Post: #176

(06-08-2018 12:59 PM)debeguiled Wrote:  

(06-07-2018 03:02 PM)MMX2010 Wrote:  How long have you been a Christian, debeguiled?

I am finding discussions of spirituality on the forum and the internet in general to be, nonproductive, and I am not engaging in them anymore.

I'm finding discussions on this forum in general have devolved into tit-for-tat bollocks. Guys who got on a mere year ago are now at each other because of a fucking psychology professor. The peak years here really were 2010-2014, as the senior guys often say/said (many have since left).

Post: #177

Damn thought dude had immunity after seeing 100 threads shit on

Post: #178

It's a good takedown in this vid.

JP has effectively an insane indidvualist collective ideology. One that started out with leftist collectivism in the 1960s in force.

Tribal racial cultural identity is the one that reigned supreme and is natural. The Chinese and the Japanese don't have to be "taught to be tribal Chinese and Japanese". They just know that they are Japanese and it would not cross their minds to import 20 mio. Somalis or even Whites, giving them welfare and calling them Japanese.

JP is utterly ideological and political. Adhering to his bottom-up political advice will just wipe Western civilization out.

In contrast his radical leftist individualism, marxism, feminism - all of that has to be taught. One of the reasons why the victim narrative works so much better on under-performing lower IQ minorities is because they already have that in-group preference for their own, seeing their own people under-performing and it takes little to tell them to blame someone else. Essentially it's the same tribal behavior of Jews who are taught constantly that a Holocoust is waiting on the next corner, so when a white woman says: "I want to have a blonde white baby with a man of similar heritage." Then this is automatically evident of Nazism rising and gas-chambers being planned by tradwives while they tend to their organic gardens:

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/01/opini...right.html

So the only thing we can be "grateful" to him is that he is allowed to counter the marxists. But he leads the awakening ones into madness anyway.

I might take a look at his life-advice, but on the other hand - that may be prevalent in countless self-help books anyway.

Quote:In a podcast interview posted last spring, Nicole Jorgenson, a singer and former schoolteacher in North Dakota, explains to her host that she has never been happier since marrying and having children. And yet between cute pastoral anecdotes of growing her own vegetables and making banana bread, it soon becomes clear that Ms. Jorgenson is advocating something sinister — not just a return to agrarian motherhood.

She lived in Germany temporarily, she says, but left just before “an influx of refugees took over the country.” She just had a child and thinks the new baby is beautiful — but maybe not quite in the same way all mothers do: “I always wanted children that looked like me,” she says, “blond-haired, blue-eyed babies, but I kind of had to say it under my breath.”

By the time the interviewer begins to gush about how wonderful it is that Ms. Jorgenson and her husband are both of Norwegian heritage — “you guys come from the same blood” — it’s clear what political demographic both women are catering to. Ms. Jorgenson is being interviewed on Radio 3Fourteen, a white supremacist talk radio program; it is interviewing her because she considers herself a tradwife.

Wanting blonde babies is supremacism. Ah fuck....

Post: #179

Post: #180

It's useless. When Mohammed doesn't go to the mountain, the mountain goes to Mohammed.

Post: #181

(06-09-2018 06:21 PM)debeguiled Wrote:  

Fucking Peterson fanbois.

No facts, arguments, logic.

Gifs! Cliches! Memes!

You should man up like the men who see through this charlatan.

Post: #182

I'll hold a sign that says:

"Real men against those cultural marxist men who are against Jordan Peterson, but who are just against Peterson's individualist political ideology. He is right about most of the rest."

Post: #183

(06-09-2018 11:26 AM)Teedub Wrote:  

(06-08-2018 12:59 PM)debeguiled Wrote:  

(06-07-2018 03:02 PM)MMX2010 Wrote:  How long have you been a Christian, debeguiled?

I am finding discussions of spirituality on the forum and the internet in general to be, nonproductive, and I am not engaging in them anymore.

I'm finding discussions on this forum in general have devolved into tit-for-tat bollocks. Guys who got on a mere year ago are now at each other because of a fucking psychology professor. The peak years here really were 2010-2014, as the senior guys often say/said (many have since left).

Aurini and any others I mentioned this to, remember what I said?

2015: Choose your side.
2016: All Truth will be revealed, (particularly meaning, the Hidden Truth within the hearts of everyone you know).

The latter was particularly-confronting: I was learning exactly the horrors that people I've known for decades would accept in the name of being 'nice' and 'tolerant', because they choose Cowardice over Truth.

The conversations now are part of the sorting, and the knowing of each other.

Debeguiled: don't turn away, understand. I'll admit this probably isn't the best forum for it, which is why I understand it's time to take my writing elsewhere.

Post: #184

Make sure you leave a forwarding address.

I'm starting to wonder if there's anywhere to go from here other than the reloading bench.

Post: #185

(06-09-2018 07:16 PM)Zelcorpion Wrote:  I'll hold a sign that says:

"Real men against those cultural marxist men who are against Jordan Peterson, but who are just against Peterson's individualist political ideology. He is right about most of the rest."

That middle guy's mouth would still be wide open, on account of confusion instead of soy.

Post: #186

This is an interesting post about identity politics. JP is wrong. Black Amercians do it a lot, interesting listening:

Post: #187

I need a little review here. How does Jordan Peterson deal with namecalling in his debates? Or when his opponents try to attack his character rather than his arguments?

Post: #188

(06-10-2018 01:15 PM)BlueResolute Wrote:  I need a little review here. How does Jordan Peterson deal with namecalling in his debates? Or when his opponents try to attack his character rather than his arguments?

He corrects them.

Or, in the case of the dude who attacked his character:

Post: #189

(06-10-2018 11:45 AM)Teedub Wrote:  This is an interesting post about identity politics. JP is wrong. Black Amercians do it a lot, interesting listening:

Tribalism is the default nature of our species - we don't need to be taught this. Actually we need to be taught non-tribalism or self-hate with each generation and constant propaganda. Currently mostly the Whites are buying that bullshit:

   

JP is but one of the countless tools used to prevent that group which has the least in-group preference to prevent becoming a despised minority in their home-country.

It's a dead horse, but here more beating down:





He goes specifically into the UN document that JP's name is on. In it you have countless marxist terms of minority promotion, gender-equality pushing, global warming carbon taxing, wealth redistribution from Western countries to developing ones etc.

JP likely only edited or God knows what he did. There are countless climatologists (actually the majority of the leading ones, but you never hear about them) who never signed that global warming document that Al Gore was so proud of. Instead they let railroad engineers and other such "scientists" sign it. Even some who were listed there later complained that their name has been added to it.

JP not only signed it, but contributed. Good globalist stooge.



And the bloody media is so clueless that they don't even get why guys on the right criticize him at all.

He is wrong on two things:

+ Blue Pill thinking about women (sort of - he has some insights due to studies, but is mostly a Blue Piller) - that point is not so important
+ His political advice to most White folk to double down on being "individualist" - this thinking from the leftist classical liberalism is actually the one that brought the West to the current state starting in the 1960s - it would not have happened otherwise.

And JP's role regarding his UN document cooperation - that is an entire new level of treason. That document is pure marxist Soros level of treason - and he should know frankly. It's no coincidence that he does not mention Global Warming too much, because then he would lose more of his viewers. Pay your carbon taxes and don't have any private cars bucko!

Post: #190

(06-10-2018 01:31 PM)debeguiled Wrote:  

(06-10-2018 01:15 PM)BlueResolute Wrote:  I need a little review here. How does Jordan Peterson deal with namecalling in his debates? Or when his opponents try to attack his character rather than his arguments?

He corrects them.

Or, in the case of the dude who attacked his character:

I really love the way JP handled Dyson. This was added to my favorite Peterson video list a while ago. It was perhaps one of the few times I also saw JP actually go on the offensive when an attack came at him. It seemed like he was using a little Ben Shapiro tactics, too, which I believed he needs more of to take on the people of today. Thanks.

Post: #191

I still don't understand this obsession people have with Peterson's political and ideological purity. His stance on the JQ, his condemnation of the alt-right, his opposition to white identity politics, his questionable Christianity, etc...

None of this matters to me, because I'm not looking at Peterson as a guru or a savior. I don't need him to reflect and regurgitate everything that I believe. I simply appreciate that he has proven highly successful at drawing large numbers of people away from the sort of "standard liberal thinking" (you might also call it "Reddit-think") that so many Millennials especially have adopted over the past decade. None of those people could swallow the red pills that the guys in this thread have. They're totally unpalatable to them. They need smaller doses to be effective. Enter Peterson.

For whatever reason, Peterson is very adroit at communicating to these people. He forces them to question their beliefs that they had previously taken for granted (i.e. Atheism, big government, SJW politics). He's basically fertilizing their ground of their mind, which was previously completely barren and useless. The error that Peterson's critics are making is believing that Peterson's fans will simply adopt all of his views unquestioningly. And sure, some of them will. But most won't. Once they've been broken out of the Matrix, so to speak, there's no going back. They've acquired a taste for those red pills. They may have started small, but they'll be working their way up. Once they realize that they are capable of engaging in badthink without spontaneously combusting, they won't be afraid to see how deep those rabbit holes go.

Peterson may not be on our side, but he's a damned effective bridge between our side and the great, seething mass of normies who have yet to be red-pilled. The fact that he does not endorse our views or that he may not even realize he is a bridge to our side is completely immaterial. Because the fact is that he is unquestionably acting as an ideological bridge between boilerplate 2018 goodthink and alt-right badthink. The end result is thousands, perhaps millions of people eventually converted to our side who, absent Peterson, would never have been able to start swallowing the red pills they previously found so unpalatable.

Post: #192

< Maybe that is his only good part, but somehow I doubt that. It could be true over time, though he does the manipulation against further shifting to the right of him very well. We won't get any stats on that of course - only his 90%+ White male viewership/readership.

Somehow I doubt that he is invited by the mainstream and green-lit from above as an entry-level political Red Piller. If that turns out to be true, then he will disappear from the official channels, but he is still going strong, so my guess is that he works rather the opposite way pulling men who are researching more identitarian approaches away back to some mythical Utopian individualism.

Though anyone's guess as good as mine. If they find out that this is what is happening as Scorpion says, then they will stop inviting him.

And honestly - countering the marxists at media and academia is really easy. The problem is that no one is giving them a platform. Men like Jared Taylor or even Richard Sencer could easily destroy all the crazies and moderaters live on TV for everyone to marvel at. But they are never going to be given the same kind of questions as JP comes with the academic respectability and they don't ask him: "Are you a Nazi? When and how do you want to exterminate everyone but Whites?"

Post: #193

Milo is questioning JP, saying how come someone smart and well educated like himself cannot work out what JP is actually trying to say in his long, meandering 12 rules? He calls it 'self-contradictory, 'muddled' & 'word salad'. He posits that JP is incoherent and self-contradictory to hedge his bets, in other words to avoid being pinned down. He goes on to say that if he can get through Kant and find a coherent message why does it completely evade him with Peterson?

Although Milo doesn't let him talk for too long the answers that Molyneux gives are weak sauce apologetics that cut no ice with me at all.

Post: #194

It definitely suffers from being too wordy and trying to be clever.

Post: #195

Everyone has strengths and weaknesses.

The feeling I get is that Peterson's strengths even before he became well known was teaching, mentoring grad students, and being a psychologist.

It doesn't sound like his first book had that much success.

It seems now like his strengths are his extemporaneous lectures as well as his contact with the fans after the shows, where he will sometimes sit there for four hours to meet and have a few words with everyone who wants him to.

Obviously he cannot get to know everyone who wants to know him, so he cannot have that personal connection that he used to have with his students and patients.

This is the downside of what he is doing, that he is trying to scale a personal approach of a psychologist up to the millions of people who encounter him online, and obviously that won't work.

I just don't think his strength is writing, his strength is how he handles interviews and how he serves as a kind of long distance mentor to millions of young people.

Someone once asked Bill Murray what the best thing about being famous was, and he said it was that people would talk to him now. Without fame he is just another aging, average looking guy walking around. With fame, he always has someone to talk to in cafes and gets invited to parties anywhere he is in the English speaking world.

I feel the same way about his book. It is more like a pubic relations tool and a way to make money and a way to draw people to his lectures.

Have you seen any of his recent lectures? Packed houses, insane reactions. Just do a search on Google for 'met Jordan Peterson' to see the kind of effect he is having on people.

It is also important to remember that he didn't set out to write a book. He set out to answer a question on Quora:

https://www.quora.com/What-are-the-most-...hould-know

The question was:

"What are the most valuable things everyone should know?"

His answer, and this was before he became famous, was extremely popular. It wasn't a densely written book, it was more a list of aphorisms:

Quote:Tell the truth.
Do not do things that you hate.
Act so that you can tell the truth about how you act.
Pursue what is meaningful, not what is expedient.
If you have to choose, be the one who does things, instead of the one who is seen to do things.
Pay attention.
Assume that the person you are listening to might know something you need to know. Listen to them hard enough so that they will share it with you.
Plan and work diligently to maintain the romance in your relationships.
Be careful who you share good news with.
Be careful who you share bad news with.
Make at least one thing better every single place you go.
Imagine who you could be, and then aim single-mindedly at that.
Do not allow yourself to become arrogant or resentful.
Try to make one room in your house as beautiful as possible.
Compare yourself to who you were yesterday, not to who someone else is today.
Work as hard as you possibly can on at least one thing and see what happens.
If old memories still make you cry, write them down carefully and completely.
Maintain your connections with people.
Do not carelessly denigrate social institutions or artistic achievement.
Treat yourself as if you were someone that you are responsible for helping.
Ask someone to do you a small favour, so that he or she can ask you to do one in the future.
Make friends with people who want the best for you.
Do not try to rescue someone who does not want to be rescued, and be very careful about rescuing someone who does.
Nothing well done is insignificant.
Set your house in perfect order before you criticize the world.
Dress like the person you want to be.
Be precise in your speech.
Stand up straight with your shoulders back.
Don't avoid something frightening if it stands in your way -- and don't do unnecessarily dangerous things.
Do not let your children do anything that makes you dislike them.
Do not transform your wife into a maid.
Do not hide unwanted things in the fog.
Notice that opportunity lurks where responsibility has been abdicated.
Read something written by someone great.
Pet a cat when you encounter one on the street.
Do not bother children when they are skateboarding.
Don't let bullies get away with it.
Write a letter to the government if you see something that needs fixing -- and propose a solution.
Remember that what you do not yet know is more important than what you already know.
Be grateful in spite of your suffering.

I think that his Quora answer is extremely powerful. It is a different experience entirely than his book.

It could well be that he would have been better off just publishing his 42 rules for life with a picture for each rule.

It could well be that he is over-writing or that he has been pressured by publishers to do the thing a certain way.

As someone who has trouble sifting the wheat from the chaff in my own writing, and who has effortlessly banged out a first draft on something, gotten good feedback, written a second draft, and had everyone ask why I ruined it, I can have sympathy for someone who over-writes.

So I think there are probably a lot of valid criticisms of the book.

Still, and Peterson is very aware of this by the way, his real value to the world is as a kind of abstract archetype of the wise older male mentor, and for that he is suited, and for that he is doing a good job, and for that he is changing lives.

The world needs a wise older guy and for now he is taking that role onto himself.

Post: #196

I agree with many of the comments under that Milo video — that he absolutely gets JP really, and is being professionally contrarian and is possibly professionally jealous. But, yeah JP definitely does suffer from being overly verbose, I agree.

I will say this about Milo though, he's nowhere near as intelligent as he likes to pass off to his now predominantly American audience who get sucked in by the accent and stereotype. He's got a private-school trained, debate-honed, high verbal IQ I'm sure, but is outmatched in that department by people on this forum like Lizard of Oz and others.

Post: #197

And well...

As far as shilling, Milo's widely known to be financially backed by Mercer who is an avowed zionist.

Post: #198

(06-23-2018 03:08 PM)debeguiled Wrote:  So I think there are probably a lot of valid criticisms of the book.

I've only read a few chapters.

As I wrote elsewhere, it has some valuable lessons, and I think the book is good at getting it into your brain and it does stick as far as I can tell.

If the lessons of the book sticks, then I am not sure it is a good point to criticize.

It is verbose, but I wonder if part of the reason, is that Peterson is making sure to "anchor" feelings with his advice. For those who can't remember the whole NLP movement, anchoring is when you create vivid emotional stories and scenarios related to something, so they stick to your brain. Emotions makes us remember things much better.

I think that's what he does with these stories. Not all stories are going to resonate, so he kind of stacks one after the other.

I think it works.

I also think his book is entering hypnosis territory.

Post: #199

I see that the tribe is spreading here.



Milo is insofar correct that JP does go into long useless meandering explanations for simple concepts. Sometimes he goes off into the wild and never returns.

When asked about the Alt-Right and their views, he answers that they "want to become the father". Nah - they just don't want to become Karachi and have their wives and daughters be safe without being gang-raped or their country turned into a multicultural low-trust shithole.

They don't want to become the father - except maybe some hoe's daddy.

Summing up his book into "be good" may be indeed correct.

Post: #200

Peterson is trying to set up a new religion for millennials and Gen Z that have an unsatisfied need for spirituality and moral guidance. The aim is to provide a replacement for Christianity complete with his 'Be Good' moral code for dummies. Globalist infiltration of the Christian church in many Western nations has feminized and subverted it into 'Churchianity'. This corrupted form of Christianity is utterly repulsive to those men that have not yet been completely mind-fucked with soy and decades of progressive propaganda.

Peterson uses pseudo-religious imagery and sophistry in writing, plundering bible stories and philosophical writings for material to reinterpret in the construction of his alternative faith. There's no wonder he actually wanted to buy a real church building and preach from the pulpit according to his former flatmate. He has deliberately cultivated the 'haunted prophet' persona to inspire religious adoration from followers.

Whether his intentions are pure or not it is in no doubt that the globalists love him and he is more than happy to work for them in evolving and selling Agenda 21. They must be doubly pleased that their new false prophet is leading young men away from the discovery of true Christianity, the Christianity that not only built Western civilisation but is also now essential for its survival.