19 Year Old Son's GF is Pregnant, Not My Problem

@Heismightytosave

Reality check: The family court system hates men. Secondly the OP is saying this all happened after spinal surgery, even with insurance that will zap the pocketbook. So how is a man with no money even going to hire a divorce attorney (who may achieve exactly nothing to boot).
You are preaching to the choir. I've been in an 11 yr custody battle for my daughter from my 1st marriage, in the worst State in the whole country for Dads.

And yet, the only reason I haven't won already is that my Ex has parents with very deep pockets.

You can't just roll over and let your kid get taken from you without a fight. And yes, that fight can- and probably should- be done without an attorney for most, at least most of the time. That's one of the big mistakes that I've made in my case- paying an attorney when I shouldn't have.
 
@Heismightytosave

Then keep doing what your doing but accept the fact that OP may simply no longer have the energy or desire to do what you are doing. You can't save everyone, particularly when said "everyone" doesn't wish to be saved. As for the grandchild...doomed like millions upon millions of latchkey kids before him/her.

This simply cannot be salvaged barring divine intervention.

P:S Name the state your living in so men know to avoid the hellhole.
 
@Heismightytosave

Then keep doing what your doing but accept the fact that OP may simply no longer have the energy or desire to do what you are doing. You can't save everyone, particularly when said "everyone" doesn't wish to be saved. As for the grandchild...doomed like millions upon millions of latchkey kids before him/her.

This simply cannot be salvaged barring divine intervention.

P:S Name the state your living in so men know to avoid the hellhole.
You are missing the point. There is a lack of accountability that I see from OP. If he steps forward and becomes accountable, both to God and his son, there may be a way to move forward. When dealing with our children, our own flesh and blood, it is not an option to throw up one's hands and say- "oh well, the system sucks, I guess I'm out of your life for the next X years and there is nothing I can do". But the point is- even if he rolled over years ago, he doesn't have to roll over now. He can still do something about the present and the future.

The State to avoid is Massachusetts. I live in NH now. And after 11 years, I'm about to win the battle by the grace of God.
 
@Heismightytosave

It wasn't the son rebelling, shouting and in general being a little shit. It was throwing hands without any provocation (and knowing that his father didn't stand a chance in hell of fighting back). That isn't just rebellion, it's a complete rejection of dad. If the son has given up on the father why should the father not simply disown him?

There is only so much you can do, if the horse refuses to drink the water (despite you having brought the horse to the trough) are you in anyway to blame for the horse's refusal?
 
@Heismightytosave

It wasn't the son rebelling, shouting and in general being a little shit. It was throwing hands without any provocation (and knowing that his father didn't stand a chance in hell of fighting back). That isn't just rebellion, it's a complete rejection of dad. If the son has given up on the father why should the father not simply disown him?

There is only so much you can do, if the horse refuses to drink the water (despite you having brought the horse to the trough) are you in anyway to blame for the horse's refusal?
Why did he rebel and throw hands? Don't you think that might have a little something to do with being raised by a Mother that was neglectful/irresponsible/crazy/ etc? And don't you think that might have a little something to do with being raised without a Father?
And don't you think based on these factors, it was a bad idea to capitulate and keep capitulating to being an every other weekend Dad?

It's not all on the kid, that's the point. Dad should have rose up and fought to be a part of the kid's life. He didn't, but he can do the right thing now, take responsibility, and possibly salvage the relationship. With God's help of course.
 
I hope she is. At least somebody's got their head on straight.

You've already written your grandchild off and he's not even born.

And 2 years is a long time for your son to have made some serious changes in his life. You wrote him off over a little weed, some trespassing, and some misdemeanor assault. Come on dude.

Your son may very well have gotten his act together without you. If he has, call and say congratulations and let him know you are there for him. You're disabled, and you've been on this forum for seven years, so you are probably rolling in cryptocurrency, affiliate marketing, penny stock, and various other work-from-home type of money. So that's good.

If he is still a little on the wild side, step the hell up and end this cycle. Apologize and be a leader. Do not allow your son to be an absentee father too. Do not be an absentee grandpa.

Do not do this for your son. Do not do this for yourself. Do this for your grandchild.

Aloha!
I understand the idea of telling men to be strong, taking on as much responsibility as possible, and not making excuses.

To a degree that’s fine advice as it pertains to your own actions. But a lot of the guys on here have put themselves in compromised positions in life by blindly following that logic.

I know it’s well meant. But some of you are literally asking the OP to go back to being a punching bag. Literally.

You sound like women in the MeToo Movement immediately blaming him because he’s a man yet paradoxically siding with his abusers.

People like his son and ex rarely change. They may turn to jesus. They’re not going to treat him much better emotionally or financially.

As you point out, his role as a man is to take on total responsibility. Then open his mouth—not to speak—but to eat more shit.

Then there’s the wild assumption of wealth and privilege. Because you’re a man or a man on this site you must be a crypto millionaire?

The dude just said he was disabled. And you’re telling him to bear a cross? Holy shit.

But he must be rich! Or maybe he lost his life savings. Either way he’s dealing with more than he can handle, obviously.

The man shaming needs to stop. It’s often at it’s worst from privileged/jealous/dismissive men who can’t fathom coming from real disadvantage. Suck it up they say.

This is the kind expectation and pressure men get from other men is toxic. If they’re not successful or have problem it’s all their fault.

No.

Most of these things are a matter of bad circumstance and timing. Sure you could have made better decisions. You also could have made a lot worse decisions.

Around 50% of American men have no dad or a weak dad. A scumbag mom. Their decisions come from a place of desperation and weakness, no real support, role models, etc. Then stronger men basically shit down their throat and say suck it up crybaby-oh but in a loving supportive way...

A modicum of support from forums can be little better than scrolling Instagram and seeing jacked bodybuilders and filthy rich entrepreneurs. Just enough to delude you and make you feel inept. Maybe that’s possible if someone actually took a real personal interest in the OP life at some point instead of throwing a little rhetoric his way and calling him a crybaby.

The other side of that “responsibility coin” is asking a man who’s already at a huge disadvantage to continue to be a doormat, ATM machine, therapist, punching bag, etc. for a society that will never value, respect, or love him for the massive effort he’s putting in.

I’d argue he’s already done his duty and is worse off for it. Reaching out will continue to enable his enablers.

Time for him to be as callous and selfish as his “family”. They actually deserve and NEED to be hard nexted.

Maybe then THEY will take on some accountability and responsibly. Don’t hold your breath.

Society will reward their antisocial asshole behavior and punish the OP. It already has.

You think his kid is a happy daddy who turned his life around? He didn’t reach out to his dad. OP found out through grapevine. The kid is the same aggressive criminal he was when he assaulted him years ago. Obviously.

OP you have a responsibility to yourself. Take the well meant advice of “manning up” and apply it to yourself. All your family will want and respond to is money, chauffeur service, a babysitter, etc.

You will NOT get respect and love. They probably won’t even be polite to you in return.

OP. Be done with it. The Bible says “separate yourself from evil”.
 
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I understand the idea of telling men to be strong, taking on as much responsibility as possible, and not making excuses.

To a degree that’s fine advice as it pertains to your own actions. But a lot of the guys on here have put themselves in compromised positions in life by blindly following that logic.

I know it’s well meant. But some of you are literally asking the OP to go back to being a punching bag. Literally.

You sound like women in the MeToo Movement immediately blaming him because he’s a man yet paradoxically siding with his abusers.

People like his son and ex rarely change. They may turn to jesus. They’re not going to treat him much better emotionally or financially.

As you point out, his role as a man is to take on total responsibility. Then open his mouth—not to speak—but to eat more shit.

Then there’s the wild assumption of wealth and privilege. Because you’re a man or a man on this site you must be a crypto millionaire?

The dude just said he was disabled. And you’re telling him to bear a cross? Holy shit.

But he must be rich! Or maybe he lost his life savings. Either way he’s dealing with more than he can handle, obviously.

The man shaming needs to stop. It’s often at it’s worst from privileged/jealous/dismissive men who can’t fathom coming from real disadvantage. Suck it up they say.

This is the kind expectation and pressure men get from other men is toxic. If they’re not successful or have problem it’s all their fault.

No.

Most of these things are a matter of bad circumstance and timing. Sure you could have made better decisions. You also could have made a lot worse decisions.

Around 50% of American men have no dad or a weak dad. A scumbag mom. Their decisions come from a place of desperation and weakness, no real support, role models, etc. Then stronger men basically shit down their throat and say suck it up crybaby-oh but in a loving supportive way...

A modicum of support from forums can be little better than scrolling Instagram and seeing jacked bodybuilders and filthy rich entrepreneurs. Just enough to delude you and make you feel inept. Maybe that’s possible if someone actually took a real personal interest in the OP life at some point instead of throwing a little rhetoric his way and calling him a crybaby.

The other side of that “responsibility coin” is asking a man who’s already at a huge disadvantage to continue to be a doormat, ATM machine, therapist, punching bag, etc. for a society that will never value, respect, or love him for the massive effort he’s putting in.

I’d argue he’s already done his duty and is worse off for it. Reaching out will continue to enable his enablers.

Time for him to be as callous and selfish as his “family”. They actually deserve and NEED to be hard nexted.

Maybe then THEY will take on some accountability and responsibly. Don’t hold your breath.

Society will reward their antisocial asshole behavior and punish the OP. It already has.

You think his kid is a happy daddy who turned his life around? He didn’t reach out to his dad. OP found out through grapevine. The kid is the same aggressive criminal he was when he assaulted him years ago. Obviously.

OP you have a responsibility to yourself. Take the well meant advice of “manning up” and apply it to yourself. All your family will want and respond to is money, chauffeur service, a babysitter, etc.

You will NOT get respect and love. They probably won’t even be polite to you in return.

OP. Be done with it. The Bible says “separate yourself from evil”.

I would say with many subjects you would be correct, but not when it comes to being a parent- especially in a case like this. A disabled Dad is actually at a huge advantage in a custody dispute, especially over time. Why? Because he can keep going to court, and back to court, and back to court again at his heart's content without needing to take time off from work. And because the court knows there is no $$ to get from him. And because he presumably has the free time to put together his case. I would never recommend a disabled Dad give up the fight- never, because of these factors.

Very very very few women have what it takes to deal with the stress and pressure of a prolonged custody battle.

The bottom line is that your council is incorrect.
 
Uh that doesn’t make sense. His kid is a grown adult.

You’re saying he should be going back to court to try and take his grandkid away from his adult son??

Yes that’s what the world needs more of. An endless custody battle of two scumbags colliding.

Battle of the scumbags. Pass the popcorn.

OP is a broken man. He’s not going to be a much better parent. He already failed his kid.

Now you want him to drag out the pain and mess up the grandkid with a War of the Roses?

Oh boy. Disagreeing resulting in being reported and a warning. This site hasn’t changed much has it?

Agree with me or be banned. Because that’s what Jesus would want.
 
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Uh that doesn’t make sense. His kid is a grown adult.

You’re saying he should be going back to court to try and take his grandkid away from his adult son??

Yes that’s what the world needs more of. An endless custody battle of two scumbags colliding.

Battle of the scumbags. Pass the popcorn.

OP is a broken man. He’s not going to be a much better parent. He already failed his kid.

Now you want him to drag out the pain and mess up the grandkid with a War of the Roses?

Oh boy. Disagreeing resulting in being reported and a warning. This site hasn’t changed much has it?

Agree with me or be banned. Because that’s what Jesus would want.
No, man. I was just suggesting that he take responsibility for not fighting for his kid in the first place. Apologizing to the kid and trying to move forward after being accountable.
 
@Heismightytosave

Have you every considered what happens if your logic is taken to it's logical end point? That end point is that millions upon millions (in the USA alone) are forgiven for assault, murder, rape, robbery and simply violence in general. Why are they forgiven, cause all they had was a welfare queen mom and that as result they can't be considered to have moral agency.

That is liberal (il)logic, all it leads to is the collapse of societies and nations. In order for civilization to endure a certain core set of standards must be expected from each and every one of it's members. It does not matter that some did not had fathers, it does not matter that some (willingly) fried their brains with drugs. There can be no excuses, if society is to live these standards must be observed, the only ones excused from them are the truly mentally impaired (aka those who didn't fry their brains with drugs).

The Japanese get it, the Chinese get it, the Koreans gets it, Russia gets it...yet we don't.
 

Based

Sparrow
A little background: son's mom and I split up back in 2003, but saw him every other weekend, holidays, and a couple of weeks in the Summer.

His mom was a helicopter parent who made sure there were no obstacles that he needed to learn to overcome himself. Never any consequences for his behavior.

When he became a teen, he fell in with a bad crowd, and mom started finding bongs and drug paraphernalia around the house. His mom would send me photos of the stuff, along with holes he punched through sheetrock in the house. She once even begged me to stay at her house to babysit him when he was 16, he was so out of control. Son said I could not stay there, and he wound up punching me in the face, so I called the police, and they charged him with assaulting me. Mom was mad that I called. Said it would ruin his life, my reply was letting it slide would ruin his life.

About 5 months later, despite living 90 miles away, she dropped him off at my house on a school night. I enrolled him in the local school, and tried to do my version of parenting. In the 8 months he stayed with me, the police was called 3 times. Shoved me once, another time threw his phone at me , and another time spat in my face, all while saying some pretty bad things at me. I have been disabled since 2003, so I wasn't about to get physical with him. The whole time he was with me, she had been messaging him several times a day telling him she wanted him back with her, which basically undermined my efforts to rein him in.

When the school term ended, he started saying he wanted to go back to live with his mom, and mom so happily agreed to take him back, that he promised to behave. "He is exactly the same kid you dropped off in November," I replied. So he left, and they returned to Mom's house, and the next week spent a week at the beach.

Friday of the next week, I got a dozen letters addressed to my son offering legal services, so I called his mom. She told me that he had been arrested Tuesday for possession of marijuana and trespassing while on vacation!!! She did not promptly inform me because she was embarrassed to admit I was right!! Got arrested in only 4 days with her!!!

Since I still had legal custody, I took a stand that he return immediately to my house, and after going easy for a couple of days, cooked some breakfast for him and asked him to do some chores. After an hour, I went to his room and he was still under the covers, almost 11am. He cussed at me, so I asked for his phone, so he cussed at me more. I went to his car to disconnect the battery to ground him when he ran out, shoved me, and punched me in the eye. The cop saw my swollen eye and charged him himself.

About two weeks after the assault, I heard a car in the driveway. Turned out it was my son's car, with a police car, as well. He came to get his things, did not call, message, or email me he was coming. Just slipping in the house and going upstairs to get his things. I visited with the same cop who arrested him for assaulting me, and after he loaded his car, then walked up to say he is sorry, like it was an afterthought. I decline to accept his apology, because if he had been sincere, he would have told me he was coming and apologized FIRST. Guess he wanted to snow over the cop and impress him.

The last time I saw him was in Juvenile court 2 years ago when he was still 17, and the judge ordered mandatory drug testing, counseling, and community service. Told him she would sentence him to a year in jail if he assaulted anyone during his probation.

Two years later, not a word from him, nor his mom. My oldest daughter keeps up with him, and she told my 91 year old mother that his GF is knocked up!!!!

If either of my daughters got pregnant in their teens, I would be more upset, but with my son, it feels more like kharma. Bet his mom is already trying to put a positive spin on things, probably getting a nursery ready.

Glad it is not my problem any longer. He made his bed, time to lie in it. I know there are other Roosh V members who have gone through the divorce machine and have had to deal with parental alienation, and there are some things you can do nothing about, so don't beat yourself up about it.
I do not agree with calling the police on your son especially as a minor. That sounds like an abdication of responsibility. He may not be your responsibility now that he is 19, and you may see his situation as karma for himself, but consider what you did to contribute to this sorry state of affairs and how this is your karma. His mother should do the same.
 
@Heismightytosave

Have you every considered what happens if your logic is taken to it's logical end point? That end point is that millions upon millions (in the USA alone) are forgiven for assault, murder, rape, robbery and simply violence in general. Why are they forgiven, cause all they had was a welfare queen mom and that as result they can't be considered to have moral agency.

That is liberal (il)logic, all it leads to is the collapse of societies and nations. In order for civilization to endure a certain core set of standards must be expected from each and every one of it's members. It does not matter that some did not had fathers, it does not matter that some (willingly) fried their brains with drugs. There can be no excuses, if society is to live these standards must be observed, the only ones excused from them are the truly mentally impaired (aka those who didn't fry their brains with drugs).

The Japanese get it, the Chinese get it, the Koreans gets it, Russia gets it...yet we don't.
Did I say that the kid has no culpability? No I did not.

Now take your insinuation and bring it to its logical end point. According to you, all children that grow into adults have an unequivocal and unambiguous responsibility to adhere to 'a certain core set of standards', regardless of circumstance. So if we take this logic to its endpoint, the relevance of a Father in a child's life is negligible. Either way, the child is fully accountable. Either way, the child is fully capable of achieving this theoretical minimum standard.

We can now take this weak and defeatist attitude and use it to justify walking away from our kid without a fight. We can use it to justify a lack of accountability to give our kids a fair shake, a lack of responsibility for using our resources to get into the fight, a lack of accountability for capitulating to 'the system'.

So you see, it is you that has the liberal milquetoast attitude- really the classic beta mindset, not me.
 

Based

Sparrow
I think so, being in my late 50s at the time, disabled, 3 fused vertebrae in my neck, chronic pain. I was seated in a chair when he punched me in the face. He thought he could do it without consequences. But he needed to discover for himself the results of poor decisions.
Did you ever try to get to the bottom of why he was so angry with you? Where was the resentment coming from?
 
I do not agree with calling the police on your son especially as a minor. That sounds like an abdication of responsibility. He may not be your responsibility now that he is 19, and you may see his situation as karma for himself, but consider what you did to contribute to this sorry state of affairs and how this is your karma. His mother should do the same.
Got that right. You can't beg the State to get involved then ask for respect from your child once you act like the State is your Daddy. I get it- OP was in a tough situation, and we all make mistakes, etc... that's not the issue. I believe that accountability is in order. And it doesn't help that OP is getting some very poor advice from some the posters on this thread.
 

bmw633

Woodpecker
Do not worry over it, the reality is the second your "wife" (read whore) divorced you the kids were doomed. Do not try to salvage that which cannot be salvaged. Let them be dead to you, strike them from your family tree and focus your efforts on getting out of the West (and to someplace saner).
I am in the Philippines, married to a really sweet woman. Here, children respect their elders, and they are shocked at how parents are treated by their kids, even as adults, in the US.

I don't wish ill on my adult kids, but the door is open, my email still works, etc., if they want to contact me.
I'll be the contrarian since you've already received e-support here. It looks like you are using your health as justification for what happened to your son, and perhaps as the reason for not being the authority figure he needed while he was acting out (and off-loading it to the police, which seems to have only made things worse). Calling the police on a child in the United States is something that single mothers do. Is there any personal responsibility you claim for how he ended up that way, starting with the relationship you had with his mom? Is it only your son and his mother's fault? Children do have two parents, not one.

You like to throw out Christian concepts, but your original post, which is all I have to go by since I don't know you, sounds like a hard-hearted man who is denying guilt and/or regret from what happened, but the fact that you posted this publicly means that you are in pain from what happened. I would consult with a priest instead of trying to analyze the situation from your own understanding of the Bible. Figure out how to make things right, as much as the willing parties allow, instead of blaming everyone. After all, you chose to have a child with his mother. If she was so bad, why did you choose her? If you put all the blame on yourself, even if it's not justified, you will start to come to a solution and reach peace with you.

Got that right. You can't beg the State to get involved then ask for respect from your child once you act like the State is your Daddy. I get it- OP was in a tough situation, and we all make mistakes, etc... that's not the issue. I believe that accountability is in order. And it doesn't help that OP is getting some very poor advice from some the posters on this thread.
If a teen is violent, and neither parent can do anything, then just what do you suggest could be done? Not doing anything for consequences only makes things worse.

When he hit me at his mom's house back when he was 16, he was the man in charge, mom had lost control of him. Whatever rules she put before him, he disregarded. The two of them live in a 6 bed McMansion, and he had no chores to do. She even had a lawn service mow the grass, with a teenage boy and a riding mower sitting in the shed!!

When he lived with me, he had chores to do at home. When he misbehaved, I did confiscate his phone, made him take the bus to school, took away his car, and grounded him at different times. I took him to counseling, paid for a Summer Adventure Bound Intervention Camp, met with teachers, etc.

He had consequences living with me. With his mom, she would tell and threaten him, the next day it was forgotten. I think he was so used to having his mom roll over to him that he thought he could do that to me, as well. Two weeks after he was arrested for assaulting me, he drove almost 90 miles to my house to get his things. Why did his mom still allow him to drive?

He told me that living at his mom's house, he went to a park and was held up at gunpoint while trying to score drugs. I wanted him out of that environment for his safety.
 
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bmw633

Woodpecker
Did you ever try to get to the bottom of why he was so angry with you? Where was the resentment coming from?
I think it was lack of respect, due to my disability. Maybe sprinkled with some parental alienation.

Before my surgery, I had a successful business, two professional degrees, went fishing in my boat regularly, played racquetball, and piloted a Cessna 172.

After the surgery, I developed chronic pain, and was prescribed Opioids that are usually reserved for cancer patients. I became a shadow of myself, my mind in a fog. He was 2 years old when I had the surgery, so he never knew the healthy me.

I strongly suspect he had been assaulting his mother for a while, but she kept it from me. I usually only heard from her if he really got out of hand. She did not want me sharing in decisions, but would tell me after the fact. If I said anything about not having a say, I was controlling. Sometimes, you cannot win.

I will be returning to US in a couple of months with my Filipina wife, so I may contact him, try to catch up and see if things can be patched up. But, it is up to him to answer. It may just roll over to voicemail.....
 
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