Bench Press

[WesternCancer]

@majortom

That helped me a lot in getting my bench up, its still shitty, but its getting better.
A few more things.

- play around with grip widths and make sure you don't have a break in your wrist. I bench with a relatively close grip. I tried wider grips, but I was very weak in those.

- LEG DRIVE!!!!! try to get your ass as close to your shoulder blades but keep your ass on the bench. Push through your heels with all your might, feet must remain on the ground at all times.

- don't just smush your shoulder blades together/flex your traps for your support base. Pretend you're wrapping your back around and down something (hard to describe). I usually Shrug my shoulders up then do a semi-circle flexing the entirety of my lats pushing my chest out.

 

[Moma]

Started up the gym again and I find that my front delts are sore and not so much my chest. I think from my physique or perhaps training style that my chest doesn't get the recruitment it should from training.
Any suggestions on how I can take the shoulders out of my chest training?

I did flat bench, incline bench, incline dumbell presses and cable crossovers.
I'm going to experiment with changing my grip to thumbless to take forearms out of the equation.

Help mucho appreciated. Gracias.

 

[dog24]

Do you work rear delts and back enough? My physio told me many years ago that my chest was owerpowering my physique so i was hunching a bit, its a very common problem when guys focus too much on bench. Also squezee your shoulder blades together not only will it take work off your shoulders youll eventually get injured if you dont. Suicide grip is called that way because people have died doing that stupid shit.

 

[Moma]

Do you work rear delts and back enough? My physio told me many years ago that my chest was owerpowering my physique so i was hunching a bit, its a very common problem when guys focus too much on bench. Also squezee your shoulder blades together not only will it take work off your shoulders youll eventually get injured if you dont. Suicide grip is called that way because people have died doing that stupid shit.

I don't work delts at all with any isolation work as I find they are quite prominent and always kick in for all my pressing exercises. For back, I usually do pullups (body weight with supinated grip) as a staple, lat pulldowns, some standing rows, dumbbell rows.

I used to pre-exhaust the shoulders in the past on the recommendation of someone at a gym I used to go to with some lateral raises, seated dumbbell presses and some flat flyes.

Not sure if I should get back into that..I just want a workout where my chest is painful as opposed to just shoulders mainly and a tad bit of chest.

 

[Kieran]

To the OP, stronglifts, which is based on even sets of 5 reps across, is not a great way to gain strength at all. You might want to consider a program like Jim Wendler's 5/3/1 or Joe De Franco's version of Westside. These programs have you working up to a set of max reps on the major lifts, with plenty of options for assistance movements worked into the program, and should be far more effective in helping you hit your goal of a 1.5 BW bench.

I wouldn't eat your way through the plateau either, as that will take you further from your goal of a 1.5 bench. Just continue to eat at a slight excess.

Also, watch the Dave Tate videos that were posted earlier in the thread.

 

[Hades]

It's been a year since I last posted in this thread and am not surprised to see that I was recommending handstands to everybody.

Anyway one tip I can offer about upping bench press numbers is to execute full upper body tension, grab the bar and destroy it with your grip while tensing every muscle in your upper body.

The other tip I can offer is that most people can't press (bench or military) worth a shit because they can't even do one dip or ten pushups. It's much easier to increase these numbers than with the bench press because you do not need a spotter. You don't even need a gym. Dips and pushups can be trained six days a week if desired and all you would need are two sturdy chairs once you've worked your way to dips.
In my opinion, this is where all pressers (bench and military) should begin.

So here's the basic steps - spend a month or two doing a program like 100 pushups, then take a week off. Try to get to a point where you can do at least sixty pushups in a sitting.

Then take two or three months at a dip station, at first do nothing but dip negatives - like four sets of 8-10 reps; done four times per week.

Then keep doing dips until you are repping your bodyweight (go down until your thumbs get close to your armpits, cheating the rep is bullshit and won't help you) at the dip station for 20 reps at a crack. Once you can do two to four sets of 15-20 reps, you can either keep going by using a weight belt and lowering the set/rep scheme to something like three sets of 3-5 reps (recommended for use in conjunction with back off sets of pushups). Be careful with this because you can snap your shoulders up in a hurry.

If you did all that correctly and your 5 rep max at the bench press isn't somewhere around body weight, go back to doing dips and a few sets and reps of weighted dips every other workout; what's likely here is that you were cheating reps or rushed it too quickly. The pushup to dip negative to dip, potentially to weighted dips - (and you can go to doing strict dips on XR rings or experiment with Bulgarian dips on parallel bars if you want to get ambitious) - should take about six months if you have started at a fairly low strength level. It's hard work.

Military press is a different animal but if you're doing two to four sets of 20 reps of bodyweight dips I don't see why you shouldn't be military pressing something like 60-70% of bodyweight. If anything dips (and the durational handstands mentioned earlier) will provide a very good foundation.

 

[DLZ]

One thing to do while you're benching is to REALLY squeeze the bar -- like you want to bend it. A powerlifting buddy told me to do this, and it really helped me stabilize my wrists and forearms when I bench.

Also, time under tension and proper range of motion are absolutely crucial. The bar should hit your chest and if you've been benching like I used to (half rom) that bottom point will be your sticking point.

Consider a 5/3/1 sort of routine if you really want to make strength gains.

 

[rhodey]

Need Some Help Guys......

I am stuck at Lifting 155 Pounds and can't go any higher, MY stats 5 feet 10 inch tall and weigh 160 Pounds. I can do a one rep max of 175 #.

hear me out , I started going to Gym 3 yrs ago and I started with the just the bar and Incrementally went upto 160 # , I guess it's decent to be able to lift your own bodyweight but I want to do atleast 1.5 times my body weight.

Things I have tried

1. Stronglifts 5 X 5 program

2. Isolated Pecs , Triceps and Deltois Excercises.

3. Using Creatine 2500 mg a day, Fish Oil, Pre work out supplement and Protein (Atleast 150 grams a day) which is a mix of Shakes, Greek yogurt, tuna , shrimp, chicken etc.

I personally think I need to take more protein atleast 225 grams a day.....

Any humbling suggestions from the RVF members are welcome and Thanks in Advance

Things that stand out to me...



Intensity

Your Max is 175 while your work set weight is 155. So you are training with %88 of your max. Basically that's powerlifter "peaking" phase level. Too high to say at week in and week out. It's way harder to PROGRESS over longer stretches at any over %85.

I suggest dropping the weight to the %72-%77(of you max) range while upping your reps to the 10+ . Reps build muscle (provided you dont eat like a bird) and muscle moves weight!



Frequency Not sure how many times a week you bench but in my experience your bench frequency to atleast twice a week to have more "practice" doing the movement.


No you dont have to do flat bench twice a week (but you could) you could substitute Inclines, or dips, or whatever the hell give you "carryover" to your bench.

Nutrition
Too many guys get caught up in the what supplements to take when they ignore the basic fact that they are just not eating enough to grow and get stronger. You need a caloric surplus , so get it with good clean foods.

So basically you need to continue to build a solid strength base. You need to be patient and take your ego out of it. Bring the percentages down and go for more REPS at a lower weight say the 135 pound range. Reps in the 8-12 range. Do this for 3-5 sets. When you can hit 12 on EACH set bump the weight up 5lbs and start over.

Do this for about 8 weeks and then test your MAX and tell me what happens

Of course the above WILL NOT work if you do not....

...Eat more clean foods and stop worrying about your waistline, you're 160 lbs for chrissake! Unless you are 5'4" or less you will be a long way from getting fat. It's not wonder you were flat lining.... Get in an extra 500 cals a day over what you currently eat - (protein shake's will work) and make sure to eat cleaner foods without being anal about it.

Do this while working out the way I advised and your max WILL go up.

 

[Vaun]

I weigh 170 # now

You went up 10#, but you still gotta eat. Keep your training consistent where it is and starting eating more. I bet these numbers keep going up. Congrats on the progress.

 

[AntiTrace]

Lothario its been about a year since your last update. How you doing now?

 

[Lothario]

Not Good, I was gaining weight and got up to 173 # and hated the way I look but I was benching 185 #, I gained 2-3 Inches on my Belly, Started trimming, again slowly just by cutting out Carbs and Sugars in my Diet and keeping the Protein Intake High, Now I am back to 160 # and like how I look.

Still Benching the same at about 175 # 1-2 rep Max, Doing Bench Press atleast 2 times a week. looking to try some new suggestions recently given.

I think I would have to compromise between how I look and how much I can Lift. Thanks every one for taking the time give suggestions.​

 

[flyfreshandyoung]

Lothario,

There are a ton of ways to switch it up. You can search up Pyramiding, West Side, Wave Loading, 5x3x1 among others.

You could try having a Low Rep day and a High Rep Day. It's a combo I've used these past few months that has helped move me up tremendously after being stuck at 275 for months.

High Rep day basically uses a 5x3x1 program but with more volume. 5x3x1 uses percentages of 90% of your max (aka your training max) to build up every week. Your training max would be ~160 based on a 175 max. 160, then, is the number you would base all percentages off of, rounding to closest multiple of 5. It can be a hit to the ego to drop down so low, but trust me it's worth it. Low Rep day is tons of heavy triples.

First Week High Rep-

5x 65% (105 lbs)
5x 75% (120 lbs)
Rep out 85% (135 lbs). This should hopefully end up being around 10 or more reps.

Rep out again at 85%, as many sets as you can.

First Week Low Rep-

3xTraining Max
3xTraining Max
3xTraining Max
Etc, Etc until you can't do any more.

Second Week High Rep-

3x70%
3x80%
Rep Out x 90%

Rep Out as much as you can at 90%

Second Week Low Rep-

3xTraining Max
Etc. Until you can't any more

Third Week High Rep-

5x75%
3x85%
Rep Out x 95%

Rep out 95% until you can't anymore

Third Week Low Rep

3xTraining Max
Etc. until you can't anymore

Week Four- Add 5 pounds to your training max and start the process all over again.

No deloading for a long time, you're not lifting heavy enough (not being a dick. Deloads are for the pros who are doing mega amounts of weight. Us amateurs do not need it and it is almost always counter prodcutive).

If on the low rep days you can complete 5 sets at 3xTraining Max without failure, bump up to 4xTraining Max

 

[Ingocnito]

I'm surprised nobody mentioned working more on back development. In my opinion, that is one of the biggest things you can do to make a quick improvements in your pressing strength, whether it's overhead or lying down on a bench. Any sort of upper body pressing involves using the muscles of the back (latissimus dorsi, rhomboids, traps) as a platform from which to press. Having strong lats helps keep your upper body tight and anchored to the bench, and to help create a nice "groove" in which to lower the bar and then back up. OP should try adding some more pulling work into his program. Exercises like dumbbell rows (or better yet Kroc Rows), chins, shrugs, and minor accessory work like face pulls and band pull aparts (great for supersetting with your pushing exercises) will work wonders if you do them consistently. Don't think of the bench press solely in terms of the prime movers (chest, triceps, anterior deltoids) but be mindful of the other muscles that create the stability and optimal position from which to press. It's also great for shoulder health as well.

Totally agree here. Its one thing to exercise your shoulders to get bigger shoulders and more overall stability for pressing exercises, but to do the exact opposite exercise for your back when compared to your pressing exercises stresses the shoulder evenly and opposingly and will help your bench.

I.E.: For inclined bench, lat pull downs on cable machine or pull ups. For flat bench, bent over rows or laying on your back, lock a smith machine bar and pull your body up to your chest. It is literally the exact opposite/opposing exercise. Decline Bench, upright rows for your upper back and so on.

 

[Divorco]

Lothario, there is a tradeoff between weight and strength. I would gladly sacrifice ten pounds of bench press strength for three inches off my waist.

I don't especially disagree with any of the suggestions. But you can't do all of them. Also, some of the programs are a bit complicated. For a hardgainer who has plateaued, one extra rep is huge. Changing weights and reps every week makes it difficult to assess progress. I would stick with a simple scheme like Starting Strength. Then if there is no progress for a week, I would change one thing (weight/reps, volume, assistance exercise, etc.).

 

[WestCoast]

Lothario IMHO you need to go to low weight high reps (15 reps). Do them slow (count to three up and count to three down).

Start juicing (beets + broccoli) before you work out.

Drop the creatine for now.

Once you do 4 weeks of low weight high reps you will increase muscle endurance. Then you can go back to mass accumulation phase.

Phase 1 high reps
Phase two medium reps
Phase three heavy

Repeat. Sounds like you're consistently doing 2-4 reps with no reward.

(Note: since we met IRL I have gained 15 lbs, I can send you photos for proof if you want/info on what I changed via text if you like. Obviously not to be shared with anyone i have never met).

 

[InternetMarketer]

I think I would have to compromise between how I look and how much I can Lift. Thanks every one for taking the time give suggestions.​

Here are my recommendations...

First, I'll lay down some info, so that you can understand why removing carbohydrates from your diet is not very smart.

Basically, your body needs glycogen (created from carbohydrates) during strength training.

Generally, you want to consume around 75-150g of carbohydrates (relative to your energy needs) an hour and a half before training, so that your glycogen reserves are full during strength training. This allows you to complete your workout without feeling fatigued, dizzy, etc...you obviously don't want your blood sugar levels to drop or you're going to pass the fuck out during your heavy squats/bench (I've seen it happen multiple times, always ends up bad).

After your workout, you NEED to consume carbohydrates as well (Fuck the low carb/high protein diets) to restore your energy levels. Aim for 50-100g of carbs and 50-70g of protein after your workout.

It's common knowledge that your body can not burn fat and grow muscle at the same time.

Here are my recommendations on how to workout, so that you gain strength and lose fat:

Workout 5 times a week with two days off, but you're also going to be doing cardio 5 days a week (I generally do 5 days of jogging and then HIIT -High Intensity Interval Training- on Saturday to keep my body guessing, but you have to decide if you really need two days off).

You should split the muscle groups you work on for each individual day (For example: Chest, legs, shoulders, arms, back. Or an improved four day split Chest, Legs, Shoulders + Triceps, Biceps + Back, followed by one day off -Friday- and then a full body workout on -Saturday- with a rest day on -Sunday-/ There are many variations to choose from)

You should do your strength training no later than before noon and wait about 4 hours from when you consumed your last meal, before you do cardio (your glycogen levels are generally at their lowest point immediately after you wake up and 4+ hours after your last meal).

Your body generally uses carbs as an energy source during the first forty minutes of cardio training and then it starts to use fat as an energy source (your body will use fat as an energy source assuming you keep your pulse at about 140). Your cardio should last about an hour long, longer than that is unnecessary. It is imperative that you keep your pulse around 140 during cardio, anything higher or lower is not ideal.

Finally, you don't want to consume a lot of sugar, because your body becomes reluctant to burn fat. I'd explain why excessive sugar is bad, but I'm sure you know why.

Before anyone says: OMG bro-sceince, why do slow cardio, HIIT is like so more effective for fat loss brah.

Following through with this regime is generally tough on the body, but manageable for most. If you substitute the slow cardio with HIIT, your body will literally break down on you in a few weeks, maybe even in a month or two if you have a good fitness background and have plenty of time for rest. But honestly, are you really going to have enough energy to do strength training, HITT and go to work all in the same day? Most likely not.

Generally speaking, the only people that I know who can handle lifting + HIIT every day for a long period of time are professional athletes, because they have ample time for rest and don't have to worry about other things.

 

[Eastbound]

Imo, if you want to build your pressing strength there are better options than bench press. Hand Stand Pushups are the king. I have been working on them for a few months and now I am at the point where I can do 15 reps, nose to floor, on the first set. My shoulders and upper chest have blown up. Try it.

 

[Kieran]

For those interested, this is a great thread by Joel Jameson (EZA on sherdog), one of the top Strength and Conditioning coaches in mma, discussing low intensity steady state cardio. It's a long read, but worth it if you are interested in the topic (just read the posts from EZA if you are pressed for time).

http://forums.sherdog.com/forums/f13/myth-aerobic-system-everyone-has-all-wrong-965299/

 

[InternetMarketer]

He's right, low intensity cardio is the bomb. I know numerous professional athletes (ice hockey and fighters that do low intensity cardio every day, in addition to their respective practices). I don't know why HIIT has become so popular, boggles the mind (people are starting to seriously neglect the benefits of slow/moderate cardio). I always liked the Soviet style of training, hours of cardio per day along with practicing their respective sport.

 

[Kieran]

Yeah, Low intensity steady state ftw.

Same in Thailand. They had me running a slow 10km or more 6 days a week and my stamina in the ring has never been better. It's funny how proponents of HIIT will criticise the Thai system / old school boxers etc saying that LISS roadwork is not effective based on their misunderstanding of how energy systems work. Do they not think that fighters and trainers would have experimented with all sorts of approaches to find the most effective methods over the years?