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subterfuge Offline
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Post: #176
RE: subterfuge journal
1/ I order a cocktail and then accuse the girl on my left of being jealous. She laughs and we banter a little. She's from Hungary which might explain the lack of negative attitude on her part. I make some jokey assumptions about what she does for a living. She's with a fat friend. I try to get the friend involved. We talk about Hungary. I tell them they look like they're wating for their tinder dates to show up. They laugh and then the better looking one tells me she's married. We chat a little longer and I bail.

2/ I open a very hot girl and tell her I like her headband thing. Probably a weak opener and not 'fun' as i'm trying to implement, but in the moment I couldn't think of an opener to amuse myself with. She was actually friendly. I told her she looked like she'd been to a festival and then she told me she works at a festival or something. She kind of cuts off her own sentence to order drinks from the barman and then a boat load of her friends bowl towards the bar and suddenly she's in a conversation with her girlfriends. I should have tried to carry on with her somehow as she was very pretty and not rude like i'm more used too.


3/ much more typical. 2 girls. 1 is making eye contact with my goodlooking friend and she kind of opens him. They talk. I try to open the other girl with fun and I smile and say ''Hi! I've missed you" (I thought it was amusing and i've heard tyler open with it before, too). She gives me that classic ''Who are you and why do you think yuo can talk to me'' look, lol. I'd usually eject straight away here, but I try to stick with it and i'm like ''Aww...are you OK? Feeling shy tonight?''. And she says ''No. I just don't know who the fuck you are and yuo said you'd missed me''. I laugh and say I was just messing around and that some people would find it funny. She said ''I'm not most people''. . I say ''I can TELL!!!'' and smile, and this actually gives her a glimmer of a smile temporarily but I still think she kinda hates me. At this point her friend grabs her and they move away and dance but i'm Not that bothered. She wasn't even really that hot and I just didn't feel taht it would be worth the EXTRAORDINARY effort it would have taken to talk with her

4/ Very pretty girl at a table with a mixed group of friends. I open with ''You! Why are you so pretty>!?'' and smile. Seh looks at me. She looks slightly afraid to be honest! She kind of backs up towards the guy behind her into his arms almost. I just try to calibrate and back off a little bit (not that I was ever in her personal space!) and am like ''I guess it must be a secret!''. She still hasn't said a word so I decide to bail. Then the guy kind of blocks my path and asks me what's up and tells me that he's her boyfriend. I tihnk he's trying too intimidate me and but it's not gonna work so he kind of flips the script after I laugh him off and he plays the friendly guy instead and gives me a condescending pat on the back for trying, lol.

5/ Girl is hanging up her leopard print jacket. I looki at it and smile and say ''If this is real leopard print, we can't be friends'' I think it was funny, lol. She gives me the classic look of contempt and says ''Yeah, Byyeeeeeee'' and turns away towards some other dude.

There were also a couple of instance of bad AA which has angered me. More towards the end of the night when my confidence had been a hit a bit I think. Some very pretty girls out last night. 2 hot girls in the smoking area that I just coudln't bring myself to open unfortunately. Got way too in my head about what to say to open and stuff.
07-29-2017 06:18 AM
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Post: #177
RE: subterfuge journal
Slightly different stlye FR to usual as it wasn't really an approach fest! Spent all night with a group of girls - just I failed to really attempt to escalate at all. I'm so used to getting shot down at the open that I felt a bit out of my depth when I wasn't shot down, lol and despite reading so much theory and stuff, I just wasn't really sure how to escalate.

I was out with 2 friends. One of them is like male model good looking which possibly affected me a bit.
We were at a table drinking, and there were 3 hot girls on the same table all talking with each other. One of the girls was GORGROUS by the way. We'll call tehm brunette, horse girl (the super hot one) and blonde.
We hadn't opened them yet and had just been talking amongst ourselves.
2 of the girls got up to go to the bathroom leaving blonde by herself. None of my friends would open her so I decided to 'man up'.

I said ''They've left you alone with us!'' She replied ''yeah, they must trust you!''. I said ''Yeah, they really shouldn't. We're blatant perverts. You're in trouble'' She started laughing and within seconds we were all chatting and laughing. Her friends came back from the bathroom and now it's like we're a big group of friends all chatting and laughing. We all gets shots in a stuff. I'm trying to remember to tease them etc - I'm trying to keeo it fun and light. We get some shit tests about our age but handle it well I think.
We all move on too another bar. The horse girl has been a bit glued to her phone all night. Apparently a new boyfriend she has.

The blonde girl tells me that I should make a move on the brunette friend. I dont know why she'd say that. Could this mean that her friend told her that she liked me or something? I have no idea.
The blonde gilr is obsessed with my super handsome friend even though he's not really said anything, lol. She is all over him, but he has a GF and doesn't tend to cheat anymore. This kind of threw me off because she was the one I seemed to get along best with maybe, but it's hard to escalate when you know she fancies your friend!

There's not a great more to add as at one point in the night they all dissappeared. Maybe the blonde one decided that since she couldn't get my friend they'd go elswhere.
I don't think I done anything like enogh in the way of escalation, though.
Wasn't really sure how to start without it being 'creepy'

I was also kind of torn between all of the girls and never really zoned in on one in particualr which was probably another mistake. I kind of fancied them all. THe girl with the boyfriend in particular! I spoke with them all and projected fun and teased them at every opportunity, but never escalated beyond that.

IN terms of escalation, I spoke with the brunette a fair bit and we spoke about dating and various shit and I tried to make it a bit flirty, and I touched her like on the arm to make points and stuff, but I just never felt as though I could escalate more without it seeming creepy and weird. I think I always need an unrealstic level of IOI's from the girl before I feel as though I can escalate which is obviously never really gonna happen so I need to fix that somehow and risk some very awkward kino rejections.

I don't think I made any statements of intent like telling any of them that they were hot.

So I fucked up, but to be honest it was kind of a confidence boost to have such a positive, long interaction rather than just getting told to go away 8 times, lol

I think the lesson is that I need to grow some balls in terms of escalation and risk coming off as a uncalibrated creep who 'miss-read' the signals. Maybe need to use statements of intent to kind of prepare her for more physical escalation so it seems less weird
07-30-2017 07:36 AM
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Post: #178
RE: subterfuge journal
She was attractive, but nowhere near my ideal age bracket! I like girls aged like 16-22 - she was nearly 40 and her kid was sleeping next door whilst I fukced her, lol

Polish. Not much to write in terms of an FR. I approached her on the dance floor with some comment about the ridiculous dancing that i'd just been doing with my mates for self amusement purposes, and I was immediately physical and pulled her towards me.
We laughed and flirted. Memory is a bit hazy, but I think I ws much more VERBALLY direct than usual. I was telling her how hot she is, which is probably a technical mistake?

It went well, but shortly after she kind of moved away from me and danced with her friend (there was 2 of them)
She done it in what I felt was a mildy rude way? Almost mid sentence! I presumed it to be some sort of a mild shit test to see if I would be like a needy puppy and follow her around.

I didn't. I just went back to the bar and laughed and joked with my mate.
About 20 minutes later, we made eye contact across the room. I think she might have actually winked at me, lol.
I beckoned her over. She beckoned me over. I buckled and went towards her and said ''How dare you make me come to you! You and I aren't gonna get along! bla bla bla''

She ate it up. I made sure to get her friend involved in the jokes since they were by themselves. In fact, I was basically flirting with her too as, despite the friend being a little chubby, she had a gorgeous face and eyes. I'm a face man.
I think I might have even made a clumbsy attempt at angling for a threesome, lol. Didn't work!
Anyway, went back to her house that she shares with her son, and banged her for 2 hours or so.
Was fun.

However, 2 things are on my mind:

1 / I was a pussy. I basically got lucky with this one, really. I wasn't approaching for shit, really. Weak sauce. AA has come back to bite me hard recently

2/In the same vain, i've never done day game, but earlier when I was walking from this girls house, I saw a STUNNING girl walk past me. Just perfection. She was like my idea of a 10. I just could NOT bring myself to open her. Angry at myself. Almost put me in a bad mood now, lol - Kudos to the guys who do day game. I was paralysed.
08-06-2017 04:47 AM
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Post: #179
RE: subterfuge journal
Brief FR: First one since getting laid a few weeks back

Was out with my male model looking friend which always gives the night a different dynamic, lol

First open was a 'warm approach' - (I later found out that she was into me!)

Me an my friend were talking to his ex GF and her friend was lingering around so I got her in on the conversation. I made some playful assumptions about her and she was cracking up laughing. She then told her friend ''he's funny!''. I pulled back slightly as I didn't want to be a clown and we chatted a bit more. Me and my friend had to go, but we arranged to meet up with them later.

Next bar. 2 hot girls are sitting down. Me and my friend are standing near them just chatting. I can tell that despite my friends super good looks, he hasn't got the balls to open them. I decide to rock an old school opinion opener. It works and I get a 'positive' reaction i.e - I don't get the typical ''Who are you and why do you think you can talk to me'' reaction I often get.

I think I might start to bring these back! I mean, I'm still mainly trying to implement the 'fun' openers that most people have recommend but in terms of not getting an instant rejection,they seem to do best for me statistically.


We chat about the opener for a little bit and then I start to ask them about themselves. I can instantly tell that they aren't really into me, though AND they have boyfriends. I try to stick in there (trying to practice NEVER bailing early and wait for them to leave r literally tell me to fuck off), but they end up getting up and saying 'nice to meet you' to us and leave the bar.

Go too a different bar. I try going direct and I open a girl and tell her that I think she's super cute. She's kind of stuck up and knows she's perfect looking and basically says that with her eyes, lol. I ask her how her night is going but she gives me the back turn. Whatever. I was in a really good 'state' for some reason last night, and this rejection didn't hurt at all.

I open a few girls with various openers like ''Welcome to my bar!'', ''are you checking out my instagram?'' (girl on phone), and other openers like that. I was in a good state, but it wasn't my night. Couldn't seem to get anything going with he girls I opened.

At this point my friend gets a text from his ex telling us to meet them and that her friend fancies me! haha. Don't think i've ever heard of a girl fancying me in my 30 years,lol.

So we go and meet them (there's about 5 girls), but for some reason, the girl who is apparently into me seems much harder work than earlier! I don't know if it's maybe because she knows that I know that she likes me? Hard to explain, but she just seemed a little cold and I wasn't sure what to say/do to pull her. I was feeling that I was now the one chasing too much and she was kind of playing hard to get. I kind of gave up and just flirted with the other girls at the table.

At this point, something awesome happened. I'm not a good looking guy at all in my opinion. Probably in most peoples opinions. But some hot girl gave the most blatant IOI's i've ever experienced in my whole 30 years! She looked at me and smiled. Then she winked at me! I noticed she was with a guy though who looked to be her BF so I didn't do anything. About 30 seconds later I looked over to her again and she was leaving with him, but on the way, she looked at me again and puckered her lips as if to kiss me from a distance. Maybe it was the social proof if sitting with like 5 girls. I don't know. Gave me a confidence boost, though. Even though I'm about 99% sure she was with the guy, I'm still angry at myself for not opening her! What a dickhead I am!! Would have been so cool to be like ''You aren't allowed to look at me like that without saying hi!!''
Anyway, made a few more opens, but nothing really hooked.


Fairly fun night, though
(This post was last modified: 08-20-2017 08:15 AM by subterfuge.)
08-20-2017 07:47 AM
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Post: #180
RE: subterfuge journal
You always seem to do better when you're out with your goodlooking friend. Why do you think that is?

"Their emotional waves will swamp you if you're just quietly-floating, so you need to learn to surf." - AnonymousBosch

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08-20-2017 07:48 PM
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Post: #181
RE: subterfuge journal
(08-20-2017 07:48 PM)King of Monkeys Wrote:  You always seem to do better when you're out with your goodlooking friend. Why do you think that is?

I don't know. I have a few theories.

First theory is simply because i'm in a better mood when i'm out with him than when with my usual friends I drink with. I've known him for like 20 years and we're just super close. (it's because of him that I managed to get laid a few times when i was young. He'd literally pull 2 girls effortlessly at 2am just by saying 'hi...we're going back to mine. Come with us' and then he'd throw the one he didn't want onto me!)

I don't get to see him loads anymore since he's settled down with a serious GF, and so when I do see him, we have so much to talk and laugh about and we are just in a good state.

He's had a lifetime of pussy throwing itself at him, and so he just doesn't give off a creepy vibe at all. Being good looking girls know that he's not desperate.

When I'm with him and I approach girls, it almost feels like a form of social proof? Bit like if some random guy starts hanging around the high school promKing super-jock, he kind of become cool by association!!? lol

With the guys I usually 'game' with, they are all possibly even worse than me with girls. They don't give off a 'cool' vibe at all. Girls can sense this. They are very negative to be around and constantly say things that put me out of state. LIke, if there's a super hot teenage girl and I say i'm gonna approach her, one in particular is like ''Mate, she's super hot. You've got no chance. We aren't young or good looking! Wait for an easier target!''.

This also makes me feel more 'judged' when I'm out with my usual drinking buddies which might effect my game a little, too. I'm often more worried about how my friends will react to me getting rejected by a hot girl, than the rejection from the girl herself!!
(This post was last modified: 08-21-2017 05:29 AM by subterfuge.)
08-21-2017 05:24 AM
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Post: #182
RE: subterfuge journal
Your other friends suck as far as I can tell. You know how much more balls you got than them just going up and talking to that hot girl even when they try to dissuade you from doing it? Wrecking ball-sized. Have you thought about finding game aware friends to go out with? While you can do solo decently, I think things might click for you if you had friendly competition to work with to push you to succeed instead of friends who work to bring you down to their level.

"Their emotional waves will swamp you if you're just quietly-floating, so you need to learn to surf." - AnonymousBosch

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08-21-2017 03:05 PM
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Post: #183
RE: subterfuge journal
(08-21-2017 03:05 PM)King of Monkeys Wrote:  Your other friends suck as far as I can tell. You know how much more balls you got than them just going up and talking to that hot girl even when they try to dissuade you from doing it? Wrecking ball-sized. Have you thought about finding game aware friends to go out with? While you can do solo decently, I think things might click for you if you had friendly competition to work with to push you to succeed instead of friends who work to bring you down to their level.

Yeah, they do suck, but they're good people in general. Even fun in certain environments. But they're good examples of how general success doesn't necessarily translate into success with girls which is the dream we often seem to be sold in the pickup community. Every one of them is VERY clever. All have top degrees and very well paid jobs etc. Just that they are shit with girls. Probably too much time studying in school and not socialising.

I'm more the other way. I've had more success with girls than them, but i'm not close to any of them in terms of intelligence or general success in life.

And yes, i'd love to go out with other people who are mildly 'game aware' and will encourage me as opposed to make me feel a bit deluded to approach a hot girl. But in my part of the UK, the only place I could meet people (such as the RSD inner circle or whatever) is in London, and it's a pretty big expense for me to get there and back with cabs and trains and expensive drinks etc, especially considering I don't have much money at all. I've started some threads on various game forums on the off chance that someone lives in my town, but no such luck.
08-21-2017 04:38 PM
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Post: #184
RE: subterfuge journal
Lay report - nothing to get overly excited about, though

Ok, out last night .

We go too a bar and it's fairly slim pickings.

My AA has become quite extreme recently which makes me sad. I just can NOT open at at the moment.

My friend opens a set by asking her about her drink. Fair play to him. They kind of join us and one of the girls asks my name. I immediately 'switch it on' and I'm being silly, talking to her and asking her questions as if i'm suspicious of her and it seems to hook her. We banter back and forth, but the set kind of dies. Partly because the atmosphere gets a bit weird when my 2 friends fail to keep the attentions of the other 2 girls. We lose the set. I could have got her number but wasn't that into my one much, anyway.

Another set walks in and they're hot, but I don't have the balls to open. It's like every open feels weird in my head if I imagine saying it. Like, I see these 3 hot girls and I think ''Hey, how's your night goin?......nahhh...to chodey. Open with something fun? Errr....can't really think of anything. Open with like ''Who are you? but with lots of intensity a bit like JulianRSD?,.......Nahh, this is a quiet bar. It's early. It'll make me look like a psychopath.....

I'm feeling like a pussy, but i'm also in a good flow because I know that I was able to get attraction with the girl from earlier.

We go too another bar and I bump into 2 girls I know. This almost never happens. I don't know that many girls anymore. They're both 5's, but one of them in particular has a bit of a crush on me. Other girls seem to sense it and I really felt some social proof happening. Yareally once said that even if the girls aren't that hot, other girls STILL put you on their radar if other girls seem interested in you.
I'm talking to the one who I doubt fancies me, and another girl joins in our conversation. We'll call the other girl 'Becky'. I notice her because even though she's chubby, she has jet black hair and killer blue eyes. I adore that combo.

I ask her who she is and we make small talk. Becky mentioned the tits that the girl I was speaking too had, maybe to see if i'd be all prudish? I just agreed and said ''I know. I wanna motor boat them puppies!'' in front of both girls. Then Becky told me she was a lesbian. I laughed and she said '''seriously!! I like girls!'' I said ''Me too!! We have so much in common!!''

We started talking more. At this point I assumed she definitely was a lesbian. She even looked a bit like one with her punky dress, nose piercings and shit. I though ''Since she's a lesbo, I'll just completely show my intent just for fun since it's funny trying to pull a girl who just told you she's a lesbian''
We were just talking about nothing, but I was giving her huge laser eye contact and looking at her lips. I wondered if she'd even noticed, but shortly after she said ''Ok, I'm not sure about the way you're looking at me''. I just carried on starring at her like i'd barely heard her and said ''Like what?'' and she said ''Like you want to fuck the shit out of me''. I wasn't sure what to said but I kind of smirked and carried on holding eye contact and said ''Interesting'' and then just asked her about her tattoos or something, all the while giving her the same eye contact.

She told me to come with her to the bar and she bought me a shot. She said something about how since she's a lesbian we can find girls to bang together and help each other out, lol.
Back outside, carried on talking and shit, and then she said ''My friend and I are going home in a second''. I said 'That's very forward of you, but thanks. Yeah, i'll come''. She cracked up laughing and said ''I wasn't in inviting you!'', but then about 5 seconds later she grabbed my arm and said ''let's go'' and rushed me out of there.

We meet her friend who is BAT SHIT CRAZY! She also seems to HATE me! She's aggressive as fuck and drunk and probably high. She just pulled some random guy who drives us all back to the girls house.
In the car we're in the back seat and it's dark. I try to kiss her and she pulls away.
We go back to the house and the crazy house mate and the guy she just pulled go straight upstairs.
Me and Becky pour a drink and go and sit outside in the garden.
We talk about this and that. I'm trying to keep the sexual vibe up and I go for the kiss again after a few minutes, lol. She kisses me back for a second but pulls away again.
Now she's telling me that she's not a proper lesbian. She fucks guys, but she likes girls and is trying to bang the hot girl she works with. The conversation is obviously getting sexual and I just start playing with her legs. She tells me it's bed time but that nothings gonna happen. I just say ''Ok''
We get on her bed. I try a few times to kiss her and eventually she gives in. We end up fucking.

Positives:
I'm definitely getting better in bed! The Polish girl I banged in my last LR has been all over me on facebook trying to make me a fuck buddy. This hasn't happened to me before.
And the girl from last night kept saying how good I was and how she hasn't been banged that hard in years, lol. It's funny because i've had LESS sex than about 99% of guys my age!
My mid game is getting better.
I'm better at showing my intent and actually leading the interaction forward.

NEGATIVES
She wasn't all that hot. She was pretty overweight. I can't lie.
I am a PUSSY at opening. I have just completely lost my balls and any sort of ability I had in the past to open. It's wierd to be at this stage. I feel as though some things are probably improving such as leading/showing intent etc, but If i'm only able to do this with warm approaches or when i'm opened or whatever, then it's not great!

After all this time my sticking point is still the open and the initial few minutes to help reach the hook point.

I also need to raise my standards a little now. As someone whose had a fairly sexless life, i've wanted to just get some practice at having sex, and even in just a few bangs I feel fairly confident in that department now and I don't feel so inferior to other men that I used too (even though my lay count is still obviously very low compared to most guys) but now I really want to get with hotter girls and will pass up any easy lays who I don't think are hot enough
08-27-2017 07:06 AM
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Post: #185
RE: subterfuge journal
Main goal last night was to actually approach, as i've been the biggest pussy on planet earth in that respect recently, and all of my success has come from warm approaches, really. I managed to open a few sets last night so i'm proud in that respect, but I was aweful, lol. However, I did end up making out with a fairly hot girl who is the friend of the girl I banged last week:

First open was a super hot 18 year old. JUST MY TYPE! I was standing next to her, thinking of how best to open her, when she accidentally flicked a little bit of water on my as she grabbed the drinks menu. I was like ”Hey!…you did that on purpose” and smiled. She kind of laughed back and said ”sorry’. I though i’d play a ‘cocky’ type line and said ”I think you were just trying to get my attention” and she was like ”nope”.

I re-engaged her and was like ”haha, i’m just being an asshole, who are you?” and she gave me her name. I asked her what the occasion was, and she told me it was her 18th birthday. I didn’t have any cool lines and just said ''Cool, happy birthday!''

In my head now as I just can’t think of anything to say, I quickly attempt to go into a small routine I read about commenting a girls facial expressions, but she pretty much palmed me off onto her friend a few seconds in, lol. Her friend was possibly even icier cold. I said ‘hey’ to the friend, asked her a few quetsions, made a statement about her interesting looking drink, but I felt as though she was giving me NOTHING, (other than them expressions that girls give that make me think they’re thinking ”’this is weird. go away” lol)


Next, I open 2 more girls who are near the bar with the ‘do I look like a drug dealer’ opener. They both just kind of shake their head and I plow on about how a few girls have asked me for weed. I try again to carry on the conversation and talk about how I think it’s my new haircut bla bla bla. They don’t respond. I cut the thread and ask them how their night is going. They’re like ‘good’. I say ‘out of 10?” and she’s like ‘7’. I accuse her of not trying hard enough and that she needs to raise her game and then say ‘go and make out with that girl!’. She laughs.

I wonder if I should make that line into my own little routine or not. Anyway, her friend then brings over 2 guys who I think are their boyfriends and she says ”anyway, nice to meet you” to me.

Next I open another 2 girls who are seated down. This one was quite painful, lol. One hot girl and one very average girl. I decide to open the average girl. I thought i'd try to be more 'normal' and not worry about self amusing/standing out etc with this one just too experiment. I approach the table and ask them what’s up. I tell them they look like they’re having a business meeting. They sort of did, lol. The average one smiles but she just has a super suspicious look on her face like she’s confused about me approaching her. I ask her the usual name/plans for the night stuff.

I’m try to get the hot one talking. She tells me her name, but she’s making a point of looking around the room as if to increase the social pressure on me and make me leave. It’s working! lol. I decide to call her out like i’ve seen MaxRSD and i’m like ”Do you hate me!?” and smile.

She just very slowly hakes her head, still looking at me like i’ve got 6 eyes. At this point my friend jumps in, and within a few seconds, the girl grabs her friends hand and they walk out.

Dancefloor approach. 2 girls. One fairly good looking and thin. The other is a bit fat but has a really pretty face. I open the thin one and my friend opens the fat one. I ask her who she is and decide to try a more direct approach and tell her I think she’s cute. She tells me she married and not interested straight away.
I try to carry on talking for a bit, just to wing my friend and stop her from cock blocking him.
Now I notice one of the girls from my last FR. A decent looking blonde with ridiculously nice tits who is a friend of the girl I took home last week. I grab her. We’re talking about last weekend and stuff for like 10 minutes. We split up briefly and I open 2 asian girls who are a bit older, but since they were so crazy, that were actually easy to talk to compared to the previous brick walls.

Like, they actually asked me questions straight away! It changes everything. I just don’t know how you can have more than a 10 second converstaion with a girl who gives you one word replies or just doesn’t reply at all, lol

I go back to the bar and bump into blonde again. She asks me about the Asian girls I was just talking too. It’s now pretty obvious i’ve got a shot here. I make a joke about them wanting a greencard and they’re gonna pay me in blowjobs or something (attempt to sexualise the conversation) It works, she takes the ball, and soon we’re talking about sexual experiences. (queue lots of lying and made up sex stories on my part!)
It’s going OK, but i’ve not kissed her or done much kino other than taps on the arm and stuff. This is where I usually overthink everything and am thinking ''how the hell do I actually escalate?!!'' but this time, I done the opposite and litterally just grabbed her in a break in the conversation almost out of nowhere and and kissed her; She kissed back. lots of kino and flirting and stuff from that point. all kinds of logistic issues, though. It’s likely that I can get her though. Will update that one in the future.

So, long story short, very happy that I found my balls and actually made some approaches, but they were all pretty bad, Nothing close to really ‘hooking’. Awkward silences. Nothing coming to my mind in the moment etc. I escalated well on the warm approach though, so every cloud..
(This post was last modified: 09-03-2017 07:25 AM by subterfuge.)
09-03-2017 07:23 AM
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Post: #186
RE: subterfuge journal
last night, after watching some stuff by that evolutionDaily dude, I decided to try more direct game for the night too experiment.

I actually found it more fun. Something about laying your cards on the table seems to actually TAKE AWAY some of the pressure for some reason. strange. I've almost always stuck with indirect game.
No real luck unfortunately, but here's what happened:

At the bar waiting to get a beer - Make eye contact with the bar girl and am just about to get served. Some girl next to me asks me if i've been served yet, and then as I answer her, the bar girl serves her friend instead of me since i'm engaged in conversation.

I playfully said ''wait, what the fuck just happened!!? You totally just used some weird trick to jump in front of me to get served before me! I couldn't hate you more!'
She cracked up laughing. It wasn't even that funny but she loved it.

She kept apologizing and I was pretended to be in shock and teased her. Then I said ''fuck it. I'll let you off just this once. You're cute. Who are you?!!'' She answered. Her friend was looking at us both now. I noticed and said '''what's up? You should choose your friends more carefully This one's bad news!'' and high fived her. She smiled, and I entered small talk and asked them what they were up too and stuff. We had a short conversation, but we were at a busy bar, I had loads of my friends there that I wanted to speak too and it was very early anyway, so wasn't gonna try to pull her. I should have maybe got her number because she was so receptive to me which i'm not used too, but in the end, they went off to meet their friends but were smiling and laughing when they left me and said ''it was nice meeting you!''

Then I notice 2 girls standing around chatting. One of them had on a dress with love hearts. My friend also spotted them and told me to open her with a comment about her dress, lol. I didn't really car about geting rejected, and even though it felt like a weird opem, I went with ''Hey, you! I've got a shirt just like this dress! (grabbed the material) I wear it every valentines night. Never lets me down!'' They both laughed, and then called me out and said ''Is that your chat up line?'' (Brain = SHIT TEST!??? Agree and amplify""")
I said ''Yep. i use it almost everytime. People like it. I can tell you liked it, too'' She said ''well, aren't you sure of yourself!'' -

I kind of ignored her question and asked them what they were up too and stuff. I wish I could remember what I said after because my sticking poing is 'the hook', but I certainly reached it this time, and before long we were chatting whilst my friends looked on and then they invited me outside.
We were chatting and I was teasing them and it was going good. We went back indoors and one of teh girls said ''You should get my friends number!''
Brilliant.

Now, shit took a huge 180!! We got to the bar and one of the girls suggested shots. I ordered 3 shots, and then one of the girls started ordering fucking gin and tonics and shit on top and then said ''It's OK, this guys gonna pay!''.

I said ''whoa, fuck that. i'm not some idiot. You can get your own drinks on top.'' Then she started getting all sassy and the atmospehere just got weird. We all felt it, lol. We drank out shots, and the friend said something like ''you can go now''. Im sure I could have stuck in their and turned it around, but I just couldn't be bothered. I didn't even like them much, although they were pretty hot. I ejected soon after.
I go too a different bar and as i'm getting served, I notice the gorgeous, tanned, middle eastern looking teenage girl next to me.

I look at her and say ''Shit. You're cute. You look like an Arabian princess or something!'' (opening direct really seems like more fun. I'm gonna continue with it for a few weeks)
She cracks up laughing and tells her friend what I said. I ask her where she's from, what her plans are for the night, bla bla bla.

We have a little chat and she was again fairly receptive. No awkward vibe where it feels like they just want you to go away or are thinking 'Errr.....this is weird. Why are you talking to me? I don't know you!''
In fact, this was the first night in ages where that never happened. Bnus
I don't want to be a routines monkey, but I still feel as though I need better 'material' for after teh open.
After a few minutes, I eject, but it felt like leaving on a high note rather than some bad rejection like I tend to get, lol

Unfortunately, my night was cut short. ONe of my friends got kicked out of the bar, and around here, once you're thrown out, the bouncers are on their radios too each other, and they just won't let you in anywhere else. Ended up going to some little party, but there was no single girls there, so night over.
It was fun though. Gonna stick withj more direct opening for a few weeks.
I've always avoided it because mystery is still thought of as the godfather of PUA, and he obviously was very much against being direct and stuff, so it felt silly to go against his theories.
I just like trying new shit, because it's the only way to feel as though you're growing
09-10-2017 06:39 AM
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Post: #187
RE: subterfuge journal
I want to give you props for being consistent with your journal for upward of a year now.

Keep up the good work.

When some girl throws out shots as an idea, come back with something clear for you and your boys, and shots of water for the girls. Extra if you get tequila and also ask for limes for all of them.

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09-16-2017 05:37 PM
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Post: #188
RE: subterfuge journal
(09-16-2017 05:37 PM)polar Wrote:  I want to give you props for being consistent with your journal for upward of a year now.

Keep up the good work.

Thanks, buddy. Always nice to get a response in the journal. Good or bad! I don't really care, lol.
09-17-2017 06:23 AM
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Post: #189
RE: subterfuge journal
Do you go out every night or only on some nights? I think I might have to do night game or something like it. Otherwise, I always find an excuse not to talk or approach someone.

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09-18-2017 09:01 PM
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Post: #190
RE: subterfuge journal
(09-18-2017 09:01 PM)King of Monkeys Wrote:  Do you go out every night or only on some nights? I think I might have to do night game or something like it. Otherwise, I always find an excuse not to talk or approach someone.

Only a few nights per week i'm afraid. I'd love to go out everynight, but money and lack of willing wings....
09-20-2017 06:52 PM
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Post: #191
RE: subterfuge journal
Somewhat uneventful FR, but still wanna write it down as I like to journal everything and look back/remind myself of various things.
I was in Brighton which is a fairly cool seaside resort town in the UK.

First approach I was on the dancefloor and there’s 2 girls next to me. An 8 and a 5. I’m a little bit in my head as i’ve not made an approach in 2 weeks for various reasons. I also have a woeful track record for dancefloor approaches. Had some very embarrassing, brutal rejections in my time on the dancefloor, lol.

Anyway, I’m dancing near them and I hear the 5 tell the 8 that that she’s going to the bar and she leaves. I just say the first thing that pops into my head and open the 8 and it’s something like ”your friend really shouldn’t leave you alone with just me. I get very ‘handsy”’ She cracks up laughing. I go into a JulianRSDpimp vibe and fire questions at her in a kind of accusatory fashion. She seems to hook and is asking me things back. I’m giving her playful answers. Her friend comes back. I can’t remember what I said here but I definitely managed to win the friend over and made her laugh.

A few minutes later the 5 says ”we’re going outside”. I say ”You’re leaving me!! How rude” and pretend to be like mock-offended. The 8 says ”You can come”. I say ”lets do it” and lead them outside.

Here I bump into all of my friends. A mix of guys and girls. They greet me which I guess is good social proof, however, immediately one of my lame friends (one of the few people even worse than me with girls!! Smile) jumps in and starts getting involved which I kind of felt killed the vibe a little bit. He never opens girls. Only jumps in to sets that I open.

I move attention to the 8 again and I’m chatting and making her laugh. Making silly assumptions about her. At one point I tell her that she must be a pisces. I was right. Now, I don’t know shit about startsigns but I know it can be ‘chick crack’ as Tyler used to say. She’s mildy impressed that I got it right and I tell her it’s a gift I have. Then she says to me ”OK, what about her!?” (points at the 5)
Without skipping a beat I say ”Well she’s obviously a capricorn! Clear as fucking day. I know capricorn girls”. I literally only know like 3 starsigns and it was just luck, but her mouth drops in shock. Then she grabs her friend whilst my friend is running his ‘game’ and interrupts them and tells them what just happened. The 5 is like ”What he got both of them first time?! How?!!”. Was quite funny.
It was all going well from my perspective, but a few minutes later, the 5 said ”Anyway, it was nice meeting you” and grabbed the 8’s wrist. She said something like ”Come find us later” but I didn’t see them again.

Then I opened a girl when I was by myself coming out of the bathroom and she was walking past me fast. I stopped her and decided to try the evolutionDaily guy style - So I used some fake ”familiarity opener” and pretended to recognise her from somewhere but them quickly followed up with ”I’m just talking shit. I just thought you were hot and wanted to say hi”. I ran a little routine about her facial expression and one about the rings on her finger but I never really felt that I had a shot.

It just didn’t feel like it was going anywhere. IN hindsight I guess I should have tried to move her around and lead her somewhere – maybe teh dancefloor or outside or something instead of just standing near the bathrooms in near where people were sitting down and stuff. She ended up bailing after about 5 minutes.

I went to the bar and realised i’m standing next too another 8 who appears to be with 2 friends. I notice she has small feet and I open her and tease her about her tiny feet. She actually hooks fast and tells me her friends make fun of her about them. I’m like ”I don’t blame them! They’re ridiculous!” I tease her about wearing childs shoes and stuff. Then I ask her a bit about her self. Then her friend who has just got served turns towards us and is just looking so I quickly try to get her involved and tell her that the 8 was just flirting with me and introduce myself. The 8 giggles, but the 5 just doesn’t really seem to like me much and looks at me like i’m gonna potentially ruin her girly night with her friends, lol and she basically pulls the other 2 away.

Annoyingly (and I don’t know whether it’s accurate) but my friend said that he overheard the hot one say that I was ”alright” (which basically means sex-worthy here in England in that context lol) so maybe I had a better shot than I realised
There were a few other opens that I can’t recall very clearly, and I also could have had sex with one of the girls in my group, but I had no interest in that. She not my type at all, and even though I still want to get my lay count up too that of a proper person, I have to have SOME standards! lol – would probably be different if I was a virgin, though.

So yeah, fairly uneventful.

I’m probably JINXING myself here, but on the plus side, I’ve gotten much fewer ”Who the fuck are you and why are you talking to me!?” type reactions/expressions from girls i’ve opened recently – possibly a result of just being slightly less anxious about it all, or maybe just luck.
(This post was last modified: 10-01-2017 10:29 AM by subterfuge.)
10-01-2017 10:28 AM
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Post: #192
RE: subterfuge journal
i'm guessing the issue in the sets was that they weren't attracted enough to stick around. I done my best to 'build attraction' and used every trick i'm aware of, but no joy that night.

I'm not sure if there was an issue in regards to something like showing too much intent / not showing enough intent / not enough kino etc.

They were all 'good interactions' which i'm pleased about (No, ''can you leave us alone'' instantly after the open, which is nice) but

I'd describe it as:
Set 1 - not enough attraction. 2 girls by themselves and me and a wingman, so technically perfect and no excuse on their part to want to leave after 10 minutes other than they weren't feeling it.

Set 2 - not enough attraction, although she also had a table of friends who she wanted to spend time with as opposed to chatting with some random dude

Set 3 - my fault. I more or less ejected myself in this set. Just basically ran out of things to say after a good start with the hottest girl of the group. It all dropped a bit, and then they left.
10-04-2017 08:47 AM
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Post: #193
RE: subterfuge journal
Laid last night. Teenager 15 years my junior, lol.

I’d give her a 6.5-7. Slim. Gorgeous, see-through blue eyes.

Dancefloor pull. It was a shitshow of comedy errors that possibly worked in my favour. (after I’d established lots of attraction, she caught me kissing some girl on the dancefloor, lol)

I somehow recovered and got her back onside.

And then, like a bad comedy, she AGAIN saw me kiss another girl whilst she was at the bar buying me a drink!!
haha By the way, this sort of thing never happens to me (kissing numerous girls per night) so i’m not bragging. But it was just hilarious in hindsight.

Her friend was warning her away from me after being caught kissing someone and this made the girl want me more. crazy.
Actually failed to bang her last night (first time in my life i’ve failed to get past LMR. I’ve never experienced it much if at all, but she was kind of pretty adamant about it and my usual technique of just saying ‘ok’ kissing her, getting her turned on, and then ploughing ahead towards her pussy left me at risk of being way too rapey since it was a 'hard no' and not a soft one, so I just gave up and let her sleep) but I banged her this morning instead
Honestly didn’t learn a great deal last night, but still pretty fun


edit: Just to add some more detail to the whole night -
In terms of interactions, i’m trying to piece it together!

I opened up these 2 gorgeous girls, but it was my first approach of the night and I was way in me head. It was some sort of opinion opener. I followed by asking their names and stuff (breaking rapport tonailty) but I wasn’t really able too hook and I kind of ejected soon after. One was 18 and totally my type!

Then when I came back from the bathroom I saw 2 girl sitting down. Can’t remember how I opened, but a few seconds later I was chatting to them both, sat down with them at their table and the vibe was very good. One of them asked who I was with and I joked about being scared to intodduce them to him as he’s too good looking (he’s like model good looking and has girls throwing themselves at him all the time). I ended up bringing him over. We all chatted. Then I lead them to the dancefloor and it actually seemed to be going OK and we were all having fun and a little kino in there, but they just bolted after a while. I was slightly surprised to be honest. I just felt kind of ‘on’.

Was still feeling stifled. Carried on just being generally socialble.

Then we went to this little club which is when I started to get lucky.

I actually tend to get non-stop rejected with dancefloor game, but something was different last night!
I was generally well received. This is when I noticed the girl I ended up pulling. She was blatantly trying to get in my space. I just grabbed her and was like ”Who are you?!” and pulled her towards me. Started kissing soon after.

Then we kind of separated and some giel basically stood on my shoe. I grabbed her and smiled and accused her of doing it on purpose. She smiled back and sort of closed the space, and I just pulled her towards me and kissed her.

The second I stopped kissing her, the original girl and her friend just looked at me horrified. The girl I originally kissed looked really sad and I felt like shit tbh. The friend looked disappointed and wagged her finger at me and pulled her friend away.

I called her towards me and few times and sehe refused, but eventually I managed to talk to her and was basically like ”Don’t get in a mood! She kissed me and I pulled away. No big deal. I want your babies” and then we started kissing again and it was back on.
She told me she was gonna buy me a drink and went to the bar
As they were gone, some girl started dancing near me and I just looked at her with a confused smirk and beckoned her towards me and we kissed.

As I look up, the main girl and her friend are there AGAIN looking at me!!

I'm mortified. Been caught out again. What a MORON! haha

This time I assume it’s fucked and half give up.

I must have been wearing the right aftershave last night, because whilst I was still in the vicinity of the original girl ANOTHER girl opened ME up! Almost never happens. She just walked up to me and asked my name and stood by me, Huge IOI. heavy eye contact too
Then the original girls FRIEND walked over to me and this new girl and whispered something in her ear and they had a brief chat. She seemed quite confrontational in fact. Not sure what she said.

A this point the new girl got a bit colder and sort of moved away and then I somehow managed the get the orignal girl back again who was still kind of close. I think I apologised and said ”Sorry. I’m an asshole” then lead her outside, walked her and her friend towards the cab rank, then me and the girl branched off and then took her back to have sex
10-08-2017 08:53 AM
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Post: #194
RE: subterfuge journal
(07-29-2017 06:18 AM)subterfuge Wrote:  5/ Girl is hanging up her leopard print jacket. I looki at it and smile and say ''If this is real leopard print, we can't be friends'' I think it was funny, lol. She gives me the classic look of contempt and says ''Yeah, Byyeeeeeee'' and turns away towards some other dude.

On this one, I'd turn it into a question and try giving her a pretext to see herself as a wild/bad girl. Ask her if she hunted the leopard herself. See where she goes with it.

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10-08-2017 11:08 AM
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Post: #195
RE: subterfuge journal
(10-08-2017 11:08 AM)Jetset Wrote:  On this one, I'd turn it into a question and try giving her a pretext to see herself as a wild/bad girl. Ask her if she hunted the leopard herself. See where she goes with it.

Yep. It's better than what my brain comes up with in the moment. I'm just not that witty, lol. At least if this situation arises again, i'll have something better to say Smile
10-10-2017 03:13 PM
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Post: #196
RE: subterfuge journal
Keep it up, my dude. I'm also exclusively night game, and am gaining tons of motivation from this thread. Keep on slaying!
10-10-2017 07:06 PM
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RE: subterfuge journal
(10-10-2017 07:06 PM)RockOn Wrote:  Keep it up, my dude. I'm also exclusively night game, and am gaining tons of motivation from this thread. Keep on slaying!

Thanks, man.
I'm still pretty shit to be honest. I must be a slow learner! Some of my interactions are still like that of a complete newbie! Once I can master reaching the hookpoint and getting them talking and asking me questions, I feel as though i'll be able to improve my hit rate as my 'mid game' has certainly improroved a little bit, but i'm yet to find the magic ingredient in terms of the open and the first 3-5 mins.
I'm slightly cringing when thinking back to my first interaction the other night with the hot 18 year old and her friend.

Having said that, I think i'm on 6 cold approach lays now in this journal -and even though some guys get that in a week or two, I was almost a virgin when I started this thread and certainly feel less anxious about my sexlife (or lack of it)

My friends now seem me as the sex-pest guy who fucks whatever he can get (sometimes hot girls, sometimes not to hot girls) instead of the guy who basically never gets laid, and I certainly prefer that, lol
(This post was last modified: 10-11-2017 06:18 AM by subterfuge.)
10-11-2017 06:17 AM
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Post: #198
RE: subterfuge journal
I deserve to fall off of the front page for now after basically failing to make any proper approaches this weekend, despite being out in London. Don't know what was wrong with me.
Was just stuck in my head about how to open and was just picturing a really awkward interaction in my head each time I contemplated opening a girl.
I think it started on my way to meet my friends when I saw a stunning 10/10 girl waiting at the bus stop. I bottled the approach, and I think maybe that set the pattern for the whole night.
Hope to find my balls again soon
10-23-2017 09:32 AM
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Post: #199
RE: subterfuge journal
Have you tried doing really bad Shakespeare?

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10-23-2017 08:14 PM
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RE: subterfuge journal
Found my balls last night after last weeks shambles of approach anxiety

Rough night, though.

In brief:

I see a group of 3. I open them all and ask where their Halloween costumes are? They flip it back on me and say ''Why are YOU not wearing a costume!?'' I tell them that I am, and that i'm usually a tall black man. They laugh. I ask them what they are up too. I ask the hot one how old she is. I pull her towards me and ask her friend if we make a cute couple lol. The friend says 'no'. I say ''Because i'm too handsome? We look odd together?'' She laughs and says ''No. Because she's my married daughter!''. I'm like ''Fuck off!! (the mother looked about 30!) I think I want you now! (I pulled her in for a hug) Amazing genes''. I more or less bail at that point

I see 2 girls sitting on a table near the bar. One gorgeous. One OK. I Open with ''Hey, how's your night going?''. She replies and I notice she is Foreign. I say 'where are you from? Wait. Let me guess....Hungary?''. Turns out i'm right. I notice the super hot friend is looking bored as fuck and I introduce myself to her and hi five her, but she still looks miserable. I try to speak to her briefly as she's the one I naturally want, but she doesn't seem interested. Me and the original girl speak a little more for a minute or so, but then she gets distracted by something on her friends phone and they are speaking Hungarian and starring at the phone. I try to engage the original girl a few times, but I never get her full attention. I bail

Next I see a stunner at the bar and I decide to try 'direct' and tell her that she looks nice and that I had to meet her quickly. She looks at me like i'm an alien and walks away from me.

GO too a different bar and as soon as I walk in I see a hot girl with a friend so I decide to use the 3 second rule of approaching a hot girl straight away in a new venue. I extend my hand for her to take it and she just looks at me and shakes her head and looks away.
Next I approach 2 girls in the outside area. Open. Name/age/what is she up too tonight/job. She answers, but never asks me anything back and I soon feel like i'm running out of things to say. I notice something on her phone case which leads to us talking about rap music for a minute. She ejects soon after.

I open a girl at the bar who is getting served and make a comment on her drink. I do a cold read that makes her laugh. I ask her who she is but she tells me she's got a boyfriend and leaves.

I make a few dancefloor approaches to end the night, but nothing lands.
10-29-2017 06:08 AM
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