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Abbot Tryphon of All-Merciful Saviour Monastery (Vashon Island, WA)
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<blockquote data-quote="Yallbeparticular" data-source="post: 1515195" data-attributes="member: 23506"><p>Certainly I can’t be sure what his precise intent was; I’m just going by the statement itself, which I disagree with. </p><p></p><p>If by “valid” with regard to apostolic succession and eucharist you mean whether it is a holy mystery or not, then I think that question is not debatable that the Roman Catholics lack holy mysteries, from the Orthodox perspective. Both mysteries of ordination (for apostolic succession) and holy eucharist proceed from the Christ and his theanthropic body (the church). </p><p></p><p>From my notes on Fr Peter Heers’ ecclesiology course, St Justin Popovich wrote, “In Orthodox teaching about the Church and the Mysteries [sacraments], the single most unique Mystery is the Church itself, the Body of the God-man Christ, so that she is the only source in the content of all divine Mysteries. Outside of this theanthropic and inclusive Mystery of the Church, the Pan-mystery itself, there are no and cannot be any “mysteries”; therefore, there can be no intercommunion of Mysteries. Consequently we can only speak about Mysteries within the context of this unique Pan- Mystery which is the Church. This is because the Orthodox Church, as the Body of Christ, is the source and foundation of the Mysteries [sacraments] and not the other way around. The Mysteries cannot be elevated above the Church or examined outside the Body of the Church. Because of this, in accordance with the mind of the Catholic Church of Christ, and in accordance with the whole of Orthodox Tradition, the Orthodox Church does not recognize the existence of other Mysteries outside of itself, neither does it recognize them as being mysteries, and one cannot receive the Mysteries until one comes away from the heretical “Churches,” that is to say the pseudo-Churches, through repentance to the Orthodox Church of Christ. Until then one remains outside the Church, un-united with it through repentance, and is, as far as the Church is concerned, a heretic and consequently outside the saving communion.” Fr Peter Heers discusses this in his ecclesiology class: [MEDIA=youtube]3Eb4_WG7V50[/MEDIA]</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Yallbeparticular, post: 1515195, member: 23506"] Certainly I can’t be sure what his precise intent was; I’m just going by the statement itself, which I disagree with. If by “valid” with regard to apostolic succession and eucharist you mean whether it is a holy mystery or not, then I think that question is not debatable that the Roman Catholics lack holy mysteries, from the Orthodox perspective. Both mysteries of ordination (for apostolic succession) and holy eucharist proceed from the Christ and his theanthropic body (the church). From my notes on Fr Peter Heers’ ecclesiology course, St Justin Popovich wrote, “In Orthodox teaching about the Church and the Mysteries [sacraments], the single most unique Mystery is the Church itself, the Body of the God-man Christ, so that she is the only source in the content of all divine Mysteries. Outside of this theanthropic and inclusive Mystery of the Church, the Pan-mystery itself, there are no and cannot be any “mysteries”; therefore, there can be no intercommunion of Mysteries. Consequently we can only speak about Mysteries within the context of this unique Pan- Mystery which is the Church. This is because the Orthodox Church, as the Body of Christ, is the source and foundation of the Mysteries [sacraments] and not the other way around. The Mysteries cannot be elevated above the Church or examined outside the Body of the Church. Because of this, in accordance with the mind of the Catholic Church of Christ, and in accordance with the whole of Orthodox Tradition, the Orthodox Church does not recognize the existence of other Mysteries outside of itself, neither does it recognize them as being mysteries, and one cannot receive the Mysteries until one comes away from the heretical “Churches,” that is to say the pseudo-Churches, through repentance to the Orthodox Church of Christ. Until then one remains outside the Church, un-united with it through repentance, and is, as far as the Church is concerned, a heretic and consequently outside the saving communion.” Fr Peter Heers discusses this in his ecclesiology class: [MEDIA=youtube]3Eb4_WG7V50[/MEDIA] [/QUOTE]
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