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Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
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Roosh Offline
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Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
It looks like feminists are not getting enough attention from males like they used to. This one makes the convoluted argument through painfully bad writing that not dating "woke" women is a manifestation of sexism and racism and will inevitably lead to far-right extremism, or at least make them act like Donald Trump. Even Jordan Peterson is too much for her.

Quote:The word "irrespective" means saying or doing something without taking anything else into account. For example: "Irrespective of the fact that the cost of living has jumped, putting pressure on many people, the government ploughed on with Brexit and argued that there would be no real economic impact."

So it is fitting that white man of the moment, Laurence Fox – who appeared on the BBC’s Question Time programme and told a BAME audience member that Meghan Markle has not been on the receiving end of racism before subsequently appearing on the cover of The Sunday Times to tell the world that he does not "date woke women" and then displaying an appalling understanding of history by calling the inclusion of a Sikh soldier in Sam Mendes' film 1917 "incongruous" – has "irrespective" tattooed on his arm.

Did you hear that at the back, ladies? Laurence Fox – who you perhaps only knew as Billie Piper’s ex-husband because you’ve never seen Lewis (what?) – does not date "woke" women who he believes are being taught that they are "victims", irrespective of whether they are right or not. He thinks that it’s "institutionally racist" to tell the story of the First World War in a racially diverse way, irrespective of the fact that Sikh soldiers absolutely fought for Britain. And he also doesn’t believe in white privilege, irrespective of the fact that he works in a painfully undiverse industry, was privately educated and comes from a wealthy acting family which is nothing short of a dynasty.

Fox is denying racism and sexism, irrespective of whether or not they exist. It’s nothing short of gaslighting. It’s all very Donald Trump. And as you would expect, the whole debacle has lit a fire under anti-woke poster boy Piers Morgan while gaining Fox thousands of extra Twitter followers.

I could go over all the things he’s said; I could use data to prove how wrong he is; I could express concern for his mental health (after all, who really enjoys arguing on Twitter?); I could make jokes about his behaviour. But all of that would be to seriously miss the point.

There’s nothing funny about the things Fox – or Wokey McWokeface as he now wants to be known – is saying. It’s also not particularly sad. It’s dangerous. He is just one very privileged man, and as a result of said privilege, has been given a platform. And he has used that platform to legitimise a bigger backlash against diversity and progress which is unfolding every single day in less public corners of the internet.

Not wanting to date "woke" women, far from being laughable, is actually one of the more insidious aspects of it. Spend an afternoon on any major dating app and you’ll come across (generally white) men saying openly sexist and misogynistic things. They might say "no psychos" or that they "fucking hate big eyebrows" in their bios. And, by and large, they also tend to hold extremely right-wing views and see themselves as victims of liberal thinking.

In fact, as I was writing this, a dear friend sent me a screenshot of a guy she’s just matched with who describes Jordan B Peterson as his "dream dinner guest". Yes, the same Jordan B Peterson who thinks that white privilege is a "Marxist lie" and wants millennials to drop their obsession with "social justice".

I, meanwhile, recently had to block someone who after matching with me launched into a vile rant about how women are "evil", "only want sex" and treat men as though they are "disposable". When I asked him if he hated women he replied that he had "only moderate disdain" for us before asking me whether I didn’t want to date him because I’m actually "pretty rough".

All of this, of course, speaks not only to the presence of the very active online communities of anti-feminist incels but to the prevalence of the hideous and incorrect ideas they promote. It doesn’t take magical thinking to see how men are radicalised by anti-feminism. As the saying goes: "When you’re used to privilege, equality feels like oppression."

The reactionary influence of these ideas doesn’t stop at dating, though. As the campaign group Hope Not Hate reported last year, a hostility towards feminism is feeding directly into far-right movements online. They found that a third of young British people today believe that feminism is marginalising or demonising men and warned that these beliefs were a "slip road" to other far-right ideas.

This isn’t just speculation. We know that the number of far-right referrals to the British government’s deradicalisation scheme Prevent has dramatically increased recently. In the year from 2017/18 they jumped by 36%, while referrals for Islamism actually decreased by 14%.

Right now, Laurence Fox, whether he realises it or not, has just landed the biggest part of his life. He is legitimising hatred and division. And yet he cannot be completely unaware of the role he plays; he has spoken about being "radicalised" himself on YouTube.

Last year he released an album called A Grief Observed which is largely about his acrimonious split from Piper. When The Times interviewed him about it he turned up wearing a pro-Donald Trump MAGA (Make America Great Again) cap and said it was a "social experiment". He then told the interviewer that he spent a lot of his time watching YouTube interviews which had "totally radicalised" him and caused him to embark on a "crusade against woke culture and political correctness." He wanted, he said, to call one of the songs "Me Too" but was prevented by his record label.

Fox is a case in point that what might start as playing devil’s advocate by wandering the streets in a MAGA cap to provoke "hipsters" can quickly turn into something more sinister.

The far right itself can be difficult to pin down because it isn’t exactly a coherent global movement with a concrete set of ideas. It largely exists online, in Facebook groups, as Twitter accounts, on YouTube and anonymous message boards such as 8chan. But every now and then, their bile spills out dangerously into the offline world.

In 2016 the Labour MP Jo Cox was murdered by far-right terrorist Thomas Mair who, 25 years before he killed her, told a far-right magazine that the "white race" faced a long and very bloody struggle. And it was 8chan that hosted the manifestos of three mass shooters who killed scores of people last year: the El Paso shooter (who left 20 people dead and many more wounded only a couple of weeks ago), the Poway shooter (who opened fire at a synagogue in California last April) and the Christchurch shooter (who killed 51 people at two mosques in New Zealand last March).

Susan Faludi wrote about the link between violence, anger and anti-feminism prophetically in her book Backlash: The Undeclared War Against American Women back in 1991. Long before the turbulent times which have seen the rise to power of two male caricatures – Donald Trump to the office of US president and the accession of Boris Johnson as our prime minister – she warned:

"When an attack on home soil causes cultural paroxysms that have nothing to do with the attack, when we respond to real threats to our nation by distrusting ourselves with imagined threats to femininity and family life, when we invest our leaders with a cartoon masculinity and require of them bluster in lieu of a capacity for rational calculation, and when we blame our frailty in ‘fifth column’ feminists – in short, when we base our security on a mythical male strength that can only increase itself against a mythical female weakness – we should know that we are exhibiting the symptoms of a lethal, albeit curable, cultural affliction."

She added: "When the enemy has no face, society will invent one." For men like Fox, who feel they have been wronged somehow, that they are missing out on opportunities because, for once in history, they are being given to other people, women and people of colour become the enemy.

You can see it in the abuse and threats received by women MPs and in the wildly different treatment of Meghan Markle and Kate Middleton. While Middleton, who generally keeps herself to herself and says little, has become a pinup heroine for traditionalists, Markle, who has spoken openly about sexism and racism, trying to use her platform for good, has been – quite literally – driven out of the country, condemned for being an outspoken snowflake.

Make no mistake, the far right is already capitalising on Fox’s words, gassing him up and turning him into an icon. He has added to their backlash and given it oxygen. Every time he is invited onto a TV or radio show to talk about it, that oxygen will cause the backlash to burn hotter and faster, irrespective of whether we’re watching or not. It’s important not to trivialise this anti-woke, anti-women backlash. In the end, it’s only by paying attention to it that we can understand it and do something about it.

In the end, her essay seems to contain all the anger she has pent up from her failures on Tinder.

https://www.refinery29.com/en-gb/2020/01...ke-meaning

Roosh
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01-23-2020 02:24 PM
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roberto Offline
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Post: #2
RE: Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
I used to know Laurence Fox quite well when he was married to Billie. Always struck me as a sound sort of bloke.

They who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety- Benjamin Franklin, as if you didn't know...
01-23-2020 02:36 PM
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DamienCasanova Offline
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Post: #3
RE: Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
Not advocating for MGTOW, but this is a response

Female Narcissism Unleashed By Social Media Has Led to Rise of MGTOW

https://alt-right.com/2020/01/23/why-has...o-popular/

Men Going Their Own Way (MGTOW) has exploded in popularity over the past 10 years.

There are hundreds of highly popular YouTube channels and blogs that traffic in MGTOW content. Business is booming for MGTOW content creators.

I believe there is a direct correlation between MGTOW and the rise of social media and dating apps

Social media and dating apps have obliterated dating for men.

Why?

Because through these apps and websites, the modern female has an abundance of penis to choose from. She can obtain a new penis as quickly as she can order a latte at Starbucks. All she has to do is upload one slutty photo to a dating app, Instagram or Facebook, and she will be bombarded with offers of dick. Thanks to our sex-crazed Jewish culture, most men are so thirsty for the punani that even obese slobs are getting major action these days. This opulence of penis and male validation through social media has unleashed the hellish nightmare of female hypergamy and narcissism.

Females are genetically hypergamous due to their weak physical stature. They cannot survive without the labour of men, so they must entice superior men with their moist holes to obtain our labour and resources.

Thanks to the satanic cult of feminism, all females have been pushed into the workforce. As a result of being more “independent” and less reliant on men for resources, females have collectively elevated their standards for men. You’d think that female hypergamy would have disappeared now that they work. But no, it has merely increased. Owed to the false validation of social media and modern makeup techniques, the average-looking female today views herself as a beauty queen, and concurrently searches for her high-status king in the top 20% of income earners. This has left scores of middle and lower income men out in the cold, or on a constant pussy-hunt with lackluster results, hence the rapid growth of MGTOW.

Because female hypergamy has exploded to astronomical proportions, modern dating has become a nightmare for most men of average income. Unless you have the bling and upper class swagger to impress a modern harlot, she will pay no attention to you. She may use you for a few free drinks and dinners, and then hop right back on the Tinder cock carousel until she hooks a high-status “keeper”.

MGTOW exists because of the atrocious dating behaviour of modern women. Dating a modern woman is like dating a mannequin. Most of these women are either vapid and soulless or annoying and needy. Studies have shown that one third of modern Western women go on dates simply to get a free meal. Women who use dating apps do so mainly to get a quick ego boost, not actually to date men.

[Image: dating-women.png]

[Image: dating-women2.png]

The answer is that women are biologically programmed narcissists who value resources over everything. In the eyes of a female, a man is just a resource machine. If he cannot provide her with some kind of resource, like a free meal, then she’s not interested. This confirms the biological reality that all women enter sexual relationships with men simply as a means of obtaining extra resources that she can benefit from. Now that she can provide for herself through work, she has upped the ante for men who must demonstrate opulence by providing her with something that she can’t get on her own.

[Image: bitch2.png]

So MGTOW is a rational male response to unhinged female narcissism that modern technology enables.

All of this repulsive female behaviour has contributed greatly to the collapse of white birth rates throughout the West. Fewer and fewer women are marrying and reproducing because they are on a massive ego and power trip with their heads up their own asses. Only multimillionaire studs can compete for the affection of even moderately attractive femoids.

Until the modern femoid is tamed and put in her place below superior men, she will continue to act destructively in our society and MGTOW will continue to grow.
(This post was last modified: 01-23-2020 03:02 PM by DamienCasanova.)
01-23-2020 03:01 PM
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Matsufubu Offline
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Post: #4
RE: Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
Quote:They might say "no psychos" or that they "fucking hate big eyebrows" in their bios.

100 billion dollars says she's a psycho with big eyebrows. Like Bert from Sesame Street, but fatter.
01-23-2020 03:03 PM
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DamienCasanova Offline
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RE: Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
(01-23-2020 03:03 PM)Matsufubu Wrote:  
Quote:They might say "no psychos" or that they "fucking hate big eyebrows" in their bios.

100 billion dollars says she's a psycho with big eyebrows. Like Bert from Sesame Street, but fatter.

[Image: serveimage?url=https:%2F%2Fs2.dmcdn.net%...68307c8094]

[Image: giphy.gif]

Highfive
(This post was last modified: 01-23-2020 03:27 PM by DamienCasanova.)
01-23-2020 03:21 PM
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Matsufubu Offline
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RE: Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
I'm here to collect!

[Image: 5f91584182fd7272b1f6b8647b40932691eb50fc...07a88f.jpg]
(This post was last modified: 01-23-2020 03:28 PM by Matsufubu.)
01-23-2020 03:27 PM
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Batman_ Offline
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Post: #7
RE: Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
Quote:All of this, of course, speaks not only to the presence of the very active online communities of anti-feminist incels but to the prevalence of the hideous and incorrect ideas they promote.

I find it incredibly amusing yet alarming how any criticism of feminism automatically gets you grouped into an incel category now.

Same goes for political beliefs - if you're not progressive, you must be alt right.

Quote:The far right itself can be difficult to pin down because it isn’t exactly a coherent global movement with a concrete set of ideas.

Maybe because it's not an actual ideology or political movement, since it formed on its own accord in direct opposition to radical leftism. If the alt-right ceased to exist overnight, the standards of "wokeness" would simply become more radical, and traditional nonradical feminists/progressives would replace the far right.

Do these people not understand the concept of independent thought? Will they ever understand that you don't need an ideology to operate in the world? You can't even be centrist now without people accusing you of (secretly) being alt right.

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(This post was last modified: 01-23-2020 04:50 PM by Batman_.)
01-23-2020 04:25 PM
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Bury Zenek Offline
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RE: Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
(01-23-2020 04:25 PM)Batman_ Wrote:  Do these people not understand the concept of independent thought?

If they did they wouldn't be leftists in the first place.

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(This post was last modified: 01-23-2020 05:05 PM by Bury Zenek.)
01-23-2020 05:05 PM
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PapayaTapper Away
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Post: #9
RE: Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
"Once you go East , you dont do beasts" PapayaTapper (2005)

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- Does She Have The "Happy Gene" ?
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01-23-2020 05:18 PM
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Easy_C Offline
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Post: #10
RE: Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
Remember the cardinal rule of these authors:

"Everything is somehow about Meeeee!!!


Without even reading the article I can tell you that what happened is that she was ditched a few times by guys because she's obnoxious and aggressively opinionated + self righteous, and is now angry about that and seeking to change society in such a manner that she herself won't have to feel rejected anymore.
01-23-2020 05:21 PM
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Aurini Offline
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RE: Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
I think this qualifies as the Misandry Bubble popping. Good. Things will start to normalize a bit, while something else becomes idiotic.

I'm not certain that this means that dating will vastly improve however. Maybe just become a little less awful.

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01-23-2020 05:27 PM
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Emancipator Offline
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Post: #12
RE: Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
Anti-woke men are refusing to date woke women?

Oh no, how will these strong independent women survive now????

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01-23-2020 05:33 PM
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RE: Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
Women only care about money if that’s the primary means you’re using to attract them. You don’t have to pay a dime to date most attractive women, as long as you’re cool and fun to be around. MGTOW is correct about more than it isn’t, but the guys whining about women only dating rich men are clueless betas with no game.

That MGTOW comment about women being “in their place below superior men” is telling because it betrays the author’s “secret king” fantasy in which he is the true ultimate man and all the guys women date instead are, in his mind, below him. The reality is that women naturally submit to dominant men already, which is why they’re ignoring the guys who complain like that.

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(This post was last modified: 01-23-2020 05:58 PM by MichaelWitcoff.)
01-23-2020 05:56 PM
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RE: Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
When you see these far left chicks, you wonder what kind of man would accept that. Then you realize what kind of puss man they have to deal with.

No wonder they are angry. I still blame them for their own stupidity.

For professing themselves to be wise, they became fools. Rom 1:22
01-23-2020 06:00 PM
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Aurini Offline
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RE: Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
(01-23-2020 05:56 PM)MichaelWitcoff Wrote:  Women only care about money if that’s the primary means you’re using to attract them. You don’t have to pay a dime to date most attractive women, as long as you’re cool and fun to be around. MGTOW is correct about more than it isn’t, but the guys whining about women only dating rich men are clueless betas with no game.

That MGTOW comment about women being “in their place below superior men” is telling because it betrays the author’s “secret king” fantasy in which he is the true ultimate man and all the guys women date instead are, in his mind, below him. The reality is that women naturally submit to dominant men already, which is why they’re ignoring the guys who complain like that.

Dating, yes; but marriage requires money.

If you don't have money, she'll eventually catch on, and either flit off to somewhere else, or become the dragon lady who demands that you get your act together. You should have your act together before hand (and good luck with that in this economy!).

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(This post was last modified: 01-23-2020 06:02 PM by Aurini.)
01-23-2020 06:02 PM
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RE: Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
(01-23-2020 05:56 PM)MichaelWitcoff Wrote:  Women only care about money if that’s the primary means you’re using to attract them. You don’t have to pay a dime to date most attractive women, as long as you’re cool and fun to be around. MGTOW is correct about more than it isn’t, but the guys whining about women only dating rich men are clueless betas with no game.

That MGTOW comment about women being “in their place below superior men” is telling because it betrays the author’s “secret king” fantasy in which he is the true ultimate man and all the guys women date instead are, in his mind, below him. The reality is that women naturally submit to dominant men already, which is why they’re ignoring the guys who complain like that.

In a normal society these men would be in a dominant role compared to women. Being an average guy, with an average job, or even a below average guy with a below average job, shouldn't render you completely dateless and non-marriage material.

It does in the west today. These men are no different than their own dads, and their dad's obviously had at least one woman willing to be with them. These men are just in a dying society and given a raw deal. Hopefully they find a way to cope with the situation, because it looks very dire for any man born after 1990.
01-23-2020 06:08 PM
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RE: Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
(01-23-2020 02:36 PM)roberto Wrote:  I used to know Laurence Fox quite well when he was married to Billie. Always struck me as a sound sort of bloke.


Small world!

I like Laurence a lot. Never met him, of course. Definitely sound!


Billie ended up marrying Chris Evans, and before that he (Chris) used to date the super model Rachel Tatton-Brown (or is it 'Tatton Brown' - all this double barreled hyphenated bizness gets me all discombobulated?).

Rachel was a year below me in school but I was in the same class as her older sister Clare, who was a researcher on the Big Breakfast and I think that's how they met.

The Tatton-Brown family has a deep naval/diplomatic history. I went to school with the sisters in an American school in the middle east that was an ex US naval base. It was an international school but did English 'O' levels as they were at the time. I was in the top class for my year, and Clare was in many of my classes. She was highly intelligent and studious.

I have another connection to Chris Evans as well as I used to date another of his Producers. I won't mention her name as I know she values her privacy. She also sailed the world on yachts. In her youth. Many stories to tell about Chris Evans...

Rachel (who went out with Chris) and her sister Clare (who was the Production Manager on Hotel Babylon and probably still works in the industry I'm sure) went to my school, but her brother Duncan did not.

He did Ok for himself: https://www.marketscreener.com/business-...biography/

Chief Financial Officer & Executive Director at Ocado Group Plc and Chief Financial Officer & Director at Ocado Solutions Ltd


I guess he was a border, unless I missed him because he would have been a year or two below me. Age is magnified when you are that young.

Clare was an absolute blonde bombshell with long blonde hair and I was madly in love with her. We hung out a few times at parties and had many mutual friends, but it never went further than that. I was heartbroken at 14 years old and that's why I started playing guitar!

She could have had any man/boy she wanted, but she chose a Portuguese lad a year younger than her called Fernando who was a real Scarface Pimp kind of cocky lad. Women loved him. Clare got to have him. He lost an eye in a fight some years later I was told when I went to a reunion with some old pals. I remember really feeling for him and feeling bad, as even though I hated him at the time, I too had lost an eye, but for some reason, God saw fit to restore it. It's where the majority of my faith comes from. What little faith I have. I've posted about this before on the forum if you care to search.

I felt so hard done by. What a fool I was. I had little 14 year old Annabella (also Portuguese) as my girlfriend to make up for it all. Keep in mind I was only 14 at the time! Sweet innocence. No funny business. The joy of holding hands. Such a deep heady glow...

I don't think Rachel went out with Chris for long. I don't remember. It was a topic of conversation when I went out with and dated his Producer, who also produced a lot of the top comedy shows in the UK at that time too. One of those little coincidences. That's how I found out about what Chris used to get up to. I've mentioned some stuff before, but I don't really care now...


Rachel was quite a stunner -

[Image: rachel-tatton-brown-fashion-model-with-h...76027a.jpg]


Then again...

[Image: rachel-tatton-brown.jpg]


Make up is a female arms-race!

And drugs are bad, Mmkaaay!


A lot of those people are stuck up. But then again, they have reason to be. They come from a lineage of family going back many generations. So what if a few of them luck out and end up in 'TV'. The men seem to go in to the more serious occupations. As witnessed by Rachel and Clare's brother! Wow. I had no idea till I did a little google after seeing your post. That is quite an achievement. I see many of the family are also in the legal profession. Kudos to them.


Sorry for the thread derail. I'm sure it's connected somehow. So much more 'goss' to spill, but I'm feeling like an old toothless Albanian granny right now, so I'll leave it for laters!


But I do like the cut of the gib of that boy Fox!

Courage of the convictions and all that, old boy, what what.

I just hope he's not going to be made an example of.




Roberto, a really wicked thought just occurred to me - we should do one of those 're-union' type things.

Laurence, Billie, Chris, Rachel, Clare...

...Fernando!


It'll be fun!

Banana
01-23-2020 06:41 PM
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MichaelWitcoff Offline
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Post: #18
RE: Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
I of course agree that for most of history men were given positions of authority over women and solved all of these problems. But the reality of our situation is that yes, it's unfair to most men born in the West, but that's simply not the case anymore. For women to find you dominant now it has to be based on you as an individual and not the position you have in society (generally speaking). You have no control over that fact and it's not going to get better any time soon (in fact it's only going to get worse until what's left of our civilization implodes). There is no path to undo this and no possibility of that happening.

That means that, for the vast majority of men, whining about how unfair it is will not get you anywhere. It's not going to get you what you want, it's not going to make women sympathize with you, and it's not going to make the dominant men suddenly all become weaker out of some sense of fairness and reciprocity to you. You simply have to become psychologically stronger to AT LEAST match the psychological strength of most women, which the majority of modern men do not have. There is no way around doing the work, which depending on where you start from, could be a brutal uphill battle for the entirety of the endeavor.

Now whether that's worth the effort and trouble in today's dating market is a completely different question, and MGTOW have strong arguments for simply unplugging and focusing on their own lives and hobbies instead of caring about dating at all. Their response to modernity is rational and easy to empathize with for all besides the people who are either profoundly clueless or simply hate men. My issue with that big comment posted above is that the guy is trying to play the fence, neither doing the work to attract women, nor detaching enough not to care. In both cases it strikes me as a lack of decisiveness and action-taking, which is likely how he wound up feeling the way he feels in the first place.

Detach or do the work. You have to pick.

Jewish convert to Orthodox Christianity and best-selling author of "On The Masons And Their Lies."
(This post was last modified: 01-23-2020 06:48 PM by MichaelWitcoff.)
01-23-2020 06:48 PM
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Abelard Lindsey Offline
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Post: #19
RE: Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
Ms. Spratt should repeat to herself, "a woman needs a man like a fish needs a bicycle", a few times so that she can get over it.
01-23-2020 07:01 PM
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SlickyBoy Offline
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Post: #20
RE: Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
(01-23-2020 02:24 PM)Roosh Wrote:  In the end, her essay seems to contain all the anger she has pent up from her failures on Tinder.
She definitely looks the part.

And, surprise surprise, AT the end of her essay is a blurb about ending the oppression against women who apparently can't suck their babies into the sink fast enough:

Quote:#ImACriminal
Help Refinery29 UK change the law – sign our petition to decriminalise abortion in England and Wales.

How much more legal do they need to make it? What's the goal? An abortion clinic in every high school?

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01-23-2020 07:09 PM
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MichaelWitcoff Offline
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Post: #21
RE: Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
Checked out the original article Roosh linked and the comments give me hope. No man with self-respect has any interest in the kind of women the article is defending.

Jewish convert to Orthodox Christianity and best-selling author of "On The Masons And Their Lies."
(This post was last modified: 01-23-2020 07:11 PM by MichaelWitcoff.)
01-23-2020 07:10 PM
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It_is_my_time Offline
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Post: #22
RE: Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
(01-23-2020 06:48 PM)MichaelWitcoff Wrote:  I of course agree that for most of history men were given positions of authority over women and solved all of these problems. But the reality of our situation is that yes, it's unfair to most men born in the West, but that's simply not the case anymore. For women to find you dominant now it has to be based on you as an individual and not the position you have in society (generally speaking). You have no control over that fact and it's not going to get better any time soon (in fact it's only going to get worse until what's left of our civilization implodes). There is no path to undo this and no possibility of that happening.

That means that, for the vast majority of men, whining about how unfair it is will not get you anywhere. It's not going to get you what you want, it's not going to make women sympathize with you, and it's not going to make the dominant men suddenly all become weaker out of some sense of fairness and reciprocity to you. You simply have to become psychologically stronger to AT LEAST match the psychological strength of most women, which the majority of modern men do not have. There is no way around doing the work, which depending on where you start from, could be a brutal uphill battle for the entirety of the endeavor.

Now whether that's worth the effort and trouble in today's dating market is a completely different question, and MGTOW have strong arguments for simply unplugging and focusing on their own lives and hobbies instead of caring about dating at all. Their response to modernity is rational and easy to empathize with for all besides the people who are either profoundly clueless or simply hate men. My issue with that big comment posted above is that the guy is trying to play the fence, neither doing the work to attract women, nor detaching enough not to care. In both cases it strikes me as a lack of decisiveness and action-taking, which is likely how he wound up feeling the way he feels in the first place.

Detach or do the work. You have to pick.

I agree with your well thought out comments and I appreciate them.

Certainly every man should count their blessings and use the day to improve themselves, no matter how small of an improvement it is. It all adds up. Men that sit around and don't try to improve are wasting their lives.

There is a difference in whining and legit complaints. And this issue draws both from men, some whining like babies and others with legit complaints.

Where are disagree are on two things...

#1) If you get married, you have to have a position that she looks up to. If you are a fun guy and make her happy, but you make less money than her, she will lose interest once the bills role in and she feels you are "taking advantage of her". This will not be 100% of the cases, but it will be the majority. The list of great men who got divorced due to layoffs or pay cuts is very long.

If you don't have a way to really be successful, then marriage in the USA will be very tough, no matter how great you are. It might work, but the odds are against you.

#2) I think something can be done about this. I think if the word spreads and more men drop out of the dating market but voice their concerns it will hit women. Not right away, but it will take time. Meanwhile the older men can rationally explain to women, both young and old, that they have made this bed and now they are forced to lay in it and the only way out is to kick this feminist nonsense to the curb. Women are not happy like this. We can see the sharp spike in women's depression, younger health concerns, alcoholism, and suicide. Women hate this shit as much as men do, and if we can up the pain on them (men leaving them in the dating market, no more attention, no more free meals) and then offer a rational and loving option to have the lives they dream to have, we might be able to get everyone on board.

If not, then civilization will collapse and when it is eventually rebuilt, the sexual roles will reset due to survival needs.
(This post was last modified: 01-23-2020 07:40 PM by It_is_my_time.)
01-23-2020 07:38 PM
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MichaelWitcoff Offline
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Post: #23
RE: Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
I hope you're right that it can be fixed, but I'm not personally optimistic about it. I've never had an interest in marriage anyway, but I often wonder whether I would be more interested if we lived in a world with sane gender dynamics and family laws. Maybe the kind of article linked here is a good sign that women are starting to realize they'll have to change if they want real men, though if that change ever happens it will certainly not be any time soon. There are decades of screeching and control-attempts that our society would have to pass through first, and I'm not convinced that our current society will even still be around that far in the future. But, as ever, I hope I'm wrong.

Jewish convert to Orthodox Christianity and best-selling author of "On The Masons And Their Lies."
01-23-2020 07:52 PM
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It_is_my_time Offline
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Post: #24
RE: Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
(01-23-2020 07:52 PM)MichaelWitcoff Wrote:  I hope you're right that it can be fixed, but I'm not personally optimistic about it. I've never had an interest in marriage anyway, but I often wonder whether I would be more interested if we lived in a world with sane gender dynamics and family laws. Maybe the kind of article linked here is a good sign that women are starting to realize they'll have to change if they want real men, though if that change ever happens it will certainly not be any time soon. There are decades of screeching and control-attempts that our society would have to pass through first, and I'm not convinced that our current society will even still be around that far in the future. But, as ever, I hope I'm wrong.

A fix certainly will not be easy and it probably will not be soon enough for me to take advantage of it. But if I have kids maybe they can enjoy a more sane society. I think women are more ripe than ever to listening to the ideas of becoming housewives. The glam of working in an office, shuffling papers, is wearing off. Hours are getting longer, the pressure is building, and the number of men who show them interest is declining.

I can completely understand not being interested in marriage in the USA. I sure have not been interested in it at all until I hit my 40's. Not because I wanted to soy my wild oats, not at all, I had no interest in that either. Mostly due to risks. I have just become more interested in marriage now because I can now more so afford it and I have a much better understanding of myself, making me much more marriage ready. I also see my parents aging, my whole family aging, and I am wondering what exactly am I doing with my life.

But I am in no hurry and I will probably want to wait another year or two before I start looking.
(This post was last modified: 01-23-2020 07:59 PM by It_is_my_time.)
01-23-2020 07:59 PM
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kel Online
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Post: #25
RE: Not dating "woke" women is dangerous and will lead to far-right extremism
It's been a few years now that "incel" has been the go-to insult for any man who goes against the globalist narrative, to the point that a woman complaining that she can't get a date uses it against the guys who are dating other, better women.
01-23-2020 08:06 PM
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