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Lifter's Lounge
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rdvirus Offline
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Post: #176
RE: Lifter's Lounge
Just checked out the video on the Agile 8. Going to add it to my routine and see if it helps.. I do some dynamic stretches but that routine looks like it hits everything good. Thanks Rex, appreciate it! Hopefully it corrects my issues. Definitely a step in the right direction anyway.

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09-04-2014 12:42 PM
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berserk Offline
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Post: #177
RE: Lifter's Lounge
(09-04-2014 12:26 AM)UnW Wrote:  So winter is slowly eroding in my part of the world and I'm keen to drop a few % in body fat over the coming months, right now I'd estimate I'm at around 13-14% and I am ideally looking to get down to around 10%.

I've made adjustments to my diet and was also hoping to incorporate some Cardio into my weekly training.

What would be the most effective manner to do this?

Should I do morning cardio on days where I don't do weights training, do HIIT training before or after a weights session, or does it not really matter how I structure my cardio (eg. Add in a few cardio sessions throughout the week)?

Your goals are similar to mine. I try to do 30 mins of cardio after lifting and 1 hour of cardio on non lifting days.
09-04-2014 01:11 PM
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OBJ Snakebite Offline
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Post: #178
RE: Lifter's Lounge
(09-04-2014 10:31 AM)rdvirus Wrote:  Has anyone ever had hip pain from squats? Specifically my left hip joint when I get down to parallel. I think I might need to take a break from squats as much as I want to keep going.. I think it may be a flexibility issue. I really want to push through the pain but I don't want to pay for it in the long term.

Yes, several times. And I did take a break/squated only warm up set.
This is because your knees are not far apart enough. When you squat, you should be able to force your elbows into your knees. Mark Rippetoe talks about this in his book.
09-04-2014 09:14 PM
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Agastya Offline
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Post: #179
RE: Lifter's Lounge
You guys have any ideas on how to balance running with lifting? I'm trying to build general strength while simultaneously improving my cardio endurance. I understand that they're counterproductive, but both are extremely necessary for my sport.
09-09-2014 01:27 PM
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StrikeBack Offline
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Post: #180
RE: Lifter's Lounge
(09-09-2014 01:27 PM)Agastya Wrote:  You guys have any ideas on how to balance running with lifting? I'm trying to build general strength while simultaneously improving my cardio endurance. I understand that they're counterproductive, but both are extremely necessary for my sport.

They are not.

For some reason, people quote shitty researches in the West and think you can't do both.

Meanwhile, strength athletes in China, EE, Russia etc. lift and run daily. They're also really fucking strong.

Having good cardio endurance improves your work capacity, which allows you to do more volume in strength training or IOW, makes you stronger.

Now of course if you run yourself into the ground everyday, then your strength training will suffer. But if you're smart about it and keep within your recovery capacity, then you can improve both. I do both, although I don't run beyond 10km, and I do other stuff while running (like stopping for some chins or burpees). I know a fellow elite powerlifter who does marathons.

There's no hard & fast rule if you want to balance the two. People may say, run on days you don't lift. That's a good one to start with, but you can also run on days you do lift. It's just a matter of getting used to it. Our body is capable of working so much harder than we think (even without PEDs).

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09-09-2014 08:11 PM
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Hades Offline
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Post: #181
RE: Lifter's Lounge
(09-09-2014 08:11 PM)StrikeBack Wrote:  Now of course if you run yourself into the ground everyday, then your strength training will suffer. But if you're smart about it and keep within your recovery capacity, then you can improve both. I do both, although I don't run beyond 10km, and I do other stuff while running (like stopping for some chins or burpees). I know a fellow elite powerlifter who does marathons.

You know an elite powerlifter who runs marathons? Is he on Michael Soong's powerlifting historical rankings list anywhere?

I'm going to generally call bullshit on the idea that good cardio endurance will have a lot of benefit in making you stronger anyway. If good cardio endurance was all that necessary for strength athletes, then all of the chainsmoking strong as hell badasses would never have had careers - David Rigert, The Saxon Trio, Sandow, the entire ex Soviet bloc of olympic lifters that have been smashing our shit for decades, Bulgaria, China, etc. Yeah, pretty much every olympic gym that ever produced an athlete worth a shit had a floor littered with cigarette butts.
(This post was last modified: 09-10-2014 03:35 AM by Hades.)
09-10-2014 03:18 AM
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StrikeBack Offline
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Post: #182
RE: Lifter's Lounge
Don't know what that is. As I looked it up, it appears to be a listing of American record holders without regards to federations.

The guy I'm talking about is an Australian elite-ranked powerlifter in the IPF.

For American examples, I remember reading about this guy: http://www.jtsstrength.com/articles/2014...lex-viada/

If you're familiar with Marty Gallagher, he advocates plenty of running too.

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09-10-2014 03:38 AM
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Hades Offline
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Post: #183
RE: Lifter's Lounge
(09-10-2014 03:38 AM)StrikeBack Wrote:  Don't know what that is. As I looked it up, it appears to be a listing of American record holders without regards to federations.

The guy I'm talking about is an Australian elite-ranked powerlifter in the IPF.

For American examples, I remember reading about this guy: http://www.jtsstrength.com/articles/2014...lex-viada/

If you're familiar with Marty Gallagher, he advocates plenty of running too.

I didn't check your nationality, Australian then, my mistake. I have the world rankings.

I'm not saying that running marathons and being good at powerlifting is impossible, it's just not all that necessary.

It's great you bring up Alex Viada. Cool guy, he also has an interview with Jamie Lewis at Chaos and Pain about how the two goals of endurance training and powerlifting aren't mutually exclusive but are pretty hard to put together (NSFW -> http://chaosandpain.blogspot.com/2013/06...-of.html).

According to Viada's numbers listed in the C&P article, he put 85 pounds on his back squat in a little over a year.

I have a list for world raw powerlifting rankings anyhow ->

http://www.powerliftingwatch.com/records/raw/world

So Viada has an 1870# total (was this a powerlifting meet or just informal gym PRs?) which would put him two pounds ahead of the current record for a drug tested meet.

So either those numbers reported were not from an actual powerlifting competition and are self reported PRs (if he's natural), or they were from a powerlifting meet and he's about 230 pounds behind the record total (if he's on PEDs).

Still though I'm interested to see where his career goes and if he ends up a world record holder, since the 220# class has some pretty insane competition.

Edit: Man some of the comments on that article are pretty hilarious. You know this dude Viada might be the Lance Armstrong of hybrid athletes, pretty awesome on paper but years later it turns out he's juiced to the gills. I don't care personally but it would explain him putting eighty five pounds on an already impressive back squat in a year and why he's not already ranked on (open) powerlifting rankings. If anything steroids were practically invented for hybrid athletes, two birds with one stone.
(This post was last modified: 09-10-2014 05:05 AM by Hades.)
09-10-2014 04:20 AM
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StrikeBack Offline
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Post: #184
RE: Lifter's Lounge
An elite-ranked powerlifter is one who has achieved the grading for elite. That doesn't mean he can be a medalist at a world championship or a world record holder or even top 10-20.

The guy I mentioned is an older gent in a light weight class who's lifetime drug-free in the IPF. He totals about 8.5x bodyweight raw.

Of course running marathons is an extreme example. My point is that you can train cardio endurance at a decent level while lifting for strength. I've already completed several Tough Mudders while doing powerlifting. It's not that hard, and you don't need to be on drugs (I'm lifetime drug-free, don't even use recreational drugs). Obviously I"m not competitive in long distance running events, but the guy asking this question wasn't trying to be a champion in both sports.

If you go by popular belief, it appears as if you're gonna lose all your gainz in strength if you do cardio somewhat regularly...

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09-10-2014 06:10 AM
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redbeard Offline
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Post: #185
RE: Lifter's Lounge
What'd you think of Tough Mudder?

It seems fun to me but I've never had the time/money for it until now.

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09-10-2014 07:47 AM
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Blackwell Offline
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Post: #186
RE: Lifter's Lounge
So it's the winter period again and I'm back on the bulk. I'm two weeks in and my back has broken out into that horrible acne which I guess is cause of elevating test levels. My face has suffered a little, bit frustrating after an acne free summer where I quit lifting to play pick up all day and go out and party. I love lifting but I hate this side effect.

Anybody got any tricks or ideas to combat this or anything that might help to keep it under control?
09-10-2014 01:56 PM
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Saweeep Offline
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Post: #187
RE: Lifter's Lounge
(09-10-2014 01:56 PM)Blackwell Wrote:  So it's the winter period again and I'm back on the bulk. I'm two weeks in and my back has broken out into that horrible acne which I guess is cause of elevating test levels. My face has suffered a little, bit frustrating after an acne free summer where I quit lifting to play pick up all day and go out and party. I love lifting but I hate this side effect.

Anybody got any tricks or ideas to combat this or anything that might help to keep it under control?

This is probably teaching you to suck eggs but are you showering at the right times after training?

What I mean is, showering straight after a workout is great and all but I find I carry on sweating for some time. Showers an hour or two after finishing training keeps my skin in good condition.
09-10-2014 05:08 PM
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Post: #188
RE: Lifter's Lounge
(09-10-2014 01:56 PM)Blackwell Wrote:  So it's the winter period again and I'm back on the bulk. I'm two weeks in and my back has broken out into that horrible acne which I guess is cause of elevating test levels. My face has suffered a little, bit frustrating after an acne free summer where I quit lifting to play pick up all day and go out and party. I love lifting but I hate this side effect.

Anybody got any tricks or ideas to combat this or anything that might help to keep it under control?

I noticed that when I came off my high protein diet, my acne started to subside. I chalked this up to high protein diets causing excessive inflammation on the digestive system. It may be something you want to look int.

Also, Winter is terrible for the skin. It dries it out, plus your Vitamin D levels are lower than normal. My new favorite supplement is Cod Liver Oil. It will take care of your Vitamin D and it's great for skin, testosterone and overall health.

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09-14-2014 07:46 PM
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StrikeBack Offline
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Post: #189
RE: Lifter's Lounge
(09-10-2014 07:47 AM)redbeard Wrote:  What'd you think of Tough Mudder?

It seems fun to me but I've never had the time/money for it until now.

It's a fun one to do and to train for with a group of mates.

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09-14-2014 09:09 PM
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Mongo Offline
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Post: #190
RE: Lifter's Lounge
I've got a very different outlook on lifting than most folks, and an extremely different outlook compared to the dudes on here, but 10x10 is some biblical shit. I recommend everybody give it a shot at some point. My legs are the biggest they've ever been, my arms are more vascular than ever and I'm putting up some stupid numbers on the bar for this much volume.

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09-14-2014 10:53 PM
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Saweeep Offline
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Post: #191
RE: Lifter's Lounge
(09-14-2014 10:53 PM)Mongo Wrote:  I've got a very different outlook on lifting than most folks, and an extremely different outlook compared to the dudes on here, but 10x10 is some biblical shit. I recommend everybody give it a shot at some point. My legs are the biggest they've ever been, my arms are more vascular than ever and I'm putting up some stupid numbers on the bar for this much volume.

I often run 8-12 week cycles similar to 10x10 but with varieties of exercise.

For instance, I may do for chest (not including warm up sets):

3x10 Incline bench
3x10 incline dumbell
3x10 incline dumbbell fly
3x10 flat bench
3x10 flat dumbbell press
3x10 dumbell pullover

That's 18 sets of 10, twice per week. I get massive muscular growth and strength increases.

Works for me.
09-15-2014 07:30 AM
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StrikeBack Offline
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Post: #192
RE: Lifter's Lounge
10x10 is German Volume Training (GVT), designed by the German lifting team for their lifters to go up a weight class.

It has its specific use in certain contexts, and I think is great for the hypertrophy part of a training cycle (duh) but is not to be abused.

The strength you develop with 10x10 is not the same strength at the top of the pyramid (absolute strength, starting strength, explosive strength) as the intensity (% of 1RM) is not enough to develop skills specific to those strengths.

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09-15-2014 09:08 PM
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Post: #193
RE: Lifter's Lounge
(09-09-2014 01:27 PM)Agastya Wrote:  You guys have any ideas on how to balance running with lifting? I'm trying to build general strength while simultaneously improving my cardio endurance. I understand that they're counterproductive, but both are extremely necessary for my sport.

It depends partially on your body shape/type. If you're endo, meso, or ectomorph. I'm naturally ectomorph with a fairly thin frame and thin bones compared to other guys 6'4" like me.

Rather than running 2+ miles (outside on dirt trails cross country), which was detracting from my ability to keep on muscle mass, I run indoors or do eliptical for only 10 minutes no more than 3 times a week

HOWEVER, I pulse my cardio. So, for instance I start at a decent clip until the 3 min mark, then for 30 sec. I go about balls out maybe 90% of my max sprint, then idle back down until the 6 min mark, and do it again, then again at the 9 min mark. After 10 min, I feel like I ran for 30 minutes.

Much like periodization periodization
.. works for lifting, it too works for running, takes less time and preserves joints a bit better for the impact lifting has on them, all while burning max calories. It keeps your cardio system confused.

I completely cut out cardio last year to gain mass, and even being thin I realized how bad that was for overall health. Hope this helps.
09-15-2014 09:11 PM
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Post: #194
RE: Lifter's Lounge
(08-21-2014 09:39 AM)StrikeBack Wrote:  3x5 is too low to build muscles. It's also rather poor to build strength for beginners. You want higher reps than that.

Switching to BB routine is a smart thing, Deluge.

Deluge Wrote:I find it interesting that most RVF lifters seem to be doing strength training rather than bodybuilding. Any idea what makes us so different? Personally I transitioned from the former to the later after 6 months or so.

Physically there's no real difference between the two (as natural lifters) if you understand how it works.

Bodybuilding is all about time under tension for muscles: lift weights as heavy as possible for as many reps as you can.

Strength is all about force production. For that, you have two components: structural (bigger muscles move bigger weights) and neuro-muscular activation (the more motor units get activated, the stronger you are). The former is obviously bodybuilding, the latter is indirectly so. A motor unit is a motor neuron + skeletal muscle fibers. To produce more force, you need to activate more muscle fibers. Only fibers recruited during exercises are available for adaptation (i.e they only grow if you use them). The more adapted they are to training, the closer they get to their genetic potential for force production and hypertrophy. In other words, if you get stronger, your muscle fibers adapt and grow into higher quality ones. It's Starling's Law of Recruitment if you want to read up.

Mentally it's a different story. Strength training makes you feel powerful. This feeling can be just as addictive if not more than having a chiseled body.

Having said that, if you train for strength correctly (as I described above) then you will also build muscles just like a bodybuilder. Any difference is just visual i.e body fat % and is down to your diets. Competitive weightlifters and powerlifters look pretty much like natural bodybuilders off stage (i.e before the last gap extreme cut and dehydration). The chubby ones (excluding super heavyweights) are usually not at the top.

In the golden age of physical culture, bodybuilders and strength athletes were the same people called...lifters. Drugs changed the game as you don't need to get very strong to build good muscles and politics made sure that bodybuilders didn't need to show case strength and athleticism anymore.

In the modern age, most people's early exposure to lifting are via 3x5 or 5x5 routines like Starting Strength or Stronglifts, which are rather mediocre for both strength and bodybuilding. This is why it appears to you guys that you either pursue strength or bodybuilding but not both.

More than half of my powerlifting training is basically bodybuilding. And I know that a significant amount of time is dedicated to bodybuilding for Chinese weightlifters esp for small muscles (yes they curl and do tons of tricep extensions).
Well thought out post, I'd add that in light of everything you've covered, a common mistake many make, myself included, is discounting the importance or nervous system development. Having that strength core is ultimately what allows you to stack on muscle that stays around a while.

The body builder only types I see in the gym fluctuate in muscular appearance so much (hidden gear use aside), that I've vowed to never go purely high rep for very long periods, providing my form and joints can retain the TOT stress of higher weights throughout aging.
09-15-2014 10:03 PM
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Mongo Offline
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Post: #195
RE: Lifter's Lounge
(09-15-2014 09:08 PM)StrikeBack Wrote:  10x10 is German Volume Training (GVT), designed by the German lifting team for their lifters to go up a weight class.

It has its specific use in certain contexts, and I think is great for the hypertrophy part of a training cycle (duh) but is not to be abused.

The strength you develop with 10x10 is not the same strength at the top of the pyramid (absolute strength, starting strength, explosive strength) as the intensity (% of 1RM) is not enough to develop skills specific to those strengths.

I'm well aware of it's roots. I'm doing my own variation on it. And the strength you develop may not be the exact same as your higher % of 1RM strength, however if you periodize with some intelligence you can translate those gains into a higher 1RM.

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09-16-2014 12:07 AM
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Post: #196
RE: Lifter's Lounge
I keep getting a sharp pain in my lower part of my left leg after I squat.

It's not like usual squat soreness where I could feel it in my thighs and glutes but it's a weird sharp feeling that occurs under my kneecap. And it's only on my left leg too.

Squatting is my fave exercise too Sad

Nope.
09-16-2014 09:13 AM
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StrikeBack Offline
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Post: #197
RE: Lifter's Lounge
Check how tight your left calf is and fix that.

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09-16-2014 07:55 PM
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Saweeep Offline
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Post: #198
RE: Lifter's Lounge
Could be a balance issue too…putting most of the weight and therefore strain on the left leg.
09-17-2014 05:16 AM
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RE: Lifter's Lounge
So I changed my workout this week to a 85% free weights and 15% cables, machines, body weight exercises isolation routine. I was doing a brutal 4-5 day a week upper body / lower body split alternating the two each day with an occasional arms only or shoulders only day thrown in.

I tend to recover pretty fast so revisiting muscles 48-72 hours later killed a lot of fat and maintained/built a more solid base I feel.

However, the brutality of engaging way more stabilizers and the natural gravity fed resistance of barbells and dumbells is plain ruthless. I haven't been this sore in 4 months. M-F I'll be hitting everything once a week hard.
M=Chest + abs/cardio 10-25 min
T=Legs + abs/cardio 10-25 min
W=Shoulders
R=Arms + abs/cardio 10-25 min
F=Back + abs/cardio 10-25 min
weekend = anything I can muster but mainly recovery.

Nothing like a switch in routine to remind you just how weak you really are at certain exercises. whew.
09-18-2014 08:39 PM
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Post: #200
RE: Lifter's Lounge
Can anyone give any advice on dumbbell work? I've been trying the 5x5 routine for compound lifts, and wondering if I should do the same for dumbbells for curls and shoulder raises.
09-18-2014 11:02 PM
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