality - hasn't stopped feminism from pushing for more and more insane laws to tilt the balance further in their favor. The more women have, the more they ask for, instead of the opposite. I wish it weren't like that, but that's sadly how it is.

I agree that in theory it should work like that. But it does not. Feminism can't ever be sated.

Then they will stand to lose more in a divorce. As of now men are still the ones coming better out of a divorce financially than women. (Not the best source but it has some interesting discussion)
(This post was last modified: 12-18-2013 04:15 PM by Vicious.)
12-18-2013 03:52 PM
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RE: How To Chose The Mother Of Your Child
My ex certainly had some obnoxious qualities as a wife, but she's a good mother. I have to travel a lot for work, and I feel comfortable with the kids in her care. Life would be a stressful Hell if I had to worry every time I went out of town.

Here are the most important qualities which make a good mother in my experience:

Responsible
Has common sense and good judgement
Good impulse control
Affectionate
Not easily bored
Patient
Not self-centered/selfish/narcissistic

That last one is hard to find, but some women are better than others with this.

There's a guy who grew up on my block who made terrible choices when it came to his kids' mother. She has a drug problem. After the divorce lots of scummy men coming around...The kids ended up living with him. All fine and good, but unfortunately he suddenly passed away a few weeks ago from something like an aneurysm. From what I gather his sister is trying to get custody.
(This post was last modified: 12-18-2013 03:53 PM by Mikev75.)
12-18-2013 03:52 PM
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RE: How To Chose The Mother Of Your Child
Vicious Wrote:Have you actually tried to use this argument in a public setting? You'll be tied to the stake.

Doesn't matter what the truth is, the perception of what the truth is will always take precedence.

What does it matter what the public reaction to that argument is? It's the truth. What you're saying is correct, but we're not arguing about how to convince a bunch of white knights here.

Of course, I might repackage the truth before I throw it at the reality-denying feminist crowd, but that doesn't change the fact that women really do have a natural inclination towards happiness by being in a normal marriage and reasonably submissive, and thus normal marriage will never become a bad deal for them no matter how far the perception of marriage shifts away from it. The point being: of course saying this won't convince anyone, but it does negate the statement that such a marriage would be a bad deal for the woman.

Vicious Wrote:Then they will stand to lose more in a divorce. As of now men are still the ones coming better out of a divorce financially than women. (Not the best source but it has some interesting discussion)

Exactly, I agree. But this is another case of reality vs. perception, and we're supposed to be talking about reality here, not crafting arguments to convince the crowd with clinically insane perception (which can't be convinced anyway).

Do men have better finances after divorce than their ex wives? Sure. Even when you wallop them with excessive child support and alimony, on average they will still do better for themselves.

Does this make divorce a crazy proposition for a woman, seeing how she'll be financially worse off even with the aid of child support and alimony? Sure.

Are women going to divorce less because they're earning a lot by themselves, so they won't really need child support and alimony anymore? No. They're going to push for and take child support and alimony on top of earning a lot by themselves. It's simple greed at work.

The point being: making women earn more might theoretically make divorce and its payments less alluring for the woman, but I don't see it happening in practice. If you have a source for this (showing several countries that enjoy both a very high marriage stability rate and a very high female participation in the labor market, implying correlation of some sort), I'd be glad to see it.

Again: I agree with everything that you said and respect your way of thinking, I just don't see it producing practical results in this matter.

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12-19-2013 03:50 AM
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RE: How To Chose The Mother Of Your Child
Why was Vendetta banned?

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12-19-2013 04:00 AM
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RE: How To Chose The Mother Of Your Child
(12-18-2013 03:52 PM)Vicious Wrote:  Then they will stand to lose more in a divorce. As of now men are still the ones coming better out of a divorce financially than women. (Not the best source but it has some interesting discussion)

If women are financially harmed by divorce and men make out so well--why do women initiate 70% of divorces? You claim to approach everything from a market-based/incentive perspective. It would seem irrational for a woman to divorce if it harmed her financially. Based on your market based/incentive logic--men should be initiating the majority of divorces since they gain the most.

It is odd--Previously you said something quite different on why women initiate 70% of divorces:
Quote:"The answer is quite simple. Women can make a nice profit on divorce in the US."

You cant have it both ways.

Scary (if true) fact from the link you provided--problem your site does not have any citations.
Quote:Among college-educated couples, the percentage of divorces initiated by wives is a whopping 90 percent.

That makes for a helpful screening tool when picking the mother of your children if the man has a college degree.

He has often been called the "Last of the Romans"

"We have prostitutes for our pleasure, concubines for our health, and wives to bear us lawful offspring."--Demosthenes (384–322 BC), Red Pill Greek Statesman
(This post was last modified: 12-19-2013 05:30 AM by Flavius Aetius.)
12-19-2013 04:37 AM
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RE: How To Chose The Mother Of Your Child
Quote:Again: I agree with everything that you said and respect your way of thinking, I just don't see it producing practical results in this matter.


That's because I still believe we can change things.

Somewhat related: I've been active in politics. And this might sound like an oxymoron but if you dedicate 20 in the field of politics it's surprisingly easy to change legislation. I would expect it to be even easier in the US where divorce laws are by state (toxic if you ask me).
(This post was last modified: 12-19-2013 05:32 AM by Vicious.)
12-19-2013 05:22 AM
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RE: How To Chose The Mother Of Your Child
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12-19-2013 05:30 AM
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RE: How To Chose The Mother Of Your Child
Quote:It is odd--Previously you said something quite different on why women initiate 70% of divorces:
Quote:The answer is quite simple. Women can make a nice profit on divorce in the US."
You cant have it both ways

There’s no contradiction in this. They can make a profit on it. Doesn’t mean they do, the general perception and one that RVF perpetrates if anything is that women do buy into this.

There’s also the fact that in a marriage the individual resources of the couple are smaller than the sum of its parts. One household with shared resources provides a higher lifestyle than two households individually carrying all household costs, especially if kids are involved.

But of course, there’s not one single cause for women to initiate divorce. In fact I think that a majority of the reasons are emotional rather than logical and rational. The trend for who initiates divorce is actually positive, in the eighties the figure was something like 80% overall women who initiated.

Quote:Scary (if true) fact from the link you provided--problem your site does not have any citations.
Quote:Among college-educated couples, the percentage of divorces initiated by wives is a whopping 90 percent.
That makes for a very effective screening tool when picking the mother of your children if the man has a college degree.

To a degree, but the overall divorce rate for educated couples is lower. So you have a scenario where you’re less likely to see a divorce with a woman with a degree but if shit goes south she’s more likely to blindside you.

I called it though and said the source wasn’t the best, but it provided a good mix of relevant stats.
12-19-2013 05:48 AM
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Handsome Creepy Eel
Handsome Creepy Eel Offline
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Post: #69
RE: How To Chose The Mother Of Your Child
Hah, I think that things are beyond even the point of last resort as far as healing the political/legal climate from feminism goes. But if you do start a political action, let me know. I'll gladly fundraise, support and vote for it ;-)

"Imagine" by HCE | Hitler reacts to Battle of Montreal | An alternative use for squid that has never crossed your mind before
12-19-2013 08:09 AM
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