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Protein Battle, Whey v Casein
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Chad Daring Offline
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Protein Battle, Whey v Casein
So this all started when Velkrum mentioned the difference between Whey Isolate and Casein in another thread

(09-23-2011 06:55 AM)velkrum Wrote:  whey ISOLATE is the worst kind of protein available. You don't fully metabolize it and it has a very specific purpose..(usually post work out nutrition). Taking an isolate is basically throwing money away.

Everyone should be using CASEIN protein.



I've done some research but most of the info is from meat head pro lifters who basically say "Just keep both in the house" but I dont have a spare $100 to drop just to keep me well stocked in protein powder.

The thought being that Whey is quick absorbing, better for post/pre workout consumption. Casein is more complete, but slow absorbing so more of a meal replacement rather then a supplement. I haven't found much to corroborate Velkrums claim, but I trust the info on this board, so I'm not going to dismiss it simply because google cant disprove it.

I'm curious what others have to say about this.

Whey Isolate is what seems to be everywhere, its in most commercially available stuff, and browsing through GNC they had wall after wall of Whey Isolate but just a small section of Casein, and it was much higher in price (about 30%)

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(This post was last modified: 10-02-2011 04:42 PM by Chad Daring.)
10-02-2011 04:40 PM
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dk902 Offline
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RE: Protein Battle, Whey v Casein
The general consensus is that Casein is better in that it releases small dosages of protein of a prolonged period, so drip feeding it to your body. Thus making it a prime candidate to eat before going to bed, this can be in the form of powder or eggs, etc.

Whey generally speaking releases protein over 2-3 hours and it's all gone. A post straight from http://www.leangains.com:

Whey protein

Ideal use is pre-and post-workout. Optimum 100% Whey is the top selling product at bodybuilding.com. I would venture to guess that's due much to the innovative tastes available. I've tried Caramel Toffee Fudge and Extreme Milk Chocolate and both are very tasty.


Casein protein

Ideal use is pre-bedtime, but it could be used at any other time during the day as well. Casein protein is slow releasing and provides more satiety than whey protein in general.
10-02-2011 04:49 PM
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Buck Wild
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RE: Protein Battle, Whey v Casein
I like Blends, best of both worlds.

Gaspari Nutrition Myofusion Banana flavor is great.
10-03-2011 01:21 PM
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MikeCF Offline
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RE: Protein Battle, Whey v Casein
Senseless debate. Do you eat ONLY chicken, fish, pork, or beef?

Per gram, protein is one of the cheapest sources of protein. Amazon.com, usign subscribe and save, has great deals. So does Costco.

When guys get into this minutiae, my first question is: How many grams of protein are you taking in? Almost always, not enough.

Focus on fundamentals. Get a lot of protein, from whatever source. Worry about the details later.
10-03-2011 01:52 PM
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travolta Offline
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RE: Protein Battle, Whey v Casein
1.7g protein/kg body weight is the most you really need. Any more, and you'll just end excreting nitrogen from the excess (not very good for your kidneys), and storing it as fat!

So you want to know which is better... Whey or Casein protein?

My answer: chicken
10-03-2011 07:13 PM
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Chad Daring Offline
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RE: Protein Battle, Whey v Casein
I'm at 94/kg and eating over 150g of protein a day, I use the powder to supplement that on days where I'm pinched for eating time or simply want something reminiscent of sweet and protein intake.

I respect you all, but I started this thread for good info not for snarky answers.

Powdered protein is very easy to take in, and cost per gram is usually cheaper then meat. Money is precious for me right now so I'd rather buy the powder thats got the most bang for the buck.

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10-03-2011 08:13 PM
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velkrum Offline
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RE: Protein Battle, Whey v Casein
@ travolta

Not so sure I agree with ya.

@ Chad

protein powders alone are INCOMPLETE (I think I mentioned this in another thread). If you want the most bang for your buck mix your protein powder with 2-4 TBSP of healthy fats (olive oil or fish oil) and 3 - 4 pieces of fruit (eaten afterwards).

If you follow that advice it won't matter what kind of protein you use.

Protein alone won't metabolize very well without carbohydrates to trigger an insulin response.

Things get alot more complex but I'll save the science lecture for some other time.
(This post was last modified: 10-03-2011 08:43 PM by velkrum.)
10-03-2011 08:39 PM
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Chad Daring Offline
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RE: Protein Battle, Whey v Casein
Thats the kind of answer I was looking for, thank you Velk!


I take in my protein blended with fruit and ground flaxseed, from what I've read flaxseed has a good amount of healthy fats

Just read this about the "lingins" in flaxseed

"Lignins seem to flush excess estrogen out of the body"

Flaxseed = edible maniless???? tard

@MikeCF

I'm gonna look into Amazon, I tend to forget they carry things like that

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(This post was last modified: 10-03-2011 08:47 PM by Chad Daring.)
10-03-2011 08:46 PM
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samsamsam Offline
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RE: Protein Battle, Whey v Casein
Can someone who has some real experience with this tell me if this is credible?

I take enough protein but my attitude has always been - whey protein after lifting, then try to squeeze in the rest within an 8 hour window for IF.

If I take whey casein before the window closes, am I keeping the window open longer because it is slowly digested?

I understand I need a carb to go with my protein after workout - I didn't do that in the past. Would a banana be fast acting enough?

But this article says you need a whole food meal before the whey.

I am trying to train better without over doing it or over thinking it. But this is all new info to me. I always just drank some whey after lifting because I had heard it was critical to eat within the first hour.

Would taking some gainer (serious mass, mass up) be better because it already should have carbs in there?

Thanks.


https://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/satternorton.htm
Quote:Should I Take Casein Or Whey Protein?
Eric Satterwhite
Eric Satterwhite
February 07, 2017
Understanding the link between the structure and function of a particular muscle will help you to make the right decision, put together an intelligent program and start adding some high quality muscle mass.

Trying to decide on which proteins to use at what times and for what reasons can be a mind-numbing process.

It is my hopes that this article can shed some light on the subject. There are basically two major proteins in the bodybuilder's arsenal. Those being casein and whey. They are also sometimes referred to as slow and fast acting proteins, respectively.

The purpose of this article series is to give you an in-depth look at the properties of each of these proteins, explain what it all means and why it is important to you. And, finally, to provide a systematic way to apply it all.

THE MYTHS
So, you've got a choice. Casein or whey? Fast or slow? Some people swear by one or the other and would have you believe that one of them is, in fact, superior.

Well, I am sorry to say that those people are just plain wrong. They either do not understand the literature, have a poor sense of critical application, or just want to make an impact by taking a stand. Whichever it may be, these people have misled you. And I can assure you that their path is nothing but a downward spiral to minimal results.

To truly get the most from your protein supplementation, you will need to utilize both types of protein in your repertoire of supplements. Let's expand on whey a little bit first. I like to start with whey because it is better known and many have some background understanding of it.

THE FACTS
WHEY
Whey is a by-product of cheese production. When cheese is made, a thin liquid is left over. That liquid is whey and it is less than 1% protein. It is concentrated and dried, and you have a protein powder. Whey protein is considered a "fast acting" protein. But what, exactly, is meant by 'fast'?

Fast refers to the amount of time it takes to be fully metabolized. More specifically, the time it takes for it to be digested (if needed), absorbed into the blood, taken up by a bodily tissue, and complete one of many metabolic fates.

The two dominant pathways here are the creation of a new protein from the individual amino acids or oxidation into urea and possibly glucose.

Urea is the major component of urine, while glucose is the human basic unit of carbohydrate. With whey protein, it will take only 20 minutes before almost all of what you have consumed is coursing through your veins.

Somewhere between 20-40 minutes, the level of amino acids in your blood has reached its high point. Within the hour it will have gone through the various metabolic processes, either protein synthesis, or oxidation.11,12,13,14

This is a good thing! Muscle growth is dependant on the balance between protein synthesis and breakdown18. If the synthesis of new muscle protein is greater than the breakdown of muscle protein, net gains in muscle mass are seen.

So with whey protein, it will take only 40 minutes for blood levels of amino acids and protein synthesis to reach a peak, and in about an hour they will come back to normal after a single feeding of protein.5,14 This is amazingly fast in comparison to its counterpart casein, or even whole food.

CASEIN
Casein is considered a "slow" protein. When you consume casein, you will reach a peak in blood amino acids and protein synthesis between 3 to 4 hours.5,12

This peak, however, does not even come close to that of whey. On a scale of 1-10 (with 10 being the highest or fastest), whey would be a 10. Casein would come in with a meager rating of 2.

But, here is the kicker. That is not a bad thing! This, too, is a good thing. Casein dramatically slows the rate of protein breakdown. Remember, muscle growth is dependant on the balance of protein synthesis and breakdown.

So as we can see here, relying on one or the other, and debating which is superior is futile in the hopes to gain the most benefits from them. To tip the scale in your favor, you need to increase protein synthesis and slow down muscle breakdown. You would be a fool to write one off.

DON'T TAKE IT ALL AT ONCE
I know what you are thinking, "Why not just mix them together and get the best of both worlds?" Well, I am one step ahead of you. Casein has a unique property, in that it coagulates in the stomach.12 This causes other proteins to be digested and absorbed much more slowly.

Have you ever tried to run through a vat of tar? It isn't easy by any means. You would be moving very slowly. Casein does the same thing to whey, and other proteins for that matter. Think of it as a sort of binding gel.

This simple little fact would nullify the biggest and most important attribute of whey. That is its ability to flood your system quickly with amino acid and stimulate protein synthesis.

Now before you ask, let me stop you - I already know what you are thinking. Perhaps it would be best to just slam whey protein drinks all day to keep your system swimming in amino acids, right? Wrong! It may seem counter-intuitive, but it would not keep protein synthesis rates up.2

Just having constantly high levels of amino acids or merely having a positive protein balance doesn't stimulate protein synthesis2,5,11 and doesn't lead to increases in muscle mass.18

Then what does, you ask? All evidence points to the same thing time and time again. It is the acute and large increase in the amount of amino acids in the blood that causes protein synthesis rates to increase.2,5,11,20,15,13 If you were to tap a vein with an IV to crank blood levels of amino acids up and keep them there, we would see a dramatic increase in protein synthesis as well as a decrease in protein breakdown.11,2

However, right around two hours, synthesis rates will level off and return to normal despite the abnormally high levels of amino acids.2 What is even more interesting is that even if amino acid levels are already very high and protein synthesis is dropping, I can consume more amino acids and further stimulate an increase in synthesis rates.11

"HOW TO" MANUAL
So, here is the 'take home' message. It is not about just shoveling down 4,000 calories7 or X-amount of protein to keep your blood saturated with amino acids at all times.

It is the about presenting your body with sudden change and increase of amino acids that stimulates protein synthesis rates.2,5,11,20,15,13,9 This is why it is important to understand the differences between the various types of protein supplements.

When products start touting how much of a certain amino acid they have added or that they have a better amino acid profile, just skip it. It doesn't matter.5 The amino acid profile becomes important when you are comparing different protein sources. And since both casein and whey are derived from milk, they have essentially the same amino acid profile.

You should be concerned with the main source of protein so that you know what that product will do for you. Will it stimulate protein synthesis? Or will it slow protein breakdown?

FINDING THE MIDDLE GROUND
Make no mistake about it, a high protein diet is a requirement for packing on high-quality muscle mass.1,9,13,15,16,19 But you need to find that middle ground.

As we have covered, if you consume so much that you have chronically high levels of amino acids in your blood, much of the protein you consume will go straight down the toilet. Literally!1,2,5,11,17 But don't let people sell you on the myth that your body can only handle so many grams of protein at one time.

Firstly, this is a very vague statement. What is meant by "handle" or "at one time"? About 50% of what you consume is incorporated into muscle tissue one way or another. 20% is incorporated into other body proteins and the remaining is oxidized.11,5,1

A large majority of the 30% is a class of amino acids called "non-essential amino acids".17 And this breakdown of metabolic fates is true for just about any protein intake "at any one time".

On the other hand, if you play it too safe, you will short circuit the muscle building mechanisms and the balance will shift towards muscle breakdown.4,11,18,16,19

So, the next time that someone tells you that they won't be happy until they can walk around with an IV drip of amino acids tapped into their arm, you can tell them they are just wasting their time. Not only that, but you will understand why!

PRECISION PROTEIN SUPPLEMENTATION
Alright, so we now have all of this information swimming around in our heads. What do we do with it? Let's put it together into a plan.

We know that we need to increase protein synthesis and reduce protein breakdown, right? We know that whey is the most effective product to stimulate protein synthesis, and we know that casein is the most effective product to reduce protein breakdown. We can't use them together, however, because casein will nullify whey's primary mode of action.

However, we have one more weapon in the arsenal that we can use. And that is our good ol' friend, food. In general, whole food proteins are digested very slowly. That means they will cause a mild and constant stream of amino acids into the blood, much like casein. However, most whole foods do not coagulate in the stomach and do not slow the digestion of other proteins.

So, the first step in the plan is to forget what you think you know about supplement timing. It is okay to consume whey protein at times during the day other than before or after a workout. And honestly, you should.

STEP #1 WHEY AFTER FOOD
Consume a whey protein drink shortly after a whole food meal.

By doing so, you will have created an environment very conducive to muscle growth. By consuming that whole food meal, you will have suppressed the rate of muscle breakdown. Firstly, by starting a slow cascade of amino acids through your system.

Secondly, provided your meal had some kind of carbohydrates, you will have stimulated the release of insulin which, in itself, can slow the rate of muscle breakdown.11,5,3,8,14

Insulin is also the hormone that governs protein synthesis rate. By elevating the release of insulin before the consumption of a whey protein drink, you have effectively set the stage for a serious anabolic reaction.14,10,11

There is a slight delay from the time you digest carbohydrates and the time that insulin levels peak. Because of the fact that whey is absorbed so quickly, it is possible that the peaks between amino acids and insulin will not coincide, resulting in a less-than-optimal response.11,14

Once the whey protein has been completely assimilated, amino acid levels will drop. However, they will not return to normal, because the "Amino Acid Cascade" that you stared with the whole food meal is still streaming. It's a beautiful sight, isn't it? This little step has effectively stimulated protein synthesis as well as slowing protein breakdown.

To View Our Whey Protein Recommendations, Click Here.

STEP #2 CASEIN WITHIN 3 HOURS
Consume a casein-based meal within the next 3 hours.

That means before three hours have elapsed - two hours would be an even safer bet. We want the levels of amino acids in our blood to drop a bit so we can create a dramatic increase again.

The degree of protein synthesis is directly related to the degree of change in the levels of amino acids. By consuming a casein-based meal here we will allow for that drop while keeping amino acid levels above normal. This keeps the rate of protein breakdown to a minimum. Do you feel the scales tipping yet?

Examples of good casein-based protein products are Molecular Sustained Protein and Xtreme Formulations Ultra Peptide.


STEP #3 LATHER, RINSE, REPEAT
Repeat! That's all there is to it.

Alternate between a whole food meal with a whey protein chaser, and follow that up with a casein-based meal. Now, I know this sounds expensive so you can modify it. You may want to reduce the size of the whey protein drink. But remember, the degree of protein synthesis is dependant on the degree of the increase in the levels of amino acids in the blood.2,5,11,20,15,13

So take caution when you are feeling cheap. It would not make sense to cut your servings and not have a very good response from it. You could also have just a whole food meal instead of a casein-based one. You would essentially get the same effect.

However, many meal replacement products on the market today have a far better nutritional profile than anyone of us could every pull off in the kitchen. I highly recommend two a day, making sure to have one just prior to bed.

CONCLUSION
Well there you have it - a three pronged attack: Precision Protein Supplementation. You now have the tools and knowledge to strategically create an environment that is highly conducive to not only increasing lean muscle mass, but preserving it as well. You will be surprised how effective this little strategy is during times of low-calorie dieting.

So, in summary, casein is a "slow" protein that is classified as anti-catabolic. That means that it prevent excessive protein breakdown. Whey protein is a "fast" protein that is classified as anabolic - meaning that it stimulates protein synthesis, but does not inhibit catabolism.5,12,2

We can't do both at the same time, but we can mimic the effect by manipulating our dietary intake. And finally, it is the rapid increase of amino acids that results in increases in protein synthesis.

Hopefully I have shed some light on the subject. There is no "best" type of protein, only a best approach. I'll never try to sway you one way or the other, I will only present you with the facts.

Don't let anyone tell you anything different. If they are convinced that there is a "best", they are only joking themselves. Just smile, nod, and realize that you are bigger than that guy!

Fate whispers to the warrior, "You cannot withstand the storm." And the warrior whispers back, "I am the storm."

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06-24-2017 05:23 PM
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SamuelBRoberts Offline
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Post: #10
RE: Protein Battle, Whey v Casein
Casein is good for weight loss. Dunno why.
06-24-2017 06:16 PM
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CynicalContrarian Offline
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RE: Protein Battle, Whey v Casein
Without probiotics, whey is guaranteed to give me acne.
From a 'scientific experiment' practice, the results are so readily repeatable, I can say that with certainty for my biology.

Yet Onnit proclaim the benefits of whey above most.
Onnit also have a goat whey product with hemp & creatine to promote however - https://www.onnit.com/recovery-protein/
06-24-2017 11:28 PM
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Fortis Away
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Post: #12
RE: Protein Battle, Whey v Casein
Why not both?

Whey is better post workout since it breaks down and is asborbed super fast and this is even faster if you combine it with some cheap carbs post workout.

Casein is good for before bedtime since it gives you a feeling of satiety and it takes hours to breakdown.

I use both.

I will be checking my PMs weekly, so you can catch me there. I will not be posting.
06-25-2017 12:55 AM
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Post: #13
RE: Protein Battle, Whey v Casein
What about egg protein? Is it whey or casein? Is it a third kind?
06-25-2017 01:17 AM
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sonoran_ Offline
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Post: #14
RE: Protein Battle, Whey v Casein
Since casein is more expensive that a normal whey concentrate or blend, I just use whey and get casein through cottage cheese before bed.
06-25-2017 08:43 PM
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MOVSM Offline
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RE: Protein Battle, Whey v Casein
Here is the medically sourced guide for supplements you should be taking from Starting Strength, the people who can back up their shit with science.

Whey is fast digesting protein, perfect for after workout.
Casein is designed to separate you from your money--eating a beef steak or eggs will achieve the same result, and you will be eating REAL FOOD.

Go lift, have whey, go eat a steak with a glass of red.

Stop Wasting Money - Nutrition Supplements that Actually Work

The bit on protein:

Quote:Whey Protein Powder
Who: Those who are not consuming enough protein via diet alone (aka most of you).

Benefits: It is no secret that adequate dietary protein is necessary to repair and remodel damaged muscle tissue, increase lean body mass, and increase strength. Active individuals require more dietary protein than those who are sedentary, and in terms of bioavailability and leucine content, whey protein has the greatest profile amongst all food.[1,2]

Dosage: 20g of whey contains about 3g of the amino acid leucine. Leucine is the amino acid most effective at building muscle in terms of the signaling of muscle protein synthesis (MPS) and 3–4g per meal will maximize this process.[1–3] Contrary to popular “bro-lief”, anything consumed above this threshold WILL be digested and utilized, yet only as fuel or for futile metabolic reactions. It is also important to note that a relationship between high protein diets and kidney damage is unfounded in healthy individuals.[4–6]

Timing: There is a 3–5 hour period that must pass between doses in order to yield consecutive bouts of MPS.[1,2] Additional protein consumed earlier will not contribute to MPS.

Additional Notes: Unless you really enjoy the flavor, never spend more than $10/lb on a whey protein powder. Whey protein isolate (WPI) is more expensive and is only necessary for those who have gastrointestinal issues with whey protein concentrate (WPC). Beta lactalbumin is the amino acid fraction found in WPC that is responsible for this sensitivity but is also a highly concentrated source of leucine for those who are not allergic. In addition, the older you are, the less sensitive you are to protein and thus the more you will need to consume.[7–10]

Quote:References
1. Norton L, Wilson GJ. Optimal protein intake to maximize muscle protein synthesis. AgroFood industry hi-tech. 2009 Mar;20:54-7.
2.Norton L. Optimal protein intake and meal frequency to support maximal protein synthesis and muscle mass. JISSN. 2008;3(5): S4.
3. Kimball SR, Jefferson LS. Signaling pathways and molecular mechanisms through which branched-chain amino acids mediate translational control of protein synthesis. The Journal of nutrition. 2006;136(1S):227S-31S.
4. Martin WF, Armstrong LE, Rodriguez NR. Dietary protein intake and renal function. Nutrition & Metabolism. 2005 Sep 20;2(1):25.
5. Friedman AN, Ogden LG, Foster GD, Klein S, Stein R, Miller B, Hill JO, Brill C, Bailer B, Rosenbaum DR, Wyatt HR. Comparative effects of low-carbohydrate high-protein versus low-fat diets on the kidney. Clinical Journal of the American Society of Nephrology. 2012 Jul 1;7(7):1103-11.
6. Poortmans JR, Dellalieux O. Do regular high protein diets have potential health risks on kidney function in athletes?. International journal of sport nutrition and exercise metabolism. 2000 Mar;10(1):28-38.
7. Pennings B, Groen B, de Lange A, Gijsen AP, Zorenc AH, Senden JM, van Loon LJ. Amino acid absorption and subsequent muscle protein accretion following graded intakes of whey protein in elderly men. American Journal of Physiology-Endocrinology and Metabolism. 2012 Apr 15;302(8):E992-9.
8. Paddon-Jones D, Short KR, Campbell WW, Volpi E, Wolfe RR. Role of dietary protein in the sarcopenia of aging. The American journal of clinical nutrition. 2008 May 1;87(5):1562S-6S.
9. Kim IY, Schutzler S, Schrader A, Spencer H, Kortebein P, Deutz NE, Wolfe RR, Ferrando AA. Quantity of dietary protein intake, but not pattern of intake, affects net protein balance primarily through differences in protein synthesis in older adults. American Journal of Physiology-Endocrinology and Metabolism. 2015 Jan 1;308(1):E21-8.
10. Katsanos CS, Kobayashi H, Sheffield-Moore M, Aarsland A, Wolfe RR. A high proportion of leucine is required for optimal stimulation of the rate of muscle protein synthesis by essential amino acids in the elderly. American Journal of Physiology-Endocrinology And Metabolism. 2006 Aug 1;291(2):E381-7.

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(This post was last modified: 06-25-2017 10:39 PM by MOVSM.)
06-25-2017 10:36 PM
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IvanDrago Offline
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RE: Protein Battle, Whey v Casein
I'm not big in to dairy, powders and pills so I prefer to eat meat, eggs and gelatin.
(This post was last modified: 06-25-2017 11:27 PM by IvanDrago.)
06-25-2017 10:56 PM
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aeroektar Offline
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RE: Protein Battle, Whey v Casein
(06-24-2017 11:28 PM)CynicalContrarian Wrote:  Without probiotics, whey is guaranteed to give me acne.
From a 'scientific experiment' practice, the results are so readily repeatable, I can say that with certainty for my biology.

Yet Onnit proclaim the benefits of whey above most.
Onnit also have a goat whey product with hemp & creatine to promote however - https://www.onnit.com/recovery-protein/

Out of curiosity, what is the link between probiotics and stopping acne from whey?

I drank Whey/Casein with whole milk every day for months a few years ago and it gave me the worst cystic acne. I just completely avoid dairy now.
06-25-2017 11:25 PM
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CynicalContrarian Offline
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RE: Protein Battle, Whey v Casein
(06-25-2017 11:25 PM)aeroektar Wrote:  Out of curiosity, what is the link between probiotics and stopping acne from whey?

I drank Whey/Casein with whole milk every day for months a few years ago and it gave me the worst cystic acne. I just completely avoid dairy now.


I've heard it said from a South African biology / nutrition professor, Walter Veith, that while we're well aware of lactose intolerance in some folk.
We're actually all intolerant of a separate element of dairy - galactose.

So it seems that with my biology, even though I don't have lactose intolerance; if I have dairy without pro-biotics, I'll be guaranteed to get acne shortly afterwards.
If I do use regular pro-biotics in the form of a kombucha tea, it seems the extra good bacteria are enough to prevent what ever there is in dairy that will cause acne.
At least, that's with small amounts of dairy.

Your mileage may well vary, but you'll only know if you do tests on your own diet.

Rather fascinating that the paleo promoter, Robb Wolf, talks about doing distinct dietary tests along with his wife & the results in blood sugar spikes & the like can vary a great deal.
Cause at the end of the day, Robb & his wife do not have the exact same genetic lineage / biology.

- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WIzJwGIam0o
06-25-2017 11:58 PM
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AntiMediocrity Offline
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Post: #19
RE: Protein Battle, Whey v Casein
(06-25-2017 08:43 PM)sonoran_ Wrote:  Since casein is more expensive that a normal whey concentrate or blend, I just use whey and get casein through cottage cheese before bed.

I used to do the whole Whey Post WO Casein before bed shtick, it certainly hit my wallet. This was when I still thought powder was more optimum than food. Learned about food being far superior as long as you can actually consume it and in a decent window, then about cottage cheese being a good source of casein -
dumped casein.

Even if you dislike cottage cheese, just blend it with strawberry yogurt in 1:1 and it will taste like and have the consistency of strawberry milkshake. Cottage cheese made me gag in my home country because of the consistency and taste (here I can eat by the spoonful).

Cottage cheese will go much further than casein and it's cheaper by unit cost. To add lot of people consider casein to be a scam in some sense because of it's much higher price, which could be a higher price margin due to specialised demand, so you're encouraging a somewhat minor level of extortion.

At the end of the day you can be the guy who takes about 20 supplements, or you can be the guy who specialises in whole foods but takes the odd Whey shake/adds Whey to their baking just to bump up their macros or to consume in situations where good isn't an option. Don't forget the EFA's if you don't consume enough fish. A multivit could go a long way too.
(This post was last modified: 06-26-2017 01:42 AM by AntiMediocrity.)
06-26-2017 01:38 AM
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Post: #20
RE: Protein Battle, Whey v Casein
(06-25-2017 10:56 PM)IvanDrago Wrote:  I'm not big in to dairy, powders and pills so I prefer to eat meat, eggs and gelatin.

The recipe for the 1800 psi punch.
06-26-2017 05:12 AM
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General Stalin Offline
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Post: #21
RE: Protein Battle, Whey v Casein
It's just protein.

Casein is overpriced buzz-supps. Consume whey powder if you do not eat enough protein with your normal solid food diet.

The only rule is less ingredients = better. Filtered whey and lecithin are the only ingredients you need in a whey powder.
06-26-2017 08:15 AM
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captndonk Offline
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Post: #22
RE: Protein Battle, Whey v Casein
I eat lowfat quark daily. 500g of it contains 60g of casein and it costs less than $ 0.9.
(This post was last modified: 06-26-2017 10:16 AM by captndonk.)
06-26-2017 10:16 AM
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