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Lifter's Lounge
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StrikeBack Offline
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Post: #701
RE: Lifter's Lounge
Two very good articles relevant to our recent discussion on quad (knee) dominant vs PC dominant squatting - plus a few more things about squats

Read in order:

http://www.strengtheory.com/its-time-to-...squatting/

http://www.strengtheory.com/squats-are-n...ominant-3/

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02-18-2015 02:16 AM
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RexImperator Offline
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Post: #702
RE: Lifter's Lounge
Thanks, those were a good read.

I wonder if I need to strengthen my glutes.

I believe my hip flexors are very tight.

Is the leg press worth doing if you are squatting?

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et Thybrim multo spumantem sanguine cerno
02-18-2015 09:12 PM
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H1N1 Offline
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Post: #703
RE: Lifter's Lounge
(02-18-2015 09:12 PM)RexImperator Wrote:  Thanks, those were a good read.

I wonder if I need to strengthen my glutes.

I believe my hip flexors are very tight.

Is the leg press worth doing if you are squatting?

With regards to your last question, the answer is it depends, what are your goals?

For me personally, having large legs and glutes and doing a lot of cardio, my goals are to get stronger without increasing the size of my legs. For me, the leg press simply takes time and energy away from movements/loadings that would directly increase my strength, and italso gives a hypertrophy focus that I don't want. For me, therefore, the leg press is not 'worth doing'.

If you have skinny legs, don't have primarily athletic goals/are aesthetics focused, or just need a bit more size to keep getting stronger, then it definitely has merit, and is a good addition to your program.
02-19-2015 05:55 AM
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Deluge Offline
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Post: #704
RE: Lifter's Lounge
I'm pretty happy with how I look shirtless at the moment, but I might have a problem. So I have a bulging chest, popping out lats and v shaped upper body, but a friend who saw me shirtless randomly told me my skin around my belly looked saggy.

Up until now I just assumed it was the last fat I had to cut, I was never obese or anything so I never thought it'd be saggy. There's still some fat there so I can't be sure till I cut down a little more, but I'm really hoping I won't need surgery or something to fix it. If it is a skin problem, it won't be significant enough to look bad per se, but it might mean I can't get a visible 6 pack Dodgy
(This post was last modified: 02-19-2015 07:13 AM by Deluge.)
02-19-2015 07:10 AM
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Sketness Offline
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Post: #705
RE: Lifter's Lounge
(02-19-2015 07:10 AM)Deluge Wrote:  I'm pretty happy with how I look shirtless at the moment, but I might have a problem. So I have a bulging chest, popping out lats and v shaped upper body, but a friend who saw me shirtless randomly told me my skin around my belly looked saggy.

Up until now I just assumed it was the last fat I had to cut, I was never obese or anything so I never thought it'd be saggy. There's still some fat there so I can't be sure till I cut down a little more, but I'm really hoping I won't need surgery or something to fix it. If it is a skin problem, it won't be significant enough to look bad per se, but it might mean I can't get a visible 6 pack Dodgy

post a picture your friend might be full of shit
02-19-2015 11:03 AM
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the chef Offline
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Post: #706
RE: Lifter's Lounge
put 10 lbs of solid mass using this program

http://crossfitfootball.com/training/todays-training/
(This post was last modified: 02-19-2015 08:14 PM by the chef.)
02-19-2015 08:09 PM
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Post: #707
RE: Lifter's Lounge
Fuck I want a power sled
02-19-2015 09:11 PM
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dads Offline
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Post: #708
RE: Lifter's Lounge
So I'm getting to the close of my bulk (unintentional dirty bulk, as the holidays were particularly bad in terms of what I was putting into my body) and I'm getting ready to start cutting. I've been doing 3 days a week, full body (8, 8, 6, 6, 6 on main lifts). Would the best way to minimize muscle loss be to double down on reps and cut weight in half (e.g. Instead of 185x8, 195x8, 205x6, 215x6, 225x6, go 135x16, 145x16, so on)? Or should I continue with my usual program?
02-19-2015 09:30 PM
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StrikeBack Offline
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Post: #709
RE: Lifter's Lounge
(02-18-2015 09:12 PM)RexImperator Wrote:  Thanks, those were a good read.

I wonder if I need to strengthen my glutes.

I believe my hip flexors are very tight.

Is the leg press worth doing if you are squatting?

Glutes: never strong enough, yes is the only answer.

Hip flexors get less tight if glutes are active, and if you reduce bum-on-seat time.

Leg press doesn't add much strength but can add a lot of useless mass, as H1N1 says. I don't want to gain useless mass that slows me down. However, if you have very skinny legs, knock yourself out.

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02-19-2015 10:28 PM
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dog24 Offline
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Post: #710
RE: Lifter's Lounge
I cant believe no one said this before, but i just wanted to thank StrikeBack for all the advice he has given on this thread, he is the most knowledgeable guy we have right now and people usually charge to share that knowledge. So you get a 1+ from me if i haven't given you one already
02-19-2015 10:28 PM
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H1N1 Offline
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Post: #711
RE: Lifter's Lounge
(02-19-2015 09:30 PM)dads Wrote:  So I'm getting to the close of my bulk (unintentional dirty bulk, as the holidays were particularly bad in terms of what I was putting into my body) and I'm getting ready to start cutting. I've been doing 3 days a week, full body (8, 8, 6, 6, 6 on main lifts). Would the best way to minimize muscle loss be to double down on reps and cut weight in half (e.g. Instead of 185x8, 195x8, 205x6, 215x6, 225x6, go 135x16, 145x16, so on)? Or should I continue with my usual program?

I'm going to start sounding like a broken record, but what are your goals? You can certainly cut weight and keep making strength gains (almost certainly not mass gains unless you're getting some help). Stick with your current program, unless you're bored and need a change, and listen to your body.

I've said it before, in this thread and others, but here I go again:

Performance based goals are, in my view, the best way to consistently make progress, both for strength and aesthetics UNLESS you are already a competitive bodybuilder at some level (and that means you live the life and actually do shows). For everyone else, even the terminally vain, performance based goals are the best way of achieving the physique you want. Diet then becomes a matter of eating in such a way that you are able to continually make progress with some aspect of your training, allowing for the fact that not all areas will progress linearly.

Put simply, show me a guy who can OHP his BW, squat and dead 500+, knockout 100 pressups any time, and run a 6 minute mile, and I'll show you a guy with a physique that anyone would desire.
02-20-2015 05:43 AM
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StrikeBack Offline
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Post: #712
RE: Lifter's Lounge
Thanks dog24, the more I share, the more I learn.

Totally agree with H1N1 on performance-based goals. That's what I focus on as well, and my physique shall reflect my strength and fitness. The other positive side effect of such pursuit is that you avoid the mental trap of being miserable with your physique fluctuations and diet changes, very common with amateur bodybuilders / recreational lifters.

Deluge Wrote:I'm pretty happy with how I look shirtless at the moment, but I might have a problem. So I have a bulging chest, popping out lats and v shaped upper body, but a friend who saw me shirtless randomly told me my skin around my belly looked saggy.

Up until now I just assumed it was the last fat I had to cut, I was never obese or anything so I never thought it'd be saggy. There's still some fat there so I can't be sure till I cut down a little more, but I'm really hoping I won't need surgery or something to fix it. If it is a skin problem, it won't be significant enough to look bad per se, but it might mean I can't get a visible 6 pack

Before you speculate any further or listen to more broscience and stress yourself out, just go book a DEXA scan. I'm not sure how much it costs, as I get it extra cheap ($33 a scan from a bulk buy ages ago), but it shouldn't be too expensive. If you're 15% BF or more, you don't have a loose skin issue to worry about, unless you have a history of obesity earlier on.

Also, loose skin in the lower belly affects the bottom 2 of your 8-pack abs, not the better known 6-packs. It's not really a problem unless you're going for a bodybuilding contest.

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02-22-2015 01:52 AM
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Oz. Offline
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Post: #713
RE: Lifter's Lounge
Update for those interested, I'm still hitting 5x5 on Monday/Wednesday/Friday

I've implemented dips and curls to workout A
Pull ups and tricep pull downs to workout B

I've also added leg extensions Monday/Friday to make my thighs look better all around. So far it's been going good with the gains and I'm always dead after workouts. Slowly increasing my calories daily

(11-15-2014 09:06 AM)Little Dark Wrote:  This thread is not going in the direction I was hoping for.
02-22-2015 01:32 PM
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Spike Offline
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Post: #714
RE: Lifter's Lounge
Can't believe I did 250 crunches 3 times a week for nearly 20 years without any impressing results (not even the faintest sight of a six pack) and now that i'm doing weighted abs exercises 3 times a week for just 2 months, my abs are growing like a motherfucker.

- leg raises from a bench (3 x 15)
- weighted crunches with cable machine ( 15 x 120 pounds, 15 x 130 pounds, 10 x 140 pounds, 5 x 150 pounds) and I'm just getting used to the exercise, will lift more soon.
- 3 sets of woodchoppers 15 times each side

FUCK every other ab exercise.

38 years old. Can't wait for summer.

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(This post was last modified: 02-22-2015 02:02 PM by Spike.)
02-22-2015 02:00 PM
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Sketness Offline
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Post: #715
RE: Lifter's Lounge
Just came from the gym where i did 300 pull ups every time i stopped for anything I did 20 dips.

It took a while but i finished.
02-22-2015 05:25 PM
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Post: #716
RE: Lifter's Lounge
(02-22-2015 02:00 PM)Spike Wrote:  Can't believe I did 250 crunches 3 times a week for nearly 20 years without any impressing results (not even the faintest sight of a six pack) and now that i'm doing weighted abs exercises 3 times a week for just 2 months, my abs are growing like a motherfucker.

- leg raises from a bench (3 x 15)
- weighted crunches with cable machine ( 15 x 120 pounds, 15 x 130 pounds, 10 x 140 pounds, 5 x 150 pounds) and I'm just getting used to the exercise, will lift more soon.
- 3 sets of woodchoppers 15 times each side

FUCK every other ab exercise.

38 years old. Can't wait for summer.

Amen, people always look at me weird when I'm grunting out damn heavy ab exercises. the 10-20 rep range with weight is sure to exhaust the muscles. I'm 40, funny started weighted abs at 37 when I made same discovery.
02-22-2015 07:30 PM
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WanderingSoul Offline
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Post: #717
RE: Lifter's Lounge
110 kilo bench press yesterday at 80.3 bodyweight. That was a 10 kilo pr. Then went for 115 but missed it. Can't be mad at a 10 kilo bench pr though.
02-22-2015 11:12 PM
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alexdagr81 Offline
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Post: #718
RE: Lifter's Lounge
(02-22-2015 11:12 PM)RioNomad Wrote:  110 kilo bench press yesterday at 80.3 bodyweight. That was a 10 kilo pr. Then went for 115 but missed it. Can't be mad at a 10 kilo bench pr though.

Goodlift! Hit an overhead press PR yesterday. Should be able to do my bodyweight again (gained 5 lbs, after doing it the first time)
02-23-2015 02:07 PM
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britchard Offline
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Post: #719
RE: Lifter's Lounge
Been using resistance bands/tubing a lot more recently, really liking it. I'm doing a datasheet on it, shold be out pretty soon.
02-23-2015 03:15 PM
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Oz. Offline
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Post: #720
RE: Lifter's Lounge
Couldn't make it to the gym because I forgot my workout clothes at home (I go to the gym in my uni) I did some calisthenics along with some resistance work anddd I need to work on my cardio thought I was going to die

(11-15-2014 09:06 AM)Little Dark Wrote:  This thread is not going in the direction I was hoping for.
02-23-2015 06:08 PM
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slubu Offline
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Post: #721
RE: Lifter's Lounge
Do you guys workout when you are sick with a cold? Symptoms starting today...
02-24-2015 10:36 AM
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GlockTrigga Offline
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Post: #722
RE: Lifter's Lounge
Personally I don't. Stay home and take some Zinc + Vitamin C.

Or you can hit the gym and the cold will last longer than it has to (Think 2 weeks vs. 2 days)
02-24-2015 10:52 AM
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Hades Offline
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Post: #723
RE: Lifter's Lounge
(02-19-2015 10:28 PM)StrikeBack Wrote:  Leg press doesn't add much strength but can add a lot of useless mass, as H1N1 says. I don't want to gain useless mass that slows me down. However, if you have very skinny legs, knock yourself out.

If you read up on what elite level lifters are doing (chinese oly lifters, captain kirk, etc.) in terms of lower body work, you'd be hard pressed to find anybody who doesn't do leg curls, extensions, and leg press as assistance work. Most of them tend to get a substantial amount of lifting volume in by bodybuilding.

By extension, I don't think that any 'useless' mass is really all that useless at all. If you're hell bent on beating a double bodyweight back squat you can do a lot worse than twenty rep death sets of leg press as assistance work.

A lot of bodybuilders also argue that doing shit like 100 rep arm curl sets (a very fun exercise, start with the bar and creep up a pound or two at a time) flush the muscles with blood and promote healing. I don't care how the mechanism works but occasional high rep work seems to help recovery like nothing else. At the very least it can break up monotony in the gym.

(02-24-2015 10:36 AM)slubu Wrote:  Do you guys workout when you are sick with a cold? Symptoms starting today...

Deadlifting seems to clear the sinuses.
I also drink when I'm sick.
Haven't been sick in like two years though.
(This post was last modified: 02-24-2015 11:18 AM by Hades.)
02-24-2015 11:12 AM
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H1N1 Offline
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Post: #724
RE: Lifter's Lounge
(02-24-2015 11:12 AM)Hades Wrote:  
(02-19-2015 10:28 PM)StrikeBack Wrote:  Leg press doesn't add much strength but can add a lot of useless mass, as H1N1 says. I don't want to gain useless mass that slows me down. However, if you have very skinny legs, knock yourself out.

If you read up on what elite level lifters are doing (chinese oly lifters, captain kirk, etc.) in terms of lower body work, you'd be hard pressed to find anybody who doesn't do leg curls, extensions, and leg press as assistance work. Most of them tend to get a substantial amount of lifting volume in by bodybuilding.

By extension, I don't think that any 'useless' mass is really all that useless at all. If you're hell bent on beating a double bodyweight back squat you can do a lot worse than twenty rep death sets of leg press as assistance work.

A lot of bodybuilders also argue that doing shit like 100 rep arm curl sets (a very fun exercise, start with the bar and creep up a pound or two at a time) flush the muscles with blood and promote healing. I don't care how the mechanism works but occasional high rep work seems to help recovery like nothing else. At the very least it can break up monotony in the gym.

I wouldn't actually disagree with any of this, and I probably wasn't clear in my previous post. If your goal is a bigger back squat, or performance in a power/oly lift, or pure aesthetics, then leg press, leg curls etc are excellent. A bigger muscle has the potential to be a stronger muscle, and forcing hypertrophy through more quickly by pumping the muscle than it would occur simply by back squatting is a sensible way of achieving your goal.

However, if your goals are more athletic/military/combat performance related, leg press/curls etc are a poor time investment. For example, with a more than 2x bw squat already, my strength in the back squat is not limiting my progress as far as my own performance goals are concerned. Indeed, a slower rate of progress in it, perhaps due to the absence of leg press/curl etc, none-the-less leaves me with the energy and lack of muscle soreness to prioritise other movements (eg sandbag getups) that may not build leg muscles, but do make me a better fighter/soldier/athlete, but also a weaker squatter.

Although I advocate (incessantly) that people set performance goals, there is no reason to suggest my performance goals are 'better' than other valid ones. Being a good power lifter is a legitimate pursuit, and a WR squat is in itself an excellent performance goal. It's just not my performance goal and my training reflects that.

I am please that on a frantic rereading of my post on leg press, I'm not contradicting myself.
02-24-2015 11:49 AM
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alexdagr81 Offline
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Post: #725
RE: Lifter's Lounge
At the very least, sprinters must do leg curls (or some sort of knee flexion exercise). It's like doing rotator cuff work to continue benching.
02-24-2015 12:02 PM
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