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Abbot Tryphon of All-Merciful Saviour Monastery (Vashon Island, WA)
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<blockquote data-quote="Basilus of Moro" data-source="post: 1515780" data-attributes="member: 22959"><p>Abbot Tryphon, like all of us, deserves the benefit of the doubt, that is, when something is vague or can be interpreted in multiple ways (one pious, one impious), we ought to stick to the better, but it does seem here like he's been rather unambiguous on the view in question, so that it is not nitpicking. These issues are not worth saying too much about with reference to him, though, since many <em>here</em> look up to him as a fatherly figure, and one should not commit regicide against one's father, nor tolerate those who seek to do so. This is just basic, simple piety.</p><p></p><p>I do want to say something about St. Augustine, and the Fathers more broadly, however. Although it is true that, as Fr. Seraphim Rose said, St. Augustine emphasized certain things too much (in terms of the powerlessness of the human will), we should not, as St. Photios says, reveal the sins of our Fathers. It is not clear to me, actually, that St. Augustine ever departed from Orthodox teaching, but rather that there are definite ambiguities in his works that can be interpreted in a manner that is not Orthodox. As St. Athanasius writes, the Fathers are inspired by the Holy Spirit, so that they are preserved from error (read his defense of St. Dionysius for St. Athanasius's view of error in the Holy Fathers).</p><p></p><p>You might rightly say that the Fathers were not always Fathers, and that there are examples of the Fathers changing their mind based on correction, but note that on the whole, they are always seeking and tending towards the truth. And indeed we should never consider ourselves worthy to correct them. If we are told of one of their teachings, it should be received as the words of God Himself, and if we find we misinterpreted it, or that the teaching seems unlike that of the other Fathers, we should be silent, and perhaps acknowledge the possibility of our misunderstanding even when it seems apparently false. This may sound strange, but we should treat the Fathers as infallible since who will set himself above the giants and rulers of the heavens? This is a pious disposition, in my mind. Too often do we glibly say "the Fathers are not infallible," with one breath, then go on to say whatever thoughts or reasonings issue forth from our sullied minds.</p><p></p><p>For a good summary on how the Fathers regard alleged errors in other Fathers (basically they read them as not errors usually), see “Patristic Hermeneutics.” Most of the quotes are in Greek, which is dumb, but the summaries are useful.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Basilus of Moro, post: 1515780, member: 22959"] Abbot Tryphon, like all of us, deserves the benefit of the doubt, that is, when something is vague or can be interpreted in multiple ways (one pious, one impious), we ought to stick to the better, but it does seem here like he's been rather unambiguous on the view in question, so that it is not nitpicking. These issues are not worth saying too much about with reference to him, though, since many [I]here[/I] look up to him as a fatherly figure, and one should not commit regicide against one's father, nor tolerate those who seek to do so. This is just basic, simple piety. I do want to say something about St. Augustine, and the Fathers more broadly, however. Although it is true that, as Fr. Seraphim Rose said, St. Augustine emphasized certain things too much (in terms of the powerlessness of the human will), we should not, as St. Photios says, reveal the sins of our Fathers. It is not clear to me, actually, that St. Augustine ever departed from Orthodox teaching, but rather that there are definite ambiguities in his works that can be interpreted in a manner that is not Orthodox. As St. Athanasius writes, the Fathers are inspired by the Holy Spirit, so that they are preserved from error (read his defense of St. Dionysius for St. Athanasius's view of error in the Holy Fathers). You might rightly say that the Fathers were not always Fathers, and that there are examples of the Fathers changing their mind based on correction, but note that on the whole, they are always seeking and tending towards the truth. And indeed we should never consider ourselves worthy to correct them. If we are told of one of their teachings, it should be received as the words of God Himself, and if we find we misinterpreted it, or that the teaching seems unlike that of the other Fathers, we should be silent, and perhaps acknowledge the possibility of our misunderstanding even when it seems apparently false. This may sound strange, but we should treat the Fathers as infallible since who will set himself above the giants and rulers of the heavens? This is a pious disposition, in my mind. Too often do we glibly say "the Fathers are not infallible," with one breath, then go on to say whatever thoughts or reasonings issue forth from our sullied minds. For a good summary on how the Fathers regard alleged errors in other Fathers (basically they read them as not errors usually), see “Patristic Hermeneutics.” Most of the quotes are in Greek, which is dumb, but the summaries are useful. [/QUOTE]
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