Derek Chauvin Trial

kel

Ostrich
To be clear, I do have sympathy for Floyd, and Chauvin as a cop is reaping what he sowed to a large extent. Whatever happens it doesn't affect me except insofar as continuing the rachetting up of political tensions, but that's going to happen anyways and regardless of the decision in this case or if this case hadn't happened at all.

I just find it - even as someone who didn't think their faith in media could drop any lower - interesting to see the media not just doing spin but entirely reporting that the exact opposite of what is transpiring in the trial.
 

M'bare

Woodpecker
Gold Member
Not in all cases. The delivery form has impact on the rate of absorption. Transdermal vs nasal vs ingestion via stomach ect....

Many people start having OD reactions and are given Narcan, which blocks the receptors and allows for the drugs to pass through the system.

Again I think you read something on the internet and are running with it and are also not paying attention to the FACTS of the case.

Bingo. This is correct.

Izad, if you're reading this and for others: As I've said there are a lot of factors at play concerning this case.

Thinking someone would fairly instantly or quickly die of an OD, is like saying everyone who dies of a heart attack does so 5 seconds from onset of symptoms. A clutch the chest and fall over dead kind of scenario. Do those happen? Yes. But there are many times when that's not the case. It's a progression.

When considering opiates (fentanyl, morphine, dilaudid, etc), there are many factors as get2choppaaa pointed out. The route matters a lot and obviously the dose. But other things like their weight, tolerance, George Floyd having meth (upper) and an adrenaline dump from the arrest/altercation, etc.

Having given thousands of people opiate meds (for medical reasons), an intravenous route of fentanyl would cause a fairly immediate reaction -- feeling it almost immediately, very much so 30 seconds in and fully 1-2 min after that -- though not peaking yet. Izad, I think you're making your assumption based on an IV overdose.

But Floyd took something orally. Not sure when, although his past and seeing the white substance suggest sometime around his arrest. Oral opiates can take 15 min before they start working -- but those are ones controlled by pharmacies. His substance may have been a little more dissolving in nature and homemade. Not sure.

The point is, it stands to reason that you cannot conclude he didn't die of an overdose just because he didn't go down like a sack of potatoes after an OD. The timeline makes perfect sense for an oral ingestion of this drug.

I also believe he suffered a heart attack from a cascade of events(hypoxia from respiratory depression, the struggle), that led to asystole that ultimately killed him. What was it, 2 or 3 people died at the capital from a heart attack for over exertion? Now think that, with massive amounts of drugs. They say his blood oxygen was 98 percent I believe in the trial. But that could have been from resuscitation efforts, bagging the patient with 100 percent O2 most likely enroute to the hospital.


As a broader point: If you have people in your life that can't accept these points, and will attack you in some way for bringing them up, then be on guard, especially as this decent continues. I don't think Izad is trying to protect himself from these realities, but it seems he's trying to protect himself from people in his life who will attack him for bringing this stuff up.

And I get it. It's tough. I have some lefty family members and friends -- a few I've disassociated from. These people will be too dangerous to reveal truth to in the future and even now for that matter. It's unfortunate.
 

get2choppaaa

Pelican

Cynic in me said she knew (or her handlers knew) this would be the result and that a mistrial on appeal would act as the perfect way to get the rioters to go ultra-ballistic considering the extremely volatile situation at the moment.
Yes... likely on appeal this will happen. That was going to happen anyway though based off of the facts presented to this point.

Mad Maxine was there to maximize the chaos agents and rioting.
 

Izad

Chicken
The found fentanyl pills in the back seat of the police car with his saliva on them. He had them in his mouth and spit them out. He likely ingested some, and five minutes later died.

no one really knows for sure how he died. That’s reasonable doubt. Even the prosecution’s witnesses contradicted each other.

We know what was in his blood stream, they covered it extensively in court.
Lets just agree to disagree. You believe the 160lbs man directly on his neck with his knee for 9 minutes had nothing to do with GF dying even though he died in that exact moment, I disagree.
I think without all the hoopla, this would be a clear-cut case of manslaughter, which is what I think he will be given if the jury is fair.
 

get2choppaaa

Pelican
We know what was in his blood stream, they covered it extensively in court.
Lets just agree to disagree. You believe the 160lbs man directly on his neck with his knee for 9 minutes had nothing to do with GF dying even though he died in that exact moment, I disagree.
I think without all the hoopla, this would be a clear-cut case of manslaughter, which is what I think he will be given if the jury is fair.
Except there was no positional asphyxia... so the knee to the neck DID NOT kill him.

Like I've said. He OD'd on Fentanyl. That is what killed him. He was hospitalized last year for the EXACT SAME action of eating the drugs.

The fact that he was laying on his stomach in the prone position is just an element of his death, but not causal. Prone is a safe position.

Did you know the person in his car was his drug dealer? Do you not think the Drug Dealer might have said eat these drugs? Do you not think its funny that said drug dealer wasn't given immunity? You are operating on the media frame and not using your God given critical thinking skills OR you are being lazy and arrogant to pass opinions on things you're uneducated on.

This is sort of logic is akin to the nurse I was talking to at a crawfish boil who told me, my uncle (Vietnam draftee, 35 years as a cop) and the wife (who has worked more messed up scenes involving everything from gunshots/ to fires/car accidents to unfortunately dead children as a Paramedic) that we were totally wrong about covid because we had never had to deal with a dying covid patient. "Covid stats aren't made up I work in a covid ward @ the hospital and I"ve held a 30 year old covid patients as they have died.. and you telling me the covid stats are made up is like telling me my job doesn't matter." I mean I have family that are doctors charged with compiling state COVID records and they can prove the stats dont bear out with the claims the media and the fear exploiters are using.

Covid didnt kill Floyd. Chauvin didn't kill Floyd. Fentanyl (FLOYD) did. Period. You can dislike the optics... but you have to take that up with the PD @ Minneapolis. When there is a scene unsafe Paramedics refuse to work... and literally only a narcan IV would have been able to save him, and only then its a big maybe.

Also, good luck subduing a man whos going through excited delirium without doing something like placing them in the prone restraint position.

I think a lot of people going on about how this went down have ZERO experience doing anything in that line of work.
 
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Dusty

Peacock
Gold Member
We know what was in his blood stream, they covered it extensively in court.
Lets just agree to disagree. You believe the 160lbs man directly on his neck with his knee for 9 minutes had nothing to do with GF dying even though he died in that exact moment, I disagree.
I think without all the hoopla, this would be a clear-cut case of manslaughter, which is what I think he will be given if the jury is fair.
You really don’t know the facts of the case. Chauvin weighs 140 pounds for example.

Do you even know that the state isn’t claiming Floyd died due to a knee on the neck, as the media and everyone claimed from the video footage, before the facts had to be hashed out in court?
 
We know what was in his blood stream, they covered it extensively in court.
Lets just agree to disagree. You believe the 160lbs man directly on his neck with his knee for 9 minutes had nothing to do with GF dying even though he died in that exact moment, I disagree.
I think without all the hoopla, this would be a clear-cut case of manslaughter, which is what I think he will be given if the jury is fair.

It's hard to take posts like this seriously especially on this forum.

"THE SUN CAME UP AT THE EXACT MOMENT I POURED MY CEREAL WHICH MEANS I MUST BE A GOD."
 

FactusIRX

Kingfisher

Cynic in me said she knew (or her handlers knew) this would be the result and that a mistrial on appeal would act as the perfect way to get the rioters to go ultra-ballistic considering the extremely volatile situation at the moment.
I disagree. I think that Maxime Waters was being an idiot. I think her handlers are furious at her for such a simple mistake. This revolution is going to look more like Venezuela or Brazil than the Soviet Union or China. In the latter cases, you had a certain tribe controlling a very high IQ, ethnically homogenous bureaucracy, which made the machine ruthlessly efficient in its cruelty. On the other hand, in US, like in Latin American countries, you have a bureaucracy of mystery meat, lukewarm IQ simpletons. As a result, you have a horrifical and comically stupid and clumsy enforcement force, who cannot even follow the simplest of directions. This is why you get the Clownworld phenomenon, where you have this massive, powerful, all consuming force being implemented by stupid, incompetent foot soldiers.
 

M'bare

Woodpecker
Gold Member
We know what was in his blood stream, they covered it extensively in court.
Lets just agree to disagree. You believe the 160lbs man directly on his neck with his knee for 9 minutes had nothing to do with GF dying even though he died in that exact moment, I disagree.
I think without all the hoopla, this would be a clear-cut case of manslaughter, which is what I think he will be given if the jury is fair.
Pls do yourself a favor, and read my post I made on this page (above).
 

jollycynic

Sparrow
But the opioid we're talking about here is fentanyl, a lethal dose of fentanyl will kill you instantly. You don't take a lethal dose of fentanyl, walk into a store, get into an altercation then suddenly overdose because digestion has kicked in.
Grossly untrue and I'm saying this based on professional experience. Only if the dose was administered IV would the effect be near instantaneous. He was orally dosed, plus the confounding effects of the meth.
 

Papaya

Peacock
Gold Member
More credence to the physiognomy theories.

What a hideous despicable creature



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