(02-10-2017 11:02 PM)CJ_W Wrote: You mean to tell me that for 20+ years of like, he never thought to take the propper tests etc to get citizenship? what was he doing all of this time? He didnt have the money? really? he coudln`t save up enough money for this? was he working slave wages? if so, why werent his employers caught and jailed as well? This doesn`t make sense, you cant expect me to have sympathy for someone screwing up in such a manner, then try to convince me becuase of this guy`s fuck up we should change immigration laws for this guys mistake.
Im not buying it. In fact, it makes me forget the rest of what you said.
Its like we dont seem to have immigration laws in our country anymore. The people didn`t decide on letting refugess in the country? Are there no laws on immigration? Why arent they being followed if they are? Sure due process is important and I agree, but arent people who break the law jailed while they`re in due process awaiting trial? Should trump just go an jail all the refugees or others coming into the country without a passport?
Whats stopping the rest of the world from just taking boats and ending up on our shores and the U.S. not doing anything about it? isnt that called an invasion?
A lot of your arguments need some fine tuning. and Make sure you dont include some silly sob story anecdote about "a guy you know" I`m sorry, but no one really cares about a "guy you know/a friend/etc. . ." when it comes to the laws of the country.
Try again. . . or don`t.
I tried to word that in a way that would take a neutral stance on whether he should be allowed to stay, and just emphasize the arbitrary discrepancy between how he was treated and how a guy who was born on U.S. soil to illegal immigrant parents was treated, but perhaps I failed.
There may have been more to his story; for example, a lot of those who end up in federal prison for illegal reentry into the U.S. have a felony or even an aggravated felony on their record. They can get up to 20 years
for that. Still, the guy born on U.S. soil to illegal immigrants could get convicted of an aggravated felony, and be allowed to stay.
It becomes like a game of freeze tag or capture the flag. If a woman can cross the border into the U.S. before a baby pops out of her hoo-ha, then that kid gets to stay in the U.S. for life and run President; but if she can't make it over the border in time, then he's subject to deportation.
I don't know that there's a process for people who enter the U.S. illegally as babies to become citizens (unless you're talking about the DREAM Act
, which hasn't passed yet). Are you aware of such a process?
Another beef I have with the 14th Amendment is that it punishes secessionists and those who lend money to their cause. The Constitution is a couple centuries old, a lot of its provisions haven't accomplished what the founders hoped (for example, grand juries are failing to serve as much of a safeguard), and it might not be such a bad idea for the union to split apart (or for states to at least have the ability to threaten to break away), so we can start from scratch and come up with a new Constitution, or one or more new Constitutions for different regions. We're at a point now where it's pretty hard "to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness" through the amendment process, as Trump acknowledged when he rejected the idea of trying to change the 14th Amendment; but it's hard for the U.S. to say that Americans can't secede, while supporting secessionists in places like Kosovo.
One of the interesting aspects about the Confederate States Constitution
was that it included additional safeguards against federal encroachment on states' rights, based on lessons learned from almost fourscore and seven years of living under the U.S. Constitution. The U.S. Constitution had likewise included safeguards (such as a very limited definition of treason) based on lessons learned from living under British rule. Maybe it's time for another iteration of this process.