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The Ethereum (ETH) thread
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PharaohRa Offline
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The Ethereum (ETH) thread
I have noticed some interest with respect to Ethereum in that many (including myself) see it as the alternative to Bitcoin and potentially even a better investment due to interest from the big boys (such as Microsoft, Goldman Sachs, etc). Anything goes here with ethereum. Also, I have made my position clear in the Bitcoin and Alt coin thread that Ethereum has a bright future.
05-02-2017 09:33 PM
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RE: The Ethereum Thread (the alt coin to Bitcoin)
Well, the price just increased four-fold in a single month. Some guys got lucky - not on the same scale than Bitcoin, but still, definitely good. I think it will increase more.

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05-03-2017 09:24 AM
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account844 Offline
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RE: The Ethereum Thread (the alt coin to Bitcoin)
Damn, I missed the boat on this one. Caught the Bitcoin wave, but wasn't paying attention to any altcoins. Do you know if there are any strong underlying fundamentals that might help drive the price up more, or could it be more like a bubble?

I aim to buy low and sell high obviously, and at the current price of 72.88 EUR it doesn't look like a great entry point from a technical perspective.

If there is big genuine interest in it though beyond speculation i'd rather jump aboard sooner rather than later.
05-03-2017 09:43 AM
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Stun Offline
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RE: The Ethereum Thread (the alt coin to Bitcoin)
(05-02-2017 09:33 PM)PharaohRa Wrote:  I have noticed some interest with respect to Ethereum in that many (including myself) see it as the alternative to Bitcoin and potentially even a better investment due to interest from the big boys (such as Microsoft, Goldman Sachs, etc). Anything goes here with ethereum. Also, I have made my position clear in the Bitcoin and Alt coin thread that Ethereum has a bright future.

Can you share a link? I've read about Microsoft and JP Morgan Chase, but I can find no evidence online that GS is involved in ethereum.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WdhFJ5uArUc
05-03-2017 12:29 PM
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JayJuanGee Offline
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RE: The Ethereum Thread (the alt coin to Bitcoin)
(05-02-2017 09:33 PM)PharaohRa Wrote:  I have noticed some interest with respect to Ethereum in that many (including myself) see it as the alternative to Bitcoin and potentially even a better investment due to interest from the big boys (such as Microsoft, Goldman Sachs, etc). Anything goes here with ethereum. Also, I have made my position clear in the Bitcoin and Alt coin thread that Ethereum has a bright future.


Thanks for creating this thread.. PharoahRa...
05-03-2017 02:37 PM
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Deepdiver Offline
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RE: The Ethereum Thread (the alt coin to Bitcoin)
(05-03-2017 12:29 PM)Stun Wrote:  
(05-02-2017 09:33 PM)PharaohRa Wrote:  I have noticed some interest with respect to Ethereum in that many (including myself) see it as the alternative to Bitcoin and potentially even a better investment due to interest from the big boys (such as Microsoft, Goldman Sachs, etc). Anything goes here with ethereum. Also, I have made my position clear in the Bitcoin and Alt coin thread that Ethereum has a bright future.

Can you share a link? I've read about Microsoft and JP Morgan Chase, but I can find no evidence online that GS is involved in ethereum.

Looks like this is a better spot for my post...

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Post: #4116RE: The Bitcoin thread

There is a major tipping point emerging with cryptos as a whole. I have been doing a deep dive into cryptos and blockchain technologies and one thing is certain these will revolutionize global commerce and be accelerated by cloud and IoT growth.

I was never a big fan of BTC due to its shadowy beginnings... A character e-named Satoshi created BTC which became the darling of the dark web.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethereum mentions quite a few innovative applications... Solving real world business problems with counts that change daily... this is the key to future adoption... Last count and as I mentioned, counts change daily there were over 700 crypto currencies and many block chain projects. Secret is which alts to pick and my deep dive provides if not the answer at least uncovered a success model methodology.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cryptocurrency good General overview and history.

I was going to write up a data sheet however demand for rational analysis and objective forecasts is yuuge so I am working on a concise ebook instead.

One topic I have not seen covered much is cryptos as solutions to mega trends... I do cyber security work on legacy and cloud based systems and no less than multi trillion dollars assests Fidelity investments is doing blockchain innovations based on ethereum ... This will change every thing... Stay tuned.
(This post was last modified: 05-03-2017 03:31 PM by Deepdiver.)
05-03-2017 03:30 PM
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Phoenix Offline
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RE: The Ethereum Thread (the alt coin to Bitcoin)
Can anybody explain what the etherium "smart contracts" are, how they work, and why someone would use them? I read an article on it but it was written by a nerd who couldn't explain how a toaster works in less than an essay.
05-03-2017 05:09 PM
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pants Offline
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RE: The Ethereum Thread (the alt coin to Bitcoin)
To my limited understanding it would work something like this.

Lets say:
Several members wants Roosh to write "Bang Norway" Roosh wants to write Bang Norway, but he requires funding. Lets say 1000 ETH in total.

So we decide for 100 members to pay 10 ETH each, which should only be released into Roosh account when we reach the target required.
This will then be hardwired into the blockchain with some basic programming "If x>1000ETH, send money to Roosh. If less then 1000ETH by 1.1.2018 transfer ETH back to funders´

Alternatively we could formulate a different contract implementing the vote function of the ethereum.
"the money should only be released after the product have been made, and when more than 80% of the shareholders votes yes that he is satisfied with the product.

You get the point, there are lots of way to formulate the contract...

Sort of like a "kickstarter" without a specific corporation behind it. That´s the ´smartness´ of the contract.
I would imagine it should also be possible to implement the actual contract in the blockchain. Sort of like "this money should specifically be used to write "Bang Norway". And by you being able to show ownership of the transaction, you might have something that could be used in our preexisting legal system?

Pure speculation, take it for what it is...
(This post was last modified: 05-03-2017 05:54 PM by pants.)
05-03-2017 05:47 PM
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Phoenix Offline
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RE: The Ethereum Thread (the alt coin to Bitcoin)
Interesting. Are there any forms of this type of technology which have privacy? As I understand it, by using a block chain (which is publicly viewable by all) you can't have secrecy. Which is often quite important for contracts.
05-03-2017 05:52 PM
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pants Offline
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RE: The Ethereum Thread (the alt coin to Bitcoin)
I am far from sure.
But lets say you go to a ethereum minibank that is not surveillance. Buy 1000 ETH for cash that you transfer to an address you have no previous connection with. And only use this money through a VPN/dark web, i would think it would be hard for someone to identify you.

Then again, they managed to take down silk road. That might have been through sloppiness of silk road/users.
05-03-2017 05:58 PM
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JayJuanGee Offline
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RE: The Ethereum Thread (the alt coin to Bitcoin)
(05-03-2017 05:47 PM)pants Wrote:  To my limited understanding it would work something like this.

Lets say:
Several members wants Roosh to write "Bang Norway" Roosh wants to write Bang Norway, but he requires funding. Lets say 1000 ETH in total.

So we decide for 100 members to pay 10 ETH each, which should only be released into Roosh account when we reach the target required.
This will then be hardwired into the blockchain with some basic programming "If x>1000ETH, send money to Roosh. If less then 1000ETH by 1.1.2018 transfer ETH back to funders´

Alternatively we could formulate a different contract implementing the vote function of the ethereum.
"the money should only be released after the product have been made, and when more than 80% of the shareholders votes yes that he is satisfied with the product.

You get the point, there are lots of way to formulate the contract...

Sort of like a "kickstarter" without a specific corporation behind it. That´s the ´smartness´ of the contract.
I would imagine it should also be possible to implement the actual contract in the blockchain. Sort of like "this money should specifically be used to write "Bang Norway". And by you being able to show ownership of the transaction, you might have something that could be used in our preexisting legal system?

Pure speculation, take it for what it is...


Great explanation..

The legal system may well be another matter in which there is likely going to be a lot of all over the place in terms of whether binding, enforceable or in violation of some public accepted principles, such as the rule against perpetuities. Just because such a contract might go against laws, doesn't necessarily mean that governments would necessarily go after them.
05-03-2017 06:09 PM
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robreke Offline
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RE: The Ethereum Thread (the alt coin to Bitcoin)
(05-03-2017 03:30 PM)Deepdiver Wrote:  
(05-03-2017 12:29 PM)Stun Wrote:  
(05-02-2017 09:33 PM)PharaohRa Wrote:  I have noticed some interest with respect to Ethereum in that many (including myself) see it as the alternative to Bitcoin and potentially even a better investment due to interest from the big boys (such as Microsoft, Goldman Sachs, etc). Anything goes here with ethereum. Also, I have made my position clear in the Bitcoin and Alt coin thread that Ethereum has a bright future.

Can you share a link? I've read about Microsoft and JP Morgan Chase, but I can find no evidence online that GS is involved in ethereum.

Looks like this is a better spot for my post...

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Post: #4116RE: The Bitcoin thread

There is a major tipping point emerging with cryptos as a whole. I have been doing a deep dive into cryptos and blockchain technologies and one thing is certain these will revolutionize global commerce and be accelerated by cloud and IoT growth.

I was never a big fan of BTC due to its shadowy beginnings... A character e-named Satoshi created BTC which became the darling of the dark web.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethereum mentions quite a few innovative applications... Solving real world business problems with counts that change daily... this is the key to future adoption... Last count and as I mentioned, counts change daily there were over 700 crypto currencies and many block chain projects. Secret is which alts to pick and my deep dive provides if not the answer at least uncovered a success model methodology.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cryptocurrency good General overview and history.

I was going to write up a data sheet however demand for rational analysis and objective forecasts is yuuge so I am working on a concise ebook instead.

One topic I have not seen covered much is cryptos as solutions to mega trends... I do cyber security work on legacy and cloud based systems and no less than multi trillion dollars assests Fidelity investments is doing blockchain innovations based on ethereum ... This will change every thing... Stay tuned.

DD
Being in this space and knowledgeable about it, I was curious what your favorite cryptos are for investing and those that are 'legit' ?

I'm assuming you like ETH. You said BTC had shadowy beginnings but have you changed your tune?

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05-03-2017 06:16 PM
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pants Offline
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RE: The Ethereum Thread (the alt coin to Bitcoin)
(05-03-2017 06:09 PM)JayJuanGee Wrote:  
(05-03-2017 05:47 PM)pants Wrote:  To my limited understanding it would work something like this.

snip..
Great explanation..

The legal system may well be another matter in which there is likely going to be a lot of all over the place in terms of whether binding, enforceable or in violation of some public accepted principles, such as the rule against perpetuities. Just because such a contract might go against laws, doesn't necessarily mean that governments would necessarily go after them.

yes, in this day and age, the best would be to formulate such a ´smart´ contract, that a legal system should not be necessary. After all thats what this whole technology is about. Replacing the accountants, the bank and the lawyers.


EDIT: messup quote signes.
EDIT2: and some types...
(This post was last modified: 05-03-2017 06:23 PM by pants.)
05-03-2017 06:21 PM
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RE: The Ethereum Thread (the alt coin to Bitcoin)
(05-03-2017 06:21 PM)pants Wrote:  
(05-03-2017 06:09 PM)JayJuanGee Wrote:  
(05-03-2017 05:47 PM)pants Wrote:  To my limited understanding it would work something like this.

snip..
Great explanation..

The legal system may well be another matter in which there is likely going to be a lot of all over the place in terms of whether binding, enforceable or in violation of some public accepted principles, such as the rule against perpetuities. Just because such a contract might go against laws, doesn't necessarily mean that governments would necessarily go after them.

yes, in this day and age, the best would be to formulate such a ´smart´ contract, that a legal system should not be necessary. After all thats what this whole technology is about. Replacing the accountants, the bank and the lawyers.


EDIT: messup quote signes.
EDIT2: and some types...

You are pie in the sky if you think that you are going to get rid of governments any time soon, even though I understand that there are a large number of aspirations to attempt to get rid of the government.

There is going to continue to be a lot of divergence in these kinds of areas and probably even disparate attempts at enforcement and new laws and maybe the most that we could expect is that the law is going to take a long time to catch up - even though some areas will have more enlightenment than others - but in the end, it will likely be the continued nature of people to attempt to take advantage of various loopholes. and ambiguities - even sometimes when people will sometimes get screwed by the same loopholes, ambiguities and disparate enforcement.
05-03-2017 06:53 PM
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pants Offline
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RE: The Ethereum Thread (the alt coin to Bitcoin)
That´s a whole another discussion. But i am far from a libertarian who want to eliminate the government.
This is also one of the negative aspects i associate with cryptos, collecting taxes could become a problem.

The tax code might need a rewrite in order to suite the new economy thought.
05-03-2017 07:02 PM
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PharaohRa Offline
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RE: The Ethereum Thread (the alt coin to Bitcoin)
Quote:Originally posted by Stun
Can you share a link? I've read about Microsoft and JP Morgan Chase, but I can find no evidence online that GS is involved in ethereum.

Best I could find:

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-02-27...n-alliance
https://venturebeat.com/2017/02/28/big-b...-ethereum/

I think the Goldman mentioning from the Youtube videos was that Vitalik Buterin hired Goldman people on his team, so the connection is just who he hired.
(This post was last modified: 05-03-2017 08:06 PM by PharaohRa.)
05-03-2017 07:54 PM
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RE: The Ethereum Thread (the alt coin to Bitcoin)
ETH is an altcoin to Bitcoin nothing more nothing less. It did well to get pumped from $1 to $80.

I would have thought big banks might be more interested in ETC because at least ETC (the actual original ETH) is actually not changed by devs on a whim.

The whole big bank backing as well could be a ruse to try to compare favorably to BTC. One of the core purposes of Cryptos is to not be a slave to the big banks and corporations in making your transactions.

Once it (hopefully) goes back down to reasonable prices I might start a Dogecoin thread.
05-03-2017 08:56 PM
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Armogan Offline
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RE: The Ethereum Thread (the alt coin to Bitcoin)
(05-03-2017 05:52 PM)Phoenix Wrote:  Interesting. Are there any forms of this type of technology which have privacy? As I understand it, by using a block chain (which is publicly viewable by all) you can't have secrecy. Which is often quite important for contracts.

There are a few technologies that use something called zK-SNARKS, specifically Zcash. Essentially, its a mathematical algorithm that verifies transactions without actually knowing the details. This will make things private. Transactions will be added to the blockchain without identifying the addresseses, but verified using zK-SNARKS. ETH will implement this by July.

(05-03-2017 08:56 PM)Skank_Hunt Wrote:  I would have thought big banks might be more interested in ETC because at least ETC (the actual original ETH) is actually not changed by devs on a whim.

Speculation is pumping ETH right now - speculation of the roadmap and it's plans. ETC is crap because it cannot follow the roadmap of ETH. What is driving investors, banks, etc., is scaling, privacy, efficiency. These are planned to be implemented on ETH through 2 planned hard forks, Metropolis and Casper. ETC will not have these features as it will not be able to hardfork like ETH to obtain these features. It will remain shitty.
05-03-2017 09:56 PM
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RE: The Ethereum Thread (the alt coin to Bitcoin)
(05-03-2017 09:56 PM)Armogan Wrote:  There are a few technologies that use something called zK-SNARKS, specifically Zcash. Essentially, its a mathematical algorithm that verifies transactions without actually knowing the details. This will make things private. Transactions will be added to the blockchain without identifying the addresseses, but verified using zK-SNARKS. ETH will implement this by July.

Is this already priced in?
05-03-2017 11:44 PM
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Armogan Offline
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RE: The Ethereum Thread (the alt coin to Bitcoin)
I don't think so. And this goes back to another point I made when Gee said the BTC ETF is priced in....

No one knows for sure, you can't be. You can only see what happens after the event to accurately determine if something was priced in.

We all know what happened with the BTC ETF, it was not priced in.

Well know after metropolis.
(This post was last modified: 05-04-2017 12:19 AM by Armogan.)
05-04-2017 12:18 AM
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RE: The Ethereum Thread (the alt coin to Bitcoin)
(05-04-2017 12:18 AM)Armogan Wrote:  I don't think so. And this goes back to another point I made when Gee said the BTC ETF is priced in....

No one knows for sure, you can't be. You can only see what happens after the event to accurately determine if something was priced in.

We all know what happened with the BTC ETF, it was not priced in.

Well know after metropolis.


You keep repeating the same thing over and over, and suggesting that you were right.. when it seems the most logical conclusion was that you were not right.

I said it was priced in and you said that it wasn't.

Thereafter, the ETF was denied and the market reacted by at first going down about 20%.. but immediately bouncing back. Actually, the market bounced back from $891 to it's present price, which I said that supported my theory that the denial of the ETF was priced in, and you said that such facts do not support such a theory.. but you did not give any explanation beyond the mere fact that the price dropped in the short term. In sum, we have a difference of opinion, but you keep suggesting some kind of competition about whether one person is correct or the other person is correct.
05-04-2017 12:25 AM
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Armogan Offline
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RE: The Ethereum Thread (the alt coin to Bitcoin)
Wrong it dropped by 30% on Friday, and it didn't immediately bounce back.

It also didn't drop straight to $895, wrong again. It went up to $1100s then proceeding to dive down.

You can't claim something was priced in because here we are 2 months later and the price is up. Completely unrelated. Biased. Skewed. False. Fake news.

When something is priced in, that event doesn't impact the price. ETF rejection impacted the price, big time, thus not priced in. I explain this multiple times because you still don't get it.

In fact, this is the Ethereum thread. Perhaps, you should take your BTC talk to another relevant thread. You've admitted that you know nothing about ETH, so essentially you have nothing of substance to add. Why make two threads if you're going to comment and read in both?
(This post was last modified: 05-04-2017 12:40 AM by Armogan.)
05-04-2017 12:36 AM
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Isaac Jordan Offline
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RE: The Ethereum Thread (the alt coin to Bitcoin)
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05-04-2017 01:22 AM
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RE: The Ethereum Thread (the alt coin to Bitcoin)
(05-04-2017 12:36 AM)Armogan Wrote:  Wrong it dropped by 30% on Friday, and it didn't immediately bounce back.

It also didn't drop straight to $895, wrong again. It went up to $1100s then proceeding to dive down.

You can't claim something was priced in because here we are 2 months later and the price is up. Completely unrelated. Biased. Skewed. False. Fake news.

Look at you.. trying to throw in a few buzz phrases just to desperately make your point, which happens to be wrong.

The punchline is that there was a lot of hype around bitcoin at the time of the ETF, but the price was generally going up.

Probably less than 30% of the folks thought that the ETF was going to be disapproved, but as the announcement came closer, more people began to believe that the ETF might get approved.. let's say it went up to 40%.. anyhow when it was disapproved market manipulators took advantage of that disapproval to manipulate down.. but largely, the price continued to go up.. because people had already expected.. for the most part that the ETF was going to be disapproved.

You can frame it in some other way if you like.. but the fact of the matter is that each of us has a different understanding of the meaning of "priced in" and what proves it or does not prove it... so we disagree and we should move on to new topics rather than beating this one to death in a dozen posts in the other thread and now another series of repetitious posts.



(05-04-2017 12:36 AM)Armogan Wrote:  When something is priced in, that event doesn't impact the price.

Don't prove yourself more of a dumb-ass than you already have.

The world is not black and white and markets are not black and white either and the concept of "priced in" is not black and white. You keep trying to assert that there is some kind of black and white and what is the point?

(05-04-2017 12:36 AM)Armogan Wrote:  ETF rejection impacted the price, big time, thus not priced in. I explain this multiple times because you still don't get it.

The most impact of the ETF was before the ETF announcement and an opportunity to manipulate.

Largely the ETF did not affect the BTC market because the market largely kept going in the direction that it was going.. namely up (with a bit of a blip in the radar - a tinee weenie 30% correction, which should be expected from time to time, anyhow, when the price had nearly doubled over the previous several months (from $600 to $1150).. we were due a correction.. am I not right?

(05-04-2017 12:36 AM)Armogan Wrote:  In fact, this is the Ethereum thread. Perhaps, you should take your BTC talk to another relevant thread.

We are not talking about ETH.. I am responding to your bringing up the topic and saying "Gee" blah blah blah..

If you did not want me to say anything, then you should have avoided saying "Gee" blah blah blah.

(05-04-2017 12:36 AM)Armogan Wrote:  You've admitted that you know nothing about ETH, so essentially you have nothing of substance to add. Why make two threads if you're going to comment and read in both?

Because I can exercise my discretion regarding whether or if to respond. That's why.
05-04-2017 01:32 AM
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RE: The Ethereum Thread (the alt coin to Bitcoin)
OP shouldn't have included the word 'bitcoin' in the title. Encourages the raging dickheadery in the bitcoin thread to break its containment and leak into this one.
05-04-2017 04:17 AM
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