I guess some people want the five star rated heaven over the budget one lol
Attending church with young kids + demographics article
- Thread starter Pray_Everyday
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Right? I guess so, lol.I guess some people want the five star rated heaven over the budget one lol
Awwwww, babies can be such an adorable distraction.
Unfortunately what my toddler likes is to run outside on the church lawn, to play with toys and to explore the area and not sit still. My baby likes to bounce in his bouncer. Neither is conductive to quiet children at church unless it's at the nursery. They do like watching baby videos on a tablet, but I get the feeling that is frowned upon at church...
Going to a later service is not an option, due to my husband's work schedule.
Edit: Just realized that we've gone to evening Bible study during the week, which is at evening time, and the kids were just as restless.
We have 2 kids under 3, so I can't hold them both, and worry that if my husband helps by holding them too often I will be seen as not doing the "motherly role" (from what I've read on the men's forum posts, the husband is supposed to help as little as possible with childcare, or have I misunderstood?). We usually try to contain them in their double stroller.
I agree 100%.
Also, clarifying that I'm not considering Mormon church. You are right, on the outside the culture does seem appealing, but I have no interest in joining something with such obvious occult/freemasonic ties...
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From what I can tell, a lot of people are drawn to it (and stay) because of the strong pro-natalist culture and esoteric teachings. I think in the past a lot of otherwise intelligent people would end up in weird sects because they seem attractive or interesting on the outside and by the time they realize something is "off" they've wasted half their lives.
I had a college professor whose family had left the Mormons and they were literally stalked for years, despite moving across the country to get away.
They are, babies.
Attended an Orthodox Liturgy and there was a family with seven young children. Dad discipled, lovingly but assertive. The children were well behaved for the whole Liturgy given the time.
That is one of the greatest blessings with Orthodox- children are encouraged to be part of the Church Liturgy - experiences with all or five senses.
Mothers and fathers, friends, relatives, all take turns holding their babies and toddlers during the Orthodox services. Before I was Orthodox, I just stayed home with my little ones letting my husband go, or we would trade off going. I didn't want some stranger taking care of them those hours. Now I realize I should have taken them along with me, to train them how to worship in reverence. By waiting until they are older they are already expecting to play and be entertained as they are at home. Fathers should have as much interactions with their children as possible. There isn't enough male influence in these recent decades. Both parents are so important as role models.
Yes, those sweet little wide-eyed smiles get you every time, a wonder-full distraction in the fullness of the term. God dwells in them, too!
Yes, those sweet little wide-eyed smiles get you every time, a wonder-full distraction in the fullness of the term. God dwells in them, too!
Context of my comment: we moved to a new state last summer and attended a Catholic Church in the previous state and are currently attending a Protestant church in our new state. Faith wise, we are still in an in between place, where I have gotten interested in reading and learning about orthodoxy, my husband is a Catholic who is not currently interested in orthodoxy at all, and I was raised Protestant with some Catholic influences. We’ve attended many Catholic and Protestant churches throughout our dating and marriage. So…. Just to explain the context.
Anyway, my son is almost 7 and for most of his life, we took him to a Catholic Church where he was in the service with us. Of course, he didn’t pay one bit of attention and was restless. The problem wasn’t necessarily that he bothered us or others, but that I started to feel that he wasn’t learning much. He really didn’t like going to church and we always had to force him to go, which we did because we are the parents, but I hated that he hated it. Despite my disagreements with Protestant churches, I started to think about my childhood Sunday school classes and vacation Bible school programs, etc… and I had a feeling my son would benefit from this. And he has. He actually does really well in the Sunday school class at a Protestant church and he looks forward to attending now. He has learned Bible verses and biblical concepts, stories, etc… and that’s what I wanted and that’s why we are there- for now anyway. I wanted him to have the same foundation I did for understanding the basic concepts of the Bible and he is the type of kid that learns better from others for some reason. I think it’s because he’s kind of a shy kid and wouldn’t dare disrupt or be rude to a teacher, but if me or his dad try and teach him, theres a lot of natural push back from him because he can express his real feelings that he doesn’t feel like listening to us in that moment or whatever. So I disagree that putting kids in a classroom with peers and non related adults (that are moral people) is some kind of bad thing automatically. Maybe for some kids it is, but it works well for my kid. On a related note, we homeschooled this year and he was begging to go back to regular school for 2nd grade. All kids are different and it’s obviously the parent’s job to know what’s best for yours.
We are having another baby, due in June, and that baby will be with us in the service probably until age 2 or 3. An infant nursery is provided by the church, but I don’t want to use it because I want my baby with me at that age and I see no educational value from a class for infants. Many infants are in our church service, and there is even a private breastfeeding room in the hallway outside of the women’s restroom. You can see and hear the pastor on a screen from there. Most toddlers are in the classrooms during service, but I’m sure no one would object if you wanted your kid with you. I personally would utilize the Sunday school for any child old enough to speak and benefit from class activities, unless my child had the temperament to need to be with me at all times for some reason.
In the church we attend, I know the youth leader personally- very based guy with 4 kids and he checks volunteer references and does background checks. Yes a weirdo could slip by, but I generally trust these people and have faith in where God has lead us in this season. So, it’s highly individual. But I just wanted to put it out there that some kids really do excel in a more structured classroom environment.
Anyway, my son is almost 7 and for most of his life, we took him to a Catholic Church where he was in the service with us. Of course, he didn’t pay one bit of attention and was restless. The problem wasn’t necessarily that he bothered us or others, but that I started to feel that he wasn’t learning much. He really didn’t like going to church and we always had to force him to go, which we did because we are the parents, but I hated that he hated it. Despite my disagreements with Protestant churches, I started to think about my childhood Sunday school classes and vacation Bible school programs, etc… and I had a feeling my son would benefit from this. And he has. He actually does really well in the Sunday school class at a Protestant church and he looks forward to attending now. He has learned Bible verses and biblical concepts, stories, etc… and that’s what I wanted and that’s why we are there- for now anyway. I wanted him to have the same foundation I did for understanding the basic concepts of the Bible and he is the type of kid that learns better from others for some reason. I think it’s because he’s kind of a shy kid and wouldn’t dare disrupt or be rude to a teacher, but if me or his dad try and teach him, theres a lot of natural push back from him because he can express his real feelings that he doesn’t feel like listening to us in that moment or whatever. So I disagree that putting kids in a classroom with peers and non related adults (that are moral people) is some kind of bad thing automatically. Maybe for some kids it is, but it works well for my kid. On a related note, we homeschooled this year and he was begging to go back to regular school for 2nd grade. All kids are different and it’s obviously the parent’s job to know what’s best for yours.
We are having another baby, due in June, and that baby will be with us in the service probably until age 2 or 3. An infant nursery is provided by the church, but I don’t want to use it because I want my baby with me at that age and I see no educational value from a class for infants. Many infants are in our church service, and there is even a private breastfeeding room in the hallway outside of the women’s restroom. You can see and hear the pastor on a screen from there. Most toddlers are in the classrooms during service, but I’m sure no one would object if you wanted your kid with you. I personally would utilize the Sunday school for any child old enough to speak and benefit from class activities, unless my child had the temperament to need to be with me at all times for some reason.
In the church we attend, I know the youth leader personally- very based guy with 4 kids and he checks volunteer references and does background checks. Yes a weirdo could slip by, but I generally trust these people and have faith in where God has lead us in this season. So, it’s highly individual. But I just wanted to put it out there that some kids really do excel in a more structured classroom environment.
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deleted because comment posted twice
My husband and I feel the exact same way about having our children with us in church. We want our son to grow up hearing the preaching of the Word of God and be used to sitting through service. We also don't trust others with him.Hi everyone, my apologies is this thread already exists.
Since there's a variety of Christians here, I was hoping you could tell me about your experiences attending church with very young children. Specifically, are they allowed to stay with the family throughout, or was there any pressure to leave them in a nursery of sorts. If they stay with you how do you keep them quiet or from running up the aisle? If you would feel comfortable saying so, please include what type of chuch you attend.
Main reason I ask is because over the past year my husband and I have been looking for a church, and every single church we've attended has wanted us to leave the kids in the nursery (despite originally telling us it's fine for them to stay with us). I guess we're wondering if every church is like that?
We don't feel comfortable leaving our young kids with anyone besides us, we feel it's our responsibility as parents to make absolutely sure no one will touch them innapropriately or expose them to anything, especially before they're able to communicate complex ideas to us. It only takes a minute. Also, just wanted to make it clear that I'm not criticizing or "judging" anyone who parents differently on that matter, but trying to express why leaving them alone at a nursery is a hard "no" with us.
What we've been doing is having me stay with them in the nursery, but at some point it feels like why am I even going. There's a speaker or video showing the service usually, but I could just watch it from home, with the bonus of subtitles (I really struggle with no subtitles unless I'm speaking to someone in person - my brain's weird). On some Sundays my husband has stayed home with them while I go alone (not ideal). We just can't figure out what we should do.
On a related note, while searching online on this topic I found an article from Christianity Today that claims that it's mostly women who attend church, women drive the growth of a church, and has always been that way. I was rather surprised because I remember a while back on the men's forum someone posted how it's dependant on the father's church attendance if the children attend church when they grow up. If I remember correctly, it even said that if only the mother attends the likelihood of the grown children attending is lower than if they hadn't gone at all.
Do y'all think the article is misleading or subversive? I'm attempting to link below (apologizing in advance for my lack of computer skills).
Making Your Church Manlier Won’t Make It Bigger
History tells us that denominational growth has nothing to do with sex ratios in the pews.www.christianitytoday.com
We currently go to a Baptist church in the DFW area. It's a smaller church with mostly older people. We asked the pastor if he was okay with our son sitting in on the service-- he said he is okay with it. I do feel awkward though when he starts squirming or making noise because we're the only couple in the sanctuary with a small child. So far it's been okay though. If he gets really rowdy I take him just outside the sanctuary for awhile and then come back in. I think a confounding factor with pastors not wanting kids in the service is that a lot of churches are live streaming/ recording the service.
Your last sentence does hit the nail on the head perfectly. On a few different sermon videos (from a couple different churches...) we've been able to hear our children over the pastor while rewatching. My husband explained to me that as much as we want our children to be present in church with us, and believe that Jesus would have never turned children away, we must be considerate of others as well (not trying to say that you and your family are not, just speaking about my own family here). Especially because in our case we are 'visitors' and not actual members.
I've been continuing to do more online research on this topic, and there are some more facts that I think are relevant that I did not know before. Please, no one take this as a personal attack or accusation - if what I'm about to say does not apply to you, great; if it does, I'm not passing judgment, just saying it's not what my husband and I have chosen with our family. However, if anyone out there is wondering how this all works, and I'm able to shed some light on this issue, great.
Anyway, I've come across a few sites that, in short, guilt the family (primarily the mom, let's be honest) for not having perfectly well behaved children who will sit quietly thru church services or act docile, and quiet in general. Also, I sometimes watch youtube videos of people who claim they were raised very religious and are now atheist (and often woke, ugh) mostly to figure out how it went horribly wrong and so I can avoid the same pitfalls for my own family (and no, going away to a liberal university is not the common thread here, some of these people married young and didn't go to college). The closest I've come to finding a common thread here is extreme levels of corporal punishment and parental hypocrisy.
Well, one church website was mentioning something about child training being a must, which I assumed meant discipline. Wrong. It actually means to intentionally tempt the child into misbehaving, in order to strike it repeatedly.
The idea comes from a book called To Train Up A Child which teaches to begin "training" months old babies when they "misbehave" by crying or reaching for a toy (that was deliberately placed there for temptation's sake) by hitting them, and pulling their hair for biting while nursing, among other things. If the child reacts in "defiance", by squirming, trying to protect itself, or anything other than just taking the beating, the parent is to "calmly" continue to beat them. This book promises to result in cheerful, quiet, well-behaved children, but sure seems to result in an awful lot of young adults that turn atheist and hate God (and three dead children, so far).
Some of the many negative reviews of this book explicitly explained how having to leave a church service because of a noisy child is seen as a huge shame on the parents (ahem, mother), and how they believe if you don't "train" your child you are not doing God's will.
My husband and I were not really raised going to church so this is all relatively new to us, but I think I'm starting to understand how these things work... In short, if attending church with our children staying with us in the service means that they expect -or demand- us to use these kind of tactics then no, it's not gonna happen. We want to raise our children to genuinely love, obey and fear God, not to just robotically go through the motions because they've been beaten to have their will broken since before they were old enough to talk.
Amazon product
To Train Up a Child - Wikipedia
That book and the authors are evil. Sorry but there is a line between loving discipline and beating your kids into submission. Oh this struck a nerve. I know Christians are not perfect but I cannot stand fake Christians. Blanket training is cruel. A baby just learning to crawl should not get beat cause they crawled off the blanket. That’s how you get psychos as adults. Gotta calm down now!!!!!
Your last sentence does hit the nail on the head perfectly. On a few different sermon videos (from a couple different churches...) we've been able to hear our children over the pastor while rewatching. My husband explained to me that as much as we want our children to be present in church with us, and believe that Jesus would have never turned children away, we must be considerate of others as well (not trying to say that you and your family are not, just speaking about my own family here). Especially because in our case we are 'visitors' and not actual members.
I've been continuing to do more online research on this topic, and there are some more facts that I think are relevant that I did not know before. Please, no one take this as a personal attack or accusation - if what I'm about to say does not apply to you, great; if it does, I'm not passing judgment, just saying it's not what my husband and I have chosen with our family. However, if anyone out there is wondering how this all works, and I'm able to shed some light on this issue, great.
Anyway, I've come across a few sites that, in short, guilt the family (primarily the mom, let's be honest) for not having perfectly well behaved children who will sit quietly thru church services or act docile, and quiet in general. Also, I sometimes watch youtube videos of people who claim they were raised very religious and are now atheist (and often woke, ugh) mostly to figure out how it went horribly wrong and so I can avoid the same pitfalls for my own family (and no, going away to a liberal university is not the common thread here, some of these people married young and didn't go to college). The closest I've come to finding a common thread here is extreme levels of corporal punishment and parental hypocrisy.
Well, one church website was mentioning something about child training being a must, which I assumed meant discipline. Wrong. It actually means to intentionally tempt the child into misbehaving, in order to strike it repeatedly.
The idea comes from a book called To Train Up A Child which teaches to begin "training" months old babies when they "misbehave" by crying or reaching for a toy (that was deliberately placed there for temptation's sake) by hitting them, and pulling their hair for biting while nursing, among other things. If the child reacts in "defiance", by squirming, trying to protect itself, or anything other than just taking the beating, the parent is to "calmly" continue to beat them. This book promises to result in cheerful, quiet, well-behaved children, but sure seems to result in an awful lot of young adults that turn atheist and hate God (and three dead children, so far).
Some of the many negative reviews of this book explicitly explained how having to leave a church service because of a noisy child is seen as a huge shame on the parents (ahem, mother), and how they believe if you don't "train" your child you are not doing God's will.
My husband and I were not really raised going to church so this is all relatively new to us, but I think I'm starting to understand how these things work... In short, if attending church with our children staying with us in the service means that they expect -or demand- us to use these kind of tactics then no, it's not gonna happen. We want to raise our children to genuinely love, obey and fear God, not to just robotically go through the motions because they've been beaten to have their will broken since before they were old enough to talk.
Amazon product
To Train Up a Child - Wikipedia
en.m.wikipedia.org
Thanks for sharing your research! Our approach to having my son with us in church so far has been to have books, toys, snacks (quiet items). These help distract him and for the most part help him sit with us relatively quietly. If he does get too squirmy or loud I or my husband will take him out of the sanctuary. We do give him swats with our open hands on his clothed bottom currently (if he bites me while nursing, touching outlets/ cords). He's 11months old. When I feel like he's old enough to understand my expectations of at least being quiet in church I plan on ramping up some discipline but for now I am mostly in an encouragement stage during church. Once he is old enough to know that "mom and dad want me to be quiet during church"... if he is being loud I intend on taking him out for a quick swat and bringing him back into the service. I personally feel fine about small children playing with quiet toys, snacking, and wiggling during service.
One strategy I've heard of, that we are trying to implement, is training our children during family worship at home. This entails a daily Bible reading (or devotional) and a worship song. Basically 15-30 minutes of some family worship. This can be used to "train" your child for how to act during church. While daddy reads the Bible, baby needs to sit quietly on mom's lap etc. So far my son squirms and wants to play with things or pull pages of the Bible. I think that's fine. We're working on him sitting more of less still for extended periods of time-- but he's working on being quiet for that time and I think that's a win.
I think it's a noble effort to keep kids with the family during service--- I wish it wasn't so frowned upon. It might be worth noting that my Lutheran friend was appalled that my nondenominational church (at the time) had children seperate from the main service. So there are definitely women and families out there who make it work! Dr Voddie Baucham is wonderful and talks about the importance of family worship and having children in church with the parents. This is one family worship: