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Clomid for Testosterone
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Tim Offline
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Post: #226
RE: Clomid for Testosterone
Currently taking 50mg clomid ed to help with fertility issues so we can have a 2nd bub without going through IVF again. Figured I would start lifting again to take advantage of the potential test boost. Been taking it since 10th sept. No side effects. I'm 188cm and have gone from 73.8kg to 76.6kg. But I used to be 82kg when I used to lift. So I should regain that quicker than if I had never lifted. Ive got 5 more months of this med potentially. I'll update my gains as I go. I don't know if it's given me an energy boost or anything like that, I have a 10 month old so I get stuff all sleep and am always tired. So who knows. Wish me luck. Ill post if I get any side effects too.
10-01-2019 04:10 AM
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bcycle Offline
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Post: #227
RE: Clomid for Testosterone
(09-01-2019 11:12 PM)perros Wrote:  Honest question.
Will injecting testosterone make your penis bigger?

No. But some men reportedly walk around with a "half chub" all day because the test makes them horny, so I guess it can appear bigger than normal most of the time.

On topic: Clomid monotherapy seems pretty promising. However, I think you should either stay away from it and raise your test naturally through training/diet/sleep/de-stress, or go all out and inject test. Injecting test is foolproof, clomid isn't, neither are test-gels and other meme-trt-medications. Don't be scared of needles, guys.
10-01-2019 05:40 AM
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jbc09 Offline
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Post: #228
RE: Clomid for Testosterone
Low dose of proviron combined with clomid could be a good choice? Proviron making his own benefits as an androgen and also boosting in very high level the free endogenous testo from clomid testo boosting I know is not good for extreme bulking but maybe for small improvement yes. I prefer small gains without LH supression than Big gains with future low testo autónomy....
10-01-2019 11:25 AM
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kassad Offline
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Post: #229
RE: Clomid for Testosterone
(10-01-2019 11:25 AM)jbc09 Wrote:  Low dose of proviron combined with clomid could be a good choice? Proviron making his own benefits as an androgen and also boosting in very high level the free endogenous testo from clomid testo boosting I know is not good for extreme bulking but maybe for small improvement yes. I prefer small gains without LH supression than Big gains with future low testo autónomy....

25mg of clomid EOD, if you have no sides on it can be very well combined with 0.5-2.5mg exemestane/day and 12.5mg-50mg/day of proviron (stick to 12.5mg if you only want to boost free test and want to minimize its own DHT type effects).

I prefer to follow the results with bloodtests, but if you don't have access to E2 sensitive, than I have never seen anyone who had a low E2 problem on 0.5mg exemestane/day even without the clomid (in which the estrogenic effects of the zuclomiphene usually allows for one step higher exemestane dose than with exemestane only).

Both proviron and exemestane is a good combination with clomid because clomid raises SHBG, exemestane lowers SHBG, and proviron binds to SHBG competittively with a 5x higher affinity than testosterone so increases freeT.

I have a guy on 12.5mg clomid twice a week (the max he can tolerate), 1mg exemestane/day (his E2 sensitive hovers aroud 18-20), his freeT is higher than the range, he sees the muscle benefits and still needs 50mg/day of proviron for libido (and using topical dutasteride for hair).

And another having a ~10% reduction on E2 and a ~30% increase in total test and a ~70% increase in freeT on 0.5mg exemestane only. And when he tried proviron he's acne was braking out like crazy on 6.25mg/day.

We are all different.
10-03-2019 03:25 AM
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kassad Offline
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Post: #230
RE: Clomid for Testosterone
Back to this earlier conversation about too much HCG desensitizing the Leydig cells in the testicles:

I have found the video I was talking about:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3ik-CSB864

It starts from about 5mins in.

(09-20-2019 04:08 AM)kassad Wrote:  
(09-16-2019 10:29 AM)Sblazer Wrote:  The study for Clomid says "Clomid produced a decrease in the LH response to LH-releasing hormone (LHRH)".

From what I understand LHRH (luteinizing Hormone Release Hormone) is secreted from the Hypothalamus, which then stimulates the pituitary to release LH. Hence the name LH Release hormone.
What I gather from this, is that you are desensitizing your pituitary from LHRH.
It says anything about Leydig cells in the testis.

Also from what I understand about HCG is that it is an LH analog, meaning its extremely similar in chemical structure to LH.
Some very knowledgable people say there is no difference in the way HCG and LH work on your Leydig cells.
That brings me to my next point: from everything I've read, it is high LH that is desensitizing the testis.
If you were to tell me Clomid is so effective and boosting LH that it desensitizes Leydig cells in the testis, that might make sense.

As far as the interview on JayCutlerTV about HCG and the myth of desensitization, I would take that with a grain of salt. It goes straight against medical research.

One interesting thing about Leydig desensitization is the actual mechanism that takes place. Scientists know its from high LH/HCG but they don't seem to know anything after that.

Thanks for pointing that out,

I find it important to discuss this to show that:
Clomid does desensitize your pituitary from LHRH. Not the Leydig cells in the testes. Nolva and Torem doesn't do this. So in theory they are capable of a larger LH boost. They are also capable of it in reality simply because you can use a larger dose with them. Most guys can take half a Clomid pill eod (25mg/eod) without getting E2 type moodiness sides from the Zuclomiphene part of Clomid (the other part is enclomiphene which is the antiestrogenic part, it is only available in solo format in India as far as I know). So the same guy that can't go higher than half a pill eod on Clomid, can go up to one pill eod on Torem (60mg) or Nolva (20mg).
I have no proof, neither claim that the boost to LH by any SERM would desensitize the leydig cells.

About your claim:
'That JayCutlerTV about HCG and the myth of desensitization going straight against medical research.'

Can you provide a link to that medical research? Because I have only seen information that above 500IU/day HCG doesn't provide any further boost in testosterone, but revs up aromatization in the testes instead (the one that we can't block with AIs), so testicular E2 production. I haven't seen anything about desensitization (as in no further reaction happening to increasing the dosage or a lower reaction happening over time to the same dose). Because if you rev up E2, your SHBG will rise, then your FreeT will get lower. So it would be very easy to confuse this with desensitization as in: the previous benefits from a higher FreeT went away or at least got lowered (just not because of desensitization but higher SHBG).
10-03-2019 06:26 AM
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Tim Offline
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Post: #231
RE: Clomid for Testosterone
So I've put on 8.8lbs (4kg) in 24 days since starting clomid ed and getting back into lifting again.

That feels like a lot of weight...
10-04-2019 01:02 AM
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kassad Offline
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Post: #232
RE: Clomid for Testosterone
(10-04-2019 01:02 AM)Tim Wrote:  So I've put on 8.8lbs (4kg) in 24 days since starting clomid ed and getting back into lifting again.

That feels like a lot of weight...

Would be informative to know if it feels like pure muscle, pure water or pure fat or any combination in between?
10-04-2019 06:56 AM
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Tim Offline
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Post: #233
RE: Clomid for Testosterone
I think there is another variable to explain the weight gain. I weigh myself at the end of the day, so before I started lifting again I was just eating normally. But now I eat a heck of a lot during the day. So that's got to add up by the time I weigh myself at night. Going off the most conservative estimate I can (first thing in the morning vs my initial night time weighing) I have still put on at least 5lbs.

Here are 2 pics. Warning I'm still a skinny 6ft 2" guy, so nothing impressive to see here. But I think the pics show that my bf% doesnt visibly look like it's gone up. http://imgur.com/a/pSiJCW7
10-04-2019 04:42 PM
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Tim Offline
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Post: #234
RE: Clomid for Testosterone
Other pics similar shot to the before pic, so easier to compare where the weight gain has gone.

http://imgur.com/a/g78TcV4

Still early days of course. Got a lot more to gain to get back up to 82kg like I used to be.
10-04-2019 05:44 PM
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revenge Offline
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Post: #235
RE: Clomid for Testosterone
hi guys after a long break ı gave aromasin another chance this time I used 12mg aromasin EOD for 10 days my latest blood results were really surprising TOTAL T 1500NG E2 45PG LH 13 this is really weird despite the beefy aromasin dosage my body still has high e2 and ı didnt feel much of a difference with 1500ng ı think aromasin skyrocketed my LH production and all e2 was intratesticular thus aromatase inhibitor was ineffective ı may add blood result picture after a while. kassad what do you think of this?
10-05-2019 05:14 AM
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kassad Offline
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Post: #236
RE: Clomid for Testosterone
(10-05-2019 05:14 AM)revenge Wrote:  hi guys after a long break ı gave aromasin another chance this time I used 12mg aromasin EOD for 10 days my latest blood results were really surprising TOTAL T 1500NG E2 45PG LH 13 this is really weird despite the beefy aromasin dosage my body still has high e2 and ı didnt feel much of a difference with 1500ng ı think aromasin skyrocketed my LH production and all e2 was intratesticular thus aromatase inhibitor was ineffective ı may add blood result picture after a while. kassad what do you think of this?

If this is an immunoassay type of E2 test (ECLIA) I would test for CRP as well. Is it prescribed aromasin from a pharmacy, or research chem or UGL ? Do you have any high E2 symptoms or just the number?
10-05-2019 09:26 AM
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kassad Offline
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Post: #237
RE: Clomid for Testosterone
(10-04-2019 05:44 PM)Tim Wrote:  Other pics similar shot to the before pic, so easier to compare where the weight gain has gone.

http://imgur.com/a/g78TcV4

Still early days of course. Got a lot more to gain to get back up to 82kg like I used to be.

I recommend taking measurements early in the morning in the same state each day.

For home bf% measuring without equipment I recommend the Covert Baily method look it up there are calculators. In my experience it is very good for tracking individual development.
10-05-2019 09:41 AM
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revenge Offline
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Post: #238
RE: Clomid for Testosterone
(10-05-2019 09:26 AM)kassad Wrote:  
(10-05-2019 05:14 AM)revenge Wrote:  hi guys after a long break ı gave aromasin another chance this time I used 12mg aromasin EOD for 10 days my latest blood results were really surprising TOTAL T 1500NG E2 45PG LH 13 this is really weird despite the beefy aromasin dosage my body still has high e2 and ı didnt feel much of a difference with 1500ng ı think aromasin skyrocketed my LH production and all e2 was intratesticular thus aromatase inhibitor was ineffective ı may add blood result picture after a while. kassad what do you think of this?

If this is an immunoassay type of E2 test (ECLIA) I would test for CRP as well. Is it prescribed aromasin from a pharmacy, or research chem or UGL ? Do you have any high E2 symptoms or just the number?
ı dont know what kind of e2 test it was but it was probably the most common one my exact usage during this time was 37.5mg clomid twice in first 10 days and 0.5mg letro then after this 10 days ı took the aromasin dosage ı mentioned earlier so ı dont know if it was clomid or letro i think that is not the case because it was 15 days ago when ı quit letro and clomid.My asin was from pharmacy with 1500ng t and 45 e2 my libido was just mediocre testicles werent hanging nicely with a pump also my mood and energy wasnt there this seem to suggest e2 above 30 is not acceptable for me with that amount of T I should have felt like superman but it wasnt that kind of experience.After seeing bloods bought myself arimidex from pharmacy and taking 0.5mg for 3 days feeling better emotionaly and testicles are bigger now will try to divide 12.5mg asin into 3 pieces and take MWF Im giving bloods again on this wednesday.
10-05-2019 02:01 PM
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Tim Offline
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Post: #239
RE: Clomid for Testosterone
Thanks. Ill start taking morning measurements.

Im not too concerned with bf% I've never had a problem with putting on fat before. When you're super skinny it's good just to get a bit of meat on your bones and you arent too fussy with how lean it is. But my plan is to keep lifting hard while Im on the clomid for a few more months so hopefully it will become apparent by the end of it if clomid makes a substantial difference or not.

It seems a lot of people have mentioned side effects of clomid like emotional sides, when would you expect them to kick in if they were going to happen? It's been almost a month now of taking 50mg every day and I honestly don't feel any different. Except maybe more energy. I think my muscles arent getting as sore as they used to either.
10-06-2019 03:18 PM
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Hattrick1 Offline
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Post: #240
RE: Clomid for Testosterone
Thought I’d chime in here.

33, have borderline normal levels in the morning and below during day....also symptomatic with bad brain fog and constant urge to sleep during the day. Should also note I’m a uniballer (born with one nut while the other never dropped down). My story so far:

Prescribed just T at 100mg once a week SubQ. Energy during the day much better, was able to sleep at night finally. Levels went to mid 6’s. However, within 3 weeks my nut turned into a pea, my libido dropped bad, and my loads were little droplets. This freaked me out bad and my doctor suggesting getting off the T right away especially given my age and try the HCG only route.

Switched to HCG mono. 500IUs M/W/F. Libido increased drastically.....nut regained size, probably bigger than before. Loads big enough to shoot a hole in the wall. Levels at mid 7’s. However, MAJOR weight gain in only under a month (not sure if bloating or fat?) even though diet is the same and E2 is within range. Scale showing 6 pounds higher than before I started. Also oddly, has made my skin very very pale....to the point people pointing out I look white as a ghost or asking if I’m sick. This is something I’ve not seen documented.

Now decided to try the last route....Clomid, which my doctor suggested from the beginning but the chemical aspect had turned me off. Regardless, would need it anyway as my SERM to restart my HPTA (LH/FSH which are 0 now) so figure I might as well give it a shot.

Doctor has prescribed 25mg EOD with no AI and stop HCG immediately. Fingers crossed I’ll see decent results without the major sides I’ve had with other routes. Will update.
10-06-2019 05:48 PM
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Hattrick1 Offline
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Post: #241
RE: Clomid for Testosterone
4 days in. Causing me to be thirsty as hell and sweating like no other. Also weird pressure around the eyes....like the kind you get when you have a sinus infection....except I don’t have one.
10-10-2019 01:49 AM
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