Are heavy metal and other forms of aggressive music bad for your soul?

[NotaBene]

One of my weird theories:

There is no such thing as "Christian" art, music, movies, record labels, songs, albums. These are just things. Things cannot be Christians. People are Christians, and even then it's hard to define. There is no sense saying the chair I'm sitting on is a "Christian" chair. There is also no such thing as a Christian business. Maybe the CEO is a believer, that doesn't make a corporate entity Christian. A country is not Christian. You see where I'm going, but this has drastic implications if you accept it.

We use that label as a shortcut to easily identify which things are suitable for consumption by a Christian - by which we mean ALL of them. This is very judgmental. It assumes that what one group of people enjoy and are drawn toward God by therefore applies to Christians all around the world. If you don't like hymns or Thomas Kincade, you like the "wrong" things.

Since beauty is in the eye of the beholder, there is no one-size fits all approach to art. Just think of movies and how even different Christians can not agree on what is appropriate to view, what is morally upstanding, entertaining, family oriented, whatever. I don't think I've ever seen a "Christian" labelled movie I've ever liked. Some believers judge me on this, the implication is that I'm messed up for interpreting subjective things wrongly.

The only way around this is to see things through your brother's eye before you give bad advice. How does HE interpret this music? Is it good for him? Does it cause him to glorify God, even though it sounds horrible to me? If he can honestly answer yes, then that is good for him and a matter of conscience for you - do not get in the way of your brother.

 

[Stoyan]

One of my weird theories:

My counterargument.

This your statement sounds like.

There is no such thing as "Christian" art, music, culture, etc.

This is an extremely liberal bias here. I would just respectfully disagree on that one. The current state of culture and society in the west is because people said that there is no such thing as "Christian" culture. In doing so, they demolished their own ancient Christian culture and replaced it with an even more hollow and shallow, fake and made up "pop culture" or "liberal culture".

Why are Middle Eastern Islamic countries maintaining traditional patriarchal societies to this day? Because they have Imams or authorities who are able to draw a clear line what is Islamic culture, and what is culture of a foreign civilization. For example, we can clearly picture what is Islamic clothing: gowns and robes, hijab, ghutra hoods, fez caps and turbans. There is a certain kind of Islamic architectural style, or collection of related architectural styles. There is also Islamic art, which is very distinctive and easily recognizable. In the Islamic world imams forbid women to wear yoga pants. You might think that's crazy, but they are actually preserving their civilization from foreign influences.

Similarly, take a look at the Amish. There is a distinctive Amish look and feel, in their clothes, their architecture, their music, their art, their lifestyle, their language. They are probably the only White people who preserved their own culture and didn't assimilate in the United States! I can't not respect such people.

Your idea that there is no such thing as "Christian" culture is another response to the thread "What is wrong with Protestantism as a Christian denomination according to Orthodoxy?" Look at mainstream American Protestants, how very different they are to the Amish! Except for extant churches which were built in the 19th century, modern Protestant churches are just brutalist concrete and glass structures, like of some kind of corporation. And the priests inside wear suits and ties just like any corporate or political worldly people. "Western Christians" in general are only Christians in matters of personal beliefs only. However they live worldly lives, wear secular clothing, participate in the pop culture. That is their main folly, unlike the Amish they don't care about their traditional culture, art, music, clothing, etc ... because, just as you say, they deny that such a culture even exists to begin with.

If not having traditional culture, then what is the replacement? It is a fake made up culture. Instead of traditional clothing, lousy T shirts with corporate logos. Instead of traditional home made healthy food, made up junk food laced with preservatives, artificial colors, and excessive sugars, such as burgers and donuts. Instead of Victorian Art Novaeu architecture, modernist glass cubes. Instead of traditional "extended" families, rainbow families. You see where this is going??! Even ancient pagan mythologies such as Greko-Roman and Hindu Indian, they have lots of heroes and demigods with epic quests, but these stories were passed along over thousands of years, and often have very deep philosophical implications to teach children some lesson. However Marvel super heroes are just made up, their clothes are weird, and they do not teach children anything other than who has the most powers wins the fight.

A very sad example of this is Japan. I like the traditional Japanese clothing, art, and architecture. It is so very beautiful. Unfortunately there are places in modern Japan where you could walk around the city for hours and not find any authentic Japanese culture. Sure, the people are ethnically Japanese and their language is a slang form of Japanese, but their traditional culture was heavily distorted because of exposure to the Western culture, and failed to properly defend it to a large extent, didn't failed completely as there still are traditional martial arts and hanfu communities.

One advantage that Orthodoxy has over Protestantism is that Orthodox priests have their own traditional clothing, their own architecture style with the domes, arches, and frescoes, iconostas, bells etc. Hence there are guidelines drawn what falls within the bounds of the Orthodox culture, and what outside. Clothes for non-members of the priesthood maybe ethnic Eastern European clothes (which were even worn at the start of the 20th century), or like clothes that Russian Old Believers wear to this day. For example women wear long skirts and head scarves, often with embroidery.

I think that my position should be clear by now, that people have to be conservatives such as Muslims, Amish, or Eastern European Orthodox, if they want to preserve their culture. So use your traditions as a fortress against the Western fake made up pop culture. In the contrary situation, you lose your traditions, you lose your culture, and such people who don't have a sense of identity are much easier to control in the short term (cucked conformists), and in the long term society collapses. Remember who your ancestors were, they created a remarkable culture over hundreds, even thousands of years. Do not let it be forgotten in only a few generations, it's your cultural kind of DNA. It would be a shame. What does religion have to do with traditional culture? Everything! Because the culture is the soul of the people. If the soul of a people is spiritually corrupt, then you have cultural decay. If the soul of a people is spiritually healthy, then you have traditional culture and worldviews, with all the constructive effects on society as a whole.

So going back to heavy metal music, from an Orthodox point of view, such kind of music wasn't around during the Byzantine Empire, or during the Russian Empire, so it shouldn't be used. The strong association of such music with Western atheistic pop culture, and even crazy Satanist cults, is an even greater reason why it should be avoided.

 

[NotaBene]

This is an extremely liberal bias here.

No, I'm not liberal. I am a bit odd and have crazy ideas. I've been teaching and playing music professionally for over 20 years, and I really don't like music in church at all. So I may fit in some odd boxes, but "liberal" ain't one of them, unless by that you mean "not overly concerned with tradition for its own sake".

The current state of culture and society in the west is because people said that there is no such thing as "Christian" culture.

It is tricky to be "in" the world but not "of" the world, and there is some pull in both directions, and bad extremes. In general I think we can adopt the culture of anywhere we are (as Paul did) in many ways without sinning. I do not believe in a universal "Christian" culture for the same reason I mentioned before.

In the Islamic world imams forbid women to wear yoga pants.

Yes, but that's a matter of modesty, which is a whole different discussion. I'd agree with them on this point.

Unfortunately there are places in modern Japan where you could walk around the city for hours and not find any authentic Japanese culture.

In one sense this is sad, because it's the loss of a distinct culture. This is happening in many places in the world. But that's not a good rebuttal to my theory. I don't listen to music because I feel sorry for a dying culture. I either like it or I don't. And believe me, I like some eclectic stuff, over many centuries. And I question if you (or anyone in the church) should have the authority to dictate what "appropriate" music or art is, because of its subjective nature. To be concerned is great, to mandate is perhaps overstepping a boundary in a matter of conscience.

One advantage that Orthodoxy has over Protestantism is that Orthodox priests have their own traditional clothing, their own architecture style with the domes, arches, and frescoes, iconostas, bells etc.

I don't see that as an advantage at all. Just because you appreciate the uniformity and tradition of it doesn't mean it does anything for me.

You also brought up the Amish. Great, they look uniform. So do a lot of denominations. So do nuns and people in jail. To my mind, you aren't addressing the actual issue at all - the subjective interpretation of art, music, poetry, movies. Surely in the Orthodox church there must be some leeway for brothers to appreciate/consume art other than what you listed? This line of reasoning is truly puzzling to me.

I'm really glad that things like a beautiful church cause you to glorify God. That's amazing. Sometimes I wish I could get excited by things other brothers seem to love - cheesy modern "worship" music, large expensive buildings, liturgy, pre-written prayers, architecture. But if I don't, it doesn't necessarily mean something is wrong with me.

I think it's ok to be very careful about what we consume. For instance, my job as a father is to be the gatekeeper of the home. I control what media comes into my house, and I am rather strict. Until my daughter is old enough to develop discernment, I decide what she watches and listens to. But this won't be my job forever. I feel that at some point it's her job to discern what is beautiful, what draws her heart closer to God, and to consume that. And it probably won't be the same as what I like - but isn't that ok?

 

[Giordano Bruno]

Are heavy metal and other forms of aggressive music bad for your soul?​

• Absolutely, it's true!

This quote by Nikola Tesla means that music, which is having energy, frequency, and vibration, is the progenitor of matter. There is a theory in physics called string theory, which states that vibrating strings, like the strings of a musical instrument, are creating all the reality of the universe.

So it means that music has a subtle effect on the matter, it has a subtle effect on the universe. This effect is especially pronounced on the soul, which has a low relative density compared to thick matter, hence it is more permeable to energy, frequency, and vibration which is encoded in the music.

If you listen to heavy metal and other forms of aggressive music, they will over time damage your soul, because such music is disharmonious. In contrary, if you listen to for example Russian Orthodox bell music, it is extremely harmonious, and it will heal the soul. This is because each bell is specifically selected according to ancient principles, to produce harmonious music. It is not arbitrary, it is extremely wise!



Listen to the music, does it leave you with a feeling of warmth, or does it leave you with a feeling of disorder inside?

People are writing about the lyrics, but also the energy, frequency, and vibration that is encoded in the melody itself is actually really important!

Is the eternal soul so easily affected by the material?

 

[Stoyan]

Is the eternal soul so easily affected by the material?

I don't know, but in general it's a system in which both parts mutually depend on each other, and influence each other. The spiritual affects the material, and the material affects the spiritual. Ying and Yang.

At least at a subjective level, aggressive music has the same effect as a depressant for me. Various different kinds of music have effects of motivation, attention, relaxation, meditation, or even sleeping. For example military music frequently uses drums and rythms. Then there is also trance music and binaural beats.

Allegedly during the Astroworld concert there was played music having negative energy, vibrations, and frequency ... and it was so detrimental to the audience that some of them even collapsed and died on the spot. It is thought that the music caused their souls to be ripped away from their bodies, causing them to die, and get sucked into the spirit portal as a prey for entities on the other side. It sounds extremely bizzare, but that is the implied main idea of this article.

Something Extremely Dark Happened at Travis Scott’s Deadly “Astroworld” Festival

Travis Scott's

vigilantcitizen.com

 

[Pantheon]

This quote by Nikola Tesla means that music, which is having energy, frequency, and vibration, is the progenitor of matter. There is a theory in physics called string theory, which states that vibrating strings, like the strings of a musical instrument, are creating all the reality of the universe.

So it means that music has a subtle effect on the matter, it has a subtle effect on the universe. This effect is especially pronounced on the soul, which has a low relative density compared to thick matter, hence it is more permeable to energy, frequency, and vibration which is encoded in the music.

Yes, it seems that sound and hearing is a more spiritual organ than sight. Sight is actually the least spiritual organ (the most spiritually 'blind'), and only in modern times has seeing become the primary sense organ ("only what I can see is real"). In ancient Egypt, hearing was seen as the supreme sense organ, and when you think about it, the world was indeed spoken into existence by the Word.

If you listen to heavy metal and other forms of aggressive music, they will over time damage your soul, because such music is disharmonious. In contrary, if you listen to for example Russian Orthodox bell music, it is extremely harmonious, and it will heal the soul. This is because each bell is specifically selected according to ancient principles, to produce harmonious music. It is not arbitrary, it is extremely wise!

I'm not so sure about that. In Orthodoxy, there is a place for darkness. Black is the color of defiance to the World, hence genres like doom metal can serve a spiritual purpose. There even exists some Orthodox black metal bands. There is no point in running from darkness, because evil is in everyone. Just because you listen to dark and heavy music it doesn't make you evil, it can mean you are realistic about the existence of these things. I don't even want my metal to be 'Christian', because it's not the point. The point is that it deals with topics of darkness, including evil. That doesn't mean you shouldn't also listen to church music, because beauty and serenity is also important, but I don't believe in shutting out everything dark and aggressive, unless you aspire for an ascetic life of course. If anything, the chaos and non-conformism that metal introduces is a good antiseptic towards the suffocating clinical order and control of modern society. This is why the rise of metal IMO always had a spiritual component, because it arose as a reaction against the mainstream (including mainstream Christianity).

 

[Pilgrim of the East]

Are heavy metal and other forms of aggressive music bad for your soul?​

my answer would be that aggressive music is indeed bad for the soul, because our God is the Lord of peace and we are to guard our hearts.
Basically it's garbage in - garbage out.

That said I wouldn't consider heavy metal aggressive - what are the most famous heavy metal bands? Led Zeppelin, Deep Purple? What part of their music would you consider aggressive?

I mostly judge modern music by lyrics (with exceptions of death metal and similar (basically everything that includes growling etc) - I consider these anti-music) and there are definitely some pieces of very good metal music that glorifies God (from the top of my head a couple of good ones from Theocracy - Altar to the unknown God, Wages of sin, On Eagles wings, As the world bleeds, Bethlehem (well that one isn't really metal, but great nevertheless))

 

[papashango]

I don't know, but in general it's a system in which both parts mutually depend on each other, and influence each other. The spiritual affects the material, and the material affects the spiritual. Ying and Yang.

At least at a subjective level, aggressive music has the same effect as a depressant for me. Various different kinds of music have effects of motivation, attention, relaxation, meditation, or even sleeping. For example military music frequently uses drums and rythms. Then there is also trance music and binaural beats.

Allegedly during the Astroworld concert there was played music having negative energy, vibrations, and frequency ... and it was so detrimental to the audience that some of them even collapsed and died on the spot. It is thought that the music caused their souls to be ripped away from their bodies, causing them to die, and get sucked into the spirit portal as a prey for entities on the other side. It sounds extremely bizzare, but that is the implied main idea of this article.

Something Extremely Dark Happened at Travis Scott’s Deadly “Astroworld” Festival

Travis Scott's

vigilantcitizen.com

The news of that Astroworld event shook me for days. Something deeply disturbing about it.

Personally, I don't think the genre of music is the issue, it's the energy or intention which created it that matters. An aggressive, obscure, Scandinavian Metal band that glorifies killing and an 'upbeat' Electro-Pop song that was made with the intention to be famous - these are one and the same for me.

Most people I know who are into Metal are some of the soundest people I know.

 

[rouchno1fan]

I've quit metal, and all secular music, not that I've had the inclination to listen to any in months. This thread has been the last nail in the coffin. Thanks to all.

 

[rouchno1fan]

I've quit metal, and all secular music, not that I've had the inclination to listen to any in months. This thread has been the last nail in the coffin. Thanks to all.

 

[Stoyan]

This quote by Nikola Tesla means that music, which is having energy, frequency, and vibration, is the progenitor of matter. There is a theory in physics called string theory, which states that vibrating strings, like the strings of a musical instrument, are creating all the reality of the universe.

So it means that music has a subtle effect on the matter, it has a subtle effect on the universe. This effect is especially pronounced on the soul, which has a low relative density compared to thick matter, hence it is more permeable to energy, frequency, and vibration which is encoded in the music.

If you listen to heavy metal and other forms of aggressive music, they will over time damage your soul, because such music is disharmonious. In contrary, if you listen to for example Russian Orthodox bell music, it is extremely harmonious, and it will heal the soul. This is because each bell is specifically selected according to ancient principles, to produce harmonious music. It is not arbitrary, it is extremely wise!

This is a Russian documentary going into the details about the energy, frequency, and vibration of the church bells that we talked about.

 

[hedonist]

Tesla

I want a study on what Travis Scott, Drake and Post Malone does to human cells!

 

[RedLagoon]

The news of that Astroworld event shook me for days. Something deeply disturbing about it.

Personally, I don't think the genre of music is the issue, it's the energy or intention which created it that matters. An aggressive, obscure, Scandinavian Metal band that glorifies killing and an 'upbeat' Electro-Pop song that was made with the intention to be famous - these are one and the same for me.

Most people I know who are into Metal are some of the soundest people I know.

Well... for me it's the complete opposite. Metal heads in my friends group are miserable on their own and a few have committed suicide.

I think Metal is inorganic "music" made by people for people to be miserable together. When I hear the growling and 16 riffs a second I become physically ill.

I'd try music from Bach or Handel, Tsjaikovsky etc if you're looking for beauty and... peace.

 

[Stoyan]

I think Metal is inorganic "music" made by people for people to be miserable together. When I hear the growling and 16 riffs a second I become physically ill.

Maybe Metal music is different to other Metal music. I think that there are two categories. Those who know what they're doing and deliberately encode destructive frequencies into the music (which can make you physically ill), and imitators amateurs who just produce discordant noise (which is just annoying).