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Career Crossroads
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papaiela Offline
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Post: #1
Career Crossroads
Hey guys!

I am seeking advice for an important thing as I am graduating soon. This community has helped me improve tremendously so I am naturally asking for advice from the wisest. I am thinking about my career and frankly I am lost. I have several options but I really don’t know what to do. I’d like to hear your opinion guys on these different options.

I am 22 years old and I will graduate with a bachelor degree in Finance in December. I will graduate with a decent GPA.

My first option is to go directly apply for jobs, I believe I could get a job in a bank or a big corporation. I am thinking about a job where I am in contact with people (Sales). If I choose this option I will be able to get out of my parents place and will have money to have a better lifestyle in general. That’s my option 1.

The trade off is time with this option and doing a job that I don’t really like. I am not improving my acting / stand up… But I have a mouth to feed.

The second option would be to take a similar job. Work as a salesman with 30 hours a week which will be enough to cover my expenses and dedicate more time to acting classes / going to open mics.

My third option is to go back to university stay with my parents and study theatre or acting. Because I believe that I belong to some creative field. I am not naturally gifted with sciences, and I feel like I’ve chosen the wrong major. I studied harder than everyone I know and I managed to get decent grades but in Finance like in Physics, if you can picture stuff you will do good. So I am thinking that’s not the right career for me.

Part of me wants to do stand up / acting really bad. I took two improv classes and loved it. It makes my mind free. I also wrote several pages of material for stand up but had a bad experience when reading it to my friends.

I haven’t talked about girls in this post because with any of the options I will make sure to dedicate some time to it.

Thank you for reading and please feel free to give any advice!
(This post was last modified: 09-30-2016 12:33 PM by papaiela.)
09-30-2016 12:29 PM
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chicane Offline
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Post: #2
RE: Career Crossroads
Go listen to Aaron Clarey's podcasts & YouTube videos.
09-30-2016 02:16 PM
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wi30 Offline
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RE: Career Crossroads
Take a sales job and spend your free time going to open mics. It's tough to be a great comic at age 22. You don't have the stories or life experience that older dudes have. Guys like Bill Burr and Joe Rogan didn't get huge until they were older. It's going to take a few years before you start getting paid gigs, but it's better to grind it out now and reap the rewards later.

Sales gigs can be really hit or miss. Out of college I took a sales job in insurance. I was technically an independent contractor, paid all my own expenses, and had no health coverage. I hardly made any money and spent most of my time cold calling. It was awful.

Now I work a sales job in the construction industry. My office staff sets all my appointments, I only do one or two a day, and pretty much work part time. I just show up, present all the information, and close the deal. It's commission only like most sales jobs, but I'm actually a W-2 employee and get benefits. I don't think I've ever put in more than 25-30 hours per week. I'm always on call, but I have tons of free time to hit the gym or run errands.

If you find the right company and position, it's not tough to make six figures after your first year. I know guys who sell B2B and make a few hundred thousand per year. They land huge deals that net them more in commission than most people make in a year. They also don't put in more than 30 hours a week.

Stay away from the typical sales jobs like used cars, insurance, or real estate. Find something B2B like office equipment, medical equipment, or software. I have a buddy who sells software for a start up, has a fixed salary of 60K, and his boss put video games in the office, beer in the fridge, and buys them lunch everyday. They also pay him a few grand to take vacations. With all the fringe benefits factored in, he's making close to six figures.

Sales is a lot like game, it will make you better with girls unintentionally.
09-30-2016 03:09 PM
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papaiela Offline
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RE: Career Crossroads
Quote:Go listen to Aaron Clarey's podcasts & YouTube videos.

I will watch them. Thanks for the suggestion!

Quote:Take a sales job and spend your free time going to open mics. It's tough to be a great comic at age 22. You don't have the stories or life experience that older dudes have. Guys like Bill Burr and Joe Rogan didn't get huge until they were older. It's going to take a few years before you start getting paid gigs, but it's better to grind it out now and reap the rewards later.

Sales gigs can be really hit or miss. Out of college I took a sales job in insurance. I was technically an independent contractor, paid all my own expenses, and had no health coverage. I hardly made any money and spent most of my time cold calling. It was awful.

Now I work a sales job in the construction industry. My office staff sets all my appointments, I only do one or two a day, and pretty much work part time. I just show up, present all the information, and close the deal. It's commission only like most sales jobs, but I'm actually a W-2 employee and get benefits. I don't think I've ever put in more than 25-30 hours per week. I'm always on call, but I have tons of free time to hit the gym or run errands.

If you find the right company and position, it's not tough to make six figures after your first year. I know guys who sell B2B and make a few hundred thousand per year. They land huge deals that net them more in commission than most people make in a year. They also don't put in more than 30 hours a week.

Stay away from the typical sales jobs like used cars, insurance, or real estate. Find something B2B like office equipment, medical equipment, or software. I have a buddy who sells software for a start up, has a fixed salary of 60K, and his boss put video games in the office, beer in the fridge, and buys them lunch everyday. They also pay him a few grand to take vacations. With all the fringe benefits factored in, he's making close to six figures.

Sales is a lot like game, it will make you better with girls unintentionally.

Thank you for taking the time to answer and sharing your personal experience!

I have to say that I don't have much experience in sales but I feel like it's the thing that will benefit me the most both in game and in acting / stand up since you meet so many people.

I don't know if a B2B will benefit me as much as a B2C kind of a job where I deal directly with customer and interact with them in terms of coming up with stories and experience in a general manner.
(This post was last modified: 09-30-2016 04:28 PM by papaiela.)
09-30-2016 04:27 PM
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wi30 Offline
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Post: #5
RE: Career Crossroads
Avoid any job that requires door knocking. There's a ton of shitty jobs where you have to go door to door to sell vacuums or knives. B2B usually pays a base salary and requires experience and a degree. It usually pays higher too.

You want something where you give a detailed presentation. That would help you the most with your acting/stand up. For example, I present my products for a couple hours to each prospective client, go through product demos, samples, different options, etc. It's almost like acting because while it isn't scripted, you have to follow a specific format and remember a ton of information.

You meet tons of people and get really good at reading them. You'd also meet some weirdos who will provide good material for your stand up routine.
(This post was last modified: 09-30-2016 06:29 PM by wi30.)
09-30-2016 06:27 PM
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Gustavus Adolphus Offline
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RE: Career Crossroads
I completely agree with wi30.

There's been a few threads like this in the past, please feel free to check out my responses to those guys- the discussions we've had are quickly linked from my signature below. Check out Birthday Cat's responses as well.

If you decide to go the sales route, feel free to ask specific questions, I'm sure the forum has someone that is currently or formerly involved with the option you are considering.

However, if you truly want to be involved in comedy or acting, set some goals and chase down those dreams. A business or finance career can be achieved later if you desire. You might be a little behind in terms of the game compared to your peers, but you can catch up. There's no shame in going after what you really want, especially when you are 22 and have minimal overhead and can live modestly. If it doesn't work out, start over with whatever you think is best at the time. We have all made some career mistakes, and may or may not regret them based on the learning experience.

Good luck, and whatever path you take, go hard at it.
10-01-2016 01:06 AM
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papaiela Offline
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Post: #7
RE: Career Crossroads
Thank you for helping me out guys! I will check out the threads Gustavus.

I think that I will try to find a job in sales for now and make sure to take time to practice acting / stand up skills. I will give myself 6 months to see if I truly like it.

If I do I might enroll in university to do a BFA because I don't want to half ass it!
(This post was last modified: 10-01-2016 10:13 AM by papaiela.)
10-01-2016 10:12 AM
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Heart Break Kid Offline
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RE: Career Crossroads
I do not recommend getting a 2nd Bachelors for a theater degree.

I think college is not a good way to learn how to act, much less perform stand up. If you're in college and you want to take them as electives then that's fine, but going to do an entire degree in it, is not useful. It will not really make you more employable. I have a minor in film and briefly majored in theater in community college, and know many actors - university is not a good place for honing your craft in regards to acting.


You should take the 30 hour gig. Having free time during the work week will be a huge deal in terms of getting work done for your entertainment career.

Supporting yourself while hustling and working on your craft is the best way to go, 100%. I have a friend who got a bachelors degree in an employable major, and he got a really great job - but he decided to go into acting while working on his job. He demanded a half day so he could have time to pursue acting, and 2 years later, he is actually going places and making money in acting, because he hustles (it's really the only thing that separates people in the acting world other than top tier connections).


Also, you still have a few months left of Uni, so I would do some work in acting/stand up before the semester ends, you'll be surprised on how much you can get done in 3 months.

For acting I recommend this (not sure if you want to do theater or screen acting, I'll assume screen acting for now)

Get your feet wet, go on a site like mandy.com and just apply to a butt load of acting gigs, even ones that don't 100% fit your description. Even with zero experience and a crap picture, you will get call backs, I did this myself personally. Most of these will be student films, and a few post graduate directors who are trying to break in. The sell for this is ideally to get a film wheel to show that to bigger productions, but to be honest, at this level it's a waste. You should do a bunch of student films/low budget productions for experience and connections - that's the utility of it really.

The reason why expecting film wheels from these amateur directors is pointless is not because the quality will be bad, but because it will take forever for them to get back to you with.

Anyway, after you get experience and connections, simply write your own screen play and make a short film that is literally about you acting, aka make a show case for yourself. This is the most efficient way to make a good film wheel quickly. Once you have this, do the same thing you were doing before, just with better productions (since now you have tangible experience and something to show people). Acting is a lot like owning your own business, a lot of your success comes from pure hustle, literally just keep throwing yourself out there. I'm assuming you're in LA, NY or even London if you're Anglosphere, the other cities are too crappy to make great connections without dumb luck.

Ideally, you should get a technical skill or go into production since that gives you the best connections and makes you employable to bigger studios as well(there is no money in pure acting, you really have to network or laterally promote yourself into a good acting gig), but that can be for later.



For stand up, it is a bit more straight forward. Go perfect your craft at open mics, get noticed by people, get 5 minute shows and work your way up from there.
(This post was last modified: 10-03-2016 03:46 PM by Heart Break Kid.)
10-03-2016 03:43 PM
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papaiela
Cattle Rustler Offline
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Post: #9
RE: Career Crossroads
Don't go back to school for theatre, you will learn more on the field and gaining a larger network there. Try some local comedy spots and attend events. That shit will teach you more than school. Get a job, even it it's a corporate one, and save up bank while networking or improving your comedy. If you drop all your card while going for comedy, you might burn out or realize that there's not a market while losing time. If you take a job, at least you will have work experience.

"May get ugly at times. But we get by. Real Niggas never die." - cdr
10-04-2016 12:47 AM
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greekgod Offline
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RE: Career Crossroads
Have you ever been on stage in front of a live audience?

10-04-2016 01:12 AM
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papaiela Offline
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Post: #11
RE: Career Crossroads
@Heart Break Kid

Thank you very much for the info. I just looked up mandy.com and didn't find much in my city. I live in Canada so there are very few acting jobs in here but anyway I need to keep learning about this.

I will try to hang out and befriend some guys who are currently studying theater at school they might give me some advice. Last week, I met an actor and a film student at my university.

Everyone seems to agree that taking the 30 hour job in sales or equivalent is the wisest thing to do in my situation and I feel the same.

@greekgod

I took improv classes and I am enrolled in Toastmasters. I know that being on the stage is on another level and I should try it out. Problem is that there aren't many open mics where I live.
10-04-2016 03:28 PM
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Post: #12
RE: Career Crossroads
(09-30-2016 12:29 PM)papaiela Wrote:  Hey guys!

I am seeking advice for an important thing as I am graduating soon. This community has helped me improve tremendously so I am naturally asking for advice from the wisest. I am thinking about my career and frankly I am lost. I have several options but I really don’t know what to do. I’d like to hear your opinion guys on these different options.

I am 22 years old and I will graduate with a bachelor degree in Finance in December. I will graduate with a decent GPA.

My first option is to go directly apply for jobs, I believe I could get a job in a bank or a big corporation. I am thinking about a job where I am in contact with people (Sales). If I choose this option I will be able to get out of my parents place and will have money to have a better lifestyle in general. That’s my option 1.


Not sure where to start.

Let's begin with option 1. If you "believe you could get a job in a bank or big corporation".

No. You will have a much harder time than you think. The reason is that you aren't going to get into those jobs because of your resume: that just gets you taken seriously. You're going to get into those jobs because you successfully "networked" with alumni or others in those firms. There's plenty on here about how to do it. Get cracking NOW so you have time to build some relationships or at the very least know what the hell you're talking about with those kinds of jobs.

This is especially true for getting a job with a "bank". If you haven't networked prior to applying you have a roughly zero chance of getting an interview with firm that's even remotely Wall Street ish. I am the exception because my military resume has gotten me pulled out of the stack but as an undergrad you do not have anything "cool" like that yet barring something like varsity athletics at a D1 school.




If you want a creative career going to acting school is a relatively poor way to get into standup. You're much better off going to improv classes in your spare time and then starting to do standups in your own time. There's one acquaintance I have ( only acquaintance, because he's the personification of the raging leftist, egotistical biglaw type) who got into standup on his own time by delivering routines at open mic nights. George Carlin got into it by doing coffee clubs. The list of theatre majors who actually work that way is small.

Important caveat: I still highly recommend taking some acting classes in your spare time because they will teach you vocal skills that are invaluable for just about anything other than internet forums.


Quote:However, if you truly want to be involved in comedy or acting, set some goals and chase down those dreams. A business or finance career can be achieved later if you desire. You might be a little behind in terms of the game compared to your peers, but you can catch up. There's no shame in going after what you really want, especially when you are 22 and have minimal overhead and can live modestly. If it doesn't work out, start over with whatever you think is best at the time. We have all made some career mistakes, and may or may not regret them based on the learning experience.

Also worth looking at. If you have a good GPA in finance and succeed in standup, going from Standup comic -> mid-tier MBA -> Corporate management/sales later on is an easy path.




Here's what I would do in your position: I would IMMEDIATELY get on LinkedIN and start looking up alumni who work in financial sales roles. Those jobs grant you quite a bit of flexibility if you're willing to go back to school at some point, and many of the sales skills that you pick up in those jobs apply well to both stage work and game.

Don't expect it to be easy. Competition is intense for even mid tier firms.
10-04-2016 03:51 PM
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Travesty Offline
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RE: Career Crossroads
Have you ever watched Magic Mike?
10-04-2016 05:54 PM
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papaiela Offline
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RE: Career Crossroads
@Easy_C

Thanks for keeping it real!

(10-04-2016 05:54 PM)Travesty Wrote:  Have you ever watched Magic Mike?

Never, but I just watched the trailer. I will add it to my movie list.
10-04-2016 11:50 PM
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