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Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet
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Zeroblack Offline
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Post: #176
RE: Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet
hey Aviel, you helped me a lot a few months back so I'm happy to do the same now.

I don't have any advice for your career or office politics but I can help with reaching out to higher ups to hit quota or job searching.

If you decide to move to another company or to an AE position and you don't wanna get there through a recruiter, I know a few tricks that might help.

I'm surprised that AE isn't in hot water yet, shouldn't his quota be based 100% on closed leads?
05-17-2019 06:02 PM
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Aviel Offline
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Post: #177
RE: Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet
Hey man,

I honestly don’t think I’m qualified to move on to an AE position now. I’m thinking of moving to another SDR position and getting promoted to AE in 6 months. Why not through recruiter?

He’s part owner so a he can do wtvr he wants.
05-17-2019 08:27 PM
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Zeroblack Offline
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Post: #178
RE: Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet
If your job history is good then that's an option. If it's not, there are ways to get around that.

The only thing I would keep in mind is staying in SDR for 2 years and not moving to AE, recruiters have said they see that as a red light. If anything, I'd try AE right now because chances are they will train you when you get in or not train you at all and you'll still have to learn on your own. Other members can correct me on that.

I don't have any particular reason not to go through a recruiter, but if your options are limited or there's a company you really want to get into then there are ways.

Sounds shitty.
05-17-2019 09:07 PM
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Aviel Offline
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Post: #179
RE: Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet
Why is staying as an SDR for 2 years a red flag? I’ve been an SDR for only 12 months, my previous work experience is irrelevant.

I don’t think my options are limited, I have recruiters hitting me up daily with other offers.
05-18-2019 02:20 PM
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tonysoprano Offline
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Post: #180
RE: Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet
(05-16-2019 11:40 PM)Graft Wrote:  If I had to do my career all over again I would major in Comp Sci/MIS, (not giving a fuck about GPA), and take the sales engineering route. Sales engineers have a higher base but lower upside than a non technical rep, but it's very easy for a good SE to transfer to an AE role where technical expertise is important.

Hey Graft, great thread. I have an MIS degree and two years of experience as a "Support Engineer". Basically half support rep half consultant for the technical side of the product.

Do you have any advice for transitioning to a sales engineer role without any sales experience? Should I try to transition at my current company or look for a new one?

I am constantly one-upping the sales engineers at my company when it comes to technical matters, but I'm afraid my reputation isn't the best and I may not be the first person considered when an opening frees up for a sales role. Could just be all in my head though.
05-18-2019 02:39 PM
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Zeroblack Offline
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Post: #181
RE: Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet
(05-18-2019 02:20 PM)Aviel Wrote:  Why is staying as an SDR for 2 years a red flag? I’ve been an SDR for only 12 months, my previous work experience is irrelevant.

I don’t think my options are limited, I have recruiters hitting me up daily with other offers.

Their reasoning is the average length as an SDR is 6 months - 2 years. If you're at 2 years and you haven't moved up then something's wrong. I'm just pointing out what they think.
05-18-2019 03:17 PM
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Klan Killer Offline
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Post: #182
RE: Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet
I've been an SDR for two years and my company isn't showing signs of giving people actual promotions. What should I do?
05-18-2019 03:40 PM
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redbeard Online
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Post: #183
RE: Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet
From the Wall Street Playboys post, most companies promote to AE within 6-12 months. That's if you are beating target every month, which you should.

If I'm beating target every month and not promoted by month 12, I'm out.

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05-18-2019 03:46 PM
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Aviel Offline
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Post: #184
RE: Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet
I’ve decided that I’ll be leaving end of August. I’ll apply as an SDR to a fast growing startup with a better base and commission.

I have one in mind and they are offering 10-15k more on the base alone and they said in 6 months if all goes well I can become an AE.

I’m not worried about finding another gig and staying there, I know I’m gona kill the quota if I put a little effort with a decent product.
05-18-2019 09:04 PM
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ChicagoFire Offline
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Post: #185
RE: Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet
This thread has made me change my approach to job hunting for the best. I used to think get a job and even if it sucks accept it. Get mad about getting rejected from an employer.

Now unless I own the place I would never do anything that involved B2C. B2B all the way unless it's a shit job like selling ads on Yelp. Everytime I walk by McDonalds, etc I smile and would never fill out an app there.

(09-21-2018 09:31 AM)kosko Wrote:  For the folks who stay ignorant and hating and not improving their situation during these Trump years, it will be bleak and cold once the good times stop.
05-19-2019 02:50 PM
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Virtual Offline
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Post: #186
RE: Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet
(05-18-2019 02:39 PM)tonysoprano Wrote:  
(05-16-2019 11:40 PM)Graft Wrote:  If I had to do my career all over again I would major in Comp Sci/MIS, (not giving a fuck about GPA), and take the sales engineering route. Sales engineers have a higher base but lower upside than a non technical rep, but it's very easy for a good SE to transfer to an AE role where technical expertise is important.

Hey Graft, great thread. I have an MIS degree and two years of experience as a "Support Engineer". Basically half support rep half consultant for the technical side of the product.

Do you have any advice for transitioning to a sales engineer role without any sales experience? Should I try to transition at my current company or look for a new one?

I am constantly one-upping the sales engineers at my company when it comes to technical matters, but I'm afraid my reputation isn't the best and I may not be the first person considered when an opening frees up for a sales role. Could just be all in my head though.

One way would be to move into a customer centric support engineer/escalation engineer role which would give you direct customer facing experience. This way you would gain experience working with the sales teams and have leveraged relationships when the roles open. I've seen guys do this time and time again. For you to explore SE jobs directly now would be kind of an uphill battle. Doable for sure but more uphill than the aforementioned route.
05-20-2019 09:58 PM
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Virtual Offline
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Post: #187
RE: Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet
(05-18-2019 09:04 PM)Aviel Wrote:  I’ve decided that I’ll be leaving end of August. I’ll apply as an SDR to a fast growing startup with a better base and commission.

I have one in mind and they are offering 10-15k more on the base alone and they said in 6 months if all goes well I can become an AE.

I’m not worried about finding another gig and staying there, I know I’m gona kill the quota if I put a little effort with a decent product.


Sounds like a good move. First off, I somewhat disagree with the previous advice given. Seen too many ISR/SDR's rush through the process on some artificial time constraint only to get their ass handed to them in the field and end of losing their job. As long as you can justify time spent inside, with quantifiable results, there should be no red flag under a few years. In fact, mgr's would rather see someone develop at a quality pace (ie where they are learning), working with productive teams and showing maturity compared to the other mostly 'kids' who are on the inside. Hiring managers look for low risk individuals because hiring/firing is a PIA. From what I've seen on the ISR's who hit their first field role; about 50% don't make it. That's much worse IMO than staying in a SDR role for a year or two longer than you think you should. My two cents...
05-20-2019 10:09 PM
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Zeroblack Offline
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Post: #188
RE: Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet
(05-20-2019 10:09 PM)Virtual Wrote:  
(05-18-2019 09:04 PM)Aviel Wrote:  I’ve decided that I’ll be leaving end of August. I’ll apply as an SDR to a fast growing startup with a better base and commission.

I have one in mind and they are offering 10-15k more on the base alone and they said in 6 months if all goes well I can become an AE.

I’m not worried about finding another gig and staying there, I know I’m gona kill the quota if I put a little effort with a decent product.


Sounds like a good move. First off, I somewhat disagree with the previous advice given. Seen too many ISR/SDR's rush through the process on some artificial time constraint only to get their ass handed to them in the field and end of losing their job. As long as you can justify time spent inside, with quantifiable results, there should be no red flag under a few years. In fact, mgr's would rather see someone develop at a quality pace (ie where they are learning), working with productive teams and showing maturity compared to the other mostly 'kids' who are on the inside. Hiring managers look for low risk individuals because hiring/firing is a PIA. From what I've seen on the ISR's who hit their first field role; about 50% don't make it. That's much worse IMO than staying in a SDR role for a year or two longer than you think you should. My two cents...
Good point. Now that you mention it, I've also heard recruiters say they've stopped advancing SDRs to AE after 6 or 9 months. They didn't see results that were as good as SDRs who stayed for 1 year or more.

At the time I thought it was fluff, but it's probably because of what you stated.
05-21-2019 08:42 PM
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redbeard Online
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Post: #189
RE: Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet
I’ll play devil’s advocate - if you can develop the necessary skills to become an AE in six months...it’s probably worthwhile making the jump. It’s up to you to decide if you’re ready.

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05-21-2019 09:31 PM
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Graft Offline
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Post: #190
RE: Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet
(05-19-2019 02:50 PM)ChicagoFire Wrote:  This thread has made me change my approach to job hunting for the best. I used to think get a job and even if it sucks accept it. Get mad about getting rejected from an employer.

Now unless I own the place I would never do anything that involved B2C. B2B all the way unless it's a shit job like selling ads on Yelp. Everytime I walk by McDonalds, etc I smile and would never fill out an app there.

Summary:

Choose a company which has an incredible track record of promoting SDRs to a six figure position within 12-18 months.

Choose the biggest and best company that you can.

Choose a technology which can give you transferrable knowledge for exit options.

I built this empire and I did it by myself. Nobody did it for me. Not Ivana, not Marla. Nobody! ~Donald Trump
05-21-2019 10:14 PM
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Aviel Offline
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Post: #191
RE: Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet
I see that Salesforce in Toronto just posted job openings for SDR/BDR and I’m thinking of applying.

I only have one concern, they’ve been in the market since forever and they’re one of the biggest SaaS. You guys think the market is saturated and it will be hard to hit quota? Kinda like, everyone who needs Salesforce has it already.
05-27-2019 11:07 PM
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Thrill Jackson Offline
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Post: #192
RE: Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet
^ they have less then half the sales ERP market. Still plenty of small fish to swallow.

Growth Over Everything Else.
05-28-2019 05:36 PM
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Graft Offline
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Post: #193
RE: Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet
Just wanted to vent a little, especially regarding my situation.

The worst part about this career, by far, is being a victim of your own success. How so? You can blow out your number one year because you got lucky with a few deals, then you come back for next quarter/half/year and find out that your quota doubled or tripled and the only way to hit it is to get very lucky again.

This is why you see so many guys leaving jobs after 1-3 years, because they have a good year or two and then they come back with a quota that you can't hit. You can either stick it out and make less than your OTE or try to find another job and repeat the process.

I've even heard of companies giving quotas a few weeks into the quarter or half. This way they see what your pipeline and closed deals looks like, then they jack up your number to make sure that you barely hit quota.

Quotas never go down, that's a fact, but you have to try to not get put in a position where you have a 200% to plan year and the next year some bean counter puts you in his sights for a ridiculous quota.

It's really a myth that you control your own destiny in sales. You can sell 3x as much as you did the last year, but the only thing that matters is the quota they email to you and whether you can hit it. You live and die by that number.

I love sales, but the only way to really be in charge of your own destiny is through entrepreneurship.

I built this empire and I did it by myself. Nobody did it for me. Not Ivana, not Marla. Nobody! ~Donald Trump
05-29-2019 12:29 AM
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Thrill Jackson Offline
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Post: #194
RE: Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet
^ Preach. It's the deadly game of cat and mouse. This is why most people don't like it in the long run and settle for sales management/support role.

Growth Over Everything Else.
05-31-2019 09:21 PM
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Aviel Offline
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Post: #195
RE: Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet
Well said! Waking up to a sale or two on my shopify store feels much better than booking a demo.

I’m only doing sales as a way to finance my businesses.
05-31-2019 09:57 PM
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sonoran_ Online
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Post: #196
RE: Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet
I did everything I could to delay picking up the phone and cold calling for over 2 weeks, or 2 years if Im really honest with myself. 2 weeks ago I came to the realization that I had to test cold calling especially for the work Im in or else Id be a peasant forever.

I came up with every excuse and delay imaginable, from constantly rewriting the script to reading about it on forums.

Today I finally did it, managed to call 5-6 places and had a decent convo with most of them. Shitty thing is, the momentum only helps so much as any little break pulls me back towards base 1. I definitely feel the progress and the advice to myself is to not ponder too much BEFORE the call. Do it in a spur of the moment and let adrenaline do the rest.
06-19-2019 05:50 PM
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redbeard Online
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Post: #197
RE: Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet
Quick update now that I've got a few months under my belt.

-First things first, SDR is unlike any other sales job. They don't throw you to the fire. This isn't door-to-door, sink or swim, commission-only sales. They give you a solid base salary and a ramp-up period of 2 months where you're not required to hit target. That way you can figure out your system, get in the groove, and do some experimentation. It's awesome.

-Real life social skills are declining QUICKLY. My millenial co-workers are wrought with call anxiety, even after months on the job. Some of them take 15-30 minutes just to type out one quick email to a prospect.

-As WSP alluded to: if you're experienced in pick-up, you'll do well at this job. Getting rejected by a hot girl at a bar is 10x worse than getting hung up on by some cold prospect you don't even know.

-Most of my co-workers don't spend any extra time/money on developing their skills. They've probably read The Challenger Sale, and that's all. Nothing on copy writing, psychology, or cold calling. No courses, either.

So, what does this mean for you? To get ahead, all you have to do is:

1. Pick up the phone every damn day, and put up numbers. Even if you fall on your ass, management will see that you're not scared, and that you're a hustler, and appreciate it.

2. Study old-school copy writing. Gary Halbert, Zig Ziglar. These guys cut their teeth selling door-to-door, and it shows.

Overall I'm still loving this job and hope to have a long career in the industry. Thanks again to all the posters here, especially GRAFT.

P.S. Want to know a top-secret perk of working in sales? Your game improves! I read this on the forum a few times, but didn't believe it until I saw it first hand.

Since I'm on the phone all day, approach anxiety has pretty much disappeared. I roll off rejections like it's nothing, and I'm about 30% funnier. Sales is the best Heart

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06-23-2019 10:13 PM
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sittinpretty2020 Offline
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Post: #198
RE: Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet
So I've been applying to sales jobs. I'm not seeing too many with base salaries; nearly all are commission-based. Some offer hourly compensation but it's generally chump change like $12 - $15 an hour.

I am also not seeing many tech sales jobs, and I live near Silicon Valley. Where are you guys generally looking or finding your jobs?
(This post was last modified: 06-30-2019 06:31 PM by sittinpretty2020.)
06-30-2019 06:30 PM
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sittinpretty2020 Offline
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Post: #199
RE: Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet





Is this thread dead now? Did OP and other contributors all leave last month?
07-03-2019 05:47 PM
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Aviel Offline
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Post: #200
RE: Inside/Outside Sales Datasheet
DocuSign just opened up a Toronto office and are hiring like crazy. What do you guys think about working there?

A little bit of research I’ve found that they have a crazy amount of competitors now. E-signature market is a hard sell nowadays... even at my current company some E-sig company tried to sell us their service.

I don’t find it exciting or groundbreaking..but would like your opinions.
07-04-2019 10:30 AM
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