I'm Touring The United States! Starting in June, I'm conducting private events in 23 American cities. Click here for full details.

Post Reply 
Side Effects of TRT
Author Message
Hypno Offline
International Playboy
******

Posts: 3,233
Joined: Dec 2016
Reputation: 33
Post: #1
Side Effects of TRT
There is some information on the TRT Injections and Clomid threads on side effects, but I thought it would be useful to have a dedicated thread for this information to share experiences.

Before I begin, I want to state that my results are not typical, my side effects were more extreme. And I made a few mistakes. TRT can be very beneficial if done right. Don’t let me discourage you, use this information to do it better than I did.

Getting a Scrip
One mistake I made was not appreciating how difficult it is to get good advice and even get a scrip. My regular physician who has been seeing me for about 10 years
does not test T as part of a regular physical. I had to tell him that I had some very specific examples of low T symptoms to get him to add it to my blood work. My T was 396 and free T 5.5. That was on the low end of normal, but for my age (40s) not alarming. Nevertheless, he referred me to an endocrinologist.

The endo was really a diabetes doctor. He acknowledged my symptoms but as a rule would not prescribe T for a many with T over 300. So I started on Clomid, 25mg every other day (EOD) with is a high dose. Eventually my T shot up to 1167, but my SHBG and E shot up as well. The first day I felt like King Kong, and I felt great for two weeks, but eventually I was completely fatigued, not leaving the house except to go to work, and going to bed at 7pm. I eventually quit cold turkey and signed up with an out of state medical practice that does telephone consultations (Defy Medical).

As an aside, I went on Clomid because I want to remain fertile for now and was a bit afraid of injections. It also seemed easier to take a pill than do an injection. The injections are no big deal except getting the hang of doing it the first time, so my reluctance was misplaced.

As a final word on Clomid, the stuff works. Now, some people get eye floaters even with taking half the dose I did, and there is concern that this can be permanent. I didn’t have this problem, but I did have minor vision problems with T, see below.

Also, my “doc” didn’t prescribe an aromatase inhibitory, so my Estradiol and SHBG shot up. These swamped the effects of the T such that I felt worse than before taking it. As an aside, Clomid is available from generic Indian pharmacies.

TRT and HCG Injections
My new doc required a cash paid consultation and new blood work. They put me on testosterone cypionate, 40 ml which is 80 mg, twice a week, or 160 mg per week. Also 500 IUs of HCG, (1000 per week), and 0.125 mg of Anastrazole or .25mg per week. Doses are twice per week to avoid spikes.

Well my T has remained high, about 100, but my Estradiol and SHBG are also high. And I’m having significant fatigue.

I assumed that the new regimen would be a magic bullet because now I had an aromatase inhibitor. But I’m still not feeling the benefits of TRT. I’m now probably at the other end of the yo yo.

One thing I learned in retrospect is to keep a detailed journal regarding energy levels, sleep times and quality, and any other relevant symptoms. This is because the benefits of TRT can be easily overwhelmed by the side effects of too much or too little T. Also, the symptoms of high E are very similar to low E, so you need to pay attention to subtle differences to fine tune things.

According to the blog dosagemayvary.com, these are the symptoms of high and low Estradiol:

High Estradiol Symptoms:

• Soft erections, inability to maintain an erection
• water retention (less frequent urination), leading to excessive sweating, blood pressure spikes or high blood pressure (from the water retention)
• insomnia
• hot flushing (flushing around the ears or on the face)
• night sweats (from estradiol lowering, causing loss of water retention)
• bloating; brain fog (like your head’s in a bubble)
• testicles seem smaller than usual

Low Estradiol Symptoms:

• Fatigue along the lines of sleepiness
• hypersomnia (sleeping too much and too often)
• strong erections but limited sensitivity
• loss of erections
• osteoporosis and osteopenia
• joint pain, clicking or popping joints
• eye fatigue (eyes seem more tired despite adequate sleep, dark circles)
• loss of libido (interest in sex)
• difficulty retaining water (constant urination)
• anxiety, depression, irritability

One thing this blog recommends is twice weekly injections in order to smooth out peaks and valleys. I’m already doing this. I had a follow up consult with my doc and he believes I have low estradiol now. I’ve stopped my aromatase inhibitor. The problem is that it’s not like a Tylenol, it stays in your body for a while. So you need to tweak things gradually. I’m also taking a break from injecting, and if I restart it might be half doses. I feel that bad.

Other side effects.
Some other side effects I have experienced is eye fatigue. I work on a computer all day, and recently about half way through the day I’m squinting strenuously.

Occasional joint pain but I’m in my 40s so I can’t say that this is a side effect.

Loss of sensitivity during intercourse, but I use condoms so again it’s hard to say this is a side effect.

Hypersomnia – definitely, to the point that I would rather sleep than have sex. I’m talking about on a Saturday afternoon or at 7 in the evening.

Red Blood count – finally, testosterone increases red blood cell count to the point where your doc will probably recommend that you donate blood every 2-3 months. This is for your health. So make sure you are getting follow up blood work and checking your hematocrit levels. Donating blood is not a big deal but to me it’s a hassle because my local red cross is like going to the DMV.

Acne - I have had a small increase in acne, and have gotten 2 or 3 large pimples on my back, but none on my face

Allergies - my skin allergies have increased to the point where I can't keep a beard past a month's growth. After about a month, I end up clawing at it and end up shaving it off despite my best efforts to keep it.

So TRT may require fine tuning for you. Expect side effects and keep a daily journal. Use a physician who knows what he is doing.
(This post was last modified: 01-02-2018 07:29 AM by Hypno.)
01-02-2018 07:20 AM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[-] The following 5 users Like Hypno's post:
CaptainChardonnay, not_dead_yet, Brodiaga, Repo, birthday cat
Hypno Offline
International Playboy
******

Posts: 3,233
Joined: Dec 2016
Reputation: 33
Post: #2
RE: Side Effects of TRT
I forgot to add this.

Since increasing my T, I am prone to drink more.

Also, since having my E screwed up, I tend to procrastinate more and lose focus more. Finishing projects has been difficult.
01-02-2018 06:38 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Steelex Offline
Wingman
***

Posts: 950
Joined: Dec 2016
Reputation: 39
Post: #3
RE: Side Effects of TRT
As you can see, TRT is no magic bullet.

You need to monitor your own T and estradiol levels. You can get the appropriate bloodwork done for 60 bucks on private MD Labs.

If your E2 is messed up you will likely have emotional and mental sides.
01-02-2018 07:27 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[-] The following 4 users Like Steelex's post:
doc holliday, Cruisen_Chubby, CaptainChardonnay, birthday cat
LINUX Away
True Player
*****
Gold Member

Posts: 1,872
Joined: Sep 2014
Reputation: 242
Post: #4
RE: Side Effects of TRT
Here is my take, I'm not going to go into detail because it would take hours to explain many misconceptions that you have and I feel for other guys interested in TRT who read this and are discouraged,

Your problem isn't the test, you have some other issues going on, probably your sleep, diet, and training.

You're confused on the half life of armidex. Your dosage is wrong, the allergy thing makes no sense, your eye issues arent related to the test, your doctor sucks, your procrastinate isnt related to estrogen. You dont need to donate blood every two-three months, especially with a normal TRT dose. I did a gram a test for a decade without any sort of AI or SERM and I never complained like this and I run a gram now and donate blood once a year. I also don't know what a test level of 100 means, I assume you mean 1000(ng/dL, which is a good level. The drinking urge also makes no sense at all.

Sure estrogen is important and you need to balance, but that's not whats going on with you. It's just not. Test is not going to improve your life in a few months like people expect, its a holistic approach, higher test, better diet, training, sleeping, fucking, enjoying life and not sweating the small stuff that will improve your life. It doesn't happen overnight and test is no magic bullet. If you were taking buckets of tren and halotestin and slamming baseball bats against trash cans outside, then yea, I get it and understand your complaints but your test levels and estrogen is so minuscule that it's just not your problem.

Fix your adex dose. Do it every other day or every day, you'll know you have the correct dosage for you by getting your own blood test like was recommended by steelex. Everyone is different but you're coming across as a hypochondriac and every problem you're having, you blaming it on increase test or lackthereof.
(This post was last modified: 01-02-2018 09:26 PM by LINUX.)
01-02-2018 09:25 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[-] The following 8 users Like LINUX's post:
zoom, doc holliday, Cruisen_Chubby, CaptainChardonnay, theking, kaotic, Windom Earle, Fortis
doc holliday Offline
Alpha Male
****
Gold Member

Posts: 1,164
Joined: Oct 2015
Reputation: 57
Post: #5
RE: Side Effects of TRT
Linux and Steelex are correct. In the beginning stages of doing TRT you need to do regular blood tests to know that your levels of T, Free T and E are where they should be. It's not a magic bullet, you won't turn into Superman just by going into a phone booth because you're on TRT and my guess is that your diet, training etc are nowhere close to where they need to be to experience the full benefits of TRT. If your body fat is too high, you're going to have issues with your E levels. It took me a good 8-9 months before I got into a good rhythm with my doses. Also, you have to stop drinking the way you likely are, that's killing whatever benefit you should be getting (and not allowing you to drop body fat).

A lot of guys think just shooting a bunch of Test is going to solve all of their problems but it requires a whole mindset and lifestyle change. If you don't do this, you will have the problems that you're having. And look even on TRT, you'll have days where you feel tired and not so hot, especially as you continue to get older. That's not a big deal. Again, it doesn't turn you into a superhero but it should improve your life. If you embrace it holistically.
01-02-2018 09:50 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[-] The following 1 user Likes doc holliday's post:
Diop
Steelex Offline
Wingman
***

Posts: 950
Joined: Dec 2016
Reputation: 39
Post: #6
RE: Side Effects of TRT
Lot of wisdom dropped here.

Everyone who feels unmotivated seems to think they have low t. Maybe they just lack a work ethic.
01-03-2018 12:04 AM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[-] The following 1 user Likes Steelex's post:
kaotic
General Stalin Offline
International Playboy
******
Gold Member

Posts: 5,033
Joined: Nov 2013
Reputation: 124
Post: #7
RE: Side Effects of TRT
Sounds like OP has other issues unrelated to his use of test, and the drug use likely isn't doing any favors on top of it - or he has a dosage issue
01-03-2018 12:15 AM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Bienvenuto Offline
Wingman
***
Gold Member

Posts: 724
Joined: Mar 2017
Reputation: 19
Post: #8
RE: Side Effects of TRT
Steelex, Linux, thanks for qualifying OP's experiences>

Following on from this discussion and speaking to the idea of.. T use being part of holistic approach/ newbies not really getting their ducks in a row for effective T use.. I am planning a 3 month T cycle from September to December this year (2018).

By that stage I should be below 15% body fat, eating healthy, sleeping well and training clean for about a year and in some serious shape - (Have been working out for many years up to this point but I have been more the 'fit' guy that wanders around the gym and lifts a few weights until a few months ago when I got more serious about training hard)

I have been following the main Test thread and will be sure to get blood work etc. done.

My question is: running a >general rule< (appreciate that you would need a lot more information to give a solid opinion) over what I have just described .. does this sound like a reasonable point to do a 3 month cycle in order to get to goals (increased size, athletic performance) or would you look at this and say that there is no point in test at that point and to just focus on maximising training cycle without T.

Many Thanks for your input.
01-03-2018 02:13 AM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Steelex Offline
Wingman
***

Posts: 950
Joined: Dec 2016
Reputation: 39
Post: #9
RE: Side Effects of TRT
Yeah a cycle of 500mg a week should do you plenty of good if what you say is true.

Your mileage may vary.
01-03-2018 07:20 AM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[-] The following 2 users Like Steelex's post:
Bienvenuto, kaotic
Hypno Offline
International Playboy
******

Posts: 3,233
Joined: Dec 2016
Reputation: 33
Post: #10
RE: Side Effects of TRT
I have gotten my blood work done six times in the last 6 months. I have consulted three physicians--GP plus two endos.

Seems to be cognitive dissonance that some people may have stronger side effects than others, assumptions that others don't get blood tests or that their results are due to being "newbs".

Starting T was low 300s. T is mid 1100s now. Free T above 30. SBHG down to 49 from 79. T3 and T4 in the normal range.

PM me if you actually want to help someone and want my labs instead of throwing around accusations and lables.
01-03-2018 09:39 AM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
ScrapperTL Offline
Chubby Chaser
**

Posts: 402
Joined: Jan 2016
Reputation: 14
Post: #11
RE: Side Effects of TRT
I think we have spoken before on this subject matter but if that is not true, here is my recommendation:

Toremifene @ 30 milligrams every other day

Toremifene is an extremely powerful SERM, without any of the psychological side effects of Clomid (feminine like emotionalism) or any of physical side of effects of Nolvadex (Lowered IGF-1 Levels and Eye Floaters)

Toremifene also increases Bone Mineral Density, which is fantastic for us aging guys (I'm 33 years old)

A good friend of mine who wishes not to be named, is one of the leading science experts on the Male Endocrine System and Elite Level Athletic Performance.

His research has shown that Toremifene can heal damage to the Testicles from prior Exogenous Steroid Use and/or Abuse.

From my own "Research" I have anecdotally proven this hypothesis to be 100% true and a number of members on this Forum who I am guiding can attest to that.
(This post was last modified: 01-03-2018 10:45 AM by ScrapperTL.)
01-03-2018 10:43 AM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
kaotic Offline
Innovative Casanova
*******
Gold Member

Posts: 11,938
Joined: Dec 2013
Reputation: 211
Post: #12
RE: Side Effects of TRT
I usually inject in my left glute, however I noticed somewhat of an itchy patch on the left side of my glute, not sure if it's related to the injection site or not.

Any of you guys experience this as an itchy patch ?

I've been putting neosporin and anti itch cream the past few days.

Next time I pin I'll use my right glute and see what happens.

I was mid 600's before I started test, currently using 250mg of Test C pinning 3/4 days. I've already got my PCT ready to go.

I have great guidance from veteran users and a semi pro strong man who have been helping me pin.

I'm on Week 4 I definitely feel a difference at the gym and at work - sex drive seems the same.

This thread reminds me to go buy a Private MD Homrone Panel for $60ish bucks, good news is the labs are right down the street from my work.

I also should be looking to donate blood also.

My Year in Review Guides 2014|2015|2016

Podcast with H3ltrsk3ltr, Cobra, and Vinman.

IF YOU HAVE DECIDED TO LEAVE RVF FEEL FREE TO DIRECT MESSAGE ME SO WE CAN STAY IN TOUCH
(This post was last modified: 01-03-2018 05:36 PM by kaotic.)
01-03-2018 05:32 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
ms224 Offline
Chubby Chaser
**

Posts: 494
Joined: Jan 2013
Reputation: 7
Post: #13
RE: Side Effects of TRT
(01-03-2018 10:43 AM)ScrapperTL Wrote:  I think we have spoken before on this subject matter but if that is not true, here is my recommendation:

Toremifene @ 30 milligrams every other day

Toremifene is an extremely powerful SERM, without any of the psychological side effects of Clomid (feminine like emotionalism) or any of physical side of effects of Nolvadex (Lowered IGF-1 Levels and Eye Floaters)

Toremifene also increases Bone Mineral Density, which is fantastic for us aging guys (I'm 33 years old)

A good friend of mine who wishes not to be named, is one of the leading science experts on the Male Endocrine System and Elite Level Athletic Performance.

His research has shown that Toremifene can heal damage to the Testicles from prior Exogenous Steroid Use and/or Abuse.

From my own "Research" I have anecdotally proven this hypothesis to be 100% true and a number of members on this Forum who I am guiding can attest to that.

Is there some kind of , guide?, you can point to on this?

Google doesn't seem to bring up anything pertinent right off the bat.
01-03-2018 08:54 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
birthday cat Offline
Wingman
***
Gold Member

Posts: 713
Joined: Jul 2015
Reputation: 76
Post: #14
RE: Side Effects of TRT
There are a few questionable comments in the original post but much of the information in that post is solid.

Hypno said his results were extreme and not typical. However, his results are somewhat typical for guys taking large dosages of testosterone so most of his post is very useful information.

I did a low-moderate dosage cycle when I first started testosterone and I had some of the same side effects that Hypno had. One of the things I learned from that experience and countless hours of reading about this stuff is that different guys respond differently especially when you push your testosterone levels above normal levels. I had estrogen related side effects. Some guys don't. But some guys need large dosages of testosterone to send their levels in the stratosphere. I don't. Everyone is different.

If there is one thing this forum needs regarding testosterone injections it is a more pragmatic approach other than Steelex being the only guy reminding us that testosterone injections aren't a magic pill. Test injections can have side effects and they do have risks. I'm not saying that test injections can't be very beneficial but they do have risks 100% of the time with 100% of people.

Regarding estrogen, it is a pain in the ass for some guys to get it dialed in. I understand that but it is also common for guys to focus too much on this. High estrogen isn't really a problem but very high estrogen is. Also, keep in mind that the ultra-sensitive test is preferable. The standard test tends to inflate the real value so you think your estrogen is higher than it really is.

Regarding chlomid, I always wondered why so many guys had horrible experiences but many doctors get guys to try out chlomid before test injections. The reason is because chlomid works for maybe 25% or 30% of guys and it doesn't shut down your natural production. So it might suck for the majority of guys but doctors try it out on guys to see if it works because it could be a solution without shutting down your natural production.

Regarding toremifene, I've researched it a little and I'm not sure about it. Some guys say it can be great for a short time during PCT but they don't recommend taking it long term because it increases SHBG and lowers free testosterone. I don't know much about this so please let me know what you think. Why do you agree or disagree?
01-03-2018 11:19 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
porscheguy Offline
True Player
*****

Posts: 2,365
Joined: Mar 2012
Reputation: 23
Post: #15
RE: Side Effects of TRT
I tried axiron gel a few years ago. It didn’t improve my libido that much. What I did notice was a change in my cognitive function. That came about rapidly. I felt sharper and more focused. I had less aversion to risk. I’m not sure if my muscle increased because I was working outside then and going to the gym was not necessary (I worked as a laborer for a concrete company so going to the gym really wasn’t necessary).

Unfortunately, I had to stop after a month because my blood pressure was through the roof. 170/120. This was really the only negative I experienced. I was disappointed to go off the stuff because mentally I felt incredible. We tend to overlook that. But the way I see it, the improvement in cognitive function/mental strength will allow you to push yourself harder physically.

The high BP is caused by the extra testosterone. It will make your body go into overdrive producing red blood cells. So much that your blood thickens leading to increased BP. I’d go back on that stuff in a heartbeat.
01-04-2018 09:58 PM
Find all posts by this user Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 


Possibly Related Threads...
Thread: Author Replies: Views: Last Post
  Drug side effects chicane 11 1,543 09-06-2018 05:53 AM
Last Post: chicane
  What is best to off-set Saw Palmetto possible sexual side effects? Mr.GoodThread 4 3,009 07-15-2015 08:06 PM
Last Post: Gatsby
  Squats - unusual side effect? ryanf 38 26,239 10-08-2014 05:51 PM
Last Post: vilevigilant

Forum Jump:


User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)

Contact Us | RooshV.com | Return to Top | Return to Content | Mobile Version | RSS Syndication