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International Living conference
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puckerman Offline
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International Living conference
Has any ATTENDED the conference sponsored by International Living magazine? Does anyone know anyone who has ATTENDED the conference?

It looks pretty expensive, and they seem a little too slick if you ask me. Is it worthwhile?

I attended the Escape Artist weekend conference in Dallas last year? I live in Austin, so going was no big deal. It was mostly a waste of time and money.

The IL conference costs twice as much, plus more with all the expenses.

Thanks.
10-03-2019 09:50 AM
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BlueMark Offline
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RE: International Living conference
(10-03-2019 09:50 AM)puckerman Wrote:  Has any ATTENDED the conference sponsored by International Living magazine? Does anyone know anyone who has ATTENDED the conference?

It looks pretty expensive, and they seem a little too slick if you ask me. Is it worthwhile?

I attended the Escape Artist weekend conference in Dallas last year? I live in Austin, so going was no big deal. It was mostly a waste of time and money.

The IL conference costs twice as much, plus more with all the expenses.

Thanks.

Without going into too much detail of yourself, are you a high-income or high-net worth individual for whom this makes more sense? If not, I would not spend your time and money on it. It doesn't sound like a good return on your investment.

What exactly are you trying to get out of it? It really depends on your the social, financial, and professional aspects of your life.

If you're just an ordinary Joe who's trying to escape the West, you're probably better served by interacting with forum members who have spent time overseas.

What a man can be, he must be. --Abraham Maslow
10-03-2019 09:59 AM
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puckerman Offline
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RE: International Living conference
(10-03-2019 09:59 AM)BlueMark Wrote:  Without going into too much detail of yourself, are you a high-income or high-net worth individual for whom this makes more sense? If not, I would not spend your time and money on it. It doesn't sound like a good return on your investment.

What exactly are you trying to get out of it? It really depends on your the social, financial, and professional aspects of your life.

If you're just an ordinary Joe who's trying to escape the West, you're probably better served by interacting with forum members who have spent time overseas.

I may be missing something here. When did you attend the conference?
(This post was last modified: 10-03-2019 11:19 PM by puckerman.)
10-03-2019 11:01 PM
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BlueMark Offline
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RE: International Living conference
I haven't attended it. That doesn't invalidate my response though.

What a man can be, he must be. --Abraham Maslow
10-04-2019 06:50 PM
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BBinger Offline
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Post: #5
RE: International Living conference
(10-03-2019 09:59 AM)BlueMark Wrote:  
(10-03-2019 09:50 AM)puckerman Wrote:  Has any ATTENDED the conference sponsored by International Living magazine? Does anyone know anyone who has ATTENDED the conference?

It looks pretty expensive, and they seem a little too slick if you ask me. Is it worthwhile?

I attended the Escape Artist weekend conference in Dallas last year? I live in Austin, so going was no big deal. It was mostly a waste of time and money.

The IL conference costs twice as much, plus more with all the expenses.

Thanks.

Without going into too much detail of yourself, are you a high-income or high-net worth individual for whom this makes more sense? If not, I would not spend your time and money on it. It doesn't sound like a good return on your investment.

What exactly are you trying to get out of it? It really depends on your the social, financial, and professional aspects of your life.

If you're just an ordinary Joe who's trying to escape the West, you're probably better served by interacting with forum members who have spent time overseas.

I have not attended. I can also vouch that nearly all of the critics concerning International Living's coverage of Uruguay are grounded in reality. Maybe the conference is better and will let you network with people living internationally without explicitly trying to sell you on particular vehicles for living abroad?
10-04-2019 11:10 PM
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puckerman Offline
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RE: International Living conference
(10-04-2019 06:50 PM)BlueMark Wrote:  I haven't attended it. That doesn't invalidate my response though.

Yes, it does. I was specific with my question. Your comment is noise.

Let's put it another way. Do I want your opinions on books you have never read? Do I want your opinions on movies you have never watched? Do I want your opinion on a restaurant that you have never patronized? So, why are you offering an opinion on an event you have never attended?

This is a serious problem with online forums overall. People are constantly offering low-quality posts with advice on topics on which they know little or nothing. They offer opinion and speculation, instead of offering observations based on actual experience. Then they defend themselves with the cliche that "I was just trying to help."

Shitposts like yours are everywhere on the Internet, and they don't help anybody. Noise does not help because it just makes it harder to hear communication that might actually be helpful. Your comment isn't really much better than the spam I get in my email.

It would also be nice to know more about the people who attend. How old are the attendees? Where are they from? What do they do? How many people show up for this? Where do people want to go? Can someone who has not attended answer those questions?

The conference just happens to be going on right now. I didn't attend.
(This post was last modified: 10-11-2019 04:42 PM by puckerman.)
10-11-2019 04:39 PM
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puckerman Offline
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RE: International Living conference
(10-04-2019 11:10 PM)BBinger Wrote:  
(10-03-2019 09:59 AM)BlueMark Wrote:  
(10-03-2019 09:50 AM)puckerman Wrote:  Has any ATTENDED the conference sponsored by International Living magazine? Does anyone know anyone who has ATTENDED the conference?

It looks pretty expensive, and they seem a little too slick if you ask me. Is it worthwhile?

I attended the Escape Artist weekend conference in Dallas last year? I live in Austin, so going was no big deal. It was mostly a waste of time and money.

The IL conference costs twice as much, plus more with all the expenses.

Thanks.

Without going into too much detail of yourself, are you a high-income or high-net worth individual for whom this makes more sense? If not, I would not spend your time and money on it. It doesn't sound like a good return on your investment.

What exactly are you trying to get out of it? It really depends on your the social, financial, and professional aspects of your life.

If you're just an ordinary Joe who's trying to escape the West, you're probably better served by interacting with forum members who have spent time overseas.

I have not attended. I can also vouch that nearly all of the critics concerning International Living's coverage of Uruguay are grounded in reality. Maybe the conference is better and will let you network with people living internationally without explicitly trying to sell you on particular vehicles for living abroad?

That is interesting. I don't think I've seen IL's coverage of Uruguay. Do you have any links to this? That does say something about their character.
10-11-2019 04:44 PM
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BBinger Offline
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Post: #8
RE: International Living conference
(10-11-2019 04:44 PM)puckerman Wrote:  
(10-04-2019 11:10 PM)BBinger Wrote:  
(10-03-2019 09:59 AM)BlueMark Wrote:  
(10-03-2019 09:50 AM)puckerman Wrote:  Has any ATTENDED the conference sponsored by International Living magazine? Does anyone know anyone who has ATTENDED the conference?

It looks pretty expensive, and they seem a little too slick if you ask me. Is it worthwhile?

I attended the Escape Artist weekend conference in Dallas last year? I live in Austin, so going was no big deal. It was mostly a waste of time and money.

The IL conference costs twice as much, plus more with all the expenses.

Thanks.

Without going into too much detail of yourself, are you a high-income or high-net worth individual for whom this makes more sense? If not, I would not spend your time and money on it. It doesn't sound like a good return on your investment.

What exactly are you trying to get out of it? It really depends on your the social, financial, and professional aspects of your life.

If you're just an ordinary Joe who's trying to escape the West, you're probably better served by interacting with forum members who have spent time overseas.

I have not attended. I can also vouch that nearly all of the critics concerning International Living's coverage of Uruguay are grounded in reality. Maybe the conference is better and will let you network with people living internationally without explicitly trying to sell you on particular vehicles for living abroad?

That is interesting. I don't think I've seen IL's coverage of Uruguay. Do you have any links to this? That does say something about their character.

Here's a critique from ExpatBob who ended up leaving Uruguay before I got here. ExpatBob wrote that in 2012, I arrived in 2017. The crime figures, general poverty, and suicide rate here have increased since them. I don't feel particularly at risk when I go for late night walks, but I am considering living somewhere else because of the absolutely broken business culture.

I contracted a service from a provider here on which much of my lines of business came to depend. This month it became obvious they gutted their staff, they have become non-performant in carrying out their contractual obigations, and out of two surviving managers with titles conveying the same level of authority in different specializations... They have funneled me into dealing with the guy in the wrong specialization. He's actively generating breaches of their contractual obligations with his very Rioplatense make things up and hope reality conforms to his fantasy later school of thought.

Anyways, businesses fail all the time and someone has to clean up the messes they leave. Wat do? The local culture is a complicating and confounding factor.

On the plus side Uruguay's Civil and Commercial codes were written by people with names back in the 19th century when being a man meant something. It's not bad prose. It's also nice to live in a civil law rather than common law country. The codes are the codes and while precedents gathered on weird cases may shape the next revision of the code... The codes are fairly clear and the law is applied as written, after the facts are investigated.

On the plus side since ExpatBob left, immigrants arriving from different parts of Latam have been displacing the Uruguayos in the workforce, because even Uruguayos would rather not hire Uruguayos if they can avoid it.

Anyways, at this moment I've not yet sold myself on Uruguay as my forever home. Contrary to the "wisdom" spread by International Living and collected in an indictment by ExpatBob, relocation for retirement is that second to last thing I would suggest Uruguay for. The last thing I'd suggest Uruguay for is trying to build a business extracting value from the local population.

Back to International Living. They are in the business of producing sales copy. I suspect the conference is a way to get people to pay to listen to them repeat their sales copy so they can afford to pay to place still more sales copy in publications open to doing the sponsored content thing. At the same time they are getting paid to produce and place ad copy by folks selling real estate, etc, etc. Maybe there's going to be some good information? Is paying what they ask for the information going to be worth it when you've already been warned you'll need to keep a skeptical eye and check any information they offer anyways? It is your money... Unless you decide to make it their money.
10-11-2019 09:28 PM
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Brother Abdul Majeed Offline
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Post: #9
RE: International Living conference
(10-03-2019 09:50 AM)puckerman Wrote:  Has any ATTENDED the conference sponsored by International Living magazine? Does anyone know anyone who has ATTENDED the conference?

It looks pretty expensive, and they seem a little too slick if you ask me. Is it worthwhile?

I attended the Escape Artist weekend conference in Dallas last year? I live in Austin, so going was no big deal. It was mostly a waste of time and money.

The IL conference costs twice as much, plus more with all the expenses.

Thanks.

I have not attended this conference, so I hope you are not annoyed at my response in this thread.

I did, however, out of curiosity prompted by your starting of this thread, look at their website. I paid particular interest to the write-up that they gave the area that I have lived in for years. I did not really find it to be an accurate representation of the place I live. Had I used this information to start my expat life, I probably would not have had the quality of life that I have now. I also have a passing knowledge of a few other places, and I didn't feel that the write ups in the website reflected what I knew of them.

I do not know if the information presented at this conference is of better quality than what is on their website.

It is a really big endeavor to start a new kind of life in a new kind of place. There is a thread about why so many expats end up going home. I want to put my thoughts together and make a decent contribution to that thread. Sometimes things go horribly wrong for people that expatriate. I've had guys who I thought were better businessmen then me in my office in tears. I've seen guys go home with absolutely nothing and having to start again at 50.

Most of these horror stories come about because people get lured in by superficial details and incorrect assumptions. Some people say "I came here for a week's holiday, and fell in love with the place." Yes, it's all very easy when you don't have to pay electricity bills, get your license plate renewed, or go through all the other petty details of life that eventually grind some people down.

(I'm adding this paragraph for humour - I doubt any member of RVF would fall for this, but it emphasizes how wrong things can go). A fellow moved down here with his wife. They bought their own island and started building their dream house. Before long, his wife was in the bars dancing with Rastafarians, while he was sweating his balls off and getting eaten alive by mosquitos trying to finish this impossible project on a remote 12 acre island. Not long after, she decides to go and discover herself in Colombia for a while, and comes back a few weeks later with a nose ring and some new tattoos.

Be wary of any information that you can learn too quickly, whether from faulty first impressions or slick information given out at conferences. These decisions will affect the rest of your life.
10-11-2019 09:41 PM
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Beyond Borders Away
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RE: International Living conference
From what I understand, International Living and escape Artist are owned by Agora Publishing.

I can't say whether they actually deliver great products or not, but their entire business model is built around marketing and esp great copywriting. If you go to a conference of theirs, it's very much another step in an extremely deliberate (and effective) marketing funnel.

They're very good at what they do and have been amassing fortunes in various industries quietly over the years. Again, I can't for sure say whether that means anything specifically about their products and services.

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe.
To be your own man is a hard business. If you try it, you'll be lonely often, and sometimes
frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself." - Kipling
(This post was last modified: 10-12-2019 12:45 AM by Beyond Borders.)
10-12-2019 12:42 AM
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Vladimir Poontang Offline
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Post: #11
RE: International Living conference
I have never attended and I know nothing about it.

I just thought I'd mention that because you seem to get very easily pissed off. I hope that helps.

That's not how we do things in Russia, comrade.

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10-12-2019 04:14 AM
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cascadecombo Offline
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Post: #12
RE: International Living conference
Popcorn 2
10-12-2019 12:31 PM
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puckerman Offline
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RE: International Living conference
(10-12-2019 12:42 AM)Beyond Borders Wrote:  From what I understand, International Living and escape Artist are owned by Agora Publishing.

I can't say whether they actually deliver great products or not, but their entire business model is built around marketing and esp great copywriting. If you go to a conference of theirs, it's very much another step in an extremely deliberate (and effective) marketing funnel.

They're very good at what they do and have been amassing fortunes in various industries quietly over the years. Again, I can't for sure say whether that means anything specifically about their products and services.

Well, I didn't know they are owned by the same people. Where did you find this? If that is the case, then IL probably isn't any better.

And that is the sad truth about all of this. There aren't any good resources for people who want to live abroad--either temporarily or permanently.

I would hope that I am paying for something that they would try to cater to me. I am their customer, after all. That being said, I am noticing more that conferences really are just marketing ploys. People are paying to attend the conference, and presenters are paying to market their stuff.
10-12-2019 10:01 PM
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RE: International Living conference
^ Now that you mention it, I could be wrong about escape artist. I know they own International Living - it's possible I only assumed escape artist was also owned by them because their marketing and content style seems to have the Agora fingerprints all over them. It's a pretty recognizable style if you follow copywriting and marketing - but I fully admit my mind could have jumped to that conclusion on its own.

As for whether or not their (Agora) products are good, I wrote for one of their supplement companies and they seem more interested in selling by all means possible than actually delivering a top notch product. They pay great money but I wondered several times if they actually believed in the product. What they did with Altucher's mailing list gives me the same impression about their financial niche companies.

I'm sure this varies a lot among their many different firms, though. The umbrellas is really quite huge. That said, they are known to be pretty consistent about transferring their business model across niche lines (and doing that very well) so I'd guess the general culture and standard is also replicated.

But yeah, a lot of "what ifs" here. Just throwing it out there.

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe.
To be your own man is a hard business. If you try it, you'll be lonely often, and sometimes
frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself." - Kipling
(This post was last modified: Yesterday 01:36 AM by Beyond Borders.)
Yesterday 01:32 AM
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puckerman Offline
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RE: International Living conference
(Yesterday 01:32 AM)Beyond Borders Wrote:  ^ Now that you mention it, I could be wrong about escape artist. I know they own International Living - it's possible I only assumed escape artist was also owned by them because their marketing and content style seems to have the Agora fingerprints all over them. It's a pretty recognizable style if you follow copywriting and marketing - but I fully admit my mind could have jumped to that conclusion on its own.

As for whether or not their (Agora) products are good, I wrote for one of their supplement companies and they seem more interested in selling by all means possible than actually delivering a top notch product. They pay great money but I wondered several times if they actually believed in the product. What they did with Altucher's mailing list gives me the same impression about their financial niche companies.

I'm sure this varies a lot among their many different firms, though. The umbrellas is really quite huge. That said, they are known to be pretty consistent about transferring their business model across niche lines (and doing that very well) so I'd guess the general culture and standard is also replicated.

But yeah, a lot of "what ifs" here. Just throwing it out there.

I don't think Agora owns Escape Artist. I do think they act in similar ways though.

I looked up the domain names, and they are with different registrars and hosting companies.
Today 09:57 PM
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