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The Trump China Policy Thread
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Rigsby Offline
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Post: #401
RE: The Trump China Policy Thread
(05-17-2019 01:37 PM)Deepdiver Wrote:  ....snipped...

I really do hear what you are saying and admire the Chinese ability to reverse engineer everything from Cell Phones, Bicycles, Land Rovers to Stealth Jet Fighters and our Trident Nuclear Ballistic Submarines and Mao's Long March Missiles not to mention our Aegis anti Missile Cruisers and Hypersonic Anti Everything Missiles.

And Confuscious Spirit only knows what they have done with our Area 51 etc, ARV technologies. I worked in a Major R&D Uni in Boston as a Cyber Security lead analyst.

Metro Boston has this phenomenon of Euro Kids - kids from wealthy families around the world who are very fond of major Euro Fashion Designers as a subtle way to exhibit their wealth DHV for men and SMV for Women.


The Euro Kids were originally wealthy students from Europe, the Middle East, and South America - more recently it is Indus Region and mostly Mainland Chinese with a few middle east, some Japanese and quite a few South Koreans... and of course Rich South Americans even richer selling Natural Resources to the Mainland Chinese. Mainland Chinese love Boston Unis so much they lead the recent Anti-Asian Racists lawsuit against the once invulnerable Harvard University for capping its "Asian" student body Undergrad and Grads at 25% - How dare this University founded on "China Trade" wealth discriminate against the Sons and some Daughters of the Communist Red Chinese predatory capitalists - China Trade in reverse is the ultimate in ironies.

Point is the more the Chinese go rogue - the more that Japan, South Korea, and Germany/EU will step up their game and they secretly support Uber Patriot Trump as they subscribe to the same intellectual property Patents, Copyrights and Trademarks protective laws that the USA does
- and - Trump's corrective interview of XI, the CCP and Communist Inscrutable Freaking Red Chinese benefit the Japan, Germany and South Korea etc, more so as they are leaders in today's Global Knowledge Technologies based economy.

The fact that no one in the China Loving CFR controlled MSM speaks about is the USA's Major Global Market advantages only become more evident;

1. Business Contracts based upon the rule of law rather than graft and corruption networks (China/Russia etc).

2. Unlimited Land to build cutting edge state of the art AI/Robotic factories.

3. Unlimited Energy Resources included newer Renewable Energy and Backup power systems.

4. Unlimited Demand USA and Globally for best in class Quality and Reliability in all products and services these factories and Corporate Office Complexes in both USA based and foreign-based Corporations will continue to explode the growth of Competitive International Free, Fair, and Reciprocal trade worldwide.

....snipped....


It's not just the Chinese with the ability to reverse-engineer.

The Japanese are absolute masters at it.

And as you also point out, it's not just in engineering, it's in fashion.

Even music production.

I'm told they have the best 'tribute' bands on the planet in Japan (correct me if I'm wrong). I've known some Japanese guys who could play like Hendrix and make dub like Lee Scratch Perry. It's uncanny how they can strip something down to its bare bones and reconstitute it.

I'm also told, by someone that lives in Japan and is 'part' Japanese (he works in the international trade of high-end Japanese vintage guitars), that it's impossible to get in to a band there! He is a virtuoso musician on Bass. Probably one of the most accomplished bass players on the planet. He even looks a bit Japanese. But there is no way in hell he is ever going to be allowed to play in a band without being native born and bred. Don't forget he runs a successful shop there bringing in revenue for the country and for many other citizens who sell him their guitars when their loved ones die. Vintage guitars remember from the 70's, and 80's.

Now, that is what I call 'Racism'. The Japanese might just be the most 'racist' people on the entire planet. Absolutely savage.



Point is the more the Chinese go rogue - the more that Japan, South Korea, and Germany/EU will step up their game
and they secretly support Uber Patriot Trump as they subscribe to the same intellectual property Patents, Copyrights and Trademarks protective laws that the USA does


I just mentioned this in a roundabout way before in my previous post before seeing yours. Japan is a competitor to China and so is South Korea. At least as far as Musical Instruments go. Well, it's not just musical instruments because those companies that make those musical instruments also make high end motorbikes (Yamaha) and software (Yamaha who bought out German company Steinberg).

If you study the history of these Japanese corporations like Korg and Yamaha they often started making something else and diversified as markets changed. A few started in the manufacture of Furniture. But those woodworking skills were quickly put to use for musical instrument manufacture.

We often talk about IQ here, so let's not forget those Chinese and Japanese are higher IQ than most Europeans/Americans. That means the ability to take previously won knowledge and apply it to other fields. Nothing is wasted. Everything is consolidated. One way or another.


As for Germany, well, I guess we'll have to delve a bit more in to that other stuff you mentioned about Patents/Copyrights/Trademarks...


Ah, Behringer again...
05-17-2019 06:44 PM
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Post: #402
RE: The Trump China Policy Thread
(05-17-2019 06:44 PM)Rigsby Wrote:  As for Germany, well, I guess we'll have to delve a bit more in to that other stuff you mentioned about Patents/Copyrights/Trademarks...


Ah, Behringer again...


I was going to talk about Behringer anyway, as it seemed pertinent, but you brought Germany in to the argument, so that's another reason to mention them.

They are a German company founded by a Swiss guy whose father was a nuclear physicist and inventor. He is loved and loathed in equal measure. Not quite a Steve Jobs figure, but in a way, he is in his own right.

Behringer are known for providing high quality cheap equipment. Of course a lot of it breaks down, but it's cheap, whaddya want?

At the moment they are working on the most disruptive technology to hit the musical instrument business for decades. In fact, it's already here.

They are mass-producing old classics like the Roland TR-808 and TR-909. And where as if you could find one of these rare gems on ebay, it would cost you about 3000 dollars or more. The Behringer models? 300 Euros!

And they have even improved upon the originals in some ways.

Roland - a Japanese corporation is not very happy about this, but there is little they can do. The trademarks were not 'defended' - as I understand it, it is different to copyright law. A trademark needs to have itself reinforced or after a certain period of time anyone can use it. That seems to be the case here and the whole internet has blown up about the rights and wrongs of it. The morality, the ethics. The fact if these things will ever come to reality. But I won't get in to that here. It looks like it is indeed happening.

The 909 and 808 were the sound of hip hop, of jungle, of techno. They invented more musical genres than any other piece of equipment. They are the two most important and canonical drum machines on the planet. Let's take a look what they look like:

[Image: behringer-rd808-demo.jpg]


[Image: behringer-rd-909.jpg]


Pretty good. They sound pretty good too (sorry for the mashed up resize).

Behringer are doing all kinds of new analogue equipment that people said couldn't be rebuilt. They have invested massive amounts in creating their own modeling techniques but also in semi-conductor component manufacture. All of it done in China in Behringer City!

It's a massive tooling up of infrastructure. Massive investment in facilities, in people.

Just need to get around that pesky Patents/Copyrights/Trademarks... BS first. Which it looks like they have pretty much done.

The market is there. People (musicians) have been crying out for this stuff for ages. They were always told it's not feasible. And besides, Japanese corporations like Roland have always been pretty swift in enforcing many of their trademarks, but somehow, legally, they have dropped the ball on many of their seminal products.

It's a fight, because Behringer are sitting on an absolute gold mine. They may only make a few dollars on an item but they will make up for that in units sold. So the theory goes.

A big thing has been made of human rights and working conditions.

Sure, Apple get to use slave labour because they are a cult and make so much money and already work for the NSA et al.

But Behringer get no such pass. They will be scrutinized like you wouldn't believe. Apparently, there is an open invitation to anyone, anyone at all that would like to go visit the facilities in China and Behringer will even put you up in one of their other facilities while you do. They aren't calling it Behringer City for nothing!

From there you will be given a tour of the factory and get to meet the actual workers.

Ok, now that isn't a right to roam free I know, but it's the next best thing. This is not a Chinese sweat shop facility where the paint sprayers aren't afforded masks when breathing in fumes. These places still exist. They probably will for a while. You can buy a guitar for less than 50 bucks in the US.

But it's not just the Patents/Copyrights/Trademarks... of Roland they are supposedly infringing upon, they are going all out on other old analogue equipment that people want like the Arp synthesizers. It's not personal.

The Japanese got lazy. They got lazy in not backing up and protecting their Patents/Copyrights/Trademarks... and now it's too late. They got lazy in not making the stuff that other musicians have been begging them for for decades. They had the ability.

Hell, Korg have done what is regarded as probably the greatest emulation in the history of software virtualisation. They have just about perfecly ported their Korg MS-20 and M1 and Wavestation et al to VST that can run on any computer. They have even built controllers for these so they just about mimic the original hardware (MS-20).

The most amazing things can be done. But companies get lazy and just want to push new mediocre digital technology.

The future has arrived. But it is still held in a relatively few people's (corporations) hands. This is why Behringer is so loved and hated. They are freeing that technology for use by the masses at a price that is cheaper than at any other time in history. And they are doing it with style and flare. Even if it is just cheap shit. It's cheap shit that is 'good enough'.

A real 909 and 808 would cost you about 6000 bucks. I'll be buying both of them for a little over 600 bucks! I don't need them, but the chance of owning a 'real' drum machine like this is not possible to pass up. I already have thousands of pounds worth of drum software. But this is just a dream come true.

Do I care about Patents/Copyrights/Trademarks...? Do I fuck. If it makes it to market it's good enough for me.

And all made in China. Made possible because of advances in automation. And also advances in human rights. Sure, I bet Uli runs a hard game. But he won't get away with slave labour. It will be a step up for those working there.

China has a massive peasant population with no chance of improvement of their conditions. But the lucky ones will get to work in Uli's new 'City'.


https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/news/gen..._city.html


Following 3 years of work and $100 million of investment, Behringer announced the completion of a major project called the MusicTribe City.

We're looking at a state-of-the-art facility located in China, featuring a 3-million-square-foot (around 275,000 square metres) smart factory, plus accommodation and recreational space for 3,000 "tribers."

Some of additional facilities within the city include a hospital, supermarket, bakery, laundry service, and more.



"Many years ago we had a crazy dream to build the most sophisticated and green manufacturing facility that would also be an amazing place for our 3,000 Tribers to work and live in. And then the dream came true."



[Image: 73517_0_wide_ver1522279205.jpg@642]


The whole Behringer thing seems like win/win to me, unless I'm missing something. People around the world (not poor people of course - fuck them) will be able to buy expensive audio equipment at 'no-brainer' prices. And it isn't even built with slave labour - just automation and the latest advances in technology. China gets some extra income via trade and domestically the workers get a pretty good place to work that is probably preferable to a paddy field. No offense to the Irish.

This is what it was always supposed to be about. Technology. Doing more with less. Freeing up the people. Enhancing their quality of life. This dream has it all.

And it's happening!




I now wait for it all to go dreadfully wrong...
05-17-2019 07:45 PM
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Post: #403
RE: The Trump China Policy Thread
Arado, welcome back, bro. Where have you been? I've been waiting for you to pop in here.
05-17-2019 11:43 PM
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Post: #404
RE: The Trump China Policy Thread
(05-17-2019 11:43 PM)Fortis Wrote:  Arado, welcome back, bro. Where have you been? I've been waiting for you to pop in here.

Thanks - interesting discussion here, but there are a lot of anecdotes and I'm trying to get to the main points and big picture. What is the vision for how relations between China and the US/West/RestofWorld will evolve 10-20 years down the line? Will China stagnate/collapse and/or what is the appropriate US response? Can the US stop China from dominating the industries of the future and/or Asia if they really put their mind to it? Does Western Civilization have the will for it?
(This post was last modified: Yesterday 01:36 PM by Arado.)
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