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Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
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Roosh Offline
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Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
Less people in America identify as Christian (Catholic or Protestant) than ever before. Church attendance is also declining.

Quote:The religious landscape of the United States continues to change at a rapid clip. In Pew Research Center telephone surveys conducted in 2018 and 2019, 65% of American adults describe themselves as Christians when asked about their religion, down 12 percentage points over the past decade. Meanwhile, the religiously unaffiliated share of the population, consisting of people who describe their religious identity as atheist, agnostic or “nothing in particular,” now stands at 26%, up from 17% in 2009.

Both Protestantism and Catholicism are experiencing losses of population share. Currently, 43% of U.S. adults identify with Protestantism, down from 51% in 2009. And one-in-five adults (20%) are Catholic, down from 23% in 2009. Meanwhile, all subsets of the religiously unaffiliated population – a group also known as religious “nones” – have seen their numbers swell. Self-described atheists now account for 4% of U.S. adults, up modestly but significantly from 2% in 2009; agnostics make up 5% of U.S. adults, up from 3% a decade ago; and 17% of Americans now describe their religion as “nothing in particular,” up from 12% in 2009. Members of non-Christian religions also have grown modestly as a share of the adult population.

https://www.pewforum.org/2019/10/17/in-u...apid-pace/

   

   

   

The reason I used "mainstream" in the title is because many people will declare themselves as a Christian but either not practice or be long ago lapsed. I don't judge other people's faith, but people will say they're Christian but be active in participation of carnal sins while refraining from prayer and church attendance. They also seem to have no concern for their salvation. That's their business, but what I suspect is happening in the survey is that Christians who have been lapsed for a long time are simply dropping out of the "identity" entirely.

Quote:“And to the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write,

‘These things says the Amen, the Faithful and True Witness, the Beginning of the creation of God: “I know your works, that you are neither cold nor hot. I could wish you were cold or hot. So then, because you are lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will vomit you out of My mouth. Because you say, ‘I am rich, have become wealthy, and have need of nothing’—and do not know that you are wretched, miserable, poor, blind, and naked— (Revelation 3:14-17)

However you interpret the survey, get ready for great evil as that percentage of non-believers starts to approach 30%. I wonder if we will ever get there before something on a biblical scale happens.

Roosh
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10-18-2019 02:44 PM
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Wutang Offline
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RE: Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
(10-18-2019 02:44 PM)Roosh Wrote:  The reason I used "mainstream" in the title is because many people will declare themselves as a Christian but either not practice or be long ago lapsed. I don't judge other people's faith, but people will say they're Christian but be active in participation of carnal sins while refraining from prayer and church attendance. They also seem to have no concern for their salvation. That's their business, but what I suspect is happening in the survey is that Christians who have been lapsed for a long time are simply dropping out of the "identity" entirely.

Relevant posts about this trend on the God thread starting from here:

https://www.rooshvforum.com/thread-72750...pid2013371

Quote:They never had faith. They just lost interest in their church as a social club.

Quote:The social benefits of being a Christian finally dipped from positive to negative.

Or in other words, the cool kids don't go to church anymore.

Quote:Sooner or later though, even the least botoxed fortysomething divorcee checking instagram in the back row has to wonder why she bothers going at all when she can just stay home, call herself spiritual, free up her Sundays and call it a day.
10-18-2019 02:48 PM
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Simeon_Strangelight Offline
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RE: Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
That will be true for a variety of reasons - one of them being that most churches are deeply infiltrated.

The ones who will survive are those which are tied with their own ethnic group or do not buckle to the feminist or globohomo trends - Amish, Mormons - some Orthodox churches. Most others are as good as done and are losing, disappearing.

Though - the human desire for belief is not gone - they are currently replacing it with wordly social justicism, feminism, environventalism, all-cultures-are-equal-ism, anti-Westernism, veganism, neo-communism (we will do it right this time) etc. Gorbachev talked about the plans to replace all religions with the worship of Mother GAIA - so environmentalism as the guiding force which meshes well with communism, feminism, anti-capitalism and social justice.

Most Christian churches will disappear, though the Christian mindset for now will still permeate Western societies.
10-18-2019 03:22 PM
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RE: Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
Modern Western people want a religion with more of an emphasis on the environment and nature.
10-18-2019 03:30 PM
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RE: Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
I was raised Catholic, but to be honest I'm not religious. I do appreciate the role Christianity has played in shaping Western Civilization and the values it teaches. A society worshipping God is substantially better than one worshipping the State (basically what we have now).

I agree with Roosh's assessment regarding most modern Christians. They do not attend church, and they certainly don't practice the values it teaches. Most Christian men have unfortunately become incredibly weak, and Christian women are full of shit, even the ones acting like good girls.
(This post was last modified: 10-18-2019 03:51 PM by TigOlBitties.)
10-18-2019 03:41 PM
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RE: Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
Eastern Orthodoxy has experienced the opposite of these trends. We have steadily increased our numbers just from protestant ranks. People know the real thing when they see it and are tired of the clown world shit show taking place in their former churches.
10-18-2019 03:47 PM
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Kungfu Offline
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RE: Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
I always criticized religion hard. "Bunch of uneducated clowns worshiping a dude in a cloud".

While I'm still not religious, in the last few years it's becoming clear to me what happens to wealthier societies without religious influence. The culture dies off, the family unit disappears, non-monogamy becomes the norm, moral decay sets in, and with enough time degeneracy is everywhere.

As much I don't like 'religion', maybe it's something this messed up culture really needs. Maybe 'be a good a person' is better than the shit we have now...
10-18-2019 04:00 PM
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Emperor Constantine Offline
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RE: Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
(10-18-2019 02:44 PM)Roosh Wrote:  The reason I used "mainstream" in the title is because many people will declare themselves as a Christian but either not practice or be long ago lapsed. I don't judge other people's faith, but people will say they're Christian but be active in participation of carnal sins while refraining from prayer and church attendance. They also seem to have no concern for their salvation. That's their business, but what I suspect is happening in the survey is that Christians who have been lapsed for a long time are simply dropping out of the "identity" entirely.

According to Fr. Seraphim Rose's biography, this is one of the things that drove him towards the Orthodox Church. The Christianity he grew up with seemed empty - no fasting, no confessing one's sins, no struggling. People just lived normally, attended Church on Sundays, and apparently believed in God but did little about it. Some of my childhood friends grew up with this type of Christianity, and of those none attend church anymore.

It's worth noting that church attendance in the US has gone down at the same time as American Christians modernized their worship, started ordaining women, and got rid of fasting and sexual morality. I imagine, though, that both are merely symptoms of a greater problem.
10-18-2019 07:59 PM
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Leonard D Neubache Offline
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RE: Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
Perhaps it is something that can be diluted but never boiled off.

As the water is boiled off the essence only gets purer.

God demands of Man responsibility. God demands of Woman vulnerability. These are their curse and blessing alike. Libertianism is to Man as Feminism is to Woman.
10-18-2019 08:05 PM
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Kid Twist Offline
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RE: Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
(10-18-2019 04:00 PM)Kungfu Wrote:  Maybe 'be a good a person' is better than the shit we have now...

"Be a good person" is what we have now.

Get your passport ready!
10-18-2019 08:25 PM
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RE: Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
(10-18-2019 08:25 PM)Kid Twist Wrote:  
(10-18-2019 04:00 PM)Kungfu Wrote:  Maybe 'be a good a person' is better than the shit we have now...

"Be a good person" is what we have now.

Most of the people in the West and maybe even the world think that what they're doing is right, from the guys selling heroin "to feed my family" up to the guys committing genocide "because those people are evil".

Without a guiding light to follow we are at the mercy of hostile worldly and spiritual influences looking to hijack our good intentions and use them to do evil.

One of that hardest lessons to learn is that your best attempts to "be a good person" still leave you utterly vulnerable to demonic influence and that liberal mantras of "you do you and I'll do me" are a prideful and narcissistic gateway to self defeat.

Even most satanists believe they're doing good while they usher in third term abortions and the use of drugs that render people helpless against demonic influence. Unfortunately we are taught to rebel against all the authorities that might aid our way forward and submit to all the authorities that seek to harm us.

God demands of Man responsibility. God demands of Woman vulnerability. These are their curse and blessing alike. Libertianism is to Man as Feminism is to Woman.
10-18-2019 09:11 PM
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RE: Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
(10-18-2019 08:25 PM)Kid Twist Wrote:  
(10-18-2019 04:00 PM)Kungfu Wrote:  Maybe 'be a good a person' is better than the shit we have now...

"Be a good person" is what we have now.

If a man doesn't believe in Jesus the Messiah. 2nd person of the trinity his works and his resurrection. Then this "Christianity" is merely moralistic deism.

This weaksauce is merely dissolving under pressure. Although I suspect real Christians will be suspected as being cultish or cults wrongly.
(This post was last modified: 10-18-2019 11:12 PM by infowarrior1.)
10-18-2019 11:09 PM
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RE: Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
(10-18-2019 04:00 PM)Kungfu Wrote:  I always criticized religion hard. "Bunch of uneducated clowns worshiping a dude in a cloud".

While I'm still not religious, in the last few years it's becoming clear to me what happens to wealthier societies without religious influence. The culture dies off, the family unit disappears, non-monogamy becomes the norm, moral decay sets in, and with enough time degeneracy is everywhere.

As much I don't like 'religion', maybe it's something this messed up culture really needs. Maybe 'be a good a person' is better than the shit we have now...

Some playlists if you are interested:

Case for the Soul:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBsI_ay8...sqIWKd2gs-

New Testament reliability:
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL...4lq1QYSzrY


Resurrection of Jesus:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ErnJF_n...uhnHLLkR_B

Quantum Universe and God:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFEBOGLj...PZpn-MoSK_
(This post was last modified: 10-18-2019 11:16 PM by infowarrior1.)
10-18-2019 11:15 PM
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RE: Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
So, if this trend continues, we will see a single digit within several decades. Jesus christ...
According to the chart that is 13% drop in about 10 years.
50 years = 65%...in other words, basically almost of all believers would be gone in 50 years

I would be dead by then or in my late 70s, so I guess it won't matter that much, but sad to see this phenomenon.
In 20 years, I will be in late 40s and it would be around 1/4 of the population identifying themselves as religious.

On a positive notes, the small minority will make it easier to Christians to find each other.

"Don't let yourself get attached to anything you are not willing to walk out on in 30 seconds flat if you feel the heat around the corner."
- Heat

"That's the difference between you and me. You wanna lose small, I wanna win big."
(This post was last modified: 10-18-2019 11:20 PM by bgbusiness.)
10-18-2019 11:19 PM
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RE: Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
Christianity grows in countries like China or some African ones, but I wonder how the religion will truly look like there. Christianity in some South American places devolved into some kind of death worship that could safely be practiced by cartel members, so equating this with anything Jesus preached or did is interesting to say the least.

And China doesn't accept anything that doesn't benefit them, so the church will serve the party to some degree.
10-18-2019 11:59 PM
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RE: Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
Chinese repression of Christianity or anything Europeanised for that matter is going to be equal parts cultural protectionism and espionage countermeasures.

Don't doubt for a second that every well meaning Western push into China is riddled with deep state fuckery. They do the precise same thing to us.

God demands of Man responsibility. God demands of Woman vulnerability. These are their curse and blessing alike. Libertianism is to Man as Feminism is to Woman.
10-19-2019 12:22 AM
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RE: Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
Relevent video of end-stage post-religious post-revolutionary society in the form of young Chinese:





However I disagree with Pigeon that this is anywhere close for the West.

The reason why the young stopped caring about revolutions or social issues - accepted the Orwellian apparatus and cared only about Iphone - that is easily explained.

Their life in China is not threatened by let's say 700 mio. Africans, South Americans or Muslims. They are not attacked constantly in the press and their internal academia does not create new Antifa with each gulag-lesson. Their entire internal ideology is based also on pride in China while they probably can understand the oppressive nature of the party, but at least the party does not hate them or wishes to replace them with Africans. The party in addition does not force them to accept mentally sick men as women or parade the gay flag around.

So essentially the Chinese Gen Z are nihilistic, atomized and politically uncaring because there is no social cultural marxist conflict created within unlike in the West.

For the West to arrive there it would mean first a total and complete destruction of everything that was old. Maybe that is the globohomo cultural revolution for the West - this honk world. Destruction and castration of Christianity is part of this plan.

And I am afraid that ultimately this won't go through without tens of millions of dead one way or another.
(This post was last modified: 10-19-2019 03:36 AM by Simeon_Strangelight.)
10-19-2019 03:34 AM
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Yatagan Offline
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RE: Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
Mainstream Zionist "christianity" in America can't die fast enough for my liking, along with the churches that support importing Africans and other turd worlders into the States.
(This post was last modified: 10-19-2019 11:21 AM by Yatagan.)
10-19-2019 11:21 AM
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Athanasius Offline
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RE: Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
Speaking for protestantism, what's happening is that the mainline liberal churches are dying out (ELCA, PCUSA, ECUSA, UCC, etc). These were once faithful churches in the 19th century that slowly began denying the authority of Scripture, with the rot nearly always starting in the seminaries, and churches were slow to discipline these wayward elements. Now these churches embrace feminism and homosexuality. The slow adoption of this wickeness led to splits along the way, which is a major reason there are so many denominations today. A good but very long case study of the fall of one such entity is Gary North's "Crossed Fingers," which details the decline of the mainline northern Presbyterian church. (One of the villains in the fall of Old Princeton, by the way, was Woodrow Wilson). This is your main open borders crowd.

Then we have denominations which split off the once faithful ones and seem to be slowly going the same route. The Christian Reformed Church did it a generation ago, the Presbyterian Church in America is doing it now (mainly through the gay stuff). Like the LCMS, the Southern Baptists had a major battle a generation ago that the conservatives won, but now SBC liberals like Beth Moore are using an abuse scandal to push egalitarianism. And they have the awful Russell Moore as well. But most of the churches are faithful and pushback is developing against orgs like the ERLC and the Gospel Coalition (which is doing the opposite of what it set out to do).

Then we have the non-denominational churches. These are congregational (local, not regional or national leadership), and many of the pastors came out of dispensational but otherwise generally faithful and conservative places like Dallas Theological. A lot of these seminaries are under attack by woke garbage, particularly on race, but even before that one of the contagions in the church was the Church Growth Movement. This was the root of the emphasis on using entertainment, "meeting felt needs," and soft language to fill seats. It's wrong on so many levels and it's been a disaster, leading to shallow and non-catechized Christians as well as effeminate preaching and leadership. Think Rick Warren and Willow Creek. It's influenced many non-evangelical churches as well. A lot of the stuff complained about here re: churches can be traced right back to this movement.

The overriding thing for all of this is that churches are always under attack. it was true in the time of the apostles and it's true now. As the old hymn puts it, "Onward Christian soldiers / marching as to war..."
(This post was last modified: 10-19-2019 01:42 PM by Athanasius.)
10-19-2019 01:36 PM
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RE: Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
(10-18-2019 03:47 PM)Nacho Wrote:  Eastern Orthodoxy has experienced the opposite of these trends. We have steadily increased our numbers just from protestant ranks. People know the real thing when they see it and are tired of the clown world shit show taking place in their former churches.

(10-18-2019 07:59 PM)Emperor Constantine Wrote:  According to Fr. Seraphim Rose's biography, this is one of the things that drove him towards the Orthodox Church. The Christianity he grew up with seemed empty - no fasting, no confessing one's sins, no struggling. People just lived normally, attended Church on Sundays, and apparently believed in God but did little about it. Some of my childhood friends grew up with this type of Christianity, and of those none attend church anymore.

I've known several Orthodox in my life. Mostly Greek-American, some immigrants from the Balkans. None of them attend church regularly, just for family events. According to one survey a majority of Orthodox in America support abortion and gay marriage.

My older Protestant church is doing well, although across the country we're in decline and you can tell there is pressure to cuck on various issues.

Of the serious Christians I know under 35, almost all are evangelicals, and they are a small minority. The state religion is now globohomo.

Nowhere, no denomination is safe.
10-19-2019 02:19 PM
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RE: Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
People don't even believe in themselves nowadays. Not surprised.

"Money over bitches, nigga stick to the script." - Jay-Z
They gonna love me for my ambition.
10-19-2019 02:23 PM
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RE: Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
(10-19-2019 02:19 PM)The Guest Wrote:  
(10-18-2019 03:47 PM)Nacho Wrote:  Eastern Orthodoxy has experienced the opposite of these trends. We have steadily increased our numbers just from protestant ranks. People know the real thing when they see it and are tired of the clown world shit show taking place in their former churches.

(10-18-2019 07:59 PM)Emperor Constantine Wrote:  According to Fr. Seraphim Rose's biography, this is one of the things that drove him towards the Orthodox Church. The Christianity he grew up with seemed empty - no fasting, no confessing one's sins, no struggling. People just lived normally, attended Church on Sundays, and apparently believed in God but did little about it. Some of my childhood friends grew up with this type of Christianity, and of those none attend church anymore.

I've known several Orthodox in my life. Mostly Greek-American, some immigrants from the Balkans. None of them attend church regularly, just for family events. According to one survey a majority of Orthodox in America support abortion and gay marriage.

My older Protestant church is doing well, although across the country we're in decline and you can tell there is pressure to cuck on various issues.

Of the serious Christians I know under 35, almost all are evangelicals, and they are a small minority. The state religion is now globohomo.

Nowhere, no denomination is safe.

All of what is said here is true. Remember, "orthodox" are still Americans and at the whim of the good life and affluence of the west, until it takes a hard it, which is obviously not yet. I think the details are most about the spectrum of sanity and belief that you see in the orthodox churches. They tend to have stricter adherence, for both good and bad reasons, but overall it is diminishing as most ethnic immigrants got watered down and communities slowly eroded, which is what you get in multicultural places that are wealthy. The demographics are also set to really hurt older churches and their properties are basically going to be vacated since they never got any "new blood" and didn't teach their kids much.

The interplay is an interesting thing as the eastern orthodox churches are basically the only place to go for real spiritual presence and proper doctrine, anymore.

Or, you can go in shorts to a lecture and a concert. Please don't forget your cafe mocha. We want you to feel at "home". Undecided

Get your passport ready!
10-19-2019 03:18 PM
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Post: #23
RE: Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
Something I noticed with Orthodoxy and Catholicism is that they seem to be as much of a cultural/ethnic identity as a religious one. That's why many times a person isn't just merely Catholic or Orthodox but is Irish Catholic, Polish Catholic, Serbian Orthodox, etc. For these adherentsm their faith as practiced is more about rituals and customs rather than any sort of deep commitment. I would compare it to Shinto in Japan: people go to the temple and pray during holidays because that's just part of their culture but it doesn't really effect their behavior in their regular life.

With evangelicals, there just isn't that same long history of tradition and culture; which is a reason why evangelicals seem so enamored on clinging onto what's trendy in pop culture because they just don't have really a long cultural history to draw on. Without that tradition/culture, this means the evangelical identity is going to be based more on belief/commitment. With Catholic/Orthodox, it seems like you can still identify as at least a nominal one as long as participate in some of the rituals and rites. It's common to see someone call themselves a Catholic even if they don't even believe in God since they also see it as a cultural identity that you are born into. With evangelicalism, if there's no belief then there's nothing really left.
10-19-2019 04:21 PM
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Post: #24
RE: Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
This sums up how pathetic mainline protestant churches have become. https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-...s-memorial

I hope they all die out. As noted above Evangelical churches are regularly under attack and many are being subverted too. Their numbers have held up much better though. People need to learn rainbow flags and refugee welcome signs dont keep the true believers around.
10-19-2019 04:27 PM
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Post: #25
RE: Mainstream Christianity in USA is dying (survey)
John Calvin is one of my heroes, not because of the "Five Points" (which he didn't write) but because of his towering intellect, his courage, his integrity (his scriptural commentaries are quite good). He deeply studied the early church and that is one of the things that led him away from Rome at the time. His liturgies were adapted from the church fathers and his study of the Bible. They were a dialogue started by God. God greets us, we respond. God calls us to confess our sins and forgives them, then we respond, etc. God preaches his word (through the pastor who does expository preaching), we respond. And for centuries, into the mid-20th century, most protestant churches had sensible liturgies, psalters, and hymnals. Catechisms of some kind were stressed. Men wore suits, women hats and veils.

The sixties brought the focus on youth and informality. The church growth movement was about drawing people through entertainment, so now the liturgies make no sense and the services are about making people "feel." The statements of faith are a page long. People at some churches wear shorts and T-shirts. When you're about drawing people through what's cool and not by what's true, you need shallow Hillsong stuff to match what people listen to on the radio, you need lattes at church, you need to avoid offense, etc. One example of this corruption is Hillsong taking the venerable hymn It Is Well (with my soul) and stripping the verses that gave theological meaning to the chorus. You listen to it and it could be well with your soul because you have a pretty girlfriend, a good job, or just because you feel emotionally good right now. It's a cipher that takes on whatever meaning you pour into it.
(This post was last modified: 10-19-2019 05:31 PM by Athanasius.)
10-19-2019 05:26 PM
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