Donald Trump orders all churches "essential" and be opened immediately

NoMoreTO

Pelican
Ther
I see my job as a man is to protect those who cant protect themselves.

That goes for the children and the elderly in MY life, whom I love.

Do what you want with your own parents because I do not care. It's your job to protect them, not mine.

If you want to send your parents to church after 38% out of 92 people in the Arkansas church got corona virus, have at it.

People have a right to assess for themselves, including the elderly. Attending Church is the intersection of not only freedom of worship but also freedom to congregate. I can't speak for Protestants, but for Catholics Church attendance is more important as we have the mass.

There are some men, of days past who viewed their role as a spiritual leader, in addition to protector. If your old man was religious and wanted to go to Church, you wouldn't stop him, you couldn't. The old should be protected, but also respected.
 
Also, let us reject the satanic insanity of using devilspeak like “non-essential businesses.” Every business is essential to the person or people who poured their time, money, and energy into creating a business in order to feed their families and give other people jobs. One of the most important battles for us to fight in this culture war is not to adopt or use the enemy’s language, since language is the shape of thought, and if we start using their words, we mentally capitulate to their frame without realizing it. Every business is essential, and nobody granted the oligarchs any power to suggest otherwise.
 

paninaro

Kingfisher
↑I disagree.

Reliance on mass technology is never without consequences.

I'm no Catholic theologian, but I would like to see virtual/digital Masses be declared invalid.

The whole point of Mass is that you congregate and worship together.

The Church's willingness to use virtual Masses to cater to the vulnerable, while well-intentioned, can easily lead to the virtual Mass being extended to all parishoners and physical churches being closed indefinitely.
The Catholic church generally isn't on the forefront of anything, but they did make a major "technology" change in the 1960s. Before Vatican II, mass was always said in Latin, After Vatican II, it was OK to say it in the local language instead.
 

Samseau

Owl
Gold Member
Church is considered more dangerous than grocery stores, Church is banned while Tinder and Grindr are open; most of the pandemic guidelines were a joke and did little to stop the spread of the virus.

The virus just isn't as contagious as people feared, although we're probably going to see an explosion in cases as things reopen because people are going from one extreme (isolation) to another (packed crowds on the beach). The middle ground was never taken, as usual.
 

bucky

Pelican
Church is considered more dangerous than grocery stores, Church is banned while Tinder and Grindr are open; most of the pandemic guidelines were a joke and did little to stop the spread of the virus.

The virus just isn't as contagious as people feared, although we're probably going to see an explosion in cases as things reopen because people are going from one extreme (isolation) to another (packed crowds on the beach). The middle ground was never taken, as usual.
I think the "explosion" in infections will happen, but whether we'll "see" it is another question. Most people don't show symptoms, and when they do it's like a mild cold. It's impossible to maintain a high level of terror about something you really haven't seen affect anyone you know.
 
↑I disagree.

Reliance on mass technology is never without consequences.

I'm no Catholic theologian, but I would like to see virtual/digital Masses be declared invalid.

The whole point of Mass is that you congregate and worship together.

The Church's willingness to use virtual Masses to cater to the vulnerable, while well-intentioned, can easily lead to the virtual Mass being extended to all parishoners and physical churches being closed indefinitely.

Additionally, governments in jurisdictions with "hate speech" laws can use their NSA-like data collection agencies to access sermons and jail preachers who preach against things like homosexuality and feminism. That already happened to Swedish pastor Åke Green, who was jailed for preaching against homosexuality. Technology will make it a lot easier for governments to do things like that.

These are only a few examples of possible consequences that could result from the widespread adoption of virtual livestream Masses. I'm sure there's many more.
On the plus side, if fewer people were inside a physical church at any one time and many services and classes took place by remote, church properties could be smaller and several congregations could share the same campus. This would reduce the amount of money churches needed to raise from parishioners—and free up more funds for charitable works. (However, some things may still have to take place in person.)
 

Easy_C

Crow
I think the "explosion" in infections will happen, but whether we'll "see" it is another question. Most people don't show symptoms, and when they do it's like a mild cold. It's impossible to maintain a high level of terror about something you really haven't seen affect anyone you know.
We already have some sample data. So far the states that re-opened businesses have NOT had any explosion in cases or fatalities.
 

bucky

Pelican
We already have some sample data. So far the states that re-opened businesses have NOT had any explosion in cases or fatalities.
I'd guess that's because most infected people don't have any symptoms and don't get tested, but it's a moot point. This isn't the new black death we were promised.
 
It looks like the Chuches here in Japan, and there aren't many, will remain closed for the foreseeable future. And what's really frustrating about this is that these closures are only suggested by the government.
 

Zenta

Woodpecker
Gold Member
I draw the line between politics / opinion vs the health of my parents, as the elderly is the majority of church goers.

I'd be the first governor to refuse given what we know at the current time before I allow my parents to go to church.

A church building is NOT essential. Last I heard, people don't need a building or church pews to speak or pray to God and the bible hasn't changed since the corona virus.

This was a political move, nothing more.

Put the health of your parents before your politics because you only have one mother and father.
Linux, as someone trying to keep my sick mother from dying to this, glad to see there is still some reasoning voice left around here.
 

911

Peacock
Gold Member
My church is opening Sunday for outdoor service.
That's what should have been done and emphasized all along, keep church services going and move them outdoors for the next month of two. Very low risk, and a great way to keep parishes open and build up your vitamin D while being spiritually elevated.
 
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