19 Year Old Son's GF is Pregnant, Not My Problem

If a teen is violent, and neither parent can do anything, then just what do you suggest could be done? Not doing anything for consequences only makes things worse.

When he hit me at his mom's house back when he was 16, he was the man in charge, mom had lost control of him. Whatever rules she put before him, he disregarded. The two of them live in a 6 bed McMansion, and he had no chores to do. She even had a lawn service mow the grass, with a teenage boy and a riding mower sitting in the shed!!

When he lived with me, he had chores to do at home. When he misbehaved, I did confiscate his phone, made him take the bus to school, took away his car, and grounded him at different times. I took him to counseling, paid for a Summer Adventure Bound Intervention Camp, met with teachers, etc.

He had consequences living with me. With his mom, she would tell and threaten him, the next day it was forgotten. I think he was so used to having his mom roll over to him that he thought he could do that to me, as well. Two weeks after he was arrested for assaulting me, he drove almost 90 miles to my house to get his things. Why did his mom still allow him to drive?

He told me that living at his mom's house, he went to a park and was held up at gunpoint while trying to score drugs. I wanted him out of that environment for his safety.
Before I answer, please understand, I'm very sorry you are going through this. I know how tough it is to be estranged from one's child.

So you were injured when your boy was 2? But he didn't punch you until he was 16? When did his Mom split up with you? How old was he? And again, why did you settle for seeing him only every other weekend? Trust me, I get that you got a raw shake on the way that his Mom raised him. I'm living that right now and that's tough.

I don't believe you can look at these things in a vacuum. What would I have done if he clocked me? Probably physically grab him and put the fear of God into him, I guess. I'd def respond in some manner, but not by calling the cops. That doesn't mean that you weren't trying to right by him and you...I just wouldn't have handled it that way.
 

uncledick

Woodpecker
Before I answer, please understand, I'm very sorry you are going through this. I know how tough it is to be estranged from one's child.

So you were injured when your boy was 2? But he didn't punch you until he was 16? When did his Mom split up with you? How old was he? And again, why did you settle for seeing him only every other weekend? Trust me, I get that you got a raw shake on the way that his Mom raised him. I'm living that right now and that's tough.

I don't believe you can look at these things in a vacuum. What would I have done if he clocked me? Probably physically grab him and put the fear of God into him, I guess. I'd def respond in some manner, but not by calling the cops. That doesn't mean that you weren't trying to right by him and you...I just wouldn't have handled it that way.

He apparently is physically disabled and a typical 16-17 year old guy can be pretty damn strong. I've wrested with a few of my teenage nephews and if I wasn't working out, they could've kicked my ass. Anyways it sounds like that wasn't a option whatsoever for him. He is at a clear disadvantage when it comes to physical presence or intimidation that can usually settle a wayward kid down before the fists are needed, and those "fists" aren't a option for him either.
 

bmw633

Woodpecker
Before I answer, please understand, I'm very sorry you are going through this. I know how tough it is to be estranged from one's child.

So you were injured when your boy was 2? But he didn't punch you until he was 16? When did his Mom split up with you? How old was he? And again, why did you settle for seeing him only every other weekend? Trust me, I get that you got a raw shake on the way that his Mom raised him. I'm living that right now and that's tough.

I don't believe you can look at these things in a vacuum. What would I have done if he clocked me? Probably physically grab him and put the fear of God into him, I guess. I'd def respond in some manner, but not by calling the cops. That doesn't mean that you weren't trying to right by him and you...I just wouldn't have handled it that way.
I had surgery in 2003, wife left 2 weeks after surgery when I was in a hard collar and could not drive. She came back after a couple of days, and left for good 4 months later. She believed I was faking, no empathy at all, before, during, or after the surgery.

He punched me in the face the first time when he was 16 at his mom's house after she begged me to come and keep an eye on him.

After he came to live with me was when he was 17 was the last time he punched me, while I was disconnecting his car battery to ground him for cussing at me and refusing to turn over his phone. I don't think many of you are familiar with parental abuse, but it DOES happen. One thing positive was that the judge ordered mandatory drug testing, so he had to keep his nose clean for a year, along with counseling, anger management, and community service.

No way I would attempt to go mano-mano with him, given my condition. Ten or twelve years old or younger, I might have.

In my condition after my surgery, I did not think I could care for a toddler part time, and she moved too far away to make a shared arrangement work. I think I did the best I could, given my condition.
 
I had surgery in 2003, wife left 2 weeks after surgery when I was in a hard collar and could not drive. She came back after a couple of days, and left for good 4 months later. She believed I was faking, no empathy at all, before, during, or after the surgery.

He punched me in the face the first time when he was 16 at his mom's house after she begged me to come and keep an eye on him.

After he came to live with me was when he was 17 was the last time he punched me, while I was disconnecting his car battery to ground him for cussing at me and refusing to turn over his phone. I don't think many of you are familiar with parental abuse, but it DOES happen. One thing positive was that the judge ordered mandatory drug testing, so he had to keep his nose clean for a year, along with counseling, anger management, and community service.

No way I would attempt to go mano-mano with him, given my condition. Ten or twelve years old or younger, I might have.

In my condition after my surgery, I did not think I could care for a toddler part time, and she moved too far away to make a shared arrangement work. I think I did the best I could, given my condition.
But you could care for him every other weekend? Listen, you've been through a ton and I do not want to hurt you, I just want you to maybe see where you came up short... which we all do. Why even let her move away with him in the first place? And once she did, what was going on for the 14 years between 2 and 16? That's a long time to not recoup.

My take is that you went through an incredibly traumatic time and you got floored to the canvas as a result, and it's understandable. But be honest, instead of just accepting the status quo, you could have fought harder for your boy.

By the age of 16 he had already been in his evil Mother's clutches for far too long. And I understand your decision not to go 1 on one with him. I personally would not call the cops unless there was a murder or something very very serious. But I understand why you did. I just don't think you can look at the situation in a vacuum.

I really do think you should consider very carefully what you could have done differently, and apologize to your boy for your role in things. And I really do think you should consider giving him a hand with your grandchild.

I acknowledge that your boy has made his share of mistakes as well, and that your ex is most likely a complete scumbag, so it's not all on you. And I acknowledge that your situation is particularly difficult.
 

Based

Sparrow
I think it was lack of respect, due to my disability. Maybe sprinkled with some parental alienation.

Before my surgery, I had a successful business, two professional degrees, went fishing in my boat regularly, played racquetball, and piloted a Cessna 172.

After the surgery, I developed chronic pain, and was prescribed Opioids that are usually reserved for cancer patients. I became a shadow of myself, my mind in a fog. He was 2 years old when I had the surgery, so he never knew the healthy me.

I strongly suspect he had been assaulting his mother for a while, but she kept it from me. I usually only heard from her if he really got out of hand. She did not want me sharing in decisions, but would tell me after the fact. If I said anything about not having a say, I was controlling. Sometimes, you cannot win.

I will be returning to US in a couple of months with my Filipina wife, so I may contact him, try to catch up and see if things can be patched up. But, it is up to him to answer. It may just roll over to voicemail.....
Well if your ex-wife left you after your injuries she is certainly a shameful hussy and you were mistreated there. That would have taught your son a terrible lesson about loyalty and commitment. It is strange to hear your son was so violent from a young age though. Something has gone seriously wrong. Do you think he is a born psychopath? Has he always lacked empathy and is he pathologically fearless, reckless and impulsive? In your comment above you said his mother had no empathy when you were injured. Is his mother a psychopath? If so this makes inheritance of psychopathy a greater possibility. Alternatively, did he suffer some serious trauma at a young age which wired him to become psychopathic? He sounds like he would meet for a diagnosis of Antisocial Personality Disorder. This behavior of physically attacking his parent/s is extreme and abnormal. Something must account for it. With that said he is now 19 and you are not his punching bag so he has no right to attack you now unprovoked. Do you think he would hit you now? Can you provide some insight into the questions I have asked above about his psychological profile?
 
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bmw633

Woodpecker
Well if your ex-wife left you after your injuries she is certainly a shameful hussy and you were mistreated there. That would have taught your son a terrible lesson about loyalty and commitment. It is strange to hear your son was so violent from a young age though. Something has gone seriously wrong. Do you think he is a born psychopath? Has he always lacked empathy and is he pathologically fearless, reckless and impulsive? In your comment above you said his mother had no empathy when you were injured. Is his mother a psychopath? If so this makes inheritance of psychopathy a greater possibility. Alternatively, did he suffer some serious trauma at a young age which wired him to become psychopathic? He sounds like he would meet for a diagnosis of Antisocial Personality Disorder. This behavior of physically attacking his parent/s is extreme and abnormal. Something must accounting for it. With that said he is now 19 and you are not his punching bag so he has no right to attack you now unprovoked. Do you think he would hit you now? Can you provide some insight into the questions I have asked above about his psychological profile?
His mom never followed through in counseling, out of fear he would be "labelled", which would, according to her, ruin his life. That is the same reason she got upset with me about calling the police when he attacked me at her house.

Whether he is a narcissist, BPD, sociopath, psychopath, etc., I am not completely sure, since he did not behavior problems in school. But, you have a point.

Seems like a Jekyll/Hyde personality. After assaulting me several times, he "Eddie Haskell'ed" the cops who responded to the call, even getting their business cards and email addresses. Very charming devil, my son is.

I surmise that because he was shielded from facing any conflicts at a young age, therefore having little self control or insight on conflict resolution, he becomes violent. Once, I asked him about it. He said he just loses control, and I asked him would he act the same way if a cop or school teacher was watching, and he said NO.

I was concerned that if this behavior continued, he would become violent with his wife, kids, or some other unfortunate person.
 
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Terrible situation.

All I can say is that I never saw my father so happy like when he is playing with my nine months old daughter.
At the moment, you seem to see your grandchild as a burden, but maybe you will fall in love with him/her.

So go ahead and try to visit them when you come back to the US, like you have planed.
 

Durden347

Robin
A little background: son's mom and I split up back in 2003, but saw him every other weekend, holidays, and a couple of weeks in the Summer.

His mom was a helicopter parent who made sure there were no obstacles that he needed to learn to overcome himself. Never any consequences for his behavior.

When he became a teen, he fell in with a bad crowd, and mom started finding bongs and drug paraphernalia around the house. His mom would send me photos of the stuff, along with holes he punched through sheetrock in the house. She once even begged me to stay at her house to babysit him when he was 16, he was so out of control. Son said I could not stay there, and he wound up punching me in the face, so I called the police, and they charged him with assaulting me. Mom was mad that I called. Said it would ruin his life, my reply was letting it slide would ruin his life.

About 5 months later, despite living 90 miles away, she dropped him off at my house on a school night. I enrolled him in the local school, and tried to do my version of parenting. In the 8 months he stayed with me, the police was called 3 times. Shoved me once, another time threw his phone at me , and another time spat in my face, all while saying some pretty bad things at me. I have been disabled since 2003, so I wasn't about to get physical with him. The whole time he was with me, she had been messaging him several times a day telling him she wanted him back with her, which basically undermined my efforts to rein him in.

When the school term ended, he started saying he wanted to go back to live with his mom, and mom so happily agreed to take him back, that he promised to behave. "He is exactly the same kid you dropped off in November," I replied. So he left, and they returned to Mom's house, and the next week spent a week at the beach.

Friday of the next week, I got a dozen letters addressed to my son offering legal services, so I called his mom. She told me that he had been arrested Tuesday for possession of marijuana and trespassing while on vacation!!! She did not promptly inform me because she was embarrassed to admit I was right!! Got arrested in only 4 days with her!!!

Since I still had legal custody, I took a stand that he return immediately to my house, and after going easy for a couple of days, cooked some breakfast for him and asked him to do some chores. After an hour, I went to his room and he was still under the covers, almost 11am. He cussed at me, so I asked for his phone, so he cussed at me more. I went to his car to disconnect the battery to ground him when he ran out, shoved me, and punched me in the eye. The cop saw my swollen eye and charged him himself.

About two weeks after the assault, I heard a car in the driveway. Turned out it was my son's car, with a police car, as well. He came to get his things, did not call, message, or email me he was coming. Just slipping in the house and going upstairs to get his things. I visited with the same cop who arrested him for assaulting me, and after he loaded his car, then walked up to say he is sorry, like it was an afterthought. I decline to accept his apology, because if he had been sincere, he would have told me he was coming and apologized FIRST. Guess he wanted to snow over the cop and impress him.

The last time I saw him was in Juvenile court 2 years ago when he was still 17, and the judge ordered mandatory drug testing, counseling, and community service. Told him she would sentence him to a year in jail if he assaulted anyone during his probation.

Two years later, not a word from him, nor his mom. My oldest daughter keeps up with him, and she told my 91 year old mother that his GF is knocked up!!!!

If either of my daughters got pregnant in their teens, I would be more upset, but with my son, it feels more like kharma. Bet his mom is already trying to put a positive spin on things, probably getting a nursery ready.

Glad it is not my problem any longer. He made his bed, time to lie in it. I know there are other Roosh V members who have gone through the divorce machine and have had to deal with parental alienation, and there are some things you can do nothing about, so don't beat yourself up about it.
Hopefully he learns something after being a parent himself... Kharma...
 

scorpion

Hummingbird
Gold Member
Seems like a Jekyll/Hyde personality. After assaulting me several times, he "Eddie Haskell'ed" the cops who responded to the call, even getting their business cards and email addresses. Very charming devil, my son is.

I think this is the most revealing piece of information the OP has shared. It indicates that his son is very likely a psychopath. Even if the OP had been father of the year his son would still be demonstrating significant antisocial tendencies, though likely not to his current level. Every boy who grows up without a father in his home is damaged to some degree, but the vast majority of them don't physically batter their parents in response. Boys without strong father figures might get into petty crime or drugs, join a gang, get into fights at school, rebel against their teachers or totally check out and lose themselves in video games. Those are the more typical reactions to lacking a father. Physically assaulting your own mother and disabled father is clearly next level. The son seems to completely lack a conscience. The fact that he can engage in such behavior and then turn on the charm as soon as the cops show up demonstrates that he isn't just a hothead who loses control when he gets angry. He is a straight up psychopath with evil in his heart.

OP, it is a difficult thing but if I were you I would completely cut your son out of your life. Pray for him every day. If he is to be redeemed in this life or the next it will be entirely God's work. There is nothing more you can do for him.
 
Kid sounds like a loser. No mention of a job but he had a car in the driveway.... Who pays for that? Mommy? Not only is he a loser who doesn't respect his father but he's a spoiled brat as well. Hopefully you can patch it up with him in his late 20s when he grows the fk up
 

NoFunInAus

Kingfisher
I had surgery in 2003, wife left 2 weeks after surgery when I was in a hard collar and could not drive. She came back after a couple of days, and left for good 4 months later. She believed I was faking, no empathy at all, before, during, or after the surgery.

He punched me in the face the first time when he was 16 at his mom's house after she begged me to come and keep an eye on him.

After he came to live with me was when he was 17 was the last time he punched me, while I was disconnecting his car battery to ground him for cussing at me and refusing to turn over his phone. I don't think many of you are familiar with parental abuse, but it DOES happen. One thing positive was that the judge ordered mandatory drug testing, so he had to keep his nose clean for a year, along with counseling, anger management, and community service.

No way I would attempt to go mano-mano with him, given my condition. Ten or twelve years old or younger, I might have.

In my condition after my surgery, I did not think I could care for a toddler part time, and she moved too far away to make a shared arrangement work. I think I did the best I could, given my condition.

A lot of "he's and she's", not much reflection.

How often do you attend Church, if at all?
 

bmw633

Woodpecker
A question to OP here, is there anything you think you could have done different (besides having kids with the wrong woman)?
Vasectomy? The thing that had me fooled about the mom was that her parents were really great folks, married until the mom died. Very active in their church. My wife, on the other hand, had her issues, masked under a "SHY" facade.


A lot of "he's and she's", not much reflection.

How often do you attend Church, if at all?
I guess I might not be a Stephen King, and for that, I apologize.

With CV19 restrictions, none. You?
 

Pangloss

Pigeon
I think it was lack of respect, due to my disability. Maybe sprinkled with some parental alienation.
His mom never followed through in counseling, out of fear he would be "labelled", which would, according to her, ruin his life. That is the same reason she got upset with me about calling the police when he attacked me at her house.
I surmise that because he was shielded from facing any conflicts at a young age, therefore having little self control or insight on conflict resolution, he becomes violent. Once, I asked him about it. He said he just loses control, and I asked him would he act the same way if a cop or school teacher was watching, and he said NO.
Seems like you don't have the full story from your son's perspective. Having an unstable environment as a child (divorce, father being disabled) was most likely traumatic for him and must have had a long-lasting impact. There may be a number of things affecting him that you're completely unaware of.

If he wasn't able to properly express how he felt, and no one cared to dig a little deeper, I imagine he has quite a few unresolved issues. Maybe he has a psychological problem, or maybe he was unable to process his own experiences and felt like no one really cared? If people are in pain they generally become defeated and depressed or lash out to express it to others in the only way they know how. He probably won't understand the effects of his childhood on his own behaviour until he's much older, if at all.

He punched me in the face the first time when he was 16 at his mom's house after she begged me to come and keep an eye on him.
No way I would attempt to go mano-mano with him, given my condition. Ten or twelve years old or younger, I might have.
It sounds like it hurt your pride that your son was able to assault you and that you weren't able to hurt him back; that you're pleased he's now suffering "consequences". This is natural I suppose, and clearly his behaviour was wrong, but holding on to spite or bitterness won't help you, and won't help you communicate with him if that's what you want.

Impossible to know how the situation ended up as it did, but if you want help him or your grandchild, perhaps it's best to start with forgiveness and see your son not as an enemy, but as a 19-year old child who's in a bad situation. It's not your problem, but it's going to be his for a long time, so if he's not a genuinely bad person I hope he gets the support (emotional and otherwise) he needs from someone to improve his life.
 
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OP -

You will never be happy no matter how right you are proven.

If you are 100% right, then what is the point in wasting your efforts arguing with other people that you are actually right? They may never see the truth, especially if you are dealing with emotionally invested people.

You will never be happy no matter how right you are proven, because your being right in this case is that your son is irredeemable, bad to the core and just needs to be seen as that and punished as such.

You are invested in proving others fault and how bad others are. Maybe you are right but while you take this stance you will never find any resolution or any peace.

The only thing that will bring you peace is accepting what people are like and accepting it. If your son is the demon seed then that's how he is.. I would focus on your future relationship with, or just the well-being of, your grand child.

Try and get some distance from the wife and your son and try and be as straight forward as you can be about what you want for your grand child and set about achieving that, no matter how humble the results that you can achieve may be.

Sorry to say but as someone who has had life changing injuries and refused to let it affect him and who knows many people with fused spinal vertebrae who have nonetheless gone on to get to the very top of their chosen sports I have to say the way you write about your disability sounds alarm bells. Hey, I could be wrong but you are coming across as clinging to victimhood as well as being petty and vindictive.

And who wouldn't be in your situation? These things take a toll..

You need to find a way to deal with this storm of excrement that has hit your life as you must be in a lot of pain and heart ache underneath it all.
You need to find a way to deal with that privately and some kind of resolution in the way you want to help/get to know your grandchild going forward.

This is a long battle/ journey that lies ahead of you.

Part of that journey is finding a bit of fun, friendship, sweetness and goodness in your life away from strangers on the internet/ these painful family problems.
 

Feyoder

Kingfisher
You are the father and HUGELY, OBVIOUSLY, responsible for the man. And yes, your grandson is your problem (just your ability to even express this sentiment gives me a clue to the behavior of the son).

The rules of this forum don't allow me to truly express my opinion about you.
 
I'm still not seeing an explanation of why you allowed your Ex to move away with your Son. Then once she did, why you didn't do something about it from age 2-16.?

As to your Ex, she sounds like a truly evil and damaged person. Is it any wonder that your Son turned out with major issues? I suggest checking out this article by Shari Shreiber. If you married a borderline waif, as I did in my 1st marriage, you most likely have a lot of trauma to recover from. Your comment on her being shy was a tipoff for me:


By the way, as to your Exes parents- what did they have to say about your Ex leaving as soon as you got sick/injured? What did they have to say about your Ex moving away with your Son?

It seems to me that there is a 14 year gap in your story that you are avoiding facing. I'm going to add you to prayer list, there seems to be a lot to unpack here.
 
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mgill0600

Pigeon
I understand the idea of telling men to be strong, taking on as much responsibility as possible, and not making excuses.

To a degree that’s fine advice as it pertains to your own actions. But a lot of the guys on here have put themselves in compromised positions in life by blindly following that logic.

I know it’s well meant. But some of you are literally asking the OP to go back to being a punching bag. Literally.

You sound like women in the MeToo Movement immediately blaming him because he’s a man yet paradoxically siding with his abusers.

People like his son and ex rarely change. They may turn to jesus. They’re not going to treat him much better emotionally or financially.

As you point out, his role as a man is to take on total responsibility. Then open his mouth—not to speak—but to eat more shit.

Then there’s the wild assumption of wealth and privilege. Because you’re a man or a man on this site you must be a crypto millionaire?

The dude just said he was disabled. And you’re telling him to bear a cross? Holy shit.

But he must be rich! Or maybe he lost his life savings. Either way he’s dealing with more than he can handle, obviously.

The man shaming needs to stop. It’s often at it’s worst from privileged/jealous/dismissive men who can’t fathom coming from real disadvantage. Suck it up they say.

This is the kind expectation and pressure men get from other men is toxic. If they’re not successful or have problem it’s all their fault.

No.

Most of these things are a matter of bad circumstance and timing. Sure you could have made better decisions. You also could have made a lot worse decisions.

Around 50% of American men have no dad or a weak dad. A scumbag mom. Their decisions come from a place of desperation and weakness, no real support, role models, etc. Then stronger men basically shit down their throat and say suck it up crybaby-oh but in a loving supportive way...

A modicum of support from forums can be little better than scrolling Instagram and seeing jacked bodybuilders and filthy rich entrepreneurs. Just enough to delude you and make you feel inept. Maybe that’s possible if someone actually took a real personal interest in the OP life at some point instead of throwing a little rhetoric his way and calling him a crybaby.

The other side of that “responsibility coin” is asking a man who’s already at a huge disadvantage to continue to be a doormat, ATM machine, therapist, punching bag, etc. for a society that will never value, respect, or love him for the massive effort he’s putting in.

I’d argue he’s already done his duty and is worse off for it. Reaching out will continue to enable his enablers.

Time for him to be as callous and selfish as his “family”. They actually deserve and NEED to be hard nexted.

Maybe then THEY will take on some accountability and responsibly. Don’t hold your breath.

Society will reward their antisocial asshole behavior and punish the OP. It already has.

You think his kid is a happy daddy who turned his life around? He didn’t reach out to his dad. OP found out through grapevine. The kid is the same aggressive criminal he was when he assaulted him years ago. Obviously.

OP you have a responsibility to yourself. Take the well meant advice of “manning up” and apply it to yourself. All your family will want and respond to is money, chauffeur service, a babysitter, etc.

You will NOT get respect and love. They probably won’t even be polite to you in return.

OP. Be done with it. The Bible says “separate yourself from evil”.
You guys harping on OP need to read this again. He didn't abandon his son, sure maybe he didn't do EVERYTHING he could have but have none of you seen families where the children are out of control? I've seen it multiple times in my own extended family, whether both parents are there or only 1, sometimes the ONLY thing you can do is let the child go fuck their life up and figure it out on their own. It's sad and terrible but just like trying to save a drowning man if you don't let go they'll pull you down with them. Pray OP's son matures and sees the error of his ways, not that OP step up or own his failures.

Comes here for support and gets a beating...shame on you Christians in here berating this disabled man who from what I can tell did the best he knew how, which may not have equated to the best some of you would have given, but it was THE BEST HE COULD GIVE.
 
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