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How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
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ArloDash Offline
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Post: #1
How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
Title says it all.

I've been abroad for two years now and I cannot imagine going back.

I look at my future financial projections and there's basically no reason to increase my cost of living another $20,000 a year just to live in the USA. That's not even counting the increase in taxes I would have to pay moving back.

I would imagine that after enough time, you eventually just find a local girl in whatever country you've chosen that you like enough to commit to.

How many of you have actually done this? What have your experiences been like with integrating into society in a LTR, or possibly even with children, on a permanent basis?

Even for those who didn't do the LTR thing abroad, how many guys have a story about settling into a permanent lifestyle abroad as an expat from the West? Or, how many of you ended up returning, and why?
07-20-2019 06:56 AM
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Dilated Offline
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Post: #2
RE: How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
Will be following.

To add- curious from folks who have moved abroad and dated/married the women there. I think you can get better quality women abroad (compared to USA) but is it still a net win when considering the cultural assimilation challenges?

If the women are higher quality but you can’t connect with them due to cultural drawbacks (xenophobia, religion, family pressure, etc.) then it doesn’t really matter.
07-20-2019 01:04 PM
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Prince Charming Offline
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Post: #3
RE: How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
I moved from Toronto to Medellin 2 over two years ago. I am content. Financially things turned out slightly better then my calculations. Socially it took me about 1.5 years to surpass where I was at in Toronto with a harsh learning curve. I think in 5 years or so when I have mastered the language I will be a king here, where as my life might have peaked at prince in Canada with a harder grind.
07-20-2019 02:57 PM
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ArloDash Offline
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RE: How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
(07-20-2019 01:04 PM)Dilated Wrote:  Will be following.

To add- curious from folks who have moved abroad and dated/married the women there. I think you can get better quality women abroad (compared to USA) but is it still a net win when considering the cultural assimilation challenges?

If the women are higher quality but you can’t connect with them due to cultural drawbacks (xenophobia, religion, family pressure, etc.) then it doesn’t really matter.

I'd say it's definitely a net win in the amount of time I have been abroad.

It's easy for a young guy who can just hit on girls, stack cash and lift.

I would think that perhaps the more serious troubles could emerge with marrying a local, purchasing property, and getting seriously integrated into the culture.

At a certain point, you'll have to learn the language and get into the nitty gritty of society in these places.

I think that's all 10+ years off for me, but it's still interesting food for thought.
07-22-2019 04:40 AM
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Fitman2018 Offline
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Post: #5
RE: How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
What would be your guys top places to go to Abroad ? My TOP Places to stack cash and build would be Medellin Or any city in Colombia like Cali, but again you have to consider safety, Playa Del Carmen, Mexico City, Bangkok, Lima Peru looks good but quality seems bad, I love Panama but COL is high in Panama City and feel like Bocas Del Torro would get old.
I hear Philippines or Bali but people say they are dumps.
Biggest factors quality of women, Cost of living, and of course safety if you guys run night game.
07-22-2019 08:00 AM
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ZAMSKI Offline
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RE: How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
(07-22-2019 08:00 AM)Fitman2018 Wrote:  What would be your guys top places to go to Abroad ? My TOP Places to stack cash and build would be Medellin Or any city in Colombia like Cali, but again you have to consider safety, Playa Del Carmen, Mexico City, Bangkok, Lima Peru looks good but quality seems bad, I love Panama but COL is high in Panama City and feel like Bocas Del Torro would get old.
I hear Philippines or Bali but people say they are dumps.
Biggest factors quality of women, Cost of living, and of course safety if you guys run night game.

For me Chiang Mai, Thailand wins hands down for COL (insane value), safety...probably the safest place I have been to in the world, language isn't really a problem either. But it drops in the quality of women. But has a place to hunker down, live a quality but cheap life, and get shit done, I have never been to a better city.
07-22-2019 11:33 AM
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RE: How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
(07-22-2019 08:00 AM)Fitman2018 Wrote:  What would be your guys top places to go to Abroad ? My TOP Places to stack cash and build would be Medellin Or any city in Colombia like Cali, but again you have to consider safety, Playa Del Carmen, Mexico City, Bangkok, Lima Peru looks good but quality seems bad, I love Panama but COL is high in Panama City and feel like Bocas Del Torro would get old.
I hear Philippines or Bali but people say they are dumps.
Biggest factors quality of women, Cost of living, and of course safety if you guys run night game.

I hear you, there is just no perfect place, as they've said above the Thai economy is rocking and the Baht is crushing it, but SEA and Thai women? Meh, at least for me. And FAR away. Maybe that's good though. Colombia is a visiting place, it's still shady but I do like it for small trips or extended stays. Panama is totally amazing but yes COL is way too high for a central american country in PTY, but it is an actual city compared to the rest of the fake capitals in that part of the world. Bocas is amazing for 60s expats more than younger ones.

Even thought Europe has a bad future with the fall of NATO, maybe the sanity of Russian and FSU countries comes back with a style that draws a lot of people. You'll have to exchange cold weather but hey, it builds character.

Get your passport ready!
07-22-2019 12:07 PM
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Post: #8
RE: How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
I've repatriated from Sydney (bad dating market) to New York (good dating market, albeit still the West). The main benefits are higher earning potential, higher salaries, and more favorable ratios. I live frugally and save my money. How do you guys earn money in places like Colombia? Do you make money in the local economy? I think it would be hard for most people to have it add up. Living in a low COL place only makes sense if you're already early retired.
07-22-2019 06:41 PM
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ArloDash Offline
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RE: How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
(07-22-2019 06:41 PM)John5000 Wrote:  I've repatriated from Sydney (bad dating market) to New York (good dating market, albeit still the West). The main benefits are higher earning potential, higher salaries, and more favorable ratios. I live frugally and save my money. How do you guys earn money in places like Colombia? Do you make money in the local economy? I think it would be hard for most people to have it add up. Living in a low COL place only makes sense if you're already early retired.

Work online bro.

You only need about $1,500 a month as a single guy to live a pretty nice life in most of EE.

Technically you could retire early with about $380,000 in an index fund.
07-22-2019 07:40 PM
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ArloDash Offline
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RE: How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
(07-22-2019 08:00 AM)Fitman2018 Wrote:  What would be your guys top places to go to Abroad ? My TOP Places to stack cash and build would be Medellin Or any city in Colombia like Cali, but again you have to consider safety, Playa Del Carmen, Mexico City, Bangkok, Lima Peru looks good but quality seems bad, I love Panama but COL is high in Panama City and feel like Bocas Del Torro would get old.
I hear Philippines or Bali but people say they are dumps.
Biggest factors quality of women, Cost of living, and of course safety if you guys run night game.

I've been to Playa, Tulum, etc.

All nice places, but Mexican girls are kind of busted in my opinion.

Is there a reason you haven't mentioned anywhere in EE?

Ukraine is going to be your best value vs. cost of living at the moment in Europe.

The Georgian economy just tanked, so that's an option too, but the quality of life there is a bit lower unless you really love underground electronic music and the whole grunge aesthetic.
07-22-2019 07:43 PM
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Fitman2018 Offline
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RE: How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
I hate cold weather so that is why I avoid most of Europe. I like 75+ degrees which is why in the states if i didn't live abroad I can only do central and south Florida.
(This post was last modified: 07-22-2019 08:31 PM by Fitman2018.)
07-22-2019 08:29 PM
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RIslander Offline
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RE: How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
(07-22-2019 07:40 PM)ArloDash Wrote:  
(07-22-2019 06:41 PM)John5000 Wrote:  I've repatriated from Sydney (bad dating market) to New York (good dating market, albeit still the West). The main benefits are higher earning potential, higher salaries, and more favorable ratios. I live frugally and save my money. How do you guys earn money in places like Colombia? Do you make money in the local economy? I think it would be hard for most people to have it add up. Living in a low COL place only makes sense if you're already early retired.

Work online bro.

You only need about $1,500 a month as a single guy to live a pretty nice life in most of EE.

Technically you could retire early with about $380,000 in an index fund.

How do you earn $1,500 a month online?

“There is no global anthem, no global currency, no certificate of global citizenship. We pledge allegiance to one flag, and that flag is the American flag!” -DJT
07-22-2019 10:21 PM
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ArloDash Offline
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RE: How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
(07-22-2019 10:21 PM)RIslander Wrote:  
(07-22-2019 07:40 PM)ArloDash Wrote:  
(07-22-2019 06:41 PM)John5000 Wrote:  I've repatriated from Sydney (bad dating market) to New York (good dating market, albeit still the West). The main benefits are higher earning potential, higher salaries, and more favorable ratios. I live frugally and save my money. How do you guys earn money in places like Colombia? Do you make money in the local economy? I think it would be hard for most people to have it add up. Living in a low COL place only makes sense if you're already early retired.

Work online bro.

You only need about $1,500 a month as a single guy to live a pretty nice life in most of EE.

Technically you could retire early with about $380,000 in an index fund.

How do you earn $1,500 a month online?

You can do it many different ways.

Get a work from home job and don't tell them you're abroad.

Teach English for an ESL company. There are loads that do this.

Be a freelance writer and line up a few clients that you do monthly features for at $100 each. Manage a few social media accounts for some contacts in the states for $200 each. You'll hit $1,500 in no time.

Learn to do SEO and create a professional blog roll for companies. Offer this service on Upwork. Someone pays me $600 a month to do this right now.

The real trick here is to not just make $1,500 a month online. In reality, that's a long term road to nowhere as you're not making enough to actually save any.

This creates the problem of washed up, older guys in their late 30's who decide they want to come back from living abroad and they have no real skills, savings, etc. Not a place you want to be.

My suggestion for someone starting out would be to do a combination of all of the above things until something really "sticks" and they can start to scale up their operations. This means taking on more clients, beginning to outsource the work to other (think: local) people.

If you do it right, you can end up with a profitable business that you essentially just manage, which would enable you to move back to the USA further down the road should you have to.

Let's say that you scale this operation to get you to $75,000 a year. Assuming your tax liabilities are set up correctly and you invest $50,000 each year for a decade (let's say between 25 and 35), you'll have close to $1,000,000 by 35 depending on how the market returns.

At that point, you've used living abroad as a way of making yourself far wealthier than I'd assume 95% of your peers.

I might do a datasheet on this at some point in the future.
(This post was last modified: 07-23-2019 05:06 AM by ArloDash.)
07-23-2019 05:05 AM
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RE: How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
(07-23-2019 05:05 AM)ArloDash Wrote:  The real trick here is to not just make $1,500 a month online. In reality, that's a long term road to nowhere as you're not making enough to actually save any.

This creates the problem of washed up, older guys in their late 30's who decide they want to come back from living abroad and they have no real skills, savings, etc. Not a place you want to be.

And just 1 major accident away from complete destitution.

There are only 2 acceptable situations for people seeking to live abroad:

1. you already have the resources (which includes a sizeable emergency fund)
2. you are getting paid more than your next best alternative at home

in every other scenario, you would be much much infinitely better off just visiting.
07-23-2019 11:13 AM
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Dilated Offline
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RE: How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
ArloDash- preach it, brother. I’m on this plan as well...or at least I want to be on this plan. I need to stop being a pussy.

I net 5-7 times the average monthly income of EE residents from investment income. For all intents and purposes I’d be very wealthy in EE terms. Yet I still can’t get myself to pull the trigger and move there. I’ve gotten too comfortable with my (soul crushing) corporate gig and I’m making too many excuses why relocating overseas wouldn’t work.

Unfortunately, I’m a catastrophic thinker...which has caused to make many good decisions throughout the course of my life but has also made me miss out on some experiences.

‘What if I can’t learn the language?’
‘What if I run out of money?’
‘What if I fail?’
‘What if it turns out foreign women really are as
vapid as American women?
‘What if.........

I need to quit being a chickenshit and pull the trigger.
(This post was last modified: 07-23-2019 11:40 AM by Dilated.)
07-23-2019 11:39 AM
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ArloDash Offline
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RE: How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
(07-23-2019 11:13 AM)GyopoPlayboy Wrote:  
(07-23-2019 05:05 AM)ArloDash Wrote:  The real trick here is to not just make $1,500 a month online. In reality, that's a long term road to nowhere as you're not making enough to actually save any.

This creates the problem of washed up, older guys in their late 30's who decide they want to come back from living abroad and they have no real skills, savings, etc. Not a place you want to be.

And just 1 major accident away from complete destitution.

There are only 2 acceptable situations for people seeking to live abroad:

1. you already have the resources (which includes a sizeable emergency fund)
2. you are getting paid more than your next best alternative at home

in every other scenario, you would be much much infinitely better off just visiting.

I do not agree with this.

You can absolutely live abroad and even work remote for an American company if you're that into being secure and having work experience.

The trick is to bolster your savings, use your free time to learn new skills (web development, coding, SEO), and actually take advantage of your situation instead of using it as an excuse to party all the time.

Sadly, the washed-up dudes in their 30's tend to do the latter.
07-23-2019 11:48 AM
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RE: How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
(07-23-2019 11:39 AM)Dilated Wrote:  ArloDash- preach it, brother. I’m on this plan as well...or at least I want to be on this plan. I need to stop being a pussy.

I net 5-7 times the average monthly income of EE residents from investment income. For all intents and purposes I’d be very wealthy in EE terms. Yet I still can’t get myself to pull the trigger and move there. I’ve gotten too comfortable with my (soul crushing) corporate gig and I’m making too many excuses why relocating overseas wouldn’t work.

Unfortunately, I’m a catastrophic thinker...which has caused to make many good decisions throughout the course of my life but has also made me miss out on some experiences.

‘What if I can’t learn the language?’
‘What if I run out of money?’
‘What if I fail?’
‘What if it turns out foreign women really are as
vapid as American women?
‘What if.........

I need to quit being a chickenshit and pull the trigger.

Ah man, I wouldn't be so hard on yourself.

Obviously, the first step is going to be using a few weeks paid vacation to actually go visit some places in EE. They are all very different from one another. Belgrade is not the same as Kyiv, is not the same as Bucharest, is not the same as Budapest.

I, personally, would not want to live in a place like Bucharest or Budapest. I do, however, love living in Belgrade, Kyiv, Tbilisi, etc.

Based on your numbers, you're getting at least $3,000 of investment income each month which sounds great. That's goals for me. That's easily a retirement for one person in EE, but not for a couple (assuming your wife stays at home), and definitely not for kids if you're trying to have a more lux-lifestyle.

If you're making that much money from both your career and your investment income, I'd be highly skeptical of you saying that you cannot spin this into your own, self directed venture. Sounds like you have a skillset.

If it makes you feel any better...

I don't speak any foreign languages.

You can always make more money abroad. All that free time needs something to do.

It's hard to feel like you've failed when you're working on something you enjoy, why not try to start a business online?

Foreign women are still women. They're just less corrupted and take better care of themselves than Americans. Hypergamy definitely still exists and you must vet women properly. You can easily get played by some EE slut, but you'd have to be pretty stupid and oblivious to basic red-pill talking points for this to happen.

Feel free to hit me up whenever.
07-23-2019 12:06 PM
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RE: How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
@Arlo - could have PM'd you, but thought I'd share in here for everyone else to see.

RE moving overseas, can you provide more info on the following (only if you have the time - if it's too much - all good):
- How long do you stay in one place for? Is it time consuming/annoying having to move every few months due to a visa expiring? Right now I'm able to be productive where I am because I'm not moving all the time (moving can be far more time consuming than people think) and I have an office area established for myself in one spot where I'm close to everything I need (I know where everything is - I don't have to go exploring a city to find out where everything is) and I know the internet is definitely going to work where I am for example
- Have you paid for a more permanent visa anywhere yet? How do you handle your visa situation overall short term and long term
- How many times a year do you come back home or need to fly out? I'd estimate I'd need to fly home at the VERY least once or twice a year for tax, business, general admin, and family reasons. All these little costs add up - and I don't think people generally consider costs beyond accomodation and food and basic living expenses (once you start adding up return plane tickets, visas, in between travel expenses etc. to your budget - it can be more than $1500 a month)
- How do you organise affordable accommodation? Did you initially do airbnb and then strike a deal with a local landlord once you were over there?
- Is tax, accounting, banking and all other life and money admin stuff a b*tch to organise and maintain from OS? As an example, I'm location independent, but I'm registered for business here in Aus. Sometimes there's little admin things I need to do where a bank or another organisation needs you to go visit them in person to register things or to change online details. It's these little things and time zone differences that makes me scratch my head when I see guys running businesses OS. Sometimes you physically HAVE to be in the locations your business is registered in, or you have to figure out something immediately and it might be really hard to do that in another country or time zone.
- How are you meeting new people OS? Mostly Roosh guys, or are you doing things like language classes and other social activities to meet new people

Personally (not related to this thread - just my personal situation) ...
something I've heard various guys like Roosh mention, is that you have to think about community and lifestyle long term (i.e. going for women is great - but, you actually have to like living where you are across many aspects long term more than just the women)
It's what is making me lean towards buying property in Australia and trying to go over to Europe for three to six months of the year instead of settling there.
I've got parents in Australia who I think I'll want make sure I'll be able to take care of long term (but, that's obviously very long term thinking)
I also actually love a lot of things about living in Australia
I also think that if I met a girl OS, figuring out what country to live in and all that other logistical stuff could get messy.
(This post was last modified: 07-23-2019 12:43 PM by GT777733.)
07-23-2019 12:26 PM
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Enhanced Eddie Offline
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RE: How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
There's a third option. You can also neither settle in a foreign country, nor go back home... and instead just keep moving around. Cause every place has its pros and cons so you get to sample from all of them. I've been doing that for 18 years now and it's ideal, especially in the past decade with online income easy to come by.
07-23-2019 01:05 PM
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RE: How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
People keep saying that making money online is easy. I've been trying for years and I've gotten nowhere. I must be missing something. That's a cry for help by the way.

That's not how we do things in Russia, comrade.

http://inspiredentrepreneur.weebly.com/
07-23-2019 02:20 PM
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Post: #21
RE: How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
I wonder what other people do for medical insurance. I was ineligible for Obamacare because I have no residence address in the US (they can detect PO Boxes). I am self funding now, because it is inexpensive in Mexico. But if something serious comes up, it is better to have a backup plan in the US.

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07-23-2019 02:23 PM
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RE: How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
(07-23-2019 02:20 PM)Vladimir Poontang Wrote:  People keep saying that making money online is easy. I've been trying for years and I've gotten nowhere. I must be missing something. That's a cry for help by the way.

I'll send you a PM mate!
07-23-2019 02:31 PM
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Post: #23
RE: How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
(07-20-2019 06:56 AM)ArloDash Wrote:  How many of you have actually done this? What have your experiences been like with integrating into society in a LTR, or possibly even with children, on a permanent basis?

I did it, ten years and counting.
Have a wife and 2 kids in Thailand, you can't integrate with Thais, they generally don't have friends and only mix with relatives and family.
My family are great and there's plenty of other expats around if I feel the need to socialise outside my family.
07-23-2019 07:50 PM
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RE: How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
(07-23-2019 11:39 AM)Dilated Wrote:  ‘What if it turns out foreign women really are as
vapid as American women?

They are all as vapid as American women, but have fewer choices.
Their government won't finance them (welfare/bogus employment/divorce) so they have fewer choices and are therefore more desperate for a man.
07-23-2019 07:54 PM
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RE: How many of you have permanently settled abroad?
(07-22-2019 11:33 AM)ZAMSKI Wrote:  For me Chiang Mai, Thailand wins hands down for COL (insane value), safety...probably the safest place I have been to in the world, language isn't really a problem either. But it drops in the quality of women. But has a place to hunker down, live a quality but cheap life, and get shit done, I have never been to a better city.

I'm also in Chiang Mai, but the four months of unbreathable air this year wasn't a great experience.
Not to mention the military government wanting all white folk out of the country, and VISAs getting harder every year, if I wasn't already here, I wouldn't be coming.
(This post was last modified: 07-23-2019 08:00 PM by John Dodds.)
07-23-2019 07:57 PM
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