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What convinced you Satan is real?
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RawGod Offline
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Post: #51
RE: What convinced you Satan is real?
I can't deny the negative reactions to the name of Jesus.

"I worship Vishnu!"
Liberal/atheist: polite smile

"Mohammed is the prophet of Allah!"
Liberal/atheist: "sure, I respect that"

"Jesus Christ is Lord!"
Liberal/atheist: seething anger, fear, hatred

Dr Johnson rumbles with the RawGod. And lives to regret it.
07-14-2019 09:29 AM
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infowarrior1 Offline
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Post: #52
RE: What convinced you Satan is real?
(07-14-2019 09:18 AM)bucky Wrote:  
(07-14-2019 07:13 AM)infowarrior1 Wrote:  
(07-14-2019 12:15 AM)Meliorare93 Wrote:  In my book Satan, or the Adversary, is part of God's plan... If you read Job 1:6-12 you can see that God gave orders to the Adversary to be as adverse as he could against Job's surroundings to test his faith.

Feel free to disagree with this statement this is just my personal opinion. Does that make God and/or Satan real, I do not know that is the beauty of religion it are beliefs not facts...
No he kept him on a leash. Satan proposed. And God make use of Satan. Its perfectly in keeping with how Ancient Kings would act.

God despite his omnipotence/Omniscience/Omnipresence have to act in a certain fashion due to his character and legality since the fall handed control of creation to an Angelic administration by which they are able to justly judge man. In those PDF you will see why:

christianthinktank.com/cross04nt.pdf

christianthinktank.com/victor.pdf


The cross of Christ is necessary for God to legally act against Satan in ways that he couldn't before.

I've heard that a common Jewish perception of Satan is as an agent of God, in charge of tempting and testing mankind.

Tempting and testing yes. But a rebel too who led a 3rd of angels in revolt against God.

Given that humanity fell and their natures became corrupted with evil who subsequently de facto transferred the authority over creation over to Satan and the rebellious heavenly power and that as angelic rulers in accordance with their original purposes as executioners they are justified in punishing mankind with deceptions and other forms of judgment in accordance with Lex Talonis.

It was bound to be a mess which humanity had no chance against until the coming of Christ which makes possible the overrule by God the Father as a result of the work of the Cross of their Authority which will legally allow Christ not only to redeem his people. But also to take by force the power over creation itself and the human kingdoms thereof which will be consummated at the 2nd coming.

The current Jewish(Pharisee) rejection of the Messiah I think has also colored their worldview too.
07-14-2019 09:59 AM
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bbgun Online
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Post: #53
RE: What convinced you Satan is real?
polyester leisure suits
07-14-2019 10:04 AM
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ThriceLazarus Offline
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Post: #54
RE: What convinced you Satan is real?
“What convinced you Satan was real?”

‘From the first sip, the Natural Scientist denys the very conception of God. At the bottom there He sits, waiting.’

To take a Materialist’s perspective, full of baseless assumptions, assertions, and axioms, this physical universe is woven together in patterning threads of fractal chaos; undulating, seemingly breathing, in rhyming spirals of time. Each energetic expression emanated from and projected unto each other. A schism of caverning mirrors, shards staring back and forth, their beaming back becoming star-streaked void as Everything tumbles and twists and dances at the beck of one another. At the kernal of this Awesome Thing is a mechanism, a twisting, twirling, elegant, graceful thing, something which flickers so fast as to be invisible. It is a slow, and roiling Spirit, its movements so subtle, so sublime and supreme, that as soon as it is sensed it slips into the deep once more. An un-nameable, unknowable thing.

The elegance with which the stars entwine...

Here. On the ground floor. Riding the wave. Only the gross can be grasped here, for as soon as it is held, as soon as it is measured, it becomes trapped in crystalline gravitational-structures tumbling through the vast cosmos. Snowflakes swirling in a blizzard. The wave-function collapses, the waveform becoming a closed, maleable element within a larger system. Entropy arises from this mechanism, degeneracy sets in, and things begin to unravel. Tangentially, at the edge of banded quanta, stratified and scintillating between streaks of Nothing, there is this same fractal fraying.

This friction creates the need for a release valve. The presence of only one thing, moving effortlessly for an Aeon, necessitates the existence of another thing through it’s emanations. This may be the root of half-lives and background radiations, the Materialist’s boutonnière. It is here that a culling is needed, to cut the wheat from the chaff, and a carnival of drama (alternating currents of tragedy and comedy) arises to recognize the absolute triviality any One thing is in the face of Everything.

Competition, as essence clashes in sloshing waves through the flow of time. This is Natural Selection, this is brutal and beautiful Nature - sensuously savage. Yet, it is all the sweetness of life as well - all imaginable. And this inherent, inherited patterning induces a duality. Good and Bad. Good and Evil. Above and Below. There in is the natural mechanism arising from the system, and a possible metaphysical explaination for the existence of an office of adversarial angels within the heights of the Host.

A thought. The order of Satan does His work when they present themseves as an adversary who is overcome by manifesting Him within oneself. A challenge bestowed, knowingly. And with perfect patterning, without Sin, this constant perturbation permits the ever spiraling of any - individual - essence. Enveloped eternally within the Spirit of the Depths. In a Hallmark way, it is a challenge to grow in the ‘best’ way, considering the infinite complexity of innumerable, individual elements interacting with one another in inexplicable ways. Ineffable.

What is it then when we challenge one another with the intent that they ‘fail’? The stupid games we play...
(This post was last modified: 07-14-2019 05:16 PM by ThriceLazarus.)
07-14-2019 05:11 PM
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Kid Twist Offline
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Post: #55
RE: What convinced you Satan is real?
(07-14-2019 09:59 AM)infowarrior1 Wrote:  It was bound to be a mess which humanity had no chance against until the coming of Christ which makes possible the overrule by God the Father as a result of the work of the Cross of their Authority which will legally allow Christ not only to redeem his people. But also to take by force the power over creation itself and the human kingdoms thereof which will be consummated at the 2nd coming.

The current Jewish(Pharisee) rejection of the Messiah I think has also colored their worldview too.

The hebrew mind (= heart, same point you'll see in a second) regarding God is that, in essence God is in control over everything, and "time" is not a beginning and an end (as we modern, westerners think) but on a continuous plan and plane. We can think abstractly about time and thus, being out of time --- though not totally conceive of what it really really means being created beings at this time and place. This flexibility actually, to the more advanced, will show one that relationships are the key to focus on for us, and not juridical ones, or legalistic thinking, which are all by essence a framework which is transactional.

In fact, the very heresies and bad religions of the world take on a transactional aspect, which makes it simple for some but creates hatred in others, because "fairness" also is a transactional concept. And life isn't fair. Sound familiar?

God has covenants with his people but the truth shown by Christ is via proper understanding of order, behavior, and relationship, which is shown by the Holy Trinity ultimately, something which existed in eternity and not legalistically.

Christ doesn't do anything legally. It doesn't even make sense to say that. He defeats death and shows what it means to be truly human, which is what everyone is called to be, with all of its virtues. He as high priest aids us, when we are willing, to enter into this mystery as priests with the One High Priest. He came in order to show what sacrifice (and love) is, but as the God-man, having been raised from the dead, He will execute judgment by his very being, which is truth when the fulfillment of this world comes. "Heaven" and "Hell" are precisely this: the states that you are in, in relation to the truth of the universe, who is a person.

The adversary, or the anti-christ (anything "in place of christ", ie an idol), is that which is in chaos and disarray because it loves darkness more than light --- going against the very purpose for which it was created.

Don't focus on disorder. Let us all try to be examples of order, admitting we are weak and flawed and not lying about our transgressions, asking God to help us, however many times we fail.

"For we do not have a high priest who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, but one who in every respect has been tempted as we are, yet without sin."
(This post was last modified: 07-14-2019 05:47 PM by Kid Twist.)
07-14-2019 05:44 PM
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Matsufubu Offline
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Post: #56
RE: What convinced you Satan is real?
I was sitting on the fence for years, but then I witnessed true evil and malevolence that only the devil could be responsible for.
(This post was last modified: 07-15-2019 06:05 PM by Matsufubu.)
07-15-2019 06:05 PM
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CynicalContrarian Offline
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Post: #57
RE: What convinced you Satan is real?
(07-15-2019 06:05 PM)Matsufubu Wrote:  I was sitting on the fence for years, but then I witnessed true evil and malevolence that only the devil could be responsible for.


I recall watching a documentary where one (if not two) police detectives detailed how serial killer Ted Bundy was largely normal in behaviour, if not somewhat charismatic during their questioning / investigation.

However...
When they exposed one of Ted Bundy's secrets, ol' Bundy suddenly became rather angry & sinister.
The police detective even said he suddenly smelt a measure of sulfur...

Perhaps the cop was simply attempting to rationalize in his own mind how one man (Bundy) could be so deranged & murderous.
Or perhaps, there was a far more sinister / spiritual element at play...
(This post was last modified: 07-15-2019 06:15 PM by CynicalContrarian.)
07-15-2019 06:15 PM
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Spectrumwalker Offline
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Post: #58
RE: What convinced you Satan is real?
Los Angeles, California...after midnight.

Dreams are like horses; they run wild on the earth. Catch one and ride it. Throw a leg over and ride it for all its worth.
Psalm 25:7
https://youtu.be/vHVoMCH10Wk
07-16-2019 09:52 AM
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Leonard D Neubache Offline
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Post: #59
RE: What convinced you Satan is real?
Does anyone remember back during the 2016 election when someone posted a tweet showing a video of some strange creature (human) wrapped in bandages and garbage wearing a mask and prancing around on all fours while dragging empty cans attached to string? It was in the middle of the street at night.

The tweet accurately described the impish movements it was making as "capering".

I can't seem to find the damn thing and perhaps that's for the best but it was about as demonic a creature as I've ever seen footage of.

The public will judge a man by what he lifts, but those close to him will judge him by what he carries.
(This post was last modified: 07-16-2019 10:17 AM by Leonard D Neubache.)
07-16-2019 10:17 AM
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bucky Offline
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Post: #60
RE: What convinced you Satan is real?
(07-16-2019 10:17 AM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  Does anyone remember back during the 2016 election when someone posted a tweet showing a video of some strange creature (human) wrapped in bandages and garbage wearing a mask and prancing around on all fours while dragging empty cans attached to string? It was in the middle of the street at night.

The tweet accurately described the impish movements it was making as "capering".

I can't seem to find the damn thing and perhaps that's for the best but it was about as demonic a creature as I've ever seen footage of.

Isn't that a Chemical Brothers video?

Feminism in ten words: "Stop objectifying women! Can't you see I've hit the wall?" -Leonard D Neubache
Today 01:55 AM
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