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Morbidly obese. Desperate for advice on where to start.
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Elster Away
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Post: #201
RE: Morbidly obese. Desperate for advice on where to start.
I would almost deny any argument on the grounds of the argumentator being a vegan but that is me navigating a vessel of fallacy...

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07-05-2017 06:37 AM
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Simeon_Strangelight Offline
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Post: #202
RE: Morbidly obese. Desperate for advice on where to start.
(07-04-2017 03:54 PM)TheMost Wrote:  I did a 30 day water fast. I lost 15 pounds, it screwed up my metabolism, and it all came back within 2 weeks.

I did a 30 day potato hack. I was never hungry, weak, tired or cold. I dropped 20 pounds and my belt is now 5 notches tighter. 3 months later, the weight is still off, eating whatever I feel like. Might have gained 5 pounds back. Once the belt notches started closing, I didn't need to weigh myself; when you lose fat that fast, it is your belt that is the best measurement. At the end of the day, most of us care about the six pack stomach and looking good more than weight. Weight is a poor proxy, but it is easier to measure than waist size, especially if you are losing 1 pound a week.

I am on day 4 of the water fast, which I do with the basic orthomolecular supplements (vitamin c 2000-4000mg extra, multivitamin-mineral, vitmain D3, magnesium, some Omega 3 acids). I lost 12 pounds already.

No idea how you managed to lose just 15 pounds while drinking water for 30 days. Of course you can easily gain 10-15 pounds in 2 weeks.

The one case of the obese guy who fasted for 380 days on water - he took also supplements.

Of course you lose more if you work out and do some cardio exercises.

Quote:The doctor who supervised Barbieri’s 382-day fast published a case report in 1973, describing not only his 276-pound weight loss—from 456 to 180 pounds—but also the many vitamins and minerals they used to keep him alive, and the fact his patient went “37 to 48 days between stools.”

I seriously doubt that it is healthy without supplements. You may do it without much impact if you are in your teens or early 20s, but that also depends on how many nutrients your body had up to now. Body fat replaces carbohydrates fully and above a certain level (10%+ of bodyfat) you can even use it to build lean muscle, though you need to be in full ketosis.

I started to experience ever less hunger now. My target is somewhere in the 8% bodyfat.

-----------------

http://nypost.com/2016/12/14/man-eats-no...or-a-year/

That guy lost 100 pounds in a year (which is frankly not that impressive), but he was slimmer than the water-fast-guy above.

The potato diet also very likely works. Depending on how your diet looked before it can be a market improvement. I would still take the basic supplements with that, but the need is less.

You can calculate the nutrient intake on Cronometer - 6 pounds of potatoes will get you a full protein, mineral and even significant vitamin dose. You will be lacking in healthy fats and some vitamins, but that is true with almost all diets.
07-05-2017 06:47 AM
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Suits Offline
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Post: #203
RE: Morbidly obese. Desperate for advice on where to start.
My weight as of this week as a stable 148 LB. No progress, as I took a step back from weight-loss for two weeks. This week I'm back into dieting hardcore at about 1000 calories per day.

Will report in on gains again on Monday.
07-05-2017 07:23 AM
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TigerMandingo Offline
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Post: #204
RE: Morbidly obese. Desperate for advice on where to start.
Suits how tall are you? Just out of curiosity. Are you looking to get leaner or something?
07-05-2017 04:55 PM
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Suits Offline
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Post: #205
RE: Morbidly obese. Desperate for advice on where to start.
(07-05-2017 04:55 PM)TigerMandingo Wrote:  Suits how tall are you? Just out of curiosity. Are you looking to get leaner or something?

I'm 6ft. I've got a very slim build, so 148 is still a little overweight for me, although it probably wouldn't be for a lot of guys my height.

I consulted with a doctor when I reached 150 to confirm that I wasn't crazy for thinking that I could stand to lose 5-10 more pounds.
07-05-2017 08:35 PM
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Post: #206
RE: Morbidly obese. Desperate for advice on where to start.
Drink lots of water.

Eat lettuce and tuna...small portions.

take duramine.
07-07-2017 04:22 AM
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Simeon_Strangelight Offline
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Post: #207
RE: Morbidly obese. Desperate for advice on where to start.
One of the most effective and quite healthy diets are promoted by an English alternative nutrition institute. I would only criticize their soy-pushing, but they still recommend even meat 2 times per week and fish daily if you like.

The diet is essentially without any "dieting" or caloric restriction. You simply eat how much you want and only cut out coffee and sugar/treats for the period. Later you can still have the meal, but can add cheat days.

They had 3 series running in Britian, Germany and Austria. Only the program in Austria ran longer, because they chose some 55 year old prune in the UK to lead it and no one wanted to watch her mug or look like her:

[Image: gillian_mckeith_1.jpg]




Note that rampant fat shaming - this is 10 years ago, so the PC pendulum had not swung that hard.

For example - that woman above lost 28 pounds in one month - keep in mind no caloric restriction whatsoever! They recommend eating nuts and other treats in great amounts if feeling hungry. Your body still loses weight because a calorie is not a calorie.

That is why I was not overly impressed by the potato guy and his 17 pounds per month while he ate nothing but fucking potatoes.

The breakfast recipes look like this:

[Image: i?u=http%3A%2F%2F4.bp.blogspot.com%2F-Af...mp;amp;c=1]

That is a lunch recipe - the only limitation is only one slice of wholemeal bread.
[Image: RDW_Hackfleischbaellchen_web.jpg]

If you are interested, then you can check out the book rather by the Austrian version of the show - she wrote a book in English with plenty of recipes. It also explains the method in detail:

https://www.amazon.com/Walleczek-Method-...bc?ie=UTF8

Also there is a reason why her program was more successful - she did the series in her mid 30s and looked like that:

[Image: _CI1490776.jpg]

The people on the show lost usually 20-50 pounds in one month - some men sped it up by working out, but most just ate the stuff that she recommended, cooked the recipes in the book and that was it. And as I said before - no starving, plenty of variety in food, meat and fish galore. No caloric counting whatsoever!

We are not combustion engines, because that is how they calculate the caloric metric - they burn it and see how much heat it generates.

But we all should know that it makes a difference whether we eat the same caloric number in apples, lean beef, coconut oil, nuts than if we ingested an equal amount of sweets, pastries, pizza and transfat-fried meat. The first group would make us lean over time while the latter fat.
(This post was last modified: 07-07-2017 06:48 AM by Simeon_Strangelight.)
07-07-2017 06:47 AM
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CJM Offline
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Post: #208
RE: Morbidly obese. Desperate for advice on where to start.
Good on you for being here, and exposing something about yourself that obviously makes you feel insecure. That's often the hardest part.

I'll give you a success story: my brother was morbidly obese. He was 20 years old, clocking in at about 325lbs. In the last 14 months, he has lost 115lbs. He did it by changing his lifestyle in only two ways.
1. He stopped eating pizza/burgers for every meal
2. He started walking to school every day (2.5km each way).

That's it. He didn't go on a ridiculous sugar free diet. He didn't eliminate all carbs. When you are obese, walking is 100% the best first solution. You will melt fat off by speedwalking everyday. It won't cause injury, and it won't exhaust you, but you can be damn sure you'll be shedding calories like a motherfucker. Combine that with just a few diet related changes. First and foremost, replace 80% of your liquid intake with good old fashioned water. You'll sleep better, think better, feel better, and lose weight. Then just try and ensure you eat a healthy dinner every night, with no junk food after dinner. I guarantee doing just those minor changes will be a. pretty easy and b. successful for you.
07-26-2017 03:19 PM
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Sonoma Offline
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Post: #209
RE: Morbidly obese. Desperate for advice on where to start.
What does your work schedule look like?

If possible, leave any means of payment at home, and never purchase things you'll regret eating the 2-3 times you need to shop for groceries.

On your time outside of work just avoid going home at all costs, to keep you from being around food. Making your food overly spicy/peppery can also deter overeating.

On days off go for a full day hike. If not near high quality hikes, take enough $ to buy a bus ticket, carry a gallon of water, maybe a protein bar, and then spend the day walking your sorry ass home from the farthest reasonable point (20 miles is a good start).

I had an issue spending money when I was younger, and by leaving my wallet at home I also found myself getting quite a bit leaner. I didn't have a car so walking was mandatory. Leave your phone at home if you're up to it. You'll find your heads a lot clearer. It can be a little blue walking that long with only your thoughts, but ultimately it's very satisfying
(This post was last modified: 07-26-2017 06:12 PM by Sonoma.)
07-26-2017 06:07 PM
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wi30 Offline
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Post: #210
RE: Morbidly obese. Desperate for advice on where to start.
(07-05-2017 08:35 PM)Suits Wrote:  
(07-05-2017 04:55 PM)TigerMandingo Wrote:  Suits how tall are you? Just out of curiosity. Are you looking to get leaner or something?

I'm 6ft. I've got a very slim build, so 148 is still a little overweight for me, although it probably wouldn't be for a lot of guys my height.

I consulted with a doctor when I reached 150 to confirm that I wasn't crazy for thinking that I could stand to lose 5-10 more pounds.

Sounds pretty soy.
07-26-2017 08:38 PM
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Beyond Borders Away
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Post: #211
RE: Morbidly obese. Desperate for advice on where to start.
Starve yourself. I'm serious.

It's not the detrimental, destructive act we've been led to believe.

You could literally not eat for months - supplementing with a multivitamin, butter coffee, and bone broth - and see nothing but good come of it aside from some discomfort, which would wane dramatically after the first few days.

Dr. Jason Fung has a couple great books in this area with extensive research and anecdotal stories on the subject. He's helped a lot of people who were not only obese but extremely ill from Type 2 diabetes, which quickly went away after they stopped eating (disclaimer: a possibly dangerous game for anyone with type 1 diabetes, a disease that is not self-imposed).

Find his books here: https://www.amazon.com/Dr.-Jason-Fung/e/B01BT8K6FK

Here's a video breaking down his theories and work. https://youtu.be/tIuj-oMN-Fk

Or take a milder alternative fasting or alternate day fasting approach and see the same results albeit over a longer time frame. Also covered at length in his books. Personally, I'd go for the nuke approach and gain momentum through massive, immediate action and then maintain your weight (and health) over the long term with a less extreme fasting schedule.

The weight thing is a critical, core issue. I'd tackle that first and gain some confidence and control over your life. Beyond that, there's surely a wealth of info in this thread and forum that can be taken to solve any of the other things holding you back.

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe.
To be your own man is a hard business. If you try it, you'll be lonely often, and sometimes
frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself." - Kipling
(This post was last modified: 07-26-2017 09:16 PM by Beyond Borders.)
07-26-2017 09:06 PM
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renotime Offline
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Post: #212
RE: Morbidly obese. Desperate for advice on where to start.

You want to know the only thing you can assume about a broken down old man? It's that he's a survivor.
07-28-2017 06:12 AM
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BarkChompson Offline
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Post: #213
RE: Morbidly obese. Desperate for advice on where to start.
I had a biologist friend explain what happens bouncing back up weight after dieting:

When you eat excess calories and store them as fat, your body makes little "pouches" for them. These pouches then fill up with fat.

When you are in a calorie deficit, these pouches empty out their fat content.

The problem is, these pouches take more energy to break down than just using the fat from other pouches.

Since they are hard to break down, you can lose a bunch of weight just by emptying the pouches. When you start eating calories again, they fill right back up.

The trick is a minor calorie deficit over a long period of time, which will break down the pouches in the longer term.

I've lost on average a pound a week since April (started at 194, this morning I was 177.2) and even with some slipups where I eat way too much for a day or two. If you're still around 300 lbs, 1% of your bodyweight per week is enough.

I've been using MyFitnessPal, and it's been the only way that I've EVER been able to lose weight and keep it off.

The three things I'd advise when using the app:
1) Stick with it. Log all your meals without trying to change how you eat, just so you can get an idea of where you're at and get in the habit of logging in general.
2) Once you've made it into a regular habit (a week or two), overestimate how many calories you eat if you don't have an exact amount.
3) Once you've made it into a regular habit, underestimate how many calories you burn through exercise.

Good luck dude, let us know how it goes.
(This post was last modified: 08-06-2017 02:32 PM by BarkChompson.)
08-06-2017 02:29 PM
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Elster Away
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Post: #214
RE: Morbidly obese. Desperate for advice on where to start.
OP hasn't been checking in?

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08-06-2017 02:48 PM
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BarkChompson Offline
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Post: #215
RE: Morbidly obese. Desperate for advice on where to start.
Plus this on lentils:

Quote: Post: #17RE: What are the least bad carbs?
Lentils. They have a ton of fiber so they make you full.

1/4 cup + chopped non-starch veggies + 1/4 cup shredded cheese + salt = ~400 calories and a full stomach.

edit:
Full disclosure, a lot of fiber means good poops but also lots of farts.

Also it's 3/4 of a cup not 1/4.

https://www.rooshvforum.com/thread-57960...pid1514830
(This post was last modified: 08-06-2017 03:03 PM by BarkChompson.)
08-06-2017 03:02 PM
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BarkChompson Offline
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Post: #216
RE: Morbidly obese. Desperate for advice on where to start.
Sweet potatoes. Fill a dutch oven with raw ones, poke some holes in them, cook at 400 for 1:15 and enjoy.

400 calories/lb, lots of fiber. Good luck eating more than a pound of that stuff at a time, you'll be full.
04-13-2018 04:27 PM
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ElFlaco Away
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Post: #217
RE: Morbidly obese. Desperate for advice on where to start.
(08-06-2017 02:48 PM)Elster Wrote:  OP hasn't been checking in?

Putting the morbid in 'morbidly obese'?
04-14-2018 04:11 PM
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