Called Off My Wedding

wwtl said:
loremipsum said:
DannyAlberta said:
General Mayhem said:
I think any guy who wants any semblance of a traditional relationship has to fight hard against the negative influences from modern society and from a girls friends. However, you can't do that alone. You need friends with wives, kids, and strong marriages that are good influences to surround your wife.
When someone on this Forum actually figures out how you can do this and win (assuming it's even possible outside of a crazy isolationist cult), they will have hacked modern mating life. I'm not sure it's even possible.
Funny how this forum that once was about collecting notches has almost collectively come to the conclusion that traditional relationships are the way to go.
Yes, we have Game that the average bluepilled guy does not have, but to quote OP in another thread
If you believe in god, do you really think he is going to deliver a virgin just because you had a change of ideology?
.
It may be just harder for us.
I asked God for that traditional relationship two years ago and what I see now is that I'm getting tested to stay chaste with increasing difficulty levels.

I fully expect to get presented with more and more unbelievably easy opportunities to score notches which I might have to let go to actually get to the prize. The shape of the latter has been clearly communicated to me during the last two months.

All that while being at peak SMV for a bachelor with the window closing in less than a decade. That requires some faith I can tell you.
Since this weekend I have the full picture how God intends me to handle this:

As a man on peak SMV instead of giving in to female desire and fornicate spinning plates until I hit the wall, use the full leverage to vet and lock down one young fertile wife with a high sex drive by leading her religiously until she is completely into you.

This turn of events sounds kinda absurd from a degenerate Western perspective, where marriage turned into a primarily financial transaction of old people. But the Lord will manage to pull this off.
 

General Mayhem

Kingfisher
No More Mr. Soy Boy said:
evilbuttmunch said:
Thank you for sharing, but you sound like a naive moron, too black-pilled to appreciate what you have. You spent five years together, and claim that the last few months have caused you to drift apart because you were fixing up a house. You sound eternally ungrateful to a woman who is doing much more compromising than you are. Most women are not willing to compromise like that, and you've decided to discard something like five years of a relationship, and marriage in your 20s with what sounds like a mostly great woman, for the rare possibility that you'll find someone even better.

If she enjoyed work that much, it's because the rest of her life was boring. That's YOUR fault.
So he's missing the chance to marriage in his 20's?

Give me a break. It surprises me just how many here who seem to come from a scarcity mindset and think it's best to just stick with a woman like that who is clearly too much of a sheep to choose a meaningless career over prioritising a family with an intelligent, masculine and traditional conservative man with some great values. I tell you what, THAT is rare today and something she'll have to regret later in life.

And that in itself should tell everyone everything they need to know.
It's better to not have kids than having kids with the wrong woman but so many men are putting up with so much shit nowadays so the boundaries have moved so far off that we are now calling a man a moron for not staying with a woman who shows that he's not priority number one or even number two.

There are still places in Eastern Europe where OP can find traditional women who would never say the crap that came out of her mouth. It's not a man's job to convince a woman to choose family over career, a good woman would choose that path anyway regardless of some new friends from work.

Her comment on religious people as only being a bunch crackheads probably says something about her morality system too. That is a more important aspect with a woman than if you're able to crack non politically correct jokes with her, if she's "very good at saving money" or wants a small wedding.
wwtl said:
wwtl said:
loremipsum said:
DannyAlberta said:
General Mayhem said:
I think any guy who wants any semblance of a traditional relationship has to fight hard against the negative influences from modern society and from a girls friends. However, you can't do that alone. You need friends with wives, kids, and strong marriages that are good influences to surround your wife.
When someone on this Forum actually figures out how you can do this and win (assuming it's even possible outside of a crazy isolationist cult), they will have hacked modern mating life. I'm not sure it's even possible.
Funny how this forum that once was about collecting notches has almost collectively come to the conclusion that traditional relationships are the way to go.
Yes, we have Game that the average bluepilled guy does not have, but to quote OP in another thread
If you believe in god, do you really think he is going to deliver a virgin just because you had a change of ideology?
.
It may be just harder for us.
I asked God for that traditional relationship two years ago and what I see now is that I'm getting tested to stay chaste with increasing difficulty levels.

I fully expect to get presented with more and more unbelievably easy opportunities to score notches which I might have to let go to actually get to the prize. The shape of the latter has been clearly communicated to me during the last two months.

All that while being at peak SMV for a bachelor with the window closing in less than a decade. That requires some faith I can tell you.
Since this weekend I have the full picture how God intends me to handle this:

As a man on peak SMV instead of giving in to female desire and fornicate spinning plates until I hit the wall, use the full leverage to vet and lock down one young fertile wife with a high sex drive by leading her religiously until she is completely into you.

This turn of events sounds kinda absurd from a degenerate Western perspective, where marriage turned into a primarily financial transaction of old people. But the Lord will manage to pull this off.
I hope to see some infield reports on this type of activity on this new generation of the forum.

"This girl at the farmers market gave me a ton of IOI's, my game was tight and my logistics were good. We went back to my flat to look at some books and she tried to initiate sex and I told her I don't fornicate casually. She had no idea how to handle this rejection. Now she won't stop texting me."

No idea how this plays out in real life.
 
General Mayhem said:
wwtl said:
wwtl said:
loremipsum said:
DannyAlberta said:
When someone on this Forum actually figures out how you can do this and win (assuming it's even possible outside of a crazy isolationist cult), they will have hacked modern mating life. I'm not sure it's even possible.
Funny how this forum that once was about collecting notches has almost collectively come to the conclusion that traditional relationships are the way to go.
Yes, we have Game that the average bluepilled guy does not have, but to quote OP in another thread
If you believe in god, do you really think he is going to deliver a virgin just because you had a change of ideology?
.
It may be just harder for us.
I asked God for that traditional relationship two years ago and what I see now is that I'm getting tested to stay chaste with increasing difficulty levels.

I fully expect to get presented with more and more unbelievably easy opportunities to score notches which I might have to let go to actually get to the prize. The shape of the latter has been clearly communicated to me during the last two months.

All that while being at peak SMV for a bachelor with the window closing in less than a decade. That requires some faith I can tell you.
Since this weekend I have the full picture how God intends me to handle this:

As a man on peak SMV instead of giving in to female desire and fornicate spinning plates until I hit the wall, use the full leverage to vet and lock down one young fertile wife with a high sex drive by leading her religiously until she is completely into you.

This turn of events sounds kinda absurd from a degenerate Western perspective, where marriage turned into a primarily financial transaction of old people. But the Lord will manage to pull this off.
I hope to see some infield reports on this type of activity on this new generation of the forum.

"This girl at the farmers market gave me a ton of IOI's, my game was tight and my logistics were good. We went back to my flat to look at some books and she tried to initiate sex and I told her I don't fornicate casually. She had no idea how to handle this rejection. Now she won't stop texting me."

No idea how this plays out in real life.
This looks like a low value mindset to me. You seem to view girls as high value trophies which need to be acquired with "tight" game and kept happy by fornicating with them.

But being the prize means the girl who is madly into you (because of your ability to lead her) will get extremely creative to get what she really wants and desires. And this kind of girl is the only kind you actually want to vet from.

Girls who don't desire you and view men as accessories are a waste of time. All carousel riders who move on the second they hear "no fornication" are a complete waste of time as well.

Now the even harder task is to hold that no-fornication frame until marriage. Most men fall here and earn the consequences: She loses respect and everything falls apart.
 

MajorStyles

Kingfisher
A lot of men in the Manosphere think "She's 24/25...she should realize that her fertility is almost up and run to the alter." Nothing could be further from the truth. Women know that they can have children in their thirties and even early fourties without complications (especially in this era of modern medicine). So they don't buy the idea that their opportunity to procreate is over in their early twenties. My wife had a child at 35 and 39 and both are fine (knock on wood).

A woman in her early thirties is less likely to play games, since she realizes that her window is closer so to speak. That being said, many Western women in their early 30s are already damaged beyond repair.
 

Feyoder

Robin
wwtl said:
Now the even harder task is to hold that no-fornication frame until marriage. Most men fall here and earn the consequences: She loses respect and everything falls apart.
So what? Filtered.
 
MajorStyles said:
A lot of men in the Manosphere think "She's 24/25...she should realize that her fertility is almost up and run to the alter." Nothing could be further from the truth. Women know that they can have children in their thirties and even early fourties without complications (especially in this era of modern medicine). So they don't buy the idea that their opportunity to procreate is over in their early twenties. My wife had a child at 35 and 39 and both are fine (knock on wood).

A woman in her early thirties is less likely to play games, since she realizes that her window is closer so to speak. That being said, many Western women in their early 30s are already damaged beyond repair.
You're confusing women's delusion with reality. Your case of your wife having kids late (God bless her) without any assistance, unfortunately does not negate the reality that women's fertility starts to dramatically drop starting from the age of 30. Lots of graphs, studies and news articles on this that I wont bother posting, but it is common knowledge.

Fertility drops with age. Now, pair that with women taking Birth Control for 2 decades, having casual sex, catching STDs, drinking copious amounts of alcohol like a drunkard, having abortions, taking Plan B multiple times throughout her life, a crap western diet filled with hormone disruptors, and you have the fertility crisis we're facing today. Women are more and more, facing challenges of being unable to get pregnant, and IVF has a very low success rate, so no "modern medicine" does not allow women to push pregnancy for a later time.

Sure, we all know of a women or two who had kids in their late 30's and even 40, but those women did not have to face the cultural and environmental factors that disrupt their fertility that women do today. Usually, the women in these anecdotal stories are late genxrs, Boomers and older.

My point is that it is delusional for women to think they can delay childbearing past their 20s, and we have the media and culture as a whole to thank for that.
 

loremipsum

Kingfisher
I'd be interested to know how birth control affects fertility.
It's pretty brutal in terms of what it does in woman's body. Wouldn't be surprised if it somehow lowers fertility.
 
If you try and goolag "Does Birth control affect fertility", you wont find any studies done by White Lab Coats trying to prove that it does. You'll see things like "Oh no, as long as you're off of it for 2-3 months, you'll be back to normal!" "no, scientist have concluded BC does not negatively affect fertility" etc.

I mean, it's simple logic to see how taking a drug to prevent pregnancy will affect a woman's fertility...especially if a woman has been taking it for over 10 years.

What these BC makers are doing as of late is quietly reducing the amount of estrogen in their BC, as more and more women are suffering side effects. In the end, I don't need any study proving that BC lowers female fertility and i'd rather err on side of caution. Seeing how women are having a hard time getting pregnant like never before in history, i'll be fine to draw my conclusion without "solid evidence". It's like Alex Jones being right all along about our water "turning the frogs gay".
 
Captain GH and Dr. Howard are adding an important element to the discussion and I want to respond to that to fill in more of the picture.

I can't jump right to saying that this was 100% the right move. I probably won't know for a while. There's a voice in my head telling me this could be a mistake and maybe I could win the war if I kept at it.

But, at the same time I've been working on this relationship for almost 5 years. I agree that you have to train a mold a modern woman through trials and hard work because I did it to some extent. There were plenty of times I wanted to walk out but didn't. One of the things I valued most about the relationship is that we both seemed so intent on making it work.

We did get in several fights about her friends and she couldn't see why I didn't like them or thought they were bad influences. She used to come home from work in tears and bitch about how awful they were to work with constantly. No matter how I broke it down she insisted they were her friends.

Like Dr. Howard pointed out, if the follower won't submit, there are problems. In a lot of aspects my girl did submit, but obviously not entirely. She was happy to submit to things especially if she could see the benefits. I got her into intermittent fasting and she got skinnier, she got off birth control and her energy and mood improved, etc.

But, at a certain point the woman has to give up her ego-pleasing dreams to focus on kids, even if you are only having a few of them. I don't think only having 3 kids would have broke my heart. I never even said she could never work again, just tone it back while the kids are young. But, my girl wasn't ready to give up the satisfaction she got from work for anything. Neither could she see how she could gain that satisfaction through other means. Maybe I could have gotten her to see that but waiting to see if having a kid would change that is a huge gamble.

I think she understood that men and women aren't equal in a physical and emotional sense. At the same time she was unwilling to give up the part of her ego that was satisfied by work. Her ego in general got to be a problem. That's why she would say things like how she didn't need religion to tell her how to live her life, or that she hated the priest who was going to marry us and thought that discussions with him, or spiritual life in general were wastes of time. I know she tried to get with the program but in a way I think that broke her.

I talked to one of my close friends who got married by the same priest and he told me about a time his wife wanted to talk some issues out with him after their first child was born. That story just made me think about how it was the wife's openness to listen to something bigger than herself was what made that work.

At one point during these last few discussions with my girl I asked if she believed in anything bigger than herself and she told me she didn't. It's not that she doesn't believe in god but that she didn't care to consider it. That was pretty telling for me.

That's part of the issue with modernism in general. Nobody wants to stop and consider anything bigger than themselves because life is good. The paychecks come in, you can buy the toys you want, and have kids and a healthy family without ever considering the bigger picture. Another thing I hate is that even if the woman wants to try stepping away from work the corporate machine is setup to make them believe that if they take a break for a while to raise kids no one will ever hire them again.
I've been married for 16 years. Went through a lot of these trials myself. I'm thinking of starting a discussion just on marriage tips/experiences themselves but for now, exploring the forum. Read the whole thread.

I'm researching marriage counselors. The challenge, of course, is getting a marriage counselor who will not make the modernism situation worse. Church is one avenue (We belong to two) so I'm hoping they can help. Looking on the forum to see if anyone else has experience with this.

When discussing things with my wife, she has her opinion, backed often by her "herd" of friends and then there's me. It's like me going to battle against a whole army at times. I'm only human. Sometimes I can be defensive and this can cloud my judgement. In Poland, before one can marry, they apparently have to go through PRE marital counseling, which I think is wise. It will help ferret out incompatible couples and avoid divorce.

In Eastern Europe, I was told, there is a stigma against going to a psychiatrist. It marks one as "crazy" and therefore untrustworthy. Some of this stigma I think exists in the states as well. It's common to hear "You're nuts! Go see a shrink!" I went to a psychiatrist for occupational stress and the guy was nice, but didn't have a lot of good tips for how to deal with my stress at work, sadly. And that guy was a neutral professional. Like auto mechanics and doctors, it can be hard to find a good one. After all, in this culture of consumerism and strong leftist ideology, even the counselors are awash in it.

Your friend's wife apparently gave you a good followup that your wife may have been on the path to cultural hedonism or perhaps, now that you're out of the picture, there wasn't anyone left to help guide her away from it so she fell in. I followed up on previous exes I had and they also appear to have been like the moth to the flame. Most of them realized a few years later that they had let a good one go and reached out to me, but I had already moved on. You'll probably be in a similar boat (my guess.)

As you said, we are "fighting" the culture, so to speak, because in conversations I had with older folks (and these conversations were 30 years ago, so that takes this back to the 1940s!!!), women were better gatekeepers of relationships than today. It sounds amazing, but back then, men didn't have to be these superhuman creatures figuring out game, "networking", and such. Her family circle/friends were largely an asset in keeping her grounded but she was also part of the "herd" doing just that. I'm curious: What's your friend's wife like? Is she exceptionally grounded?

One observation/thought about your story (thanks for sharing): Women particularly, but also men, can sometimes get caught up in "career". They call it "family values", not "career values." When I work, I remind my wife that this is my "career" meaning I have to think in terms of my value in my profession, but I also am aware that my "career" exists to serve my family, not the other way around. My income is largely earmarked for my, and the family's, survival: the mortgage, the bills, and keeping up fed and looked after. I'm not the sole breadwinner, and my wife's income does help, but I'm the difference between us living a comfortable life versus in a two family tenement and she appears aware of that. I think that's helped a lot in keeping our marriage together.

I'm chuckling a bit with the COVID crisis in that due to the stores being closed, there's a lot less materialism to suck women in. Yeah, they can shop online and such, but there's less of the shiny-object dopamine rush in public. Do we really need to go out to restaurants so much?

It's been a while since this thread is active and I hope you're doing well.
 
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