A Honeymoon From Hell

What caused my now estranged "Orthodox" wife to act the way she did?

  • Being in immigration jail for half a day (my Father's pick)

    Votes: 1 2.8%
  • It was pre-planned - likely a lover (wife's version)

    Votes: 21 58.3%
  • Something else? please elaborate

    Votes: 17 47.2%

  • Total voters
    36

Philosopher

Kingfisher
Orthodox
Fellow RVFers/ big and little brothers, here is why I have been missing from the forum for a while. As you may remember, I tied the knot (under Caesar) with my on and off again girlfriend in December of 2020 (engaged since the summer). This May had something happen that I still cannot quite wrap my head around. Will try to keep it brief with maximum detail and as I had asked for help in prior times - I am turning again to my God fearing brothers to help make sense of what happened. Can elaborate later if necessary.

So she arrived from Russia to a different terminal than I had and was detained by the Mexican immigration authorities. She called my Mother as she was being detained and had her cell confiscated. My parents informed me that she was detained by immigration authorities. I contacted the Russian consulate and was informed that the Mexican authorities thought it was a case of human trafficking as she said she was coming to see "her friend" and that the address of the hotel "was a surprise" which was standard MO for sex traffickers in Mexico. After about six hours of communicating with the Consul and sending them the Marriage cert and hotel reservations - the Mexicans finally released her, though the airlines put her luggage in storage. She was happy to see me initially and hugged me and rubbed my shoulders a little on the way.

She said she was under stress and in the hotel we ended up with separate beds since I was late as a result of all BS with immigration, I lost the Honeymoon suite for 3 days. After she took a shower, I tried to kiss her but she said to please not "be intimate tonight" due to stress. Later in the night we held hands but I did not escalate. Later she went to the lobby to make a phone call. My mother later told me that she called her and my wife cried the whole time saying that she flew to Mexico "to break up with me."

Day 2: In the morning, we went to breakfast - she presented me with 3 ultimatums.

1) We are "friends"
2) I want a separate room ($1500 with me only having $2000 left for the trip)
3) I want a flight back to Russia

I stonewalled her at first - playing the Alpha Man to ignore her request. Wanted for us to take some photos together (requirement by USCIS for a spousal visa) as I took the scenic ride with her in my rental yet she refused. She stated that she wanted to hang out in the Hard Rock Cafe later. She tried to bring up the "friends" thing again and I said I would make her walk, which shut her up. Next, we drove back to the airport to unsuccessfully retreat her baggage but Turkish airlines were closed.

When we drove back, she asked on getting some dark wine and local SIMS, I obliged. Later, I invited her to go to a romantic restaurant on stilts, she refused. The water ocean was stormy so we could not swim so just walked alongside the sea. I began enjoying some cocktails in the pool instead while she was on her phone taking selfies. I gave her my shirt to wear at night as she had none of her own (they were in the luggage) she said that she was going to talk to a psychologist at night. She complained about the room as it had some shoddy masonry as the bathroom door was too big for the frame and would not close and the balcony was on the side of the road and the master Air Duct rather than the ocean. I was pretty annoyed and was happy to let her leave. As the hotel gave only one key, she later knocked to let her back in, my attempts at a kiss proved unfruitful.

Day 3: We drove to the airport again. The parking there was by the hour so I was annoyed when after we got the luggage - she still wanted to remain to "talk" with the company. I assumed that she was going to talk about a return ticket so I told her that she could take her own taxi. Went to have lunch at a casino and she called me as I was having a Siesta back at the hotel - begging to pick her up as she could not afford a taxi. I made her be polite before taking my time to pick her up. As we drove back, she talked about us having separate rooms and her needing her own space and that we would only see each other during the day - I sarcastically joked that "I only want to see her at night." Trying to make peace, she said that "one of the reasons she came here was to see me" I let her off easy and said I appreciate it. Asked her out to the restaurant on stilts again but she refused and said she would prefer to go to the beach.

Back at the hotel, the staff said I could upgrade to the Honeymoon suite and it was a King sized bed with a view of the pool. My "wife" refused immediately and asked me if I want to discuss it. Still being the Alpha - I refused to discuss and she went to the lobby with her luggage as I stayed in the room. Feeling the relief of not having to deal with all her nagging, I enjoyed watching soccer. A few hours later, a member of hotel staff (dude in his 30s) came to the room and said "my friend" said I promised her a separate room. I told him that it was my wife and not my friend, he apologized and suggested I try to make peace with her which is what I did.

Stepping over my own pride, I get my "wife" her favorite wine and come to the lobby to offer her a walk on the beach - saying I want to make peace. She reluctantly agreed and as we walked on the stormy beach I said that I understand her need to talk and she repeated the three points in a "nice" way and I refused to respond saying that tonight I am just listening and letting her vent. She touched my shoulder, thinking she was consoling me - I took the opportunity to passionately kiss her. She pulled away and acted offended saying that "I am rushing things." I offered another round, she refused saying that she is still on Moscow time and wanted to call her shrink again.

We went back to my room where she took a shower, I put on some romantic music and enjoyed her fashion show. She started complaining again that I was not being serious and that why did I come to her to the lobby to make peace. I told her that was then and now is the time to enjoy music. She put on her yoga pants and hat and said that talking to me was like talking to a wall. I joked that she should try to teach the wall the alphabet and algebra. She asked why did I ever pick her up 8 years ago, I said that she looked cute and that I would have felt guilty before God if I let the opportunity go. She said that she was leaving and I said good riddance.

PS: I felt relief and I chilled with the locals and some Brits. The next morning, I saw her in a beach chair and walked past her for breakfast. She eventually left to another hotel as I went to a museum. After a few days, I asked her if she was alive and if she wanted to meet - she refused. I had fun on my own, sightseeing and fornicating. A week later, I found a beach far away to enjoy and she offered to meet in a mall. I though I would never hear from her again so I rushed to meet her but she tried to control the frame by saying "she is short on time" and that I was an asshole for making her wait in the lobby all night long. I countered by saying that I thought that she wanted to be alone. She continued complaining and I just said that this was all just a tactic - she disrespected me by sating it was a bad tactic and that she was about to leave.

I enjoyed the rest of my trip, seeing the Mayan pyramids. Later, my "wife" said she had nothing to eat, I offered to help when we met, but she insisted that I pay for half of the hotel ($700 out of $1,500) that she paid. I refused and blocked her (as soon as she messaged me that I "harassed her" as I returned to the States.) Unblocked her on my birthday (2 weeks later ) and she apologized. When she returned to Russia and started begging for rent money (she spent all her saving on her own hotel) and again and I said that I only give money to my relatives. She angrily responded that I "promised" to which I answered that I would only help with food but that I would not be a cuck and pay for her "crazy actions" of getting another hotel. Whoever she was sleeping with could pay instead. This hit too close to home for her and she said that I don't have to pay if I do not want to as "she was not my wife." In other words - in full denial. She even said that she changed her mind about marrying me a month after marriage, before we met each other's families! Did she lose her mind or was she LARPING?

Finally, she corresponded with my mother. Than my uncle, in June, went to be with God after a stroke - I offered my wife to give my mom (his sister) condolences and that was the end of communication.

It has not been two months and I am still trying to make sense of what happened so I put up a poll.

I am grateful to God for saving me from an unhappy marriage as I know that I got off easy before I had kids with this girl who clearly was not ready despite the kind words she said in the past. I think I understand better now how Roosh felt about the woman that he wanted to "wife up"

All comments, criticisms and suggestions are appreciated. Do not let my story discourage any of you from making a family under God.
 
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MartyMcFly

Woodpecker
You were way too nice. I wouldn't have given her a dime for a separate room and gave her the choice of sleeping in the same room or using her own money to pay for her own room. Due to the lack of a romantic feeling, I would have taken her to a budget restaurant and paid for her food (I am not mean enough to make her go without food but it will be basic) and if she were behaving rudely, I would get takeaway, or just give her a small amount to get her own tacos and quesadillas, to avoid unpleasant scenes in the restaurant. If she was still acting awful, I would tell her I am going to a different city and ask is she wants to join. If she refused, I would head out of town and let her sort out her situation.

I wouldn't pay for her flight back considering I already paid for her flight there. Let her get help from the Russian consulate. Maybe I am a bit vengeful but it is easy to be cold to someone that is cold to me first. If she wants to play tough, I am happy to play tough as well. Maybe I am too cynical.

At least you didn't beg her to stay and you ended things quickly and you were fairly tough to her (but not as tough as you should have been). Good riddance. She is trouble.
 

Philosopher

Kingfisher
Orthodox
You were way too nice. I wouldn't have given her a dime for a separate room and gave her the choice of sleeping in the same room or using her own money to pay for her own room. Due to the lack of a romantic feeling, I would have taken her to a budget restaurant and paid for her food (I am not mean enough to make her go without food but it will be basic) and if she were behaving rudely, I would get takeaway, or just give her a small amount to get her own tacos and quesadillas, to avoid unpleasant scenes in the restaurant. If she was still acting awful, I would tell her I am going to a different city and ask is she wants to join. If she refused, I would head out of town and let her sort out her situation.

I wouldn't pay for her flight back considering I already paid for her flight there. Let her get help from the Russian consulate. Maybe I am a bit vengeful but it is easy to be cold to someone that is cold to me first. If she wants to play tough, I am happy to play tough as well. Maybe I am too cynical.

At least you didn't beg her to stay and you ended things quickly and you were fairly tough to her (but not as tough as you should have been). Good riddance. She is trouble.
Thanks, when she was begging me a week later, I made it clear that I would only give her a little for food but the hotel would always be on her. The moment she ran away- she took full responsibility. On Day 4 she paid 1500 for her own room wherever she went.

She tried to play the victim and say "that I promised to help her and knew she did not have much cash" I suppose after she left I felt a little was willing to try being nice kind of like throwing darts at the wall. Thanks for confirming it was a mistake. Disrespect should not be tolerated even after time has passed.

Thankfully, the Mexicans and other tourists gave me the companionship I missed. I even went to see the Mayan pyramids on my own. I guess that was going to a different city (200 miles) and I did let her know by text.

I was considering canceling her flight back (it was pre-paid) but I guess I feared the legal consequences if she ended up getting sold into sex slavery (most likely) once she ran out of money.
 
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ginsu

Kingfisher
my answer is something else": she just wasn't that into you

how did you end up planning a honeymoon with someone like this ?, you didnt see any red flags ?.

Its just my guess that there were red flags but you really wanted to make it work and so kept skipping by them already before this honeymoon. I say this because of the parts where you say she was uncooperative or straight out letting you know she wants to end it but you try to push on with your plan ( being alpha ).
 
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unit414

Robin
Not sure what to make of this. Or you. All the references to God, yet talking about having fun "fornicating" down in Mexico with someone or someones who were not your wife, as well as "intimacy" with the Russian chick "on and off," in Russia apparently. Not saying I'm perfect, but I sure wasn't invoking the name of God in my fornication days, which for you was as recently as May.

Were you two not together between getting married in Dec., and the Mexico get-together in May?? If so, why?

You handled her antics in Mexico pretty well, pretty Alpha, but either she hid her craziness well, or you married someone you really didn't know.
Why did you break up with the first fiancee? Also gotta ask, are you a native English speaker? Doesn't matter, just curious.

Your Russian "wife" was definitely not good marriage material. But are you?
 

Philosopher

Kingfisher
Orthodox
my answer is something else": she just wasn't that into you

how did you end up planning a honeymoon with someone like this ?, you didnt see any red flags ?.

Its just my guess that there were red flags but you really wanted to make it work and so kept skipping by them already before this honeymoon. I say this because of the parts where you say she was uncooperative or straight out letting you know she wants to end it but you try to push on with your plan ( being alpha ).
Yeah you are right, I ignored them out of a scarcity mindset of wanting to get married and already having invested too much into the relationship as we were already married and met each other's parents. Some of the were

-"I do not want to be a housewife"
-"You cannot tell me what to do like yoga or fitness"
-Trying to postpone the honeymoon
-Favorite TV show being the degenerate "Grey's Anatomy"
-Saying she wants to adapt to American culture

-Last one was Day 2 at the Honeymoon when she said that "Feminism is good and has erased all stereotypes."

I took a risk and don't blame anyone but myself. Figured I could train her. Guess gambling is my weakness.
 

ginsu

Kingfisher
But than why go through the whole song and dance of marriage and meeting parents? But yeah - women's emotions are fickle. She just ignored the legal implication.
Where you tempting her with your wallet ?, have you supported her financially or was her begging for rent money the first time. Could be she was under peer pressure to marry, could be she wanted into america but later changed her mind. It doesnt matter the answer is always the same, no genuine desire to be with you its the harsh truth.

Now that you know you can take steps to prevent it next time, improve your own value/game maybe lower the expectations for the woman ( not typically hot/crazy ) but increase your standards for behavior at the same time. if you come across ANY resistance just leave. someone who wants to be with you will make it as easy as possible. Don't try to force it like you did with this girl on the trip.

6 hours at the airport is nothing, get to the point where the girl would spend a month quarantined just to honeymoon with you. Honestly without that kind of commitment there is no point to get married and if even doubt the girl would do that for you without blinking an eye then its not worth it. Thats why i said work on yourself and at the same time lower expectations for the typical smv of the girl until you reach a point where her behavior towards you is 100% and you trust her with your life.
 
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SingularityOne

Robin
Orthodox
But than why go through the whole song and dance of marriage and meeting parents? But yeah - women's emotions are fickle. She just ignored the legal implication.
Just went through something similar. Confusion stemming from the “why go through the whole song and dance of marriage and meeting parents?” question. It’s hard to struggle with because it seems so irrational. But I think you’re right... it sounds like this woman wasn’t to be trusted due to the red flags. I can understand wanting things to work out, but (not sure if you are Christian or not...) God’s Providence rules in this situation. I think you’re lucky it ended so that you didn’t have to suffer more than you already did.

Great book on God’s Providence: https://www.amazon.com/Sunflower-Conforming-Will-Man-God/dp/0884654605

A quote from this book that hits home for me (serendipitously I just read it today as I was going through the book again) that gives me some semblance of peace is: “The ancients had the habit of writing the following maxim on their walls: “Whoever consecrates his work to God will live peacefully and without cares on earth, and in eternal life he will be blessed.” What does it mean to consecrate our work to God? This means that we must accept that everything we encounter happens by the will or permission of God, and so we must thank God for it. Do we receive good things? We receive them from God’s hand. Do we receive evil? This is allowed by God to make us wiser. Let us thank God for the former and the latter! To accept everything as coming from God’s hand, or as occurring by His disposal, is a general rule with no exceptions. It is so universal that not only external, societal calamities, troubles, and sorrows but even inner troubles coming from our confusion or sins must be accepted by each person with gratitude, for “we know that all things work together for good to those who love God” (Romans 8:28).”

There is a lot of mystery as to the “reasons” why things like this happen. But, it happened for a reason and I’m not sure that I can give anything other than this to help with the confusion.

I would say that I would have struggled with letting go of her if I was attached to her like it sounds like you were. I get it. But, she showed you so much disrespect that letting her go and doing your own thing makes sense. I wouldn’t have paid for her as much as you did given the disrespect I read here. If she said she wanted to be friends, then I would have responded with confusion to put the ball in her court given she said she wanted marriage and met your family to put the onus on her. It sounds like she didn’t want to continue the relationship and thankfully (like another person said here) you didn’t beg. I begged in my situation and I regret it.

Lord have mercy. This is confusingly hard brother. Hope this is helpful.

Edit: You attract your reflection.
 

Philosopher

Kingfisher
Orthodox
Not sure what to make of this. Or you. All the references to God, yet talking about having fun "fornicating" down in Mexico with someone or someones who were not your wife, as well as "intimacy" with the Russian chick "on and off," in Russia apparently. Not saying I'm perfect, but I sure wasn't invoking the name of God in my fornication days, which for you was as recently as May.

Were you two not together between getting married in Dec., and the Mexico get-together in May?? If so, why?

You handled her antics in Mexico pretty well, pretty Alpha, but either she hid her craziness well, or you married someone you really didn't know.
Why did you break up with the first fiancee? Also, gotta ask... are you a native English speaker?

Your Russian "wife" was definitely not good marriage material. But are you?
I have not communed and have done my confession since May.
We could not be together between Dec and MAy because she did not have her US spousal visa yet.

The first fiancee just got tired of waiting for her visa and refused to go to the US consulate in Russia for her Visa interview. Her official reason was that "I travel too much (military)." Miss my first fiance now. No, I am not a native English speaker but have lived in the States since I was 10.

Good question about me being good marriage material - If I was absolutely sure, would not have posted this. Ready for a penance. Helping my church cook food for the Greek festival and did some volunteer work for Independence Day. Listened to some psychology lesson. I would like to think I would respect a wife who would respect me. Adult to adult instead of the PUA games I used to play. You'all do know how rare women who don't play games are.
 

MartyMcFly

Woodpecker
Thanks, when she was begging me a week later, I made it clear that I would only give her a little for food but the hotel would always be on her. The moment she ran away- she took full responsibility. On Day 4 she paid 1500 for her own room wherever she went.

She tried to play the victim and say "that I promised to help her and knew she did not have much cash" I suppose after she left I felt a little was willing to try being nice kind of like throwing darts at the wall. Thanks for confirming it was a mistake. Disrespect should not be tolerated even after time has passed.

Thankfully, the Mexicans and other tourists gave me the companionship I missed. I even went to see the Mayan pyramids on my own. I guess that was going to a different city (200 miles) and I did let her know by text.

I was considering canceling her flight back (it was pre-paid) but I guess I feared the legal consequences if she ended up getting sold into sex slavery (most likely) once she ran out of money.
I didn't know the flight was already paid for. I would not have cancelled it in that case as well because at the time it was paid for things were OK. It is like taking back a gift that was given during good times. Your reasoning makes sense and I didn't think about the fact that Mexico is a dangerous country.

You actually didn't waste too much time which is good. Three days is not a long time and the trip to the pyramids is a nice way to take a mental break from the stress.

Russian women seem risky overall considering their high divorce rates. I think the only reason it is a good idea to date/marry a woman from there is if you permanently live there or live in a former USSR state.
 

Philosopher

Kingfisher
Orthodox
Where you tempting her with your wallet ?, have you supported her financially or was her begging for rent money the first time
Second time. I helped her out in April as her landlady thought that she would not come back from her Honeymoon and asked her for advance payment. So yes, I did use it for leverage as she informed me that she has almost no money ($1600)
 

Philosopher

Kingfisher
Orthodox
I didn't know the flight was already paid for. I would not have cancelled it in that case as well because at the time it was paid for things were OK. It is like taking back a gift that was given during good times. Your reasoning makes sense and I didn't think about the fact that Mexico is a dangerous country.

You actually didn't waste too much time which is good. Three days is not a long time and the trip to the pyramids is a nice way to take a mental break from the stress.

Russian women seem risky overall considering their high divorce rates. I think the only reason it is a good idea to date/marry a woman from there is if you permanently live there or live in a former USSR state.
I used to live there 5 years ago but got tired of living paycheck to paycheck despite it being a "P" paradise.
 

Philosopher

Kingfisher
Orthodox
Just went through something similar. Confusion stemming from the “why go through the whole song and dance of marriage and meeting parents?” question. It’s hard to struggle with because it seems so irrational. But I think you’re right... it sounds like this woman wasn’t to be trusted due to the red flags. I can understand wanting things to work out, but (not sure if you are Christian or not...) God’s Providence rules in this situation. I think you’re lucky it ended so that you didn’t have to suffer more than you already did.

Great book on God’s Providence: https://www.amazon.com/Sunflower-Conforming-Will-Man-God/dp/0884654605

A quote from this book that hits home for me (serendipitously I just read it today as I was going through the book again) that gives me some semblance of peace is: “The ancients had the habit of writing the following maxim on their walls: “Whoever consecrates his work to God will live peacefully and without cares on earth, and in eternal life he will be blessed.” What does it mean to consecrate our work to God? This means that we must accept that everything we encounter happens by the will or permission of God, and so we must thank God for it. Do we receive good things? We receive them from God’s hand. Do we receive evil? This is allowed by God to make us wiser. Let us thank God for the former and the latter! To accept everything as coming from God’s hand, or as occurring by His disposal, is a general rule with no exceptions. It is so universal that not only external, societal calamities, troubles, and sorrows but even inner troubles coming from our confusion or sins must be accepted by each person with gratitude, for “we know that all things work together for good to those who love God” (Romans 8:28).”

There is a lot of mystery as to the “reasons” why things like this happen. But, it happened for a reason and I’m not sure that I can give anything other than this to help with the confusion.

I would say that I would have struggled with letting go of her if I was attached to her like it sounds like you were. I get it. But, she showed you so much disrespect that letting her go and doing your own thing makes sense. I wouldn’t have paid for her as much as you did given the disrespect I read here. If she said she wanted to be friends, then I would have responded with confusion to put the ball in her court given she said she wanted marriage and met your family to put the onus on her. It sounds like she didn’t want to continue the relationship and thankfully (like another person said here) you didn’t beg. I begged in my situation and I regret it.

Lord have mercy. This is confusingly hard brother. Hope this is helpful.

Edit: You attract your reflection.
Thanks for the kindness. I did try to bringing up the fact that we were married yet she said "documents mean nothing!" Would love to hear details about your own experience Brother.
 

unit414

Robin
I have not communed and have done my confession since May.
We could not be together between Dec and MAy because she did not have her US spousal visa yet.

The first fiancee just got tired of waiting for her visa and refused to go to the US consulate in Russia for her Visa interview. Her official reason was that "I travel too much (military)." Miss my first fiance now. No, I am not a native English speaker but have lived in the States since I was 10.

Good question about me being good marriage material - If I was absolutely sure, would not have posted this. Ready for a penance. Helping my church cook food for the Greek festival and did some volunteer work for Independence Day. Listened to some psychology lesson. I would like to think I would respect a wife who would respect me. Adult to adult instead of the PUA games I used to play. You'all do know how rare women who don't play games are.
Thanks for the explanation and candor. You're growing. And have much potential. Keep it up. I speak as a husband, dad, and now granddad.
 

SingularityOne

Robin
Orthodox
Thanks for the kindness. I did try to bringing up the fact that we were married yet she said "documents mean nothing!" Would love to hear details about your own experience Brother.
I’ll post about my experience when I get more time. I’m having some people over and don’t have time to respond as well as I’d like to at the moment.

If you go into my post history you may see some of it. Mine was related to her past with rape, not being over seas/Russian/etc.
 

Philosopher

Kingfisher
Orthodox
I’ll post about my experience when I get more time. I’m having some people over and don’t have time to respond as well as I’d like to at the moment.

If you go into my post history you may see some of it. Mine was related to her past with rape, not being over seas/Russian/etc.
No worries, get to it whenever you have time. I only know that my wife had one ex previously which probably means 10. But yeah, it is difficult to find women who are undamaged.
 

fortyfive

Woodpecker
Your story brought me back memories from the past when I was dealing with the similar craziness of my then GF.
What was worse, at that time, I had no idea about women's psyche and also thought she was a unicorn, and I only need to be patient and more attentive, and everything would be alright.
Of course, it didn't work.

Approaching reasonably to crazy people doesn't work. You can't cure someone's mental disorder by satisfying his demands and by tolerating his crazy actions. Also, no time will heal it. There is no remedy for craziness. (except God's intervention).

I'm not a proponent of leaving the boat when a storm will come, but some boats you will be forced to leave anyway.

Even when you will keep trying, there will come a time when you become tired of it. Constantly. You will begin to ask yourself, what is the point of it.

And one day, there won't be a single reason to maintaining it anymore.
There would be a pity and sorrow why it ended this way, but no reason to continue.

My advice is, either way, don't fall into some extreme behavior after a crash. Don't start wild fornication or hating women or doing any crazy stuff because you would feel that you have the right to act crazy too because you were wronged.

There is no right to live as a sinner, you will only lose God's mercy, protection, and maybe salvation.
You will only damage yourself, and it doesn't make sense too.
 
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