Demons Can Put Thoughts Into Your Mind

Chi-Rho

Pigeon
May I suggest you read 1John 4:4, Ephesians 2:2, Colossians 1:13-14, 2 Corinthians 6:15, Ephesians 1:13-14, 1 Corinthians 6:19 and finally Romans 8:38-39 (all KJV). There is no example in scripture of a believer in Jesus Christ being demon possessed, all cases of demonic possession were with those who were unbelievers. Be careful not to rely on stories of believers and demon possession, many other explanations are possible. The Christian who is indwelt by the Holy Spirit, should not fear demon possession. Having said that, demons do attack believers in various ways. Once again (in my humble opinion), oppressed yes.... possessed no. In peace, God bless.
I'm by no means an exocrist ok, and I think I might've already given inaccurate information on this topic, but after further research it seems "you don't have to open yourself up to the demonic to become possessed". Demons can take possession of 'parts' or the entire body, it can be isolated. It's false that you have to give consent for the possession to happen and it's also false that you have to do something evil to become posessed.

You can become possessed apparently by:
1) committing a mortal sin
2) something gravely disordered happens to you
3) the will of God

People that are partially possessed can generally function normal and might not even know it.
Full possession the demon is in control all of the time. But with that being said apparently it doesn't look the way you think it does.

Anyways, it's a complicated topic. If you think simply 'the Holy Spirit is in me I'm fine' then I think you're missing the overall point of what's actually happening. The demonic is on a short leash. God allows demons to oppress you for your santificaiton, for you to grow in virtue.

Maybe you don't care for the Roman Catholic answer on this, flip to the Book of Job. You might say, "He wasn't possessed." But was he not under incredible oppression which most people will never experience? Of course he was.

Not to mention, but apparently quite a few possessed people are some the holiest people. For them to even have a normal functioning life, they have to strive after holiness far more than the average person. Anyways make of it what you will, there's quite a bit more on the topic, even from a scriptural point of view which I think you're overlooking, but goodluck regardless.
 
While the designation "demon" may appear foreign to mundane thinking, the subject addresses something that I find very interesting, important, and, actually, hardly seriously discussed and understood:

Where do thoughts come from?

Now, I have an opinion on this and will mention it below but what I really wanted to impart is how I dealt with thoughts: I had a phase in my life where I was pondering very much over philosophical, spiritual, religious questions and, like so many, I drilled myself deeper and deeper into complicated, desperate constructions because there seems to be no end if you continue to ask: why, what´s the reason for that, and the reason for that reason, and so on; it wasn´t OCD but still very uncomfortable. Then I read about meditation and tried that and I can tell you: I failed terribly at the attempt to not think! Very very frustrating ! I felt like a total failure. Then I saw an offer for a (free) meditation course, and there I got the advice that I wanted to impart here because over all the years and decades I found this among the few that work (for me): don´t give energy into thoughts. Sounds simple, no... but a)it works like a charm, and b) never would I have come myself to that idea ! I was hugely happy and thankful for this advice, and still am. The other advice that I consider as working well, and is of-course kind-of similar to the first one, is: be the observer; thoughts are allowed to be, allowed to exist, but don´t engage, don´t be attached, just let them be, but don´t care.

So with these tips, I was able to let go of the permanent stream of thoughts and am now (self-assessment) at a level where I am more immediately experiencing.

So experience what? I could say "God" to be in line with the forum but to be honest, I call it the "It". The "It" is that which is there when I myself do nothing; because I found that when I try to do nothing, there is still very well something in my head ! That which is there, I call the "It": and I therefore consider the "It" as the cause of thoughts that come into my head. I don´t know what the "It" is... but I don´t have to care about that. So to my initial question, Where do thoughts come from, my answer (at this point in my life) would be: from the "It". But I think it quite possible that I will at some time experience something different that may be more of what one would call "God". I just go by what I experience... so far I experience an "It", maybe some time later I will experience "God".

In any case: I was given advice of how to deal with OCD-like thinking, and... boy that was important, a huge huge help in my life ! I was desperate, and that advice made a huge difference for me.
So maybe this helps one or the other here (but not quite sure because I guess the forum is in the paradigm of christian religion, and I suppose that that which I say is not really part of that paradigm. But since it was so most helpful to me, and I would never have come to that idea on my own, I thought that I would share this tip ! ).
Thoughts and all other physical activity in the bodies of all living organisms are powered by electricity which is generated by ionizing sodium and potassium ions in a chemical reaction using oxygen and macronutrients such as fats, carbohydrates, and protein.

The ions are stored in the cells, and also neurons in the case of animals, and released when any action is committed to generate the power needed to perform that action. In biology, this is referred to as the action potential or bioelectricity.

Bioelectricity was discovered by Luigi Galvani in the late 1700s which proved that life forms are essentially just machines driven by a power source and using nutrients as fuel for power generation which he demonstrated in a disturbing experiment where he reanimated dead animals using electricity coming from leyden jars, which he also invented, and is the precursor to the electric battery, and is charged using lightning rods, which were invented by Benjamin Franklin.
 

Peter22

Pigeon
Thoughts and all other physical activity in the bodies of all living organisms are powered by electricity which is generated by ionizing sodium and potassium ions in a chemical reaction using oxygen and macronutrients such as fats, carbohydrates, and protein.

The ions are stored in the cells, and also neurons in the case of animals, and released when any action is committed to generate the power needed to perform that action. In biology, this is referred to as the action potential or bioelectricity.

Bioelectricity was discovered by Luigi Galvani in the late 1700s which proved that life forms are essentially just machines driven by a power source and using nutrients as fuel for power generation which he demonstrated in a disturbing experiment where he reanimated dead animals using electricity coming from leyden jars, which he also invented, and is the precursor to the electric battery, and is charged using lightning rods, which were invented by Benjamin Franklin.
My point "Where do thoughts come from?" was meant to refer to the content of thoughts, not thoughts as a phenomenon generally. Your text obviously does in no way explain where the content of thoughts comes from.

What you point out, only does, IMO, point to the fundamental problem of the mechanistic world view (which I´m knowledgeable of, I´m a chemist by training), namely the problem of the first mover.
I came across a, IMO, very striking argument, in this realm: these brain researchers can now very well demonstrate that a limb moves when a certain brain area is stimulated; but... : WHERE does the impulse to stimulate that area come from?
In this question, I think, lies the entire problem.

Similarly, to the question if the brain is the place, the cause, of consciousness, I find this argumentation interesting: the brain to be a receiver, rather than an originator. So it´s argued that when the brain is destroyed, then consciousness is gone but the counter-argument is: with the brain destroyed, only this receiver is destroyed but consciousness still exists. Fwiw... I find that an interesting approach, worth further speculating...
 
My point "Where do thoughts come from?" was meant to refer to the content of thoughts, not thoughts as a phenomenon generally. Your text obviously does in no way explain where the content of thoughts comes from.

What you point out, only does, IMO, point to the fundamental problem of the mechanistic world view (which I´m knowledgeable of, I´m a chemist by training), namely the problem of the first mover.
I came across a, IMO, very striking argument, in this realm: these brain researchers can now very well demonstrate that a limb moves when a certain brain area is stimulated; but... : WHERE does the impulse to stimulate that area come from?
In this question, I think, lies the entire problem.

Similarly, to the question if the brain is the place, the cause, of consciousness, I find this argumentation interesting: the brain to be a receiver, rather than an originator. So it´s argued that when the brain is destroyed, then consciousness is gone but the counter-argument is: with the brain destroyed, only this receiver is destroyed but consciousness still exists. Fwiw... I find that an interesting approach, worth further speculating...

The source of conscious thought or intelligence is neuroplasticity which is the ability of the brain to voluntarily rewire its electrical connections.

This phenomenon was discovered by American scientist Karl Lashley in 1922.

The mind itself is nothing but information in the brain which is caused by the input of DNA and environmental stimuli.

The thoughts are accumulated as a result of the influence of genetic and environmental factors, which is why many of us here are complaining about the leftist opposition to eugenics, the leftist propaganda lowering the intelligence of the people, and the anti-androgens that are lowering men's testosterone levels and thus their intelligence.

If you can document your thoughts by creating text, sounds, images, and videos, then you are already uploading your mind to the medium that stores that information whether it be physical media such as tablets, scrolls, books, paintings, photos, phonograph discs, film, tapes, hard drives, floppy discs, optical discs, and flash drives or cloud storage on internet servers. And if your thoughts can influence or completely convert people to your way of thinking then you are already uploading your mind into those people's brains.

The brain-computer interface even allows thoughts to be transmitted directly into computers and this was invented by American scientist Jacques Vidal in 1973.

Another American scientist named Jose Delgado actually proved that consciousness can be involuntarily altered by sending electrical currents into the person's brain to stimulate specific brain regions and compel specific actions. He invented a device called the Stimoceiver in the 1970s to test his hypothesis and it worked.

In fact the minds of living organisms can be started even after death by resurrecting the organism.

CPR and the defibrillator were invented by American scientist William B. Kouwenhoven in 1928 to resurrect people who died of respiratory or cardiac arrest.

American scientist Robert Cornish invented resurrection using oxygenated blood, adrenaline, and anticoagulants in 1934 to also revive people who died of respiratory or cardiac arrest.

With the neuroplasticity allowing the brain to wire itself into a specific configuration the person who was resurrected continues their thoughts exactly where they last left off because the brain keeps a record of its electrical activity.
 
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Peter22

Pigeon
The source of conscious thought or intelligence is neuroplasticity which is the ability of the brain to voluntarily rewire its electrical connections.

This phenomenon was discovered by American scientist Karl Lashley in 1922.

The mind itself is nothing but information in the brain which is caused by the input of DNA and environmental stimuli.

The thoughts are accumulated as a result of the influence of genetic and environmental factors, which is why many of us here are complaining about the leftist opposition to eugenics, the leftist propaganda lowering the intelligence of the people, and the anti-androgens that are lowering men's testosterone levels and thus their intelligence.

If you can document your thoughts by creating text, sounds, images, and videos, then you are already uploading your mind to the medium that stores that information whether it be physical media such as tablets, scrolls, books, paintings, photos, phonograph discs, film, tapes, hard drives, floppy discs, optical discs, and flash drives or cloud storage on internet servers. And if your thoughts can influence or completely convert people to your way of thinking then you are already uploading your mind into those people's brains.

The brain-computer interface even allows thoughts to be transmitted directly into computers and this was invented by American scientist Jacques Vidal in 1973.

Another American scientist named Jose Delgado actually proved that consciousness can be involuntarily altered by sending electrical currents into the person's brain to stimulate specific brain regions and compel specific actions. He invented a device called the Stimoceiver in the 1970s to test his hypothesis and it worked.

In fact the minds of living organisms can be started even after death by resurrecting the organism.

CPR and the defibrillator were invented by American scientist William B. Kouwenhoven in 1928 to resurrect people who died of respiratory or cardiac arrest.

American scientist Robert Cornish invented resurrection using oxygenated blood, adrenaline, and anticoagulants in 1934 to also revive people who died of respiratory or cardiac arrest.

With the neuroplasticity allowing the brain to wire itself into a specific configuration the person who was resurrected continues their thoughts exactly where they last left off because the brain keeps a record of its electrical activity.
I´ll give it to you that you seem to have a good overview over the goings-on in that scientific area... but what do you actually say? That consciousness is a function of complexly organized matter?
You haven´t addressed my earlier point of "WHERE does the impulse to stimulate that area come from?". Is there a scientific position to that question?

IMO, the idea of "consciousness as a function of complexly organized matter"... well, this idea can be confronted with the exact same questions as Evolutionary Theory: how likely is it that all these phenomena are the result of chance, of mutation - selection: things like the tongue of the woodpecker... amphibians evolving out of fish... all that is implausible. And similarly implausible is it that "consciousness is a function of complexly organized matter", it just doesn´t add up well, it leaves a lot to be desired, in explanatory value.

But look... for all the transhumanistic endeavors... I feel that there is one very simple question that is never addressed: WHO T* WANTS THAT. Who wants to live like that!!?? So I´ll be superior as a man-machine so t* what... nobody wants to live like that. Interestingly, this argument also refers to some "soft" factors that are not easily nameable... and IMO it´s this very phenomenon of these "soft" factors that prove the mechanistic, deterministic view wrong.

Lastly... here another, IMO, interesting idea... approach... thought-experiment: we have started to replace parts of humans with artificial parts: hips, knees, cardiac valves etc.: so...: could we build a human in laboratory? If we add neuron to neuron: will a human brain result?
For me... that´s a very uncomfortable thought. In a way, I have to admit that yes, I think, adding enough neurons together, a brain would result... which, I guess, would say that yes, consciousness is just a result of complexly organized matter.
The only thing that I can say to that is that I don´t like the idea. Also, nobody would like to be that person. Nobody would like to be the result of technical production. People want a mother and a father.
So... not sure eventually what to say... but sure of that I would not like a world of artificial transhumanism. And this preference... that is inherent in me... and that´s perhaps the preference of all humans... maybe that in itself already decides the question? I.e.: there will never be transhumanism because we don´t like it? And the fact that we don´t like it is the consequence of that we just simply are not biological machines?
 
I´ll give it to you that you seem to have a good overview over the goings-on in that scientific area... but what do you actually say? That consciousness is a function of complexly organized matter?
You haven´t addressed my earlier point of "WHERE does the impulse to stimulate that area come from?". Is there a scientific position to that question?

IMO, the idea of "consciousness as a function of complexly organized matter"... well, this idea can be confronted with the exact same questions as Evolutionary Theory: how likely is it that all these phenomena are the result of chance, of mutation - selection: things like the tongue of the woodpecker... amphibians evolving out of fish... all that is implausible. And similarly implausible is it that "consciousness is a function of complexly organized matter", it just doesn´t add up well, it leaves a lot to be desired, in explanatory value.

But look... for all the transhumanistic endeavors... I feel that there is one very simple question that is never addressed: WHO T* WANTS THAT. Who wants to live like that!!?? So I´ll be superior as a man-machine so t* what... nobody wants to live like that. Interestingly, this argument also refers to some "soft" factors that are not easily nameable... and IMO it´s this very phenomenon of these "soft" factors that prove the mechanistic, deterministic view wrong.

Lastly... here another, IMO, interesting idea... approach... thought-experiment: we have started to replace parts of humans with artificial parts: hips, knees, cardiac valves etc.: so...: could we build a human in laboratory? If we add neuron to neuron: will a human brain result?
For me... that´s a very uncomfortable thought. In a way, I have to admit that yes, I think, adding enough neurons together, a brain would result... which, I guess, would say that yes, consciousness is just a result of complexly organized matter.
The only thing that I can say to that is that I don´t like the idea. Also, nobody would like to be that person. Nobody would like to be the result of technical production. People want a mother and a father.
So... not sure eventually what to say... but sure of that I would not like a world of artificial transhumanism. And this preference... that is inherent in me... and that´s perhaps the preference of all humans... maybe that in itself already decides the question? I.e.: there will never be transhumanism because we don´t like it? And the fact that we don´t like it is the consequence of that we just simply are not biological machines?

Aside from genetic and environmental factors, there is also an element of random chance in human thought just like there is random chance in all physical phenomenon.

And we already had transhumanism even during the rise of the Christendom from 500-1400 because the industrial civilizations of Europe already had prosthetics such as glasses, ear trumpets, peg legs, and dial operated hands.

In fact the industrial civilizations of Europe and Asia had average lifespans of 50 years compared the the average lifespans of only 20 years with the tribal societies of the Jews, Africans, and Native Americans because food, nutritional supplements, and medicine was mass produced using draft animals, farming tools, quern stones, grain silos, saltworks, smokehouses, filter presses, and factory mills.

Simply having access to a wide variety of nutrients and medicine can enhance human performance through phenotypic plasticity, and this is not to mention that humans applied selective breeding on living organisms and even ourselves to enhance our quality using the manipulation of genes.

The Eurasians who descended from the steppes of Mongolia are conquerors by nature and the religions of Europe and Asia refer to people as holy soldiers, i.e. Christian Soldiers, and use terms such as holy war to motivate people to conquest and to become as powerful as possible.

I believe that heaven is a great allegory for people's desire to possess eternal life and unlimited power, but we are already becoming immortalized by uploading our thoughts into communications systems an becoming more and more powerful through our scientific and technological advances.

This is why the empires of Europe and Asia conquered vast tracks of land especially during the colonial era from 1415-1945 because we believe only in power.

By the 1400's, the West and the East were ready to bear the full weight of their industrial might on the Americas, Southern Africa, Asia, and Australia. The enhanced physical and mental performance of the Europeans and Asians because of their use of nutritional supplements and medicine and the use of gunpowder and rocket weapons, mass produced in factories, gave the European and Asian Empires an overwhelming advantage in colonizing other territories. Here is a list of territories colonized by the European and Asian Empires:

European Empires:

Viking Empire:


Iceland and Greenland (during the 800s)

Spain:

South America and the Philippine Archipelago

Portugal:

South America

UK:

Parts of North America, Malaysia, India, Southern Africa and Australia

France:

Parts of North America, Khmer, and Southern Africa

The Netherlands:

Indonesia, and Parts of Southern Africa

Germany:

Parts of Southern Africa

________________________________________________________________

Asian Empires:

India:


Kalinga (in 260 BCE), and Sri Lanka (in 1017)

Islamic Caliphate:

Egypt, Persia, Byzantium, Northern Africa, Spain, Portugal, Malaysia, Indonesia, Brunei, Mindanao, Palawan, and Coron (during the 600s)

Russia:

Eastern Europe and Northern Asia (Specifically the Kingdoms of Astrakhan, Kazan, and Sibir)

China:

Vietnam, Tibet, Mongolia, Manchuria, Korea, Taiwan, Hainan, Hong Kong, Singapore, and Pangasinan

Japan:

Hokkaido (during the 600s), Shikoku, Kyushu, Ryukyu, and an attempted invasion of Korea
 
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Peter22

Pigeon
Aside from genetic and environmental factors, there is also an element of random chance in human thought just like there is random chance in all physical phenomenon.

And we already had transhumanism even during the rise of the Christendom from 500-1400 because the industrial civilizations of Europe already had prosthetics such as glasses, ear trumpets, peg legs, and dial operated hands.

In fact the industrial civilizations of Europe and Asia had average lifespans of 50 years compared the the average lifespans of only 20 years with the tribal societies of the Jews, Africans, and Native Americans because food, nutritional supplements, and medicine was mass produced using draft animals, farming tools, quern stones, grain silos, saltworks, smokehouses, filter presses, and factory mills.

Simply having access to a wide variety of nutrients and medicine can enhance human performance through phenotypic plasticity, and this is not to mention that humans applied selective breeding on living organisms and even ourselves to enhance our quality using the manipulation of genes.

The Eurasians who descended from the steppes of Mongolia are conquerors by nature and the religions of Europe and Asia refer to people as holy soldiers, i.e. Christian Soldiers, and use terms such as holy war to motivate people to conquest and to become as powerful as possible.

I believe that heaven is a great allegory for people's desire to possess eternal life and unlimited power, but we are already becoming immortalized by uploading our thoughts into communications systems an becoming more and more powerful through our scientific and technological advances.

This is why the empires of Europe and Asia conquered vast tracks of land especially during the colonial era from 1415-1945 because we believe only in power.

By the 1400's, the West and the East were ready to bear the full weight of their industrial might on the Americas, Southern Africa, Asia, and Australia. The enhanced physical and mental performance of the Europeans and Asians because of their use of nutritional supplements and medicine and the use of gunpowder and rocket weapons, mass produced in factories, gave the European and Asian Empires an overwhelming advantage in colonizing other territories. Here is a list of territories colonized by the European and Asian Empires:

European Empires:

Viking Empire:


Iceland and Greenland (during the 800s)

Spain:

South America and the Philippine Archipelago

Portugal:

South America

UK:

Parts of North America, Malaysia, India, Southern Africa and Australia

France:

Parts of North America, Khmer, and Southern Africa

The Netherlands:

Indonesia, and Parts of Southern Africa

Germany:

Parts of Southern Africa

________________________________________________________________

Asian Empires:

India:


Kalinga (in 260 BCE), and Sri Lanka (in 1017)

Islamic Caliphate:

Egypt, Persia, Byzantium, Northern Africa, Spain, Portugal, Malaysia, Indonesia, Brunei, Mindanao, Palawan, and Coron (during the 600s)

Russia:

Eastern Europe and Northern Asia (Specifically the Kingdoms of Astrakhan, Kazan, and Sibir)

China:

Vietnam, Tibet, Mongolia, Manchuria, Korea, Taiwan, Hainan, Hong Kong, Singapore, and Pangasinan

Japan:

Hokkaido (during the 600s), Shikoku, Kyushu, Ryukyu, and an attempted invasion of Korea
Ok... enhancements...etc. Whatever. I don´t have a final idea about all that but I´ll bring up again a point that does, IMO, not well agree with various transhumanistic endeavors: the phenomenon that is called mesmerism. Today less known than 100 years ago... I would like to point the attention to the phenomenon of humans touching each other: touching the skin of another person, touching each other, in an erotic context, that´s a quality on its own. It´s very little addressed as phenomenon. It´s a very intense communication. And my point would be: machine not can do that ! Right? And with artificial parts in the body, that also doesn´t work that way! So the human form IS marked as something distinctive, special. So these fr***en ideas about uploading the consciousness etc., it´s just pointless because, as I said: nobody wants to live like that.

I´ll bring up another point in this context: death, and the idea of living forever. There is a very grave, existential aspect to the temporal limitation of life that I learned from Heidegger: if there was no death, nobody would move his ass one inch in this world ! It´s mañana forever ! Death IS necessary in life in order to inspire action ! E.g. if a woman didn´t expire, she would never settle for a husband. Only the fact that few years later she won´t marry at all anymore makes her settle.
There are of-course many other problematic aspects of eternal life, i.e. psychological aspects, what about boredeom, tedium... very possibly, we just aren´t constructed for eternal life. And... to just add another point randomly coming to mind, who considers himself that perfect that he wants to stay that way forever?

So IMO, as soon as one looks a tad deeper into all these ideas, they fall apart. Like Evolutionary Theory: seems so logical at first view but the moment you have a closer look, it just doesn´t add up. Same with transhumanism, eternal development, and various other ideas. In any case, IMO needs to be looked at diligently and in detail; a cursory general view won´t hold good.
 
Ok... enhancements...etc. Whatever. I don´t have a final idea about all that but I´ll bring up again a point that does, IMO, not well agree with various transhumanistic endeavors: the phenomenon that is called mesmerism. Today less known than 100 years ago... I would like to point the attention to the phenomenon of humans touching each other: touching the skin of another person, touching each other, in an erotic context, that´s a quality on its own. It´s very little addressed as phenomenon. It´s a very intense communication. And my point would be: machine not can do that ! Right? And with artificial parts in the body, that also doesn´t work that way! So the human form IS marked as something distinctive, special. So these fr***en ideas about uploading the consciousness etc., it´s just pointless because, as I said: nobody wants to live like that.

I´ll bring up another point in this context: death, and the idea of living forever. There is a very grave, existential aspect to the temporal limitation of life that I learned from Heidegger: if there was no death, nobody would move his ass one inch in this world ! It´s mañana forever ! Death IS necessary in life in order to inspire action ! E.g. if a woman didn´t expire, she would never settle for a husband. Only the fact that few years later she won´t marry at all anymore makes her settle.
There are of-course many other problematic aspects of eternal life, i.e. psychological aspects, what about boredeom, tedium... very possibly, we just aren´t constructed for eternal life. And... to just add another point randomly coming to mind, who considers himself that perfect that he wants to stay that way forever?

So IMO, as soon as one looks a tad deeper into all these ideas, they fall apart. Like Evolutionary Theory: seems so logical at first view but the moment you have a closer look, it just doesn´t add up. Same with transhumanism, eternal development, and various other ideas. In any case, IMO needs to be looked at diligently and in detail; a cursory general view won´t hold good.

With the advances in science and technology in the 20th and 21st centuries, the average lifespans in developed countries is already 80 years.

The average lifespan in hunter-gatherer societies is only 20 years, while the average lifespan in agrarian societies is 35 years, the average lifespan in industrial societies is 50 years, and the average lifespan in information societies is 80 years.

With all of the progress that has been made, the average lifespan is already 4 times higher than what prehistoric humans had, and with advances in nutrition, toxicology, exercise, diagnostic equipment, surgery, transplantation, regenerative medicine, resurrection, cloning, genetic engineering, synthetic biology, and prosthetics, the average lifespan may exceed 130 years by the end of the 21st century.

You must also consider that the abstinence from vice is expanding with the increased knowledge of the negative effects of substances like alcohol, smoking, drugs, chemical preservatives, and UV rays in the 20th century and gluten, trans and polyunsaturated fat, soy protein, spicy food, sour food, chocolate, beans, legumes, diary products, garlic, caffeine, ginger, oatmeal, and coconut in the 21st century, the average lifespan would increase even further from this alone.

Christians and other religious people may not realize it but simply abstaining from vice according to their religious doctrines can already artificially extend their lifespans.

You will gain eternal life when you go to heaven or hell, if you believe that, and nothing ever really dies, the mind which is just data in the brain, can live on by uploading the information to physical mediums like books or e-books or influencing people's thinking.

The mesmerism that you mentioned is the stimulation of various nerves to generate a response from the brain.

When a person is generating emotions, the brain simply uses input stimuli to send electrical currents to the endocrine glands to release stimulatory hormones that will bind to receptors in the brain to generate electrical impulses that will result in a heightened state of physiological activity where logical thinking in the higher cognitive areas of the brain such as the pre-frontal cortex, hippocampus, amygdala, and cerebellum is suppressed and instinct dominates by activating the sympathetic nervous system which is responsible for the fight-or-flight emotions like anger, anxiety, and depression and also other emotions.

This is why people with an excess of stimulatory hormones are given hormone replacement therapy with inhibitory hormones to block the emotional responses and calm the person down.

An interesting note about religious morality is that the heaven or hell and God vs the Devil narrative originated in ancient eastern religions like Shenism in China, Hinduism in India, and Zoroastrianism in Persia and the hells described in those religions along with Christianity and Islam are not primarily places of punishment but bases where the Devil is building up his army for a revolution against God.

This is why art depicting angels or demi-gods, in the case of eastern religions, along with the Devil and his demons are always brandishing weapons and wearing battle armor because they are going to engage in a battle for supremacy to see who gets to rule the universe.

Unlike the superstitions of the Jews, Africans, and Native Americans, which involve bizarre rituals like human sacrifice, cannibalism, scalping, and ritualized sexual perversions like the Jews sucking the penises of circumcised newborn boys, causing them to have fatal infections, the religious doctrines of the Europeans and Asians are filled with stories of power struggles that are allegorical to real life events in the same way that leftist ideology depicts class, racial, and gender struggles as the ultimate conflict.

And with the principle of the conservation of matter and energy which states that matter and energy cannot be created or destroyed and can only change form, the universe or multiverse as a whole is eternal and will never end.
 
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Peter22

Pigeon
With the advances in science and technology in the 20th and 21st centuries, the average lifespans in developed countries is already 80 years.

The average lifespan in hunter-gatherer societies is only 20 years, while the average lifespan in agrarian societies is 35 years, the average lifespan in industrial societies is 50 years, and the average lifespan in information societies is 80 years.

With all of the progress that has been made, the average lifespan is already 4 times higher than what prehistoric humans had, and with advances in nutrition, toxicology, exercise, diagnostic equipment, surgery, transplantation, regenerative medicine, resurrection, cloning, genetic engineering, synthetic biology, and prosthetics, the average lifespan may exceed 130 years by the end of the 21st century.

You must also consider that the abstinence from vice is expanding with the increased knowledge of the negative effects of substances like alcohol, smoking, drugs, chemical preservatives, and UV rays in the 20th century and gluten, trans and polyunsaturated fat, soy protein, spicy food, sour food, chocolate, beans, legumes, diary products, garlic, caffeine, ginger, oatmeal, and coconut in the 21st century, the average lifespan would increase even further from this alone.

Christians and other religious people may not realize it but simply abstaining from vice according to their religious doctrines can already artificially extend their lifespans.

You will gain eternal life when you go to heaven or hell, if you believe that, and nothing ever really dies, the mind which is just data in the brain, can live on by uploading the information to physical mediums like books or e-books or influencing people's thinking.

The mesmerism that you mentioned is the stimulation of various nerves to generate a response from the brain.

When a person is generating emotions, the brain simply uses input stimuli to send electrical currents to the endocrine glands to release stimulatory hormones that will bind to receptors in the brain to generate electrical impulses that will result in a heightened state of physiological activity where logical thinking in the higher cognitive areas of the brain such as the pre-frontal cortex, hippocampus, amygdala, and cerebellum is suppressed and instinct dominates by activating the sympathetic nervous system which is responsible for the fight-or-flight emotions like anger, anxiety, and depression and also other emotions.

This is why people with an excess of stimulatory hormones are given hormone replacement therapy with inhibitory hormones to block the emotional responses and calm the person down.

An interesting note about religious morality is that the heaven or hell and God vs the Devil narrative originated in ancient eastern religions like Shenism in China, Hinduism in India, and Zoroastrianism in Persia and the hells described in those religions along with Christianity and Islam are not primarily places of punishment but bases where the Devil is building up his army for a revolution against God.

This is why art depicting angels or demi-gods, in the case of eastern religions, along with the Devil and his demons are always brandishing weapons and wearing battle armor because they are going to engage in a battle for supremacy to see who gets to rule the universe.

Unlike the superstitions of the Jews, Africans, and Native Americans, which involve bizarre rituals like human sacrifice, cannibalism, scalping, and ritualized sexual perversions like the Jews sucking the penises of circumcised newborn boys, causing them to have fatal infections, the religious doctrines of the Europeans and Asians are filled with stories of power struggles that are allegorical to real life events in the same way that leftist ideology depicts class, racial, and gender struggles as the ultimate conflict.

And with the principle of the conservation of matter and energy which states that matter and energy cannot be created or destroyed and can only change form, the universe or multiverse as a whole is eternal and will never end.
I would like to resume some points:

1)Transhumanism: as an idea of ever continuing development and bold reaching for ever higher goals. Ok... why not let the mind run free in bold visions, why limit oneself... if I explore... if I look into myself what I would wish and desire, what ideas and fantasies I might have: what would I like if I could... and maybe eventually I could... so assuming gene therapy was possible: would I do it... and I find: yes of-course I would do it.. if I could actually choose: I would choose to be an incredibly attractive, super intelligent, creative, charming, charismatic, muscular man; I would never age, never be sick, any injury would easily go away; I would even be able to try out different types, be blond one day, brownhaired another day, e.g. So... if I let fantasy run wild and not limit myself: why would western inventiveness and venturing spirit not achieve such by way of genetic manipulation. When I´m honest: I would choose these options if given the chance, rather than age and die and be limited to that which I am by accident of birth. Maybe I´m too quick in giving up on the perspectives and possibilities of technology, and others, more venturing, might bring these developments to mankind.

However, the reason why I haven´t thought about such possibilites, is that I never actually thought it possible. I always assume that genetics is too complex to be manipulated in any relevant way.
But if I´m wrong there... then maybe the above visions are possible... and, given the choice, I would root for these possibilities in my life. Now granted... I would do it with trepidation... but that is always the case with new endeavors and must not deter from venturous steps, one can argue.

It´s different, however, with man-machine ideas, as pointed out earlier, I don´t think that that can do that which man as a biological being can do... i.e. in the realm of tactile sense, and other, more subtle, areas.

An important point, however, I want to address: I´m suspicious that these ideas are the usual bait, and the true objective is, as always, control, not enhancement. As pointed out, the idea of unlimited self-modification and improvement is interesting and legitimate but for the powers-that-be it´s only the usual bait to lure us into their technological dystopias. It´s the Mars-spacetravel narrative writ large: oh yes...: it´s always in the next 10-20 years that we will land on Mars... since many decades now it´s going to happen in the next 10-20 years... it´s obviously the carrot that they dangle before our nose, they have no intention, and most likely not the ability and also likely, even fundamentally not the ability (i.e. it´s impossible on principle) to realize it, it´s only bait to keep our imagination busy and have us running behind their carrot.

(to be continued)
 

Peter22

Pigeon
I would like to resume some points:

1)Transhumanism: as an idea of ever continuing development and bold reaching for ever higher goals. Ok... why not let the mind run free in bold visions, why limit oneself... if I explore... if I look into myself what I would wish and desire, what ideas and fantasies I might have: what would I like if I could... and maybe eventually I could... so assuming gene therapy was possible: would I do it... and I find: yes of-course I would do it.. if I could actually choose: I would choose to be an incredibly attractive, super intelligent, creative, charming, charismatic, muscular man; I would never age, never be sick, any injury would easily go away; I would even be able to try out different types, be blond one day, brownhaired another day, e.g. So... if I let fantasy run wild and not limit myself: why would western inventiveness and venturing spirit not achieve such by way of genetic manipulation. When I´m honest: I would choose these options if given the chance, rather than age and die and be limited to that which I am by accident of birth. Maybe I´m too quick in giving up on the perspectives and possibilities of technology, and others, more venturing, might bring these developments to mankind.

However, the reason why I haven´t thought about such possibilites, is that I never actually thought it possible. I always assume that genetics is too complex to be manipulated in any relevant way.
But if I´m wrong there... then maybe the above visions are possible... and, given the choice, I would root for these possibilities in my life. Now granted... I would do it with trepidation... but that is always the case with new endeavors and must not deter from venturous steps, one can argue.

It´s different, however, with man-machine ideas, as pointed out earlier, I don´t think that that can do that which man as a biological being can do... i.e. in the realm of tactile sense, and other, more subtle, areas.

An important point, however, I want to address: I´m suspicious that these ideas are the usual bait, and the true objective is, as always, control, not enhancement. As pointed out, the idea of unlimited self-modification and improvement is interesting and legitimate but for the powers-that-be it´s only the usual bait to lure us into their technological dystopias. It´s the Mars-spacetravel narrative writ large: oh yes...: it´s always in the next 10-20 years that we will land on Mars... since many decades now it´s going to happen in the next 10-20 years... it´s obviously the carrot that they dangle before our nose, they have no intention, and most likely not the ability and also likely, even fundamentally not the ability (i.e. it´s impossible on principle) to realize it, it´s only bait to keep our imagination busy and have us running behind their carrot.

(to be continued)
2)upload consciousness to harddrive
That´s the aspect of transhumanistic ideas that I consider the most obviously flawed. Why obvious... hm... ok it´s obvious that the harddrive can´t do what the neuronal net can do. But... if we had computing with organic materials? Could we not simply build neuronal nets?
Well at least de-facto, I assume that it´s too complicated to achieve, and I don´t expect anything in that realm any time soon.

That brings me to my main point: the whole reason why all that transhumanism talk bugs me is that I think that human consciousness is not at all understood... and also that there is just a huge number of phenomena that have not been looked at, not gotten acquainted with, not been studied, been practised. I am referring to: trance hypnosis charisma attraction possession speaking-in-tongues invocation spiritism psi sleep dreams intuition creativity revelation. The complex of these phenomena; states of mind.
I think we have every reason to deal with these things before we dabble in modifications of our human condition.

I admit that I put my hopes, expectations, regarding improvement and development more to that area... e.g. in questions of health... i.e. maybe I´m just deluded in this area instead of the technological area.
But in any case, as said, I find it striking that this subject: human consciousness, states of mind, is, IMO, so underappreciated with respect to the amount of attention given to. I find these phenomena interesting; they affect our state of being.

With that in mind, I find it... coming back to my original point...naive to assume that thoughts could be explained with a mechanistic world view. Could e.g. Gauss´ mathematical insights be the result of accidental electrical occurances in neurons? Sure... but equally sure is that that´s just indefinitively unlikely... i.e. it´s obviously BS. So if we establish that e.g. in the realm of creativity, the mechanistic worldview is wrong, why don´t we give more energy to developing a different worldview? But I don´t see much of such effort, at least not in our established institutions.
 
With that in mind, I find it... coming back to my original point...naive to assume that thoughts could be explained with a mechanistic world view. Could e.g. Gauss´ mathematical insights be the result of accidental electrical occurances in neurons? Sure... but equally sure is that that´s just indefinitively unlikely... i.e. it´s obviously BS. So if we establish that e.g. in the realm of creativity, the mechanistic worldview is wrong, why don´t we give more energy to developing a different worldview? But I don´t see much of such effort, at least not in our established institutions.

Creativity is caused by higher levels of neuroplasticity which is caused by elevated testosterone levels and that is why all of the mathematical theorems, discoveries, inventions, and works of art are made by men.

Peter22 said:
2)upload consciousness to harddrive
That´s the aspect of transhumanistic ideas that I consider the most obviously flawed. Why obvious... hm... ok it´s obvious that the harddrive can´t do what the neuronal net can do. But... if we had computing with organic materials? Could we not simply build neuronal nets?
Well at least de-facto, I assume that it´s too complicated to achieve, and I don´t expect anything in that realm any time soon.

That brings me to my main point: the whole reason why all that transhumanism talk bugs me is that I think that human consciousness is not at all understood... and also that there is just a huge number of phenomena that have not been looked at, not gotten acquainted with, not been studied, been practised. I am referring to: trance hypnosis charisma attraction possession speaking-in-tongues invocation spiritism psi sleep dreams intuition creativity revelation. The complex of these phenomena; states of mind.
I think we have every reason to deal with these things before we dabble in modifications of our human condition.

Inventor Guy Benary already created an artificial brain from his own cell samples:

 
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Peter22

Pigeon
Creativity is caused by higher levels of neuroplasticity which is caused by elevated testosterone levels and that is why all of the mathematical theorems, discoveries, inventions, and works of art are made by men.



Inventor Guy Benary already created an artificial brain from his own cell samples:

"Inventor Guy Benary already created an artificial brain from his own cell samples"

-> a) I disputed the possibility of uploading one´s mind to a harddrive but you bring brain cells b) I have already conceded that it might be possible to create an artificial brain by adding many neurons together but: can you transfer your mind to that artificial brain? No you can´t
-> so my claim stands: it is not possible to transfer one´s consciousness to another medium.

Regarding creativity, you did not answer my claim that creative thought is not the consequence of electric neural activity; your response consists of mentioning an accompanying phenomenon of creativity, that of testosteron-levels.

My suggestion is, we give this discussion a rest... might just feel like an obligation to answer and re-answer... I´m open to exchange but will try to give a chance to avoid a possibly obligatory back and forth...
 

Pantheon

Sparrow
Orthodox
The common view is that thoughts are private and perceptions are shared. I believe the opposite, perceptions are private and thoughts are shared. Negative thoughts can thus come from the outside. This seems highly prevalent in schizophrenics. They often have a violent inner voice that talks to them in highly derogatory ways. It seems very illogical why someone should do that to themselves. I've also experienced an extreme degree of self-harmful thoughts that have a very negative pull and are hard to get rid off. The equation of free will has helped. I now know that the body is like an instrument, and you can choose what music to play. A good musician doesn't confuse himself with his instrument being out of tune.
 

Peter22

Pigeon
"Inventor Guy Benary already created an artificial brain from his own cell samples"

-> a) I disputed the possibility of uploading one´s mind to a harddrive but you bring brain cells b) I have already conceded that it might be possible to create an artificial brain by adding many neurons together but: can you transfer your mind to that artificial brain? No you can´t
-> so my claim stands: it is not possible to transfer one´s consciousness to another medium.

Regarding creativity, you did not answer my claim that creative thought is not the consequence of electric neural activity; your response consists of mentioning an accompanying phenomenon of creativity, that of testosteron-levels.

My suggestion is, we give this discussion a rest... might just feel like an obligation to answer and re-answer... I´m open to exchange but will try to give a chance to avoid a possibly obligatory back and forth...
... oh and regarding "Benary" whose name seems to actually be "Ben-Ary"... with that kind of name, my built-in lie detector gets triggered... I may well assume that this brain cell stuff is all BS... it may be legit but may well be BS, would need to have a closer look but the questionable claim combined with the kind of name gives me a good chance that it´s BS...
 
"Inventor Guy Benary already created an artificial brain from his own cell samples"

-> a) I disputed the possibility of uploading one´s mind to a harddrive but you bring brain cells b) I have already conceded that it might be possible to create an artificial brain by adding many neurons together but: can you transfer your mind to that artificial brain? No you can´t
-> so my claim stands: it is not possible to transfer one´s consciousness to another medium.

Regarding creativity, you did not answer my claim that creative thought is not the consequence of electric neural activity; your response consists of mentioning an accompanying phenomenon of creativity, that of testosteron-levels.

My suggestion is, we give this discussion a rest... might just feel like an obligation to answer and re-answer... I´m open to exchange but will try to give a chance to avoid a possibly obligatory back and forth...

Well mind uploading may be possible but using a brain computer interface to transfer the data to a duplicate brain also made of organic matter.

But I believe that creating text, sounds, images, and video of your thoughts, such as writing an e-book or making a vlog, and putting them into any communication medium is already mind uploading except that the data is not conscious or self-aware because you did not transfer the entire contents of your brain to the physical mediums which may not yet have the processing power to run your whole mind.

And if people can be influenced by the information you created, then your thoughts are already being uploaded into other people's brains.

What is the spread of belief systems like religion and politics but the mere uploading of the ideas of the founders of these movements into the brains of their followers?
 
The common view is that thoughts are private and perceptions are shared. I believe the opposite, perceptions are private and thoughts are shared. Negative thoughts can thus come from the outside. This seems highly prevalent in schizophrenics. They often have a violent inner voice that talks to them in highly derogatory ways. It seems very illogical why someone should do that to themselves. I've also experienced an extreme degree of self-harmful thoughts that have a very negative pull and are hard to get rid off. The equation of free will has helped. I now know that the body is like an instrument, and you can choose what music to play. A good musician doesn't confuse himself with his instrument being out of tune.

Negative thoughts are the product of stress hormones being released into receptors in the brain's sympathetic nervous system to trigger a fight-or-flight way of thinking while simultaneously damaging the pre-frontal cortex, hippocampus, amygdala, and cerebellum because nutrients for building the neural connections in those brain regions are diverted to the sympathetic nervous system.

If you want this and other mental disorders to stop so that you can be unemotional and logical, you have to stop using products with anti-androgens, get the sufficient amount of all the nutrients, and consume supplements or drugs for blocking the stress hormones.

Studies show that Africans, Native Americans, and Mesoamericans are more prone to schizophrenia because their cultures have plenty of superstitions.

While Arabs and Indians are more prone to anger problems because they are fanatics of their religions.

Mongoloids on the other hand are more prone to depression and erotomania which is why they have a high prevalence of suicides and shut-ins and this is due to their effeminate physical characteristics brought on by their lack of testosterone and elevated levels of serotonin, cortisol, estrogen, prolactin, and oxytocin.

Jews are more prone to addictions and sexual perversions because of their androgynous physical characteristics brought on by a lack of testosterone which causes them to have elevated cortisol levels that can damage the pre-frontal cortex, hippocampus, and amygdala which can affect their decision making, learning, and impulse control. This is why they dominate the entertainment industry that promotes degenerate behavior.

Whites have the highest prevalence of serial killers and sociopaths because we are the most individualistic of all races but this is due to the absence of the 5HTTLPR gene, also known as the serotonin transporter, which elevates serotonin and then cortisol, hormones that are known to induce collectivism and unquestioned obedience to superstition, religion, social norms, and addictive behavior. But this lack of rigid conformity to societal beliefs and norms is what allowed the White people to produce the most mathematical formulas, discoveries, inventions and works of art, and this is what allows Whites to dominate extremes of physical performance like strongmen competitions because the absence of the 5HTTLPR gene increases Whites' testosterone levels.
 

Peter22

Pigeon
... oh and regarding "Benary" whose name seems to actually be "Ben-Ary"... with that kind of name, my built-in lie detector gets triggered... I may well assume that this brain cell stuff is all BS... it may be legit but may well be BS, would need to have a closer look but the questionable claim combined with the kind of name gives me a good chance that it´s BS...
Ooh the surprise... isn´t that surprising...
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/culture/1.5343107 :

"An expatriate Israeli, Guy Ben-Ary, 35, who lives in Australia and is a lawyer by profession and says: "I am really an artist?" "

Now I´m again more positive that a closer look into this brain cell work will bring to light BS...

So much for the moment to artificial brains, the creativity of artificial brains, etc. We´ll see and certainly don´t expect much...
 

Peter22

Pigeon
Negative thoughts are the product of stress hormones being released into receptors in the brain's sympathetic nervous system to trigger a fight-or-flight way of thinking while simultaneously damaging the pre-frontal cortex, hippocampus, amygdala, and cerebellum because nutrients for building the neural connections in those brain regions are diverted to the sympathetic nervous system.

If you want this and other mental disorders to stop so that you can be unemotional and logical, you have to stop using products with anti-androgens, get the sufficient amount of all the nutrients, and consume supplements or drugs for blocking the stress hormones.

Studies show that Africans, Native Americans, and Mesoamericans are more prone to schizophrenia because their cultures have plenty of superstitions.

While Arabs and Indians are more prone to anger problems because they are fanatics of their religions.

Mongoloids on the other hand are more prone to depression and erotomania which is why they have a high prevalence of suicides and shut-ins and this is due to their effeminate physical characteristics brought on by their lack of testosterone and elevated levels of serotonin, cortisol, estrogen, prolactin, and oxytocin.

Jews are more prone to addictions and sexual perversions because of their androgynous physical characteristics brought on by a lack of testosterone which causes them to have elevated cortisol levels that can damage the pre-frontal cortex, hippocampus, and amygdala which can affect their decision making, learning, and impulse control. This is why they dominate the entertainment industry that promotes degenerate behavior.

Whites have the highest prevalence of serial killers and sociopaths because we are the most individualistic of all races but this is due to the absence of the 5HTTLPR gene, also known as the serotonin transporter, which elevates serotonin and then cortisol, hormones that are known to induce collectivism and unquestioned obedience to superstition, religion, social norms, and addictive behavior. But this lack of rigid conformity to societal beliefs and norms is what allowed the White people to produce the most mathematical formulas, discoveries, inventions and works of art, and this is what allows Whites to dominate extremes of physical performance like strongmen competitions because the absence of the 5HTTLPR gene increases Whites' testosterone levels.
To this, I will quickly reply (and maybe later more extensively) : all these details may be interesting but IMO they miss the point which is, more precisely: where does CREATIVE thought come from. I think that you don´t refute my point with Gauss´ mathematical insights.
 
Ooh the surprise... isn´t that surprising...
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/culture/1.5343107 :

"An expatriate Israeli, Guy Ben-Ary, 35, who lives in Australia and is a lawyer by profession and says: "I am really an artist?" "

Now I´m again more positive that a closer look into this brain cell work will bring to light BS...

So much for the moment to artificial brains, the creativity of artificial brains, etc. We´ll see and certainly don´t expect much...

Truth to be told is that artificial brains with some basic level of intelligence already exist and are either made from cultured cells or are electronic. They use artificial intelligence software that makes decisions by using input data to calculate decisions using an algorithm that chooses decisions from a pre-programmed decision library which is a file that contains a list of decisions that have been written down by programmers. The decisions that are selected by the algorithm usually have the highest statistical probability of being the most effective decision.

The project of Guy Benary is possible because living tissue can be sustained in vitro using nutrient solutions that are injected directly into the tissue.

Tissue culturing on a petri dish was invented by Wilhelm Roux in 1885, while the nutrient solution was invented by Dennis Hoagland and Daniel Arnon in 1938 for use in hydroponic and aeroponic farming.

Artificial intelligence was invented in 1966 by Ralph H. Baer, the creator of the magnavox odyssey, the 1st video game console, and inventor of electronic video games, because games need to be able to respond with some level of intelligence to user input.

Another pioneer of artificial intelligence is Joseph Weizenbaum, who in 1966, invented the chatbot, which replies automatically to user messages and is now used for automated reply software used in telecommunications systems to reduce the use of operators.

The brain-computer interface was invented in 1973 by Jacques Vidal as I stated earlier, so with the use of all of these technologies combined, it is possible to build an artificial brain but only with a basic level of intelligence that can only do simple tasks.

In the case of Guy Benary's artificial brain, it only processes musical data.

Source:
 
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